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White House Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without Reforms (reuters.com)

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Reuters: The Trump administration does not want to reform an internet surveillance law to address privacy concerns, a White House official told Reuters on Wednesday, saying it is needed to protect national security. The announcement could put President Donald Trump on a collision course with Congress, where some Republicans and Democrats have advocated curtailing the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, or FISA, parts of which are due to expire at the end of the year. The FISA law has been criticized by privacy and civil liberties advocates as allowing broad, intrusive spying. It gained renewed attention following the 2013 disclosures by former National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden that the agency carried out widespread monitoring of emails and other electronic communications. Portions of the law, including a provision known as Section 702, will expire on Dec. 31 unless Congress reauthorizes them. Section 702 enables two internet surveillance programs called Prism and Upstream, classified details of which were revealed by Snowden. Democratic and Republican lawmakers have said reforms to Section 702 are needed, in part to ensure the privacy protections on Americans are not violated. The U.S. House of Representatives' Judiciary Committee met Wednesday to discuss possible changes to the law.

40 of 61 comments (clear)

  1. But Trump is the Emperor by fredrated · · Score: 1, Insightful

    so Congress should just give him anything he wants!

    1. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by Geoffrey.landis · · Score: 2

      So far, the Republicans in Congress have been following along with Trump's lead. It seems unlikely that they will pick this as the issue to break ranks with him.

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      http://www.geoffreylandis.com
    2. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by the_Bionic_lemming · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It's unfortunate that they are going to just let this be renewed, it was bad enough under Bush, but at least they are not expanding it like Obama did.

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      _ _ _ Go for the eyes Boo! GO FOR THE EYES!
    3. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

      That's unfair in this case since they're talking about renewing an existing law. That's much easier than making changes. You have to get those changes approved in both House and Senate committees then approved by both. I was a page for Ted Kennedy in 1977 when he wrote this bill. Blaming Trump for something Ted Kennedy wrote and Jimmy Carter signed is just ingenuous.

    4. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Blaming Twitler, or more likely, President Bannon, is not disingenuous. I almost don't care who wrote it originally, or who signed it. What matters is that it's being renewed now – just as it was about to sunset. The decision to renew it is his, not Kennedy's or Carter's. Do we need it now? Why exactly?

      I don't know, but maybe if we remind the Conservitards that it was a Dem idea, they'll poo poo it solely on that basis.

    5. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by Tokolosh · · Score: 1, Informative

      Democrat Nancy Pelosi has been pushing for these powers all along (except when she is the spyee).

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      Prove anything by multiplying Huge Number times Tiny Number
    6. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by GrumpySteen · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's unfortunate that they are going to just let this be renewed, it was bad enough under Bush, but at least we haven't found out that they're expanding it like Obama did.

      FTFY

      There are still 10 months left in the year for them to decide that Trump deserves even wider surveillance powers to prevent imaginary attacks like the Bowling Green massacre.

    7. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      Ohh, fuck off. Trump has clearly rolled over and is now under establishment control. Anything the establishment wants, Trump will give them and it is back to fuck the majority, over and over and over again. Suckers did the work of the establishment without even knowing it, morons.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    8. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by buck-yar · · Score: 1

      Pelosi actually opposed it from the start http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Poli...

      Whether it was partisan politics, I cannot say. Probably more likely upset over the Bush administration cutting off information going into her oversight committee.

    9. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by buck-yar · · Score: 1

      The full NSA data is available to any agency since Obama signed this executive order https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/...

      DEA using it for drug busts http://www.drugpolicy.org/news...

    10. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by Tokolosh · · Score: 1

      As any conniving politician would, she has her bases covered. I raise you http://www.dailykos.com/story/...

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      Prove anything by multiplying Huge Number times Tiny Number
    11. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      Um, is it better to vote for someone who speaks out against the establishment, and caves in the end, or someone who was outspoken about being part of the establishment? I can't say where Jill Stein fits, as she has never been successfully elected, but Johnson and Clinton were firmly establishment figures.

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      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
    12. Re:But Trump is the Emperor by Coren22 · · Score: 1

      According to State, it usually takes 60 days, so not sure what process you are talking about.

      https://travel.state.gov/conte...

      Perhaps you meant the legal immigration process which hasn't been changed?

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
  2. Thanks Obama/Bush/etc by TrancePhreak · · Score: 2

    People didn't stand up strong enough last time, now this is the new normal. It's always harder to get back rights after they have been taken. Push hard to undo this, but don't expect anything to change. (Remember, they were also doing this before it was legalized).

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    -]Phreak Out[-
  3. Just like the last Administration by mpercy · · Score: 2, Informative

    Pres. Obama did not seek changes for FISA and allowed its renewal. He also oversaw renewal of PATRIOT Act, twice. Well, he signed the a last-minute 4-year extension and then 4 years later signed the USA Freedom Act, which renewed the PATRIOT Act, which had finally expired.

    1. Re:Just like the last Administration by coastwalker · · Score: 2

      I regret to say that America has been no different to the old Soviet Union or East Germany for some decades. It is laughable to think back to the days when we pointed nuclear weapons at them believing them to be the totalitarian enemy and now we are them.

      --
      Facts are history now plebs have politics for religion on social media.
    2. Re:Just like the last Administration by halivar · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That's silly. Alright, I don't like where America is heading, but I grew up a couple miles from the Berlin Wall, and I can tell you that what I saw when I looked out over it looked nothing remotely like America. We do not know fear or hopelessness the way East Germans did. This kind of hysterical false equivalency does not help the cause because it makes pro-privacy look alarmist. We are on a bad trajectory, that's enough to argue from.

    3. Re: Just like the last Administration by halivar · · Score: 1

      No, the East German regime was based on being occupied by a way bigger, more powerful country.

    4. Re:Just like the last Administration by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      True. This is only noteworthy because Trump's campaign pledges included limiting the power of the executive branch and "draining the swamp". He was elected, partly, precisely because he wasn't going to continue with "business as usual".

      So here we are.

    5. Re:Just like the last Administration by AHuxley · · Score: 2

      The paper files on every interesting person are the same, East or West. All the audio tapes, paper files found in East in the early 1990's got presented to the media. The reports back to the Soviet Union.
      Often the same East German workers are now working for Germany as policy advisors. The German press even knows they worked in the East German security bureaucracy and have now found roles in German politics and government.
      Germany now has better computers, the help of the NSA, GCHQ for the BND. The need to protect German democracy at any cost is just a new job for former East German staff. Zersetzung to protect German democracy... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

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      Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
    6. Re:Just like the last Administration by Falconhell · · Score: 1

      You have obviously never visited the rust belt states, they clearly resemble the rot in East Germany.
      Goingby what I see, there is a lot of fear and hopelessness in the US currently, from those not fooled by President baboon.

  4. The Flynn affair really has him rattled by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    The administration seems ready to rubber stamp anything the intelligence creeps want.

  5. Next step by xession · · Score: 1

    Maybe the next step can be for them will be to introduce an internet curfew. It can be a cost saving measure so that data only need be collected between 8am and 4pm monday through thursday. Friday through sunday, we'll be expected to take our agression inhibitors. Close the universities, public schools, and public libraries and then burn the books because those spawn ideas of dissent.

  6. White House Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without Re by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 5, Informative

    SURPRISE!

    But seriously, President Obama was in love with the various spy laws as well...

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    If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
  7. and this surprises ANYONE? by v1 · · Score: 2

    [Insert Government Name Here] Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without Reforms

    That's pretty much a universal truth lately, isn't it?

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    I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
  8. Re:White House Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without by phantomfive · · Score: 1

    Given that most Americans favor the surveillance, including both Republicans and Democrats, it would be rather foolish politically to try to change them. Something bad is going to happen that's bigger than LOVEINT or even spying on politicians, because the NSA has done both of those things.

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    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
  9. In other words... by Lumpy · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Trump is a slimy politician just like all the Career politicians.

    Not one of them give a flying fuck about the constitution.

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    Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    1. Re:In other words... by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      Trump is a slimy politician just like all the Career politicians.

      Not one of them give a flying fuck about the constitution.

      To be fair, Trump only promised to "drain" the swamp. He didn't actually say he'd clean up the muck.

      And truth is, he did. He drained the swamp and exposed all the corruption happening (usually by who he installs). Better to be corrupt in public, it's the Trump way!

  10. Re:So this is part of ... by Tokolosh · · Score: 2

    ...and at what cost?

    Follow the money.

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    Prove anything by multiplying Huge Number times Tiny Number
  11. Re:Obama was for FISA. Trump's just an idiot. by Tokolosh · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Welcome to the new boss, same as the old boss.

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    Prove anything by multiplying Huge Number times Tiny Number
  12. Re:White House Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without by interkin3tic · · Score: 1

    I'd point out that our current president is not an example of majority rule, but that's just a technicality, and yes yes yes, HRC would have been no different.

    I'd more seriously point out that majority rule at least seems to take longer to get to tyranny than minority rule.

  13. Re:White House Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without by interkin3tic · · Score: 2

    We're living in bizarre times. We have the best communication technology available in the history of humankind, and yet it's politically foolish to be a political leader rather than an elected follower.

    Frankly, if anyone could have ended our security state, it's Trump. He was only sorta joking when he said he could shoot someone and his voters wouldn't care. He says "we don't need big brother spying on us" and BAM, a good chunk of america decides we don't need security theater. Which makes it all the more frustrating to see what he chooses to do instead.

  14. Re:White House Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without by phantomfive · · Score: 1

    Yeah, it seems like it's something he doesn't care about either. He probably thinks, "it's a reasonable way to stop terrorists" and it hasn't caused him any problem personally, so what's the big deal?

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    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
  15. Re:White House Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without by s.petry · · Score: 2

    Given that most Americans favor the surveillance, including both Republicans and Democrats...

    This is why majority rule has hit the brick wall. It always ends in tyranny...

    Which is why we are a Republic, and not a pure Democracy. The founders knew that Democracy always fails, there were plenty of historical examples for them to study.

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    -The wise argue that there are few absolutes, the fool argues that there are no probabilities.

  16. After whining about Russian wiretaps? by Qzukk · · Score: 1

    You'd think he'd have SOME reservations about continuing to expand the powers of our three-letter-agencies after they use them to undermine his own cabinet members, but whatever floats his boat, I guess.

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    If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
  17. Re:White House Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    >What are the chances he will ask the NSA to investigate journalists he thinks are creating "fake news"?

    About as likely as the Obama administration's prosecution of journalists doing their jobs...

    https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/30/opinion/sunday/if-donald-trump-targets-journalists-thank-obama.html?_r=0

    Mr. Trump made his animus toward the news media clear during the presidential campaign, often expressing his disgust with coverage through Twitter or in diatribes at rallies. So if his campaign is any guide, Mr. Trump seems likely to enthusiastically embrace the aggressive crackdown on journalists and whistle-blowers that is an important yet little understood component of Mr. Obama’s presidential legacy.

    uh-oh

  18. The future by AHuxley · · Score: 1

    UK political leaders are pushing for diversity in the security services.
    "Why GCHQ needs to fix its diversity problem" (22 November 2016)
    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-379...
    The GCHQ will have to become culturally enriched with lots of new staff.
    Questions of security, merit and skill will no longer hold any applicant back from getting a job in or been rapidly promoted within the UK security services.
    Once staff who are loyal to a cult or only their faith advance up in the UK security services the US will have to rethink any and all sharing with the UK.
    If Canada, Australia and NZ keep on sharing US material with the UK questions about the role of Canada, Australia and NZ will have to be considered by the USA. NATO could see the same staffing issues as the UK. Translators, experts hired with few questions in the EU would rise up the EU ranks, reporting on any US material they find.
    The UK/NATO/EU security services will be as useful and trust worthy to the USA as the UK was in the 1940-60's.
    The only way around this politically motivated hiring policy by the UK security services is for the US to look inward and expand the domestic role of the FBI and NSA. Digital collection will be expanded as it is the only method generations of US officials understand.
    Expect ever more internet tracking as the security services in the US have to protect their own gov staff from the UK gov and its lack of security due to changes in UK staffing policy.
    The staff issues can be seen in the UK for the need to collect everything. The UK cannot trust its own staff so it has to collect on the entire UK population by default to try and find any self/radicalization.

    Such hiring issues might not have reached the more secure parts of the US mil/gov but the US gov had relaxed the legal conditions to apply for entry into the US bureaucracy.
    Issues surrounding criminal records, a criminal past, security issues might not always remove an applicant from consideration for working in some enter level role in the US gov.
    People with no past, no papers, just been made US citizens for some reason, might also be be granted access to some US gov work.
    More cult members, people loyal to their own faith and not the USA will attempt to enter and move up in the US gov over the decades.
    Ever more domestic raw material will have to be gathered in the USA for domestic court use as more people trying to infiltrate the US gov and mil are discovered.
    The lack of any background information been considered normal will allow a lot of interesting people to enter the US gov, UK security services.
    The only reaction to that by the US security services will be more digital collection. The methods perfected by the Soviet Union to place human spies in the UK, and US mil/gov over decades is now been attempted by faith groups and cults.
    Unlike Soviet spies the need to meet a Soviet diplomat or easy to track hander is not an issue.
    Their faith or local community is the only contact needed. A full generational support network within the US or UK. Digital methods will not uncover any issues due to human contacts been used.
    The long term role of the FBI, CIA will have to be expanded to track a lot of new gov workers in the US and UK.
    That might take funding, political access away from the now expanded role of the NSA. Expect more leaking as party political operatives talk to the political motivated press. Operatives from one US agency enter another US agency to leak information to the press to ensure political access is reduced or funding removed.

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    Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
    1. Re:The future by Falconhell · · Score: 1

      I would be more than happy for Australia to cease any involvment with the US, be it millitary or intelligence, because that means our data will be kept private, and our young soldiers wont die being involved in wars of agression forvthe benefit of US corporations.
      Our future is trading with China, not the incresingly decrepit and divided USA.
      American is rapidly becoming aworld wide laughing stock. I really pity those who live outside the flyover states, who cared tarred with the rdneck bigot brush.

    2. Re:The future by AHuxley · · Score: 2

      The last time that split with the US and UK was considered in any detail was near the end of 1945 during a crypto review.
      What the US and UK understood, what codes they had on Japan and Germany in the 1930's-45. What was held back and what would have been vital in the war with Japan.
      The feeling was split. Go alone and try and decode Russia, China, Asia using local experts after 1945. Or sign up with what would be the NSA, CIA and get given all the raw intercepts in real time.
      The cost and risk of going alone into the 1950's or give the US total access to Australia.
      The same charm was used on West German staff after ww2, now German staff.
      Data privacy was given away. The deal was for all Soviet and Asian gov, mil networks ready for translation, raw traffic in real time, decoded.

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      Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
  19. Re:White House Supports Renewal of Spy Law Without by Falconhell · · Score: 1

    Your republic has failed spectacularly, in electing a lying bufoon, frankly, rigging the election so as unrepresentative swill like the electoral college get to overrule the peoples will, is a failure of epic proportion, and a fine example of the US ongoing slide to irrelevance in the modern world.
    Youre just a sad, deluded old man, enjoy the last gasp of the inbred right, it wont last long.