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India's Richest Man Launches 4G LTE Network, Offers Unlimited Free Voice Calls (mashable.com)

Posted by msmash on from the wow dept.

An anonymous reader writes: India's biggest industrial house has launched its 4G LTE network and is offering unlimited free voice calls forever to anyone who signs up for its services. It is also claiming to offer the cheapest 4G LTE data rates in the world. After numerous delays and months of testing, India's richest man, Mukesh Ambani, today announced the commercial availability of Reliance Jio's mobile services. The conglomerate's Jio services, which users can avail starting Sept. 5, is offering a nation-wide LTE network coverage, coupled with free voice plans and best data tariff Indian consumers have ever seen. Jio's network is being touted as the largest 4G LTE deployment anywhere in the world, Ambani said, adding that the network is also "future proof" with baked in support for upcoming 5G and 6G network technologies. Jio's 4G coverage is available in 18,000 cities in the country, and over 200,000 remote areas. The company aims to extend the coverage to 90 percent of India's population by next year. Reliance Industries has invested $22 billion in Jio, and has been working on the roll-out for last five years.

57 of 92 comments (clear)

  1. Kingsman by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    some kind of evil plan?

  2. I saw that movie... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    You'll go wild for this cell service. It'll blow your mind!

  3. Not free by sjbe · · Score: 3, Insightful

    India's biggest industrial house has launched its 4G LTE network and is offering unlimited free voice calls forever to anyone who signs up for its services.

    If there is a monthly fee for the service then they aren't free. On a unit cost basis (per call) it might be cheap if someone makes a lot of calls but it isn't free. If the network has enough bandwidth the marginal cost of allowing additional calls within the network is a good approximation of zero. There is an upper cap to the amount of bandwidth a single phone can use for voice calling so once the network exceeds that capability there really is no reason to bill by the minute anymore.

    Ambani said, adding that the network is also "future proof" with baked in support for upcoming 5G and 6G network technologies.

    Sounds like puffery to me.

    1. Re:Not free by mjwx · · Score: 1

      India's biggest industrial house has launched its 4G LTE network and is offering unlimited free voice calls forever to anyone who signs up for its services.

      If there is a monthly fee for the service then they aren't free. On a unit cost basis (per call) it might be cheap if someone makes a lot of calls but it isn't free. If the network has enough bandwidth the marginal cost of allowing additional calls within the network is a good approximation of zero. There is an upper cap to the amount of bandwidth a single phone can use for voice calling so once the network exceeds that capability there really is no reason to bill by the minute anymore.

      By the sounds of it, the way it's being advertised, you pay for network access only (the ability to connect to the network) with maybe text included, voice and data are add on packs. This is not the first country I've seen this done in.

      Not everything is advertised in overpriced plans like in the US. Currently paying GBP 12 a month for 2 GB of data (plus some minutes and texts I don't use) on PAYG.

      Now the real profit for this telco comes from the customer data that will be sold and the ads that will be sent to customers and injected in their page loads. This crap is, sadly commonplace in most developing countries.

      Ambani said, adding that the network is also "future proof" with baked in support for upcoming 5G and 6G network technologies.

      Sounds like puffery to me.

      In other words, standard marketspeak.

      I've never heard a telco advertise an obsolete network even when it's years behind everyone else. Not so long ago in Oz, 2mbit ADSL was "Super Fast(TM)". Kind of laughing at Australia now I live in the UK and get 150mbit fibre, I shouldn't, but those idiots voted in the LNP twice so I'm revelling in the schadenfreude

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    2. Re:Not free by mark-t · · Score: 1

      Even with a fee for the service, if it does not matter how often or how much you use that service, it amortizes to being effectively free. The limit of some fixed positive number over x as x approaches infinity is zero. If the fixed positive number is small enough relative to average income levels, then even the fixed cost is inconsequential.

      --
      File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
    3. Re:Not free by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Good job on having that in England. You must be very proud. This article is about a new thing in India though. Maybe the next article will be about you. Then we can talk about the things you have.

    4. Re:Not free by unixisc · · Score: 2

      What does the phone plan of a cellular provider have to do w/ the type of society a country is?

    5. Re:Not free by asliarun · · Score: 1

      The real question is - do you have VOIP integrated with your cellphone and your phone number? To my knowledge, every single cellphone service provider charges separately for voice, and this is always a mandatory charge. Even Google Fi which uses VOIP for voice calls charges $20 a month for voice, and then $10 a month for every 1GB used (which rolls over).

      Nobody offers a cellphone with a phone number where you are only charged for data usage and for nothing else. At least to my knowledge. As such, what Jio is doing in India is what all wireless telecom companies will be doing in the future. Especially since the entire backhaul is IP based anyway. They will all become ISPs.

    6. Re:Not free by quenda · · Score: 1

      The real question is - do you have VOIP integrated with your cellphone and your phone number?

      The old Nokias had VoIP fully integrated. With Android, it needs a 3rd party app, but is semi-integrated.

      With LTE, aren't all voice calls packet-switched anyway?

    7. Re:Not free by SlaveToTheGrind · · Score: 1

      If the network has enough bandwidth the marginal cost of allowing additional calls within the network is a good approximation of zero. There is an upper cap to the amount of bandwidth a single phone can use for voice calling so once the network exceeds that capability there really is no reason to bill by the minute anymore.

      This is one of those statements that's tantalizingly close to right in theory, but badly wrong in the real world.

      First, wireless providers don't design systems to have oodles of unused bandwidth sitting around at any given time -- that would force them to charge subscribers more for no perceived benefit. So for a real-world system that is running close to capacity, an extended burst of voice traffic caused by a bunch of people making long phone calls all at the same time because... free (think about how people used to modify their calling behavior to get inside a cell provider's "free nights and weekends" envelope), is just about the furthest thing from "a good approximation of zero" you can get.

      Second, the net effect on other data traffic is much worse than the voice data's actual percentage of the bandwidth, because the networks give voice traffic a higher priority because of latency requirements.

      The net result of all this is that the cost of the data plans will have to factor in the increase in voice traffic due to unmetered voice calls -- there is no free lunch. Not surprisingly, TFA tells us that's exactly how it already works in India:

      The world's second most populous nation, India, already has some of the cheapest voice calling plans but data remains expensive for most subscribers.

      I'll be curious how the data rates for this new service actually pan out if/when its billionaire owner stops effectively subsidizing them.

  4. Re: My mom still call me by JcMorin · · Score: 1

    My mother would still pick up the phone and call me. I agree with you it's in decline but I would not rule that out yet... the number of phone call per day is still very high!

  5. For customer service... by seven+of+five · · Score: 1, Troll

    He'll set up a cut-rate call center in Atlanta, and tell the good 'ol boys to answer the phone as 'Arnav,' 'Sai,' and 'Vihaan'...

    1. Re:For customer service... by houghi · · Score: 1

      Obviously, as you can work people to death and don't have to give them days off and when they are free, you can still ask them to come in. Just got a kid? I do not care, work and leave the kid to die or don't work and it starves.
      And if you complain, you are a communist.

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    2. Re:For customer service... by unixisc · · Score: 1

      They have people working in shifts, so nobody works the way you are describing. Talking about the companies here - Reliance, Airtel, Tata, et al

    3. Re:For customer service... by asliarun · · Score: 1

      He'll set up a cut-rate call center in Atlanta, and tell the good 'ol boys to answer the phone as 'Arnav,' 'Sai,' and 'Vihaan'...

      That would be defined as "reverse outsourcing".

      Why would it be reverse anything? It would just be outsourcing.

  6. forever ? by ardmhacha · · Score: 3, Interesting

    "offering unlimited free voice calls forever to anyone who signs up for its services"

    A promise that cannot be kept.

    1. Re:forever ? by Duhfus · · Score: 1

      While they likely won't keep this promise, I don't understand why this promise can't be kept.
      Their announced model seems to be charge for data and not for calls or text. Why is this not viable?

  7. Free voice does not mean free plan by mark-t · · Score: 1

    Lots of posts so far referencing Kingsman, but I would think that this only means that the number of voice calls or how long you talk does not create any additional cost to whatever fixed rate you pay everything that is bundled with the service.

    I have free unlimited calls nationwide on my cell phone plan too... but I still pay for it, One fixed monthly rate... It's not that big a deal.

    --
    File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
    1. Re:Free voice does not mean free plan by asliarun · · Score: 1

      considering we pay $80 plus taxes for voice service on three feature phones (and that is without nationwide roaming or unlimited minutes.. that would be something like $30-35 more and take us off our old pre-verizon plan), chopping off voice calls from the bill and charging a measly 75 cents for a gigabyte of data sounds like a hell of a deal.

      india must not have ridiculous baked-in per-line taxes, fees and other 'mandatory' charges for voice and not have the stupid money merry-go-round between carriers for each voice call.. so they can basically eliminate voice from phone plans completely. it's a wonderful idea. the u.s. will never see such a thing.

      Try Google Fi which uses VOIP but is integrated with your phone and you get a phone number just like a conventional phone. They still charge you $20 a month for voice and $10 for 1GB but you do get the benefits of VOIP such as national/international roaming for free, very low priced international calling rates etc.

      But yes, this is all made possible because Jio has its own backhaul network that is entirely IP packet based. This is what telecoms will become in the future. ISPs.

  8. "Baked in" before they decide on recipe? by daboochmeister · · Score: 3, Informative

    The 5G spec isn't stable yet, and isn't the 6G spec just a glint in someone's eye at this point? Not sure how he could have "baked in" support for them yet ...

    --
    "Ahh! I see you're in that indeterminate Schrodinger state where - oh, uh ... never mind." Dave Bucci
    1. Re:"Baked in" before they decide on recipe? by mark-t · · Score: 1

      This is kinda what I was wondering about here too.... it makes me a bit suspect that something is going on that isn't kosher.

      --
      File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
    2. Re:"Baked in" before they decide on recipe? by unixisc · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't buying extra frequency bands cover for it? Unless 5G and 6G completely changes the way data is transmitted from RF signals to, say, UV signals or something?

    3. Re:"Baked in" before they decide on recipe? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The 5G spec isn't stable yet, and isn't the 6G spec just a glint in someone's eye at this point? Not sure how he could have "baked in" support for them yet ...

      This could just mean that the backhaul to the towers will support the higher data rates.

    4. Re:"Baked in" before they decide on recipe? by Scarred+Intellect · · Score: 1

      The 5G spec isn't stable yet, and isn't the 6G spec just a glint in someone's eye at this point? Not sure how he could have "baked in" support for them yet ...

      It's easy. You've already got the tower!

      All you have to do is change the equipment, data lines, power lines, and antennas!

      Or maybe "baked in" support means the tower supports are literally baked in clay...

    5. Re:"Baked in" before they decide on recipe? by unixisc · · Score: 1

      Does equipment always need to get changed, or would firmware/software updates take care of what's needed? I'm assuming that data lines and power lines won't be different for 5G and 6G, or would they?

    6. Re:"Baked in" before they decide on recipe? by Scarred+Intellect · · Score: 1

      I really don't know. Depends on power consumption, more data means more power...might have to upgrade to bigger/more power lines to the devices...maybe that's what they've already accounted for. Same with data lines.

  9. Re:Great just what we need by houghi · · Score: 1

    Most likely no international calls as that would mean he needs to pay others that do the connection. For international calls VoIP will still be much cheaper. Look around and you get unlimited callsfor free for 6 months when you pay 10USD and then you pay 1c per minute till your 10USD is gone, adding anothter 1000 minutes.

    --
    Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
  10. The real question is... by sudden.zero · · Score: 1

    ...will Eggsy save the world this time?

  11. Re:Was this not a plot in a movie recently? by sudden.zero · · Score: 1

    Yes, it was called "The Kingsmen: The Secret Service"

  12. Nice piece by campuscodi · · Score: 1

    That's some good reporting right there. Nice job Manish!

  13. Sounds like the plot to the movie Kingsman by JoeyRox · · Score: 1

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

  14. This is different from Reliance's other mobile? by unixisc · · Score: 1

    For those who don't know, Reliance is already one of the leading telecom companies in India. Already offers both GSM and CDMA services. Just wondering - how is Jio different, other than being 4G?

    And they are still way behind Airtel, which has had 4G for the last 3 years.

    1. Re:This is different from Reliance's other mobile? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      There are TWO reliance companies in India.
      Reliance ADAG (Anil Dhirubhai Ambani Group) that owns the incumbent Reliance Communications that is the one you are mentioning isn't doing well.

      Second Reliance is Reliance MDAG (Mukesh DAG) that owns RIL - Reliance Industries Limited, that has launched Reliance Jio.

      So, from Sept 5th there will be TWO reliance companies offering telecom in India:
      Reliance Communications
      Reliance Jio.

  15. Still a lie by sjbe · · Score: 1

    It means no additional charge for calls, regardless of how many you make.

    No shit Sherlock. It's still a lie. The calls are not and could not be free. It just means that they pay a fixed cost instead of a variable cost but there still is a cost. I don't think anyone is confused but it is false to say it is free.

  16. Re:Free voice calls by unixisc · · Score: 1

    Not true in India. Having visited there quite a bit, people are always on their cellphones - talking, texting/WhatsApp'ing and FaceBook

  17. Re:No way! by unixisc · · Score: 1

    In India, SIM cards are never free, unless they happen to come in the box in which your phone comes

  18. Re:Advertisement? by unixisc · · Score: 1

    But wouldn't it be strange posting an ad for a service that's only available in India on a site primarily read in the US?

  19. Bounded by sjbe · · Score: 1

    Even with a fee for the service, if it does not matter how often or how much you use that service, it amortizes to being effectively free.

    If you make one phone call per billing cycle the price does not amortize to even close to free. Even if you use it a lot the price per call might be cheap but it will not and cannot be free. It might be inconsequential but it isn't zero.

    The limit of some fixed positive number over x as x approaches infinity is zero.

    There is an upper bound on the number of minutes a phone can be used in a billing cycle. Infinity does not ever come into the discussion. To make up some bogus numbers for a 28 day billing cycle, the most a phone could possibly be used is 40,320 minutes if it was used 24/7. If the flat fee per month is $100 then the per minute rate is effectively $0.00248. Very cheap to be sure but not free.

    1. Re:Bounded by mark-t · · Score: 1

      If you make one phone call per billing cycle the price does not amortize to even close to free.

      True, but if you are on a month-to-month plan and not using a burner phone, then you are spending that money anyway. It becomes part of your monthly cost of living.

      If you prefer to use a burner instead of paying every month for a service, that's fine... but not everyone does that.

      --
      File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
  20. Casting starts now... by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 1

    Samuel L. Jackson will probably play him in the inevitable biopic.

    --
    It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
  21. Re:Free voice calls by Maritz · · Score: 1

    That's easy when nobody uses voice anymore.

    I can't even remember the last person I spoke with that wasn't a telemarketer or some kind of recorded spam.

    Looks like you went and generalised from your case to everybody. It's led you astray here. Loads and loads of people make loads and loads of calls. Every day.

    --
    I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
  22. Re:Free voice calls by JustAnotherOldGuy · · Score: 1

    That's easy when nobody uses voice anymore.

    I can't even remember the last person I spoke with that wasn't a telemarketer or some kind of recorded spam.

    Yes, that must be why AT&T and Sprint are shutting down their voice service and going to text-only.

    --
    Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
  23. Unlimited unlimited? by kimgkimg · · Score: 1

    So is that "Unlimited" unlimited, or Unlimited unlimited?

    1. Re:Unlimited unlimited? by Anne+Thwacks · · Score: 1

      Don't forget, "forever" in Telco-speak means "10 days, or till our shares value is affected, which ever is first".

      --
      Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
  24. Re:Free voice calls by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    [Citation needed]

  25. Re:Free voice calls by haruchai · · Score: 1

    Yeah, that's what happens when you don't know anyone in real life and you never leave your mommy's basement.

    But for us regular humans, lots of us make and receive voice calls.

    We regular humans also get a lot of info out of voice that's not easily extractable from text.
    And the voices, tones, timbre & pitch of so many of my female friends are beautiful and can't be replaced with "Lol, how rlly awesom3 :-D"

    --
    Pain is merely failure leaving the body
  26. Kingsmen by whoozwah · · Score: 1

    this sounds suspiciously like the plot from "The Kingsmen"

  27. Re:Free voice calls by Anne+Thwacks · · Score: 1

    Why not, if you are happy with 110 baud? (They are very flakey at 300 baud).

    --
    Sent from my ASR33 using ASCII
  28. Never reliance. by freedom_india · · Score: 1

    Worst customer service. The Comcast of india. Hard to activate. Harder to cancel.

    --
    "Doing what i can, with what i have." ~ Burt Gummer
    1. Re:Never reliance. by golden_hands · · Score: 1

      Worst customer service. The Comcast of india. Hard to activate. Harder to cancel.

      This... I would rather pay more for every call than take a connection from Reliance. They are always keen to take your money, but the moment a problem crops up( as it inevitably does) you are left to swim on your own. Anil or Mukesh Ambani- which ever brother it is from, unless you have a lot of time and a lot of patience its better to avoid Reliance.

  29. Re:Free voice calls by SScorpio · · Score: 1

    Ford Sync is doing something like that. The car can do monthly system diagnostic checks. When it sends them out, it does a voice call instead of relying on the phone having a data connection.

  30. Re:Great just what we need by Compumyst · · Score: 1

    Okay, unlike T-Mobile and now Sprint's very fluid (and wrong) usage of "unlimited data" (classifying video as something other than data is incorrect), saying "unlimited free calls" doesn't specify the geographical boundaries, so "national" calling can easily be assumed.

    --
    What's done's in the past, forever shall last.
    Work is work; life is life; fair is not!
  31. Not bad by OneHundredAndTen · · Score: 1

    Although it might have been more useful for him to invest that money to provide toilets for the more than 600 million Indian citizens who lack them. Well, at the very least they will be able to use their phones while taking a shit in some public lot.

  32. Re: Great just what we need by hackwrench · · Score: 1

    No matter how you look at it the parent post was poorly written and led with international calls, so that had me confused

  33. Here Please ! by JimSadler · · Score: 1

    Come to the US. It might be a great option here.

  34. Re:Was this not a plot in a movie recently? by WindBourne · · Score: 1

    that depends on how many ppl die using it.
    If none, then no, it was not.

    --
    I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
  35. Govt must nationalize Reliance Industries; by NewYork · · Score: 1

    Ambani owes 100,000 crores to Banks;
    Govt must nationalize Reliance Industries;
    https://www.change.org/p/india...

    --
    Casteism