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Firefox 49 For Linux Will Ship With Plug-in Free Netflix, Amazon Prime Video Support (mozilla.org)

Posted by msmash on from the plug-in-free-world dept.

Reader LichtSpektren writes: Widevine, the media protocol that allows users to watch videos on Netflix, is supported in Firefox for Windows and macOS. But until now, its users on Linux were required to use a plug-in. That changes with v49, which offers out-of-the-box support for Netflix.Mozilla plans to offer plug-in streaming for Netflix as well as Amazon Prime Video and other similar services. The v49 will be available on Linux in September. Mozilla adds that it will be removing support for NPAPI plugins from its browser in the near future, plugins that some video streaming sites rely on for playback. "Mozilla plan to support the Widevine CDM on Linux, letting users watch Netflix without plugins," the company said.

91 of 134 comments (clear)

  1. Not plugin free by Carewolf · · Score: 4, Informative

    If they switch from NPAPI to CDM, that does not make them plugin-free. CDM is based on plugins and Widivine is a plugin.

    1. Re:Not plugin free by tepples · · Score: 3, Informative

      It does, however, drastically reduce the attack surface of plug-ins. The CDM is a much narrower, more focused API than NPAPI. And it'll be easier to avoid: don't use any services that offer Hollywood movies for online rental.

    2. Re:Not plugin free by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      "the attack surface of plug-ins" oh fuck off. If processes can't be assigned fine-grained permissions then your operating system is shit. VMS had no problem with the concept in the early '80s. You should be able to write a plug-in that does nothing but attempt to scrape data from the user account and infect the whole system with crap, and the OS should be able to catch every attempt - or, rather, default deny.

      The virtual machine / cloud craze itself is a fucking retarded band-aid over the fact that operating systems are insecure and just having a user account is for some reason not good enough. So instead of trying to privilege escalate to root/Administrator/whatever primitive concept commercial operating systems have, the hipster hacker now has to work out how to break out from guest into hypervisor - and is broadly succeeding here too.

    3. Re:Not plugin free by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 2

      Yes and no: the interactions between the browser and the CDM defined by the 'encrypted media extension' stuff are indeed pretty narrow; but the spec allows, and deliberately doesn't not define, what the CDM itself does, what privileges it runs with, and so on. There are a few plaintive encouragements to avoid incompetence or malice; but those are optional. It is less likely to be useful for attacking the browser than an NPAPI plugin is; but the security and behavior of the CDM itself are restricted only by the vendor's implementation choices.

    4. Re:Not plugin free by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      it isn't easier to avoid, as as unlike NPAPI plugins CDM's have no click-to-play option (or didn't last time I checked)

    5. Re:Not plugin free by tepples · · Score: 1

      By "the spec", are you referring broadly to the W3C's EME spec or more narrowly to the spec of how Firefox implements EME?

    6. Re:Not plugin free by tepples · · Score: 1

      Uncheck "Options > Content > Play DRM Content".

    7. Re:Not plugin free by Blaskowicz · · Score: 1

      The only DRM'ed video I remember downloading, a .wmv, was a porn video. It was unreadable, and was part of the peer-to-peer noise.
      Back then, you mostly downloaded video when you wanted to play them. Real Player was the running joke ; streamed .wmv was great but I only got it working near the end of its popularity, else the user experience was a message that said "failed to automatically download the codec".

      A proper plug-in based video streaming like streamed .wmv would use a 2D graphics card's abilities to scale video and do YUV to RGB conversion in hardware so that a low end 500MHz CPU would play full screen smooth, with no SSE, no hardware decoding or no OpenGL.
      Fast-forward a decade and a faster netbook with 16x the RAM is struggling playing 240p youtube even in small size windowed mode. Well done.

    8. Re:Not plugin free by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      A proper plug-in based video streaming like streamed .wmv would use a 2D graphics card's abilities to scale video and do YUV to RGB conversion in hardware so that a low end 500MHz CPU would play full screen smooth, with no SSE, no hardware decoding or no OpenGL.

      Your statement here is...bizarre. You laud not using hardware acceleration in a process using hardware acceleration? YUV to RGB is definitely hardware decoding. Though perhaps you were thinking about whole-stream in-hardware decoding of MP4?

      Fast-forward a decade and a faster netbook with 16x the RAM is struggling playing 240p youtube even in small size windowed mode. Well done.

      SSE came out in 1999, not 2006, and was in response to AMD's 3dNow! from 1998, which itself was a response to Intel's 1997 MMX technology, whose specific purpose was graphics processing acceleration on the CPU. We're getting darn near 20 years ago, at this point.

      Now, I won't argue that the layers upon layers of APIs and abstractions aren't harming performance and reliability. On the contrary, I think the proliferation of different components all fighting to talk to the GPU is creating a huge bottleneck and complexity point. And browser architecture, such as it presently exists, isn't making things much better. It sort of helps you understand why flash was so popular for so long; a content provider could trust that there was a team of people at Adobe dedicated to concentrating on and working around platform issues that harmed the viewer's subjective experience. (Yes, flash is buggy, it crashes, it's the worst thing that ever happened to the web, whatever. But nobody else had a team dedicated to providing what Flash tried to provide.)

    9. Re:Not plugin free by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      If processes can't be assigned fine-grained permissions then your operating system is shit.

      Let's ignore that there are entire operating systems built around the browser experience. The browser itself is the new thick client for a huge swath of user experience; you don't need to escape the browser's process to do real damage.

    10. Re:Not plugin free by Eravnrekaree · · Score: 1

      I am for getting rid of ALL native code plugins and instead providing Javascript APIs for audio, video and 3D. Replacing one native code plugin API with another would be a huge mistake. Native code plugins are just begging for binary blob plugins that run only on Windows and therefore keep applications unavailable to Linux users, like Unity and Shockwave has done. Unity, Flash and Shockwave needs to be killed off for good.

    11. Re:Not plugin free by Eravnrekaree · · Score: 1

      I completely agree that sandboxes are vitally important, this doesnt change the fact that binary blob plugins need to go, many other problems with them, since they often do not work on the BSDs and create a lock-in to Windows as which can be seen with Unity3D and Shockwave. The browser should be 100% open source with no binary blob native code plugins and the thing should be heavily sandboxed and multiprocess on top of that.

    12. Re:Not plugin free by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      If anyone is having trouble playing youtube videos, then I think it is lack of support for current video cards. Adobe was particularly bad at this. They sucked even compared to community efforts. They seemed primarily good at making lame excuses.

      Although struggling to play anything at 240p is sad.

      I used an x86 AppleTV as a MythTV frontend until h264 started to become a thing. It could easily handle 1080 broadcast content.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    13. Re:Not plugin free by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      VMS is dead. Get over it already.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    14. Re:Not plugin free by wolrahnaes · · Score: 1

      They've been procratinating on this "remove NPAPI" thing for years now. They always say they will and never actually do since it would rregress their market position by breaking most of the web.

      Chrome (which has about 50% of desktop users) removed NPAPI entirely almost a year ago. None of the mobile browsers (which depending on country may be the majority of internet users) have ever had it. The vast majority of the web isn't going to miss it, because they don't have it right now and they clearly don't care.

      --
      I used to get high on life, but I developed a tolerance. Now I need something stronger.
    15. Re:Not plugin free by Kiwikwi · · Score: 1

      Unity, Flash and Shockwave needs to be killed off for good.

      Well, good news on one front: Unity Webplayer is officially end-of-life as of last year, and webplayer authoring is not supported at all in the recent 5.4 release of Unity. When it comes to browser gaming, Unity is focused 100% on cross-platform, open standard HTML 5/WebGL, and is working closely with Mozilla on bringing those technologies up to par with native.

      (Outside browsers, Linux is a first-class Unity target platform, and the Linux version of the Unity editor is coming along nicely, although it's still considered experimental.)

      Full disclosure: I work for Unity Technologies.

    16. Re:Not plugin free by roca · · Score: 4, Informative

      "The browser should be..." Sure! But it turns out that Hollywood won't let you play their movies in such a browser :-(.

      If you want Firefox to be that browser, just uncheck "play DRM content" in the preferences and you're all good.

    17. Re:Not plugin free by roca · · Score: 1

      Browser vendors have been working very hard on that goal for a long time and are almost as close as they're ever going to get.

      DRM is "special" in that Hollywood won't let you play their movies in any full-open-source no-binary-blobs browser. You can opt out of DRM in the Firefox preferences and that gets you as close as you're going to get until you persuade Hollywood to alter their licensing terms.

    18. Re:Not plugin free by toddestan · · Score: 1

      I'd suggest looking at IceCat (formerly IceWeasel). Given that the whole reason the browser exists is because of the not-free-enough license for the Firefox trademark and artwork, I'm sure they'll also strip out any binary blob DRM schemes.

  2. This move from modularity to massive monoliths... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    ...controlled entirely by three major vendors for some reason is praised by the software development community.

    What is it about freedom and control of your own systems that makes even professionals so afraid?

  3. more features for the feature god. by nimbius · · Score: 4, Insightful

    for netflix viewers: ignore this update, you already likely see netflix on an embedded linux television.
    for non viewers: enjoy your free, mandatory DRM in the browser.
    for Firefox developers: get rid of pocket, get rid of sync, please work on fixing the bugs youre assigned, hustle up and get that godforsaken voice chat program out of the browser, restore cookie control functionality, quit mandating signed plugins to curtail adblock users, and ditch the targeted advertising tiles.

    --
    Good people go to bed earlier.
    1. Re:more features for the feature god. by pecosdave · · Score: 1

      I rather like Sync. It's one of the biggest draws to the browser for me.

      Most of the users at my company don't use it. It harms nothing being there. I don't care for pocket, have never used it. It doesn't bother me.

      --
      The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
    2. Re:more features for the feature god. by QuietLagoon · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't use Sync and would prefer if it were a plug-in for those who do like to use it. The concept of mandatory options, i.e., plug-ins that are permanently plugged-in, runs counter to good security practices. When they are not used, they do little more than increase the attack surface.

    3. Re:more features for the feature god. by houstonbofh · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Firefox has lost the point and become a fat bloated monster. And Chrome is not far behind. (And this ignores the massive data gathering both do) So there is a fantastic market opportunity for a lightweight browser that can still render the bloated modern web... Any ideas?

    4. Re:more features for the feature god. by geek · · Score: 1, Insightful

      I don't use Sync and would prefer if it were a plug-in .

      It's all about you isn't it Kim Kardashian?

    5. Re:more features for the feature god. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Pale Moon?

    6. Re:more features for the feature god. by QuietLagoon · · Score: 2
      On the contrary, I am generally opposed to the "mandatory options" plug-ins because of the problems (security and otherwise) they can cause in instances when they are not wanted or used. I most specifically am not saying the plug-ins should not be available for those who do want to use them. Indeed, the abuility to choose what plug-ins you want in your browser is one of the great benefits of plug-ins.

      .
      In being concerned about security and other issues, I am looking at things beyond myself and this Kim Kardasian person you speak of.

    7. Re:more features for the feature god. by QuietLagoon · · Score: 1

      ...Firefox has lost the point and become a fat bloated monster....

      Have the people who are running Firefox run it into the ground yet, i.e., has its marketshare fallen below the magical 10% threshold? Once a browser falls below 10% marketshare, its relevance diminishes greatly.

    8. Re:more features for the feature god. by dmahurin · · Score: 4, Funny

      > Firefox has lost the point and become a fat bloated monster. And Chrome is not far behind. (And this ignores the massive data gathering both do) So there is a fantastic market opportunity for a lightweight browser that can still render the bloated modern web... Any ideas?

      Well, you could create a minimal version of Firefox, stripping out all the junk, and call that Phoenix.

    9. Re:more features for the feature god. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Vivaldi for sure. Opera 12's successor, if only in spirit.

    10. Re:more features for the feature god. by MBGMorden · · Score: 1

      So there is a fantastic market opportunity

      I'd argue that there isn't.

      The number of people who care about the stuff you listed is generally trivial, and your statement itself touches on a key point - "market opportunity". If you want anything more than a hobbyist project (of which there are tons out there already), you have to have a product that will make money.

      Browsers can either make money by doing things like the data gathering you mention (and be of no cost to the users), or they can skip on things like that and charge the user directly. You seem to want the latter.

      With monetarily free options available I don't think there's enough demand for a paid browser to actually fund it. By all means though if you thing it can happen, then feel free to start up such a project and see if it has wings.

      --
      "People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
    11. Re:more features for the feature god. by retchdog · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "OMG these sites i don't pay to use are advertising to me and that's evil!"

      okay, use noscript.

      "but that's hard and there are other ways i can be tracked."

      okay, i'll build and maintain a secure browser for $5 a month.

      "i can't afford that."

      okay, $5 a year.

      "information wants to be FREE, man!"

      okay, then i guess i'll go to work for an online advertising company.

      --
      "They were pure niggers." – Noam Chomsky
    12. Re:more features for the feature god. by guises · · Score: 2

      What is the massive data gathering that Firefox does? This is a serious question, the fact that they seem to be the only browser maker who's cares about privacy, even a little, is the whole reason why I use Firefox.

    13. Re:more features for the feature god. by StormReaver · · Score: 1

      for netflix viewers: ignore this update, you already likely see netflix on an embedded linux television.

      Speak for yourself. Netflix is the only reason I fire up Chrome. Otherwise, Firefox is my browser of choice.

    14. Re:more features for the feature god. by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      The only time I ever bother with video streaming on a PC is when I am away from home and I've got enough room to stretch out in and have a laptop setup with the screen so I don't have to hold onto it (like a tablet).

      Beyond that very particular use case, pretty much ANY OTHER device is much better for dealing with those services. Video in browsers has always sucked and required far more resources than necessary on a PC. Choice of OS doesn't help this.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    15. Re:more features for the feature god. by lgw · · Score: 1

      The UI is better on PC, because you have a mouse and keyboard. Easy to search, easy to jump to any point in a video. Why would I care how much resources the video player is using? That's the only job of my HTPC.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    16. Re:more features for the feature god. by macxcool · · Score: 1

      I do exactly the same thing. I'm looking forward to this.

    17. Re:more features for the feature god. by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Right now, less than they used to since they've stopped the idea of sponsored tiles targeted based on your browsing habits. However read their privacy policy. When you find the page have a dig back in the wayback machine and see how they seem to change this policy more often than an average person changes underwear. Then laugh at the comments that they claim this is opt-in, yet they have systematically changed defaults away from the privacy of the user over the years, and on a fresh install of Firefox all checkboxes to share information, including those when Sync is first enabled come pre-checked. (psst Mozilla, that is what's called opt-out).

    18. Re:more features for the feature god. by TangoMargarine · · Score: 1

      It harms nothing being there.

      Technically speaking, it occupies your computing device's memory, which can be interpreted as a form of harm.

      --
      Unity? Screw that: XFCE. Slashdot Beta? Screw that: SoylentNews. Australis? Screw that: Pale Moon. UX developers DIAF
    19. Re:more features for the feature god. by roca · · Score: 2

      > enjoy your free, mandatory DRM in the browser.

      Not mandatory. Disable it with one checkbox in preferences.

      > get rid of pocket

      Being moved to a disable-able extension.

      > please work on fixing the bugs youre assigned

      Of course they're always doing that. To insinuate they don't is just gratuitously insulting.

      > hustle up and get that godforsaken voice chat program out of the browser

      Already done.

      > quit mandating signed plugins to curtail adblock users

      No connection between signed addons and adblock. The suggestion there is is something you just made up.

      > ditch the targeted advertising tiles

      Already done a long time ago.

    20. Re:more features for the feature god. by houstonbofh · · Score: 1

      I would argue that there is for a traditional FOSS project. One where a few people contribute the the browser they want to use. A project like Security Onion where people contribute to the tool they need.

    21. Re:more features for the feature god. by roca · · Score: 1

      In other words, "haha I lied"

    22. Re:more features for the feature god. by roca · · Score: 1

      What evidence do you have that Mozilla wants to spy on people?

      Mozilla bent over backwards to make it possible for you to run your own Firefox Accounts and Sync servers:
      https://docs.services.mozilla....
      Is that the action of an organization that is determined to spy on you?

    23. Re:more features for the feature god. by roca · · Score: 1

      You can disable DRM by clicking one checkbox in preferences.

    24. Re:more features for the feature god. by roca · · Score: 2

      What are you talking about? Firefox already implemented the relevant WebRTC standards; they're what Hello was based on.

    25. Re:more features for the feature god. by houstonbofh · · Score: 1

      It harms nothing being there.

      Technically speaking, it occupies your computing device's memory, which can be interpreted as a form of harm.

      That and we have no idea what it is really doing while running, or if it really exits...

  4. App Neutrality? by Malggi · · Score: 1

    This makes me wonder if "App Neutrality" will become a thing in the future the same way "Net Neutrality" is today.

    Imagine a conversation like, "I really only watch anime's that are on Netflix because that site 'just works'. I don't want to have to do the extra steps that I need to do for Crunchyroll."

    Although for all I know this will affect Cruchyroll too. I just picked them out of the air as an example.

  5. Truth in Advertising? by gQuigs · · Score: 2

    I do support this move by Firefox, but can we please actually call it DRM on this site?

    We were just talking about how we want to call it out as being anti-consumer, etc.
    https://yro.slashdot.org/story...

  6. Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netflix? by pecosdave · · Score: 1

    There's one thing really holding my HTPC back from sheer awesomeness.

    The fact I can't navigate Netflix with a keyboard. Sure there's some rough scrolling and what have you, but it sucks. I want full screen arrow navigation. I know a webpage CAN do it, but why it won't do it is beyond me. The fact it CAN be done on commercial boxes with dedicated apps just annoys me so. I've tried to get copies of the apps meant for Blu-ray players, I even tried installing Dolphin to see if I could get the Wii version to work. No good.

    Friggin arrow keys! How hard could that be?

    --
    The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
  7. Re:Firefox: Kitchen Sink Edition by houstonbofh · · Score: 1

    Actually, worse then the typical kitchen sink, because they will remove support for the old standard drains. Because legacy support is bad...

  8. Re:Where's the source code by houstonbofh · · Score: 1

    Widevine is "DRM and Content Protection" scheme (see http://www.widevine.com). But is it open source? The Widevine plugin appears to be a binary without any source code.

    https://tools.google.com/dlpage/widevine

    Is Mozilla putting a binary blob into Firefox, or do they have the source code for Widevine?

    And queue a bunch of the beginner Linux sites releasing articles on how to pin Firefox on 48. Because "Hell no" to that crap on my system.

  9. Not my fault by LichtSpektren · · Score: 3, Informative

    My original submission said nothing about plug-ins, so I declare this "not my fault"

    :P

    1. Re:Not my fault by Psicopatico · · Score: 1

      Wait... so we now have clear evidence of an editor actually editing something?!?

      On Slashdot!?!?!

      Oh my...

      --
      Mastering the English language is fucking easy: all you have to do is to put an f* word in every fucking sentence.
  10. CDM is sandboxed by tepples · · Score: 2, Informative

    "the attack surface of plug-ins" oh fuck off. If processes can't be assigned fine-grained permissions then your operating system is shit.

    Unfortunately, people have allowed themselves to become locked into incumbent operating systems that are, as you put it, "shit". But given the presence of "sandbox" in the titles of bugs listed at Media/EME, it appears Firefox is at least trying to limit the permissions of the CDM.

  11. Re:Where's the source code by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    "Everything you need to begin your device integration or content encryption process is available here. Depending on your needs, please review the information below to help determine your next steps. ... For end users, the implementation of Widevine DRM is dependent upon your device manufacturer and/or service provider."

    That shit is certainly not free as in speech.

  12. Re:Where's the source code by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    It just gets worse the deeper you dig:

    "In order to become [an implementation partner] the following obligations must be completed: ... Non Disclosure Agreement ... Product Licensing Agreement ... "

    "[implementation partners] must: Have on staff a minimum of 2 individuals that are CWIP certified, Pass audits of end user sites conducted by Widevine to ensure proper and secure installations, End user and content owner experience must remain satisfactory"

  13. NPAPI has started acting strange under FireFox. by Zombie+Ryushu · · Score: 1

    NPAPI has started acting strange under FireFox for me. I currently have a crisis on my hands where in Linux, I cannot load Okular Plugin, or nspluginwrapper Acroread plugin and I need them.

    I get errors like the following:
    From Okular:
    (msgtype=0xAA0006,name=PPluginInstance::Msg_NPP_SetWindow) Channel
    timeout: cannot send/recv
    Error: (msgtype=0xAA000C,name=PPluginInstance::Msg_NPP_GetValue_NPPVpluginScriptableNPObject)
    Channel timeout: cannot send/recv

    From NsPluginwrapper
    wrapper.c:2228):invoke_NPP_SetWindow: assertion failed: (rpc_method_invoke_possible(plugin->connection))
    *** NSPlugin Wrapper *** WARNING:(/usr/src/packages/BUILD/nspluginwrapper/src/npw-wrapper.c:2278):invoke_NPP_GetValue: assertion failed: (rpc_method_invoke_possible(plugin->connection))
    *** NSPlugin Wrapper *** WARNING:(/usr/src/packages/BUILD/nspluginwrapper/src/npw-wrapper.c:2487):invoke_NPP_NewStream: assertion failed: (rpc_method_invoke_possible(plugin->connection))
    *** NSPlugin Wrapper *** WARNING:(/usr/src/packages/BUILD/nspluginwrapper/src/npw-wrapper.c:2159):invoke_NPP_Destroy: assertion failed: (rpc_method_invoke_possible(plugin->connection))

    Okular Plugin and nspluginwrapper have nothing to do with each other. I instruct FireFox to load Okular Plugin for normal PDF Viewing but use Acroread when I have a specific site that requires an XFA Form filled out via Acroread. Has anyone else run into this?

    1. Re:NPAPI has started acting strange under FireFox. by NotInHere · · Score: 1

      Currently the plan is to make non flash npapi plugins disabled by default on firefox 52, and by firefox 53 support will be removed entirely. So better change to pdf.js, or open the pdf files that pdf.js has problems with externally.

      Source: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/s...

  14. Re:Where's the source code by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    It's even worse than just a binary blob, it's a binary blob designed for the sole purpose of subverting the end user:

    "Robust device security is enabled by using factory provisioned keyboxes to establish a hardware root of trust, secure decryption and content rendering."

  15. built-in features vs plugins by Atmchicago · · Score: 1

    And let's make HTML support and the ability to zoom plugins too, while we're at it /s. No, seriously, some features are popular enough that they warrant being standard.

    --

    You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it dissolve.

  16. Re:This move from modularity to massive monoliths. by MBGMorden · · Score: 2

    What is it about freedom and control of your own systems that makes even professionals so afraid?

    Freedom and control is ok to a point, but often times having stuff just work is of greater importance.

    I use Linux at home. I like it. I can setup cronjobs to automate maintenance tasks and write scripts to handle all sorts of neat tricks (ie, I had a ton of old TV series downloaded and discovered that my media player downstairs choked on anything encoded with the old "DivX" codec - in about 10 minutes I had a script written that would scan over the entire media directory, find stuff encoded in DivX, re-encode it, then delete the old file).

    That being said - there comes a point where I just want my damned Netflix videos to work. And truthfully - for a STREAMING SERVICE - I don't have any issue with the DRM or plugins needed to facilitate it. The downside of DRM is that I consider it a rental. If I want to move the files to a different device it won't work, and if the mothership authentication servers go offline stuff stops working. I will not buy videos or songs that have DRM - HOWEVER, a streaming video subscription service is by definition already a rental service. On that type of arrangement I truly don't care about the DRM because I'm not paying for a copy of what I'm watching and for the most part the DRM doesn't get in the way.

    --
    "People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
  17. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by tepples · · Score: 1

    Netflix is a service you pay for, making you the customer, not just "the product" as with ad-supported services. When you asked Netflix support how to use the service with a PC keyboard, what was the form letter?

    Do you have a disability advocate organization near where you live? Perhaps a support request from such an organization might carry more weight than one from an individual.

  18. Re:How to remove plugin? by tepples · · Score: 4, Informative

    Hamburger menu > Preferences (or Options) > Content > Play DRM content

    Turn it off and no CDM will run.

  19. Good riddance by Eravnrekaree · · Score: 2

    Removing NPAPI is actually a huge improvement, this has only been an invitation for companies to make a fleet of closed source, proprietary plugins that only run on Windows and which contain tons of security problems. Good riddance! Instead, if app developers need to do 3D and and video, they can use the built in browser APIs to do this, like WebGL, implemented better audited open source code available on all the platforms.

    It is Netscape/Mozilla that is primarily to blame for Flash, Java, Unity, Shockwave plugin junk, because Mozilla for a while did not include built in Video and 3D capability for a long time despite enormous demand for this, but did provide plugin APIs which were just an invititation for Windows only plugins that would lock out FreeBSD and so on. There are still too many applications, often corporate custom apps used in corporate and education environments, and online games, that still use the Flash, Unity, and Java junk despite Flash disappearing from many sites like YouTube. We have Mozilla to blame for this plugin mess. Hopefully it will now go away for good and take all of its binary blogs, crappy proprietary code and so on with it.

    Now, Firefox finally needs to get sandboxing and multiprocess to work to further security and safety, something that should have been done eons ago like Google Chrome has done.

  20. Re:Support for Linux... by Eravnrekaree · · Score: 1

    Getting rid of NPAPI will be a win for Linux as it will stop companies from making OS dependant binary blob plugins and force them to use the built in browser 3D, audio and video APIs instead.

  21. Re:This move from modularity to massive monoliths. by Eravnrekaree · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Most Firefox memory use is due to memory leaks and caching of image data, rather than actual code. What the browser could and needs to do is allow for more on the fly decompression of image so off screen images are not stored in memory uncompressed and allow the user to set the maximum size of the image cache. Google Chrome seems to do a little better because each tab is a different process, there is more chance for memory to reclaimed by the OS when a tab is closed and the process killed. Firefox is one big process that just accumulates leaked memory.

  22. Re:This move from modularity to massive monoliths. by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

    Are you saying that all libraries for browsers is being loaded statically at startup?

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  23. Re:This move from modularity to massive monoliths. by MightyMartian · · Score: 1

    I'm in agreement. If Netflix wants to throw out DRM-laden video, well, I'm only paying like $12 a month, so I'm willing to concede them the point. I'm not buying the videos, as you say, so if distribution means DRM-capable infrastructure, then so be it.

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  24. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by ausekilis · · Score: 4, Funny

    Dear Sir/Ma'am,

    Our client, pecosdave, suffers from the debilitating disease of Laziness wherein he cannot be bothered to use a mouse or mouse-like interface to use your service, "Netflix". Our client has sent not zero, but exactly 1 (one) email to your customer support asking for proper keyboard support for your services web browser client. As described in his email, he is able to use arrow keys and the space bar without problem, and mashing his hand down on a keyboard as a response to your "Are you still watching?" prompt. However, anything that requires our client to sit up and move his arm around causes him considerable pain and mental anguish. We politely ask for your assistance in aiding our client and others stricken with Laziness in providing proper keyboard support for your platform.

    Sincerely,

    Real-life Lawyer
    Association of Lazy People

  25. Widevine by GrievousMistake · · Score: 3, Informative

    This is the same buggy piece of crap that led to root exploit on many Android phones, since of course a media player needs privileged access to the kernel.

    http://bits-please.blogspot.co...

    But don't worry, that was a fluke, I'm sure the opaque blob for the PC is written by their best men, and not the scum of the earth who failed their McDonalds job interview.
    The complete loss of security to all their users is a small price to pay to eradicate unlicensed copying of movies once and for all!

    --
    In a fair world, refrigerators would make electricity.
  26. Re:Where's the source code by lgw · · Score: 1

    Why is it an issue? If you don't want to watch streamed Hollywood movies, the plugin won't be plugged-in. It's not going to reach out and stop your torrents, FFS.

    --
    Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  27. Re:This move from modularity to massive monoliths. by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 1

    I mostly concur.

    I was under the impression, anecdotal evidence based on experience, that Firefox leaded memory via it's Flash video player. I found that once I stopped using Firefox for YouTube it seemed to never really leak memory anymore.

    But yeah, Chrome's one tab = on process is a smarter design.

  28. Re:Firefox: Kitchen Sink Edition by CaptSlaq · · Score: 1

    Legacy security holes are bad. If no one's willing to continue to maintain the interface, it should be removed.

  29. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by pecosdave · · Score: 1

    ICON = Idiots Can Operate Now
    GUI = Goober User Interface
    I use WIndows because I don't know how to use a computer.

    All things I said in the 90's.

    My real reason for wanting to be able to use my keyboard is I built a Kodi system and put all of my media on it. I really don't want to have to switch back to the Wii so my wife and kids can use Netflix, which they can't live without, and Amazon Prime video, which I have.

    That and I have https://amzn.com/B00SIIU2N6 ">this as a control. I can make it work with the crappy little touchpad and have done so, but it breaks the feel of the whole system.

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  30. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by omnichad · · Score: 1

    Just get a Roku for your streaming services. It may not integrate into your HTPC, but it's always-on and low-power. If you have a universal remote already, it supports IR even if it comes with a Bluetooth remote.

  31. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by omnichad · · Score: 1

    Laziness != Convenience && Laziness != WAF

    You can map keyboard keys to IR remote presses, making it work like an easy to understand consumer electronic device.

  32. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by corychristison · · Score: 1

    I use Chromium as basically my HTPC with a simple custom web app (runs locally on the machine) to tie a bunch of services together in Fullscreen Kiosk Mode.

    I use a Mele F10 Deluxe air mouse/keyboard, purchased on Amazon for $30US. You can bind certain keys to certain devices (it has both RF and IR transmitters). I only use IR to turn m TV on and Off, but you can program it to control volume as well.

    In Chromium I use the following extensions to make the experience a little cleaner:
    - No Scroll Bars Please!
    - Smooth Key Scroll
    - uBlock Origin (necessary for Youtube and Spotify)

  33. Debian just moved from iceweasel to firefox - by xtronics · · Score: 1

    Sounds like we will have to back track?

    Not sure how this plays out?

  34. Re:Firefox: Kitchen Sink Edition by roca · · Score: 1

    I'm not sure what you're implying here. This is about removing a large chunk of very old cruft and replacing it with something much smaller and much more tightly constrained.

  35. Re:Where's the source code by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Why is it an issue? If you don't want to watch streamed Hollywood movies, the plugin won't be plugged-in. It's not going to reach out and stop your torrents, FFS.

    The issue is that we want an open source browser that's free from proprietary binary blobs. We're worried becuase "Mozilla plan to support the Widevine CDM ... without plugins". That is, Widevine won't be an optional plugin anymore. Instead, it appears that this proprietary binary blob will be installed by default for everyone.

    Do you understand that this isn't about watching movies? It's about the principle of open source software.

  36. Re:This move from modularity to massive monoliths. by roca · · Score: 1

    Four, actually. (Five if you count Opera.) Three of which are open-source and have reasonably open development models. Plus the APIs are governed by an open-standards process that anyone can participate in.

    I'm not sure what the point of your message is actually. Are you arguing that NPAPI was a valuable extension point to let people democratically extend the Web platform? Because in practice it was not; the only NPAPI plugin developers could use in practice was Flash. And Flash was 100% Adobe, so did not lend itself to "freedom and control of your own systems".

  37. Re:This move from modularity to massive monoliths. by roca · · Score: 1

    Removing NPAPI in favour of the much more limited CDM interface is a major net reduction in code and attack surface.

    Your hate reflex is definitely misplaced this time.

  38. Re:This move from modularity to massive monoliths. by roca · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Firefox does do "on the fly decompression of images so off screen images are not stored in memory uncompressed".

    When complaining about Firefox memory usage, make sure your understanding of the issues is up-to-date.

  39. Re:Where's the source code by roca · · Score: 1

    Mozilla doesn't distribute any closed-source binary blobs. Firefox downloads the CDM separately. You can configure it to not do that. There's a "don't play DRMed content" checkbox in preferences; I'm not sure if that stops the download, but it will stop the blob being loaded.

  40. Re:Where's the source code by houstonbofh · · Score: 1

    How do you know? Because the company said that is how it works and they would never do anything to harm us?

  41. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by pecosdave · · Score: 1

    EXACTLY

    WAF is a very heavy considering in my HTPC. Putting all my movies, music, and photos on KODI has a high WAF, however having to go to the Wii or use a clunky touchpad for Netflix is very low on her tolerance list. She will generally switch to the Wii so she doesn't have to deal with the stupid browser launcher and touchpad.

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    The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
  42. Re:Where's the source code by roca · · Score: 1

    Because the code that loads the CDM blob is open source. If you don't trust the binaries distributed by Mozilla you can build it yourself.

  43. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by omnichad · · Score: 1

    Definitely see my recommendation for Roku in my other post, then. I was a one-device guy before Roku. Great UI, even if Netflix subverts it a bit too much. https://www.roku.com/how-it-wo...

  44. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by pecosdave · · Score: 1

    I've seriously considered getting one of those TV's that has built in Roku. If I'm not mistaken it will play back the media on my Kodi box anyways.

    (I'm still on a CRT for now, long story)

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    The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
  45. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by omnichad · · Score: 1

    I'd recommend not. If you can avoid a TV with Smart functionality, you can have a box that's easily replaced to upgrade even after the TV warranty is over.

    Also, if you want a Roku TV, you have to buy one made by TCL. Their TV's aren't terrible, but having a choice is worth the extra money for a separate box.

  46. Re:Great, can we get keyboard naviation from Netfl by spire3661 · · Score: 1

    Get her a FireTv/Roku and call it a day. I have several fire breathing HTPCs, with badass GPUs, but the wife only sees the FireTV for Amazon, Netflix and Kodi. She has her own remote and input, I even labeled the input with her name. This lets me go as crazy as i want with my HTPCs without worrying about accommodating normal users.

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    Good-bye