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Russia To Block LinkedIn After Court Ruling on User Data (go.com)

Posted by msmash on from the privacy-woes dept.

Social network for professionals LinkedIn faces being blocked in Russia after a court ruled it broke a law on data storage. From a report on AP:Moscow city court spokeswoman Ulyana Solopova tells The Associated Press that the court rejected an appeal Thursday by LinkedIn against a district court's decision that the company had broken a law that requires personal data on Russian citizens to be stored on servers within Russia. Solopova says LinkedIn can appeal Thursday's ruling. The case was brought by Roskomnadzor, the Russian state telecommunications and media regulator.

24 of 44 comments (clear)

  1. haha - Russian government is so ignorant by iggymanz · · Score: 1

    You can't block any Russian that wants to use Linkedin, short of severing all comm out of Russia. Proxies, vpn, etc. What morons.

    1. Re:haha - Russian government is so ignorant by Maritz · · Score: 1

      Knowing what a proxy is and preventing any from being used are two different things.

      --
      I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
    2. Re:haha - Russian government is so ignorant by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      I'm italian. Italian government (and so do other European countries, but I know the details just for my country) are routinely blocking servers (mostly http(s) servers...So websites) for very disparate reasons in court rulings (child abuse, sexual content, defamation, infringing on copyright and registered trademarks etc.).

      Those server are almost never in the country (When they happen to be in the country they just send the police to the physical location). The block is usually a simple DNS block, they force all national ISPs to make the DNS records of the blocked sites point to a specific, state operated IP address. In a few cases I know they also forced providers to pollute routing tables, but that has other technical issues so that technique is usually avoided.

      All technicians know that method is not bulletproof and also judges and politicians know, but it's not a problem for them, because 99% of the users don't know how to work around such a block (and don't care enough to spend 3 minutes on it), and blocking 99% of users is more than what they need.

      This applies in this case too. causing 90% or even just 75% of Russian linked in traffic to disappear could be bad enough for linkedin as a punishment.

    3. Re:haha - Russian government is so ignorant by micahraleigh · · Score: 1

      You don't seem to understand how when the government punishes companies other people end up paying for it.

      The people in Russia should decide whether they want to use LinkedIn. Their government shouldn't make that decision on their behalf.

      I can't imagine how you can make the case that LinkedIn is a threat to society while ISIS is going around blowing up all kinds of stuff.

    4. Re:haha - Russian government is so ignorant by dallaylaen · · Score: 1

      They are nowhere near stupid.

      They don't want to reliably deny Russian citizens access to some specific sites (why would a sane government ever want that?).

      They want to be able to quickly suppress any protest rally on the internet when the hour comes (if it comes at all). To achieve that, they don't need to patch all the holes; it's enough to know where holes are. Should the hour come, all sites used for hosting protestant communication will be shut down "due to technical reasons" (if not completely legally by that time - new legislation is being passed all the time) and all proxy IPs will be banned on ISP level.

      This means that one needs to block sites which few technically savvy people need badly, but which are not crucial to the general public. Such tactic reveals proxy/vpn endpoints and other evasion methods without causing an uproar. Which they did twice to github (re-allowing it back both times), and which they seem to be doing to linkedin now.

      --
      WYSIWIG, but what you see might not be what you need
    5. Re:haha - Russian government is so ignorant by kelemvor4 · · Score: 1

      You don't seem to understand how when the government punishes companies other people end up paying for it. The people in Russia should decide whether they want to use LinkedIn. Their government shouldn't make that decision on their behalf. I can't imagine how you can make the case that LinkedIn is a threat to society while ISIS is going around blowing up all kinds of stuff.

      Russia can, and has, decided linkedin is a threat to society by not following Russia's laws regarding where their citizens' personal data is stored. The whole thing sounds very reasonable to me.

    6. Re:haha - Russian government is so ignorant by iggymanz · · Score: 1

      The whole thing sounds like Russia has a stupid and control freak filled government to me.

    7. Re:haha - Russian government is so ignorant by micahraleigh · · Score: 1

      I'm okay with you saying you would not personally be happy. I'm actually glad you are aware of what you would want. Most people don't get that far.

      What's not okay with me is you then forcing everyone in your country to adopt your opinion as well.

  2. Will just balkanize the web by tepples · · Score: 1

    Requirements of domestic storage of information related to a particular country's citizens will just balkanize the web into a silo per country. Otherwise, when citizens of one country that requires domestic storage (such as Russia) interact with citizens of another country that requires domestic storage, on whose soil shall the record of their interaction be stored?

    1. Re:Will just balkanize the web by caseih · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I think the regime knows exactly what they are doing. By passing a law that is virtually impossible for most internet entities to comply with, they are creating the legal framework to strictly control information dissemination in Russia. Even better, it's couched in terms that the masses approve of in principle, such as protecting privacy from foreigners who would exploit you.

      Sure there are ways to route around the damage, but those are summarily grouped under anti-terror laws.

      It's a brilliant scheme, one that is becoming increasingly common across the world. And it's very pernicious and subtle. Governments can now do things that were only dreamed of years ago by dictatorships and the tin-pot kingdoms of history.

      Thank goodness trump will make America great again.Oh wait, what's that? He's been in talks with the soviets since before the election? Oops.

    2. Re:Will just balkanize the web by tepples · · Score: 2, Interesting

      How is this law impossible to comply with? Put some servers in Russia. That's it.

      Perhaps a more concrete example might be easier to understand: If information about Russian users is stored on servers in Russia, and information about German users is stored on servers in Germany, then on whose soil shall information about interaction between Russian and German users be stored?

    3. Re:Will just balkanize the web by nitehawk214 · · Score: 1

      Uhh, yeah, that is exactly the point. For the country to have complete control of all web traffic within its borders.

      --
      I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
    4. Re:Will just balkanize the web by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      poland

    5. Re:Will just balkanize the web by caseih · · Score: 1

      How do you figure? It's definitely not practical for every web site out there that might require "user information" of some kind to put a server in Russia. Even a popular site like slashdot is not going to put a server in Russia. If I run a forum that requires registration of some kind, and therefore user data storage on my server, if I can't afford to place my server in Russia, then the government can, under this sort of law, block access to my site. Now it may not matter to me, since I don't care about Russian users (no money in it for me anyway). And maybe at the moment the law speaks only to sites that actually sell something to Russians, or involve money. But that will change. And as it changes this becomes, in the true sense of the word, censorship. Justified by the law. Maybe Russians were using my forum to speak negatively about their government, and even plan a campaign to peacefully take back power from Putin. Now they can't.

      This pattern is playing out in other countries as well, including Turkey. This should raise significant red flags in everyone's minds. It could never happen here, I'm sure many think. But the erosion of rights and freedoms in the west over the last 15 years has shown that it can happen, and I suspect it will. If we think it won't happen in Russia we're particularly fooling ourselves. The Russian government has little use for dissenting voices.

    6. Re:Will just balkanize the web by Luthair · · Score: 1

      Consider as someone outside Russia, your local server couldn't have a near copy of the data about a Russian which cause a delay and lacks redundancy. Any search would need to be orchestrated globally via servers in every country. And due to storage requirements none of it can be cached.

      That said, this is only an issue for services like Facebook & LinkedIn whose sole purpose is to disseminate the information they hold about you. Its an entirely appropriate restriction for medical information, financial, etc.

    7. Re:Will just balkanize the web by tepples · · Score: 1

      "Name of Russian guy is..." and "Name of German guy is..." are user data though. If displaying a single page requires the server to ping servers in a dozen different countries to retrieve the name and photo of a dozen different users appearing on a particular user's timeline, that could become impractical.

    8. Re:Will just balkanize the web by rainmouse · · Score: 1

      on whose soil shall information about interaction between Russian and German users be stored?

      that would be the NSA's soil

      And thus, the heart of the issue was reached.

    9. Re:Will just balkanize the web by currently_awake · · Score: 1

      Do you want a hostile foreign power to control your citizens communications? To have unlimited access to everything but you don't? The USA has a documented history of overthrowing foreign governments they don't like, and Russia has plenty of reason to believe they are (or will be) attacked this way.

  3. Re:Now you know it is a STATION WAGON, right? by avandesande · · Score: 1

    Wouldn't it be funny if Ferrari made a car with a purple decal on the side that said 'sport'?

    --
    love is just extroverted narcissism
  4. Not a big deal by dallaylaen · · Score: 1

    There are hh.ru and moikrug.ru (which effectively mirrors linkedin's functionality) for those looking for a job in Russia. I bet there's a party at both offices! (Well, given the time difference, they should be already drunk).

    However, the trend is disturbing. Roskomnazgul is taking on larger and larger targets. If they get an uproar, they fall back immediately (like with github and wikipedia). If there's no uproar, they move on. One bit at a time.

    --
    WYSIWIG, but what you see might not be what you need
  5. "Just" put "some" servers in Russia by dallaylaen · · Score: 1

    How is this law impossible to comply with? Put some servers in Russia. That's it.

    It's not that easy in practice. For instance, one can run a fairly big site on MySQL, but if there's requirement to put part of the storage in a specific place, the choice is limited:

    1. Rewrite the software to handle distributed database;
    2. Run a totally separate entity in Russia (same logo, same software and nothing much else in common);
    3. Move ALL data storage to Russia.

    In theory, a common database with master-master replication is possible, but that's not actually compliant with the law because Russian citizens' data gets stored abroad in the end.

    For giants like Google and Facebook who already use distributed custom databases that's peanuts. For a (say) low-cost airline, not so much.

    --
    WYSIWIG, but what you see might not be what you need
  6. No no no by fubarrr · · Score: 2

    >Perhaps a more concrete example might be easier to understand: If information about Russian users is stored on servers in Russia, and information about German users is stored on servers in Germany,

    Here how it was designed to work:

    1. KGB knocks on Google's Moscow's office and says: you are not keeping data on dissident A, B. and C in Russia because their spooks can't find them in the data they intercept

    2. Google responds that A, B, and C registered their accounts outside of Russia

    3. KGB claims that they didn't and threaten Google to close them down if they keep withholding data of "Russians"

    4. Google gives KGB access to a full mirror of their database including people who have nothing to do with Russia

    In 2013, Google gave Russian government an SSL key from their Russian Google market server, most likely with full understanding how Russians will use it (and they thought that they will use it to spy on their own dissidents). But Russians used that SSL certificate to do MITM attacks to remotely install spyware on phones of British members of parliament in Britain. After that, Google disbanded their Russian office, only leaving some non-tech operations people in Saint Petersburg. Of course they also invalidated that individual certificate (Google market was not tied to a specific SSL cert as long as it was signed by Google).

  7. Re:Now you know it is a STATION WAGON, right? by lgw · · Score: 1

    Sort of like this?

    --
    Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
  8. Re:Now you know it is a STATION WAGON, right? by avandesande · · Score: 1

    thinking more of things like chrysler minivan with 'sport' on the side of it, but that will do :)

    --
    love is just extroverted narcissism