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More Than Ever, Employees Want a Say in How Their Companies Are Run (qz.com)

Two readers share a report: While workers have traditionally looked to unions to address their grievances, a new generation is trusting in the power of petitions to force changes. At the Wall Street Journal, 160 reporters and editors, delivered a letter to their managers protesting the lack of women and minorities running the organization, Business Insider reported yesterday. "Nearly all the people at high levels at the paper deciding what we cover and how are white men," the letter read. IBM employees are circulating an online petition objecting to the tone of CEO Ginni Rometty's letter to US president Donald Trump, and calling on her affirm what they call the company's progressive values. [...] Other employee petitions call for Oracle to oppose US president Donald Trump's second travel ban, and to let men who work at US regional supermarket Publix grow beards. Employee petitions are now so popular there's a website, coworker.org, devoted to hosting them. In some cases, the campaigns work: Starbuck's relaxed its rules about visible tattoos and unnatural hair color for baristas after thousands signed petitions asking for a change. Sometimes, they fail disastrously. Interns at one (unnamed) company described in a blog about being fired en masse after signing a petition asking for a more relaxed dress code.

47 of 231 comments (clear)

  1. this is really getting tiring by ganjadude · · Score: 5, Insightful

    there are zero barriers for entry in the workforce today. this push for diversity for nothing other than the sake of diversity is pointless.

    the best person for the job regardless of race or gender is how it should be, nothing else.

    --
    have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
    1. Re:this is really getting tiring by silas_moeckel · · Score: 3, Insightful

      But making false numbers games are how SJW's survive.

      As a business owner I would have a huge pushback on the force change bit if stuff this simple requires a petition your management is probably already dysfunctional.

      --
      No sir I dont like it.
    2. Re:this is really getting tiring by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Let me take a wild stab here. You are an SJW, right? You're certainly racist and sexist enough.

    3. Re:this is really getting tiring by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      - Different people from different viewpoints are almost invariably GOOD for an organization. Those that don't have diversity tend to wither and die due to stagnation.

      Proof?

    4. Re:this is really getting tiring by fluffernutter · · Score: 2

      Having a company hire someone solely based on race is a terrible way to fight discrimination, in fact it is counterproductive because not you have many workers with resentment towards people who have been perceived to receive a 'free ride'. The only way to really tackle it is to look at the societal forces that prevent a person from being as tell trained or applicable for a job due to their background. I have no doubt that some companies turn away people based on race and this should be stopped. But if a company only has 1% of minority applications they shouldn't be expected to tip the scales. Once that happens it is too late. Sadly, I fear things are going the other way. Decent job opportunities seem to be fewer and far between for everyone, and this will only exacerbate the situation.

      --
      Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
    5. Re: this is really getting tiring by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's not rightist and centrists who keep bringing traits like race, gender, sexual preference, and so on into every situation and discussion. They aren't constantly pushing identity politics. It's the leftists who are doing that.

      Everybody but the leftists have moved on. The leftists draw their power from exploiting the differences between groups of people, however. So they need to continually foster disagreement and disruption. Leftists need this disunity in order for their failed belief systems to survive. They need to constantly create new 'victims' in order to exploit society.

    6. Re:this is really getting tiring by grasshoppa · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The problem is folks get outcomes confused with opportunity. Just because a certain gender or color isn't present in representative numbers in upper management and certain jobs doesn't mean they didn't have the opportunity to pursue that job. Equal Opportunity does not equate to Equal Outcomes, essentially.

      Amusingly, what these folks are advocating for is a lowering of the bar which only applies to certain genders or skin colors...which makes them, you guessed it, bigots.

      --
      Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
    7. Re:this is really getting tiring by CaptainDork · · Score: 2, Funny

      I was a suit at Mobil Oil during its Dilbert years, and it was called, "empowerment."

      It died along with "Quality, Vision and Mission" statements.

      --
      It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
    8. Re:this is really getting tiring by Penguinisto · · Score: 2

      - We have historical (and current) discrimination to overcome.

      "historical" means approximately bupkis - no sane human is in the business of reparations, or of acting on induced guilt for things that they themselves have not done.

      "(and current)"? Must not be all that prevalent if it's in parentheses, now is it?

      - Different people from different viewpoints are almost invariably GOOD for an organization.

      Almost, but...

      • doing so doesn't require "diversity" as the SJW crowd defines it
      • having differing viewpoints just for the sake of having them can be just as detrimental as having a monoculture/bubble/echo-chamber
      • there is a huge difference between having different viewpoints to consider from, and giving all of those differing viewpoints equal influence and/or power in an organization (else you have 'paralysis by analysis')
      --
      Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
    9. Re:this is really getting tiring by epyT-R · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm sure if we gave non whites enough other distractions "to be totally disgusted about", we could avoid having to respect their rights too. Doesn't make it right, however.

    10. Re:this is really getting tiring by cayenne8 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Those that don't have diversity tend to wither and die due to stagnation.

      I"ve yet to see that ever.

      I suppose if the business is catering to a specific market where no one is a part of or knows that market it could be detrimental (all white guys trying to see black women gerry curl, or whatever it is called).

      On the other hand...throwing out or not hiring people due to their race and ONLY being interested in meeting quotas for diversity sake, I have seen tank a company's abilities.

      I have no problem with hiring whomever is the best for the job.

      Hell, why is it no one complains there aren't enough white jewish men playing in the NBA? I mean, you look at those teams....no diversity there, just a bunch of tall black guys, with the occasional token tall white boy in there.

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    11. Re:this is really getting tiring by Tablizer · · Score: 2

      the best person for the job regardless of race or gender is how it should be, nothing else.

      I've been in the workforce long enough, including in interview panels, to know that raw merit is only half the game. Hiring and promotion decisions are largely social, especially when multiple candidates have similar merit credentials. Humans are social animals, and thus naturally biased.

    12. Re:this is really getting tiring by ganjadude · · Score: 2

      ok...so get a masters or PHD? that isnt a barrier in the sense i was speaking here. that actually goes along with my "best person for the job" point

      --
      have you seen my sig? there are many others like it but none that are the same
    13. Re:this is really getting tiring by Austerity+Empowers · · Score: 2

      Barriers to entry are almost always used in the same breath as "requires high investment factor". Masters and PhD (or even B.S.) degrees all require a very significant investment. These degrees represent dubious qualifications. They are academic certifications, which may or may not have applicability in the corporate world. I'm not sure how many of my professors could hack it outside of academia, but not so many.

      And I disagree, very often those things are requirements that are not actual qualifications, just ways of shrinking the candidate pool. I interview people with those degrees who don't know what they're doing, and I know people without them I'd hire in a heartbeat (but cannot interview or hire because HR). The two best software people I've worked with had GEDs and learned their job in the Army of all places, but I can't hire them. Whatever dicking around they did as teenagers is well behind them, but they're barred.

      Diversity for the sake of diversity is just about as arbitrary of a barrier as academic degrees. While white people can't acquire black to get a job, in theory someone of another race can acquire a degree. However often people of other races have a hard time acquiring the money to make it over the barrier, it is as impossible for them as for me to become a black lesbian woman. If this were not true why are we acquiring so many people from India and China, when there are plenty of Americans who do not have jobs. Those countries do a much better job at providing the degrees needed to overcome these barriers.

    14. Re:this is really getting tiring by spire3661 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      "- We have historical (and current) discrimination to overcome."

      I absolutely refuse to pay for the sins of our fathers. This will only perpetuate an eternal victimhood. If you see wrong, fix it, but 'diversity' for its own sake is just racism.

      --
      Good-bye
    15. Re:this is really getting tiring by RightwingNutjob · · Score: 2

      Yeah. Sure. We do engineering work. We hired a guy to head our HR's diversity department because regulations. What's he do? Nothing harmful at first, but then he gets it into his head that ethnic clubs at work are a good idea.

      Diversity with a big 'd' is an employment plan for idiots who can't find real work and have to make their living as parasites and rabble rousers. Believing it is anything other than that is foolish. No one needs ethnic clubs at their workplace.

    16. Re:this is really getting tiring by Goragoth · · Score: 2

      Because who gets promoted to management is entirely based on merit, right? If you actually believe that then your naivete is staggering.

    17. Re:this is really getting tiring by grasshoppa · · Score: 2

      Because who gets promoted to management is entirely based on merit, right?

      Sadly no. In my experience, who gets promoted to management has more to do with who you're friends with than actual ability.

      Please note that gender and race were not mentioned *once* in the above.

      --
      Mod me down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
    18. Re:this is really getting tiring by swillden · · Score: 2

      Because who gets promoted to management is entirely based on merit, right?

      Sadly no. In my experience, who gets promoted to management has more to do with who you're friends with than actual ability.

      Please note that gender and race were not mentioned *once* in the above.

      But they're still there. What you've described constitutes deep and systematic racism and sexism that place serious obstacles in front of anyone who isn't the right race and gender. Just because no one is doing it "on purpose", that everyone has good intentions and thinks they're doing their best to be fair doesn't mean it isn't happening. It's the result of pervasive unconscious biases.

      So, how do you overcome those unconscious biases, break the stranglehold of the good old boys' network on management positions (or a thousand other similar structures)? How do you root out the unconscious biases and make the people who hold them see that they do? Remember, these are well-intentioned people who consider themselves to be kind, and fair... but they just tend to hang out with their own kind, so that's who they know, and who gets promoted.

      Serious question. What's your answer? Just letting the self-reinforcing system continue isn't a good one. So what do you do?

      --
      Note to ACs: I usually delete AC replies without reading them. If you want to talk to me, log in.
    19. Re: this is really getting tiring by KozmoStevnNaut · · Score: 3, Informative

      It's not rightist and centrists who keep bringing traits like race, gender, sexual preference, and so on into every situation and discussion. They aren't constantly pushing identity politics. It's the leftists who are doing that.

      That's only because the rightwingers and other assorted bigots are perfectly OK with the status quo, where brown people, non-straight people, women and people with middle-eastern sounding names are routinely rejected for jobs at much higher rates than straight white males.

      --
      Eat the rich.
  2. Re:Translation by skids · · Score: 3, Funny

    We need to build a wall and keep all the females out until they can be throughly vetted. Over 50% of the poeple living in this country are female, did you know that? That's MILLIONS. We have to put a stop to this until we cn figre out WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON.

  3. Sure To Be Effective by tsqr · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'm convinced that these petitions will be at least as effective as the ones posted on whitehouse.gov.

  4. Re:Translation by fluffernutter · · Score: 4, Funny

    I'd like to be on the female side of the wall please. You know, so I can help figure out what's going on.

    --
    Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
  5. Simple solution by Snufu · · Score: 2

    Just ask your union... Oh.

    1. Re:Simple solution by DickBreath · · Score: 2

      Do you realize what a crazy idea that is?

      First, that would take actual hard work, and money.

      Second, someone has already done the work for you, as they should, and started a company for you to have a say in.

      --

      I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
  6. How cute by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The workers think they have an opinion that matters.

    The current American culture gives absolutely no shits what workers think, only that they show up and do what it says on the tin.

    You want to have an opinion? Fight for it. Walk out. Organize. Use the tools that are available to you, not spineless open letters that only provide the status quo with targets to aim at.

    And, btw, when you have that opinion, don't give it up. Remind everybody that you fought hard for the right to have a voice, as opposed to workers in the 70s, 80s, and 90s that happily gave up their ability to affect change.

  7. Interns != Employees by Rob+Riggs · · Score: 3, Insightful

    That intern was taught an invaluable business lesson.

    --
    the growth in cynicism and rebellion has not been without cause
  8. Re:Translation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    1. Dress codes (outside of safety) have little to do with working hard and more to do with enforcing unnecessary conformity. As long as your clothing's sanitary and safe for the typical workday environment, I don't see a reason why it can't be worn to work. Employees undistracted by uncomfortable clothing are productive employees. Asking for this should got get one fired as it has nothing to do with workload.

    2. In mentioning 'white men' the letter's author exposes a racist viewpoint. Just because someone's white and male does not mean he is responsible for all suffering.

  9. Only if there was something by future+assassin · · Score: 2, Insightful

    say we used the word Union. It would be an organization of people from the same industry banded for the benefit of all workers. Maybe the workers could donate a little of their monthly income so the Union could hire lawyers and lobbying power. Its just an idea...

    --
    by TheSpoom (715771) Uncaring Linux user here. I have nothing to add to this but please continue. *munches popcorn*
    1. Re:Only if there was something by Penguinisto · · Score: 2

      ...and in 20 years when management decides to offshore *all* of its tech work to India (due to bloated contracts with said unions, bloated wages, and a systme where the incompetent could never get fired, let alone done so in a timely manner), we can all sit back and say we at least tried, right?

      --
      Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
  10. Stock holding? by cyocum · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Why not club together with your fellow employees to collectively purchase stock in the company that you work for? That way, you can force issues at the board level when management comes up for re-election.

  11. worker co-operatives by Presto+Vivace · · Score: 2

    unions are good, worker co-operatives are better https://medium.com/@PrestoViva...

  12. Re:Translation by DickBreath · · Score: 2

    Your otherwise excellent policy proposal fails because it does not describe how to pay for the wall. Here's an idea: make the females pay for the wall. Oh, wait. They might be happy to do that. :-) Walls work two ways.

    --

    I'll see your senator, and I'll raise you two judges.
  13. Re:Translation by CaptainDork · · Score: 4, Insightful

    We're sorry, but North Carolina will have to see your birth certificate, please.

    --
    It little behooves the best of us to comment on the rest of us.
  14. Re:Translation by cayenne8 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    1. Dress codes (outside of safety) have little to do with working hard and more to do with enforcing unnecessary conformity.

    They also promote the image the company wants to project publicly in many cases.

    I hate the dress codes too, but they can be there for a reason.

    I was at a place that started out having all men wear ties, women were dresses, or if in pants they had to be pretty formal looking.

    After a few years there, they relaxed the dress codes to much more casual when in the work place when not meeting or being seen by customers.

    But if we had to meet with customers or they were coming into our building, we had to go back to ties and formal looks those days.

    And hell, for the times it is for conformity, I'd think the snowflake generation would be used to wearing the "school uniform"...don't most public and private schools today require uniforms?

    --
    Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
  15. Re:Translation by jimmifett · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I agree with your second point, but dress code, is important. I work completely differently in shorts and a tee than a button down shirt.

    A button down puts me in a completely different mindset and attitude. Having a co-worker in sandals and ripped shorts is distracting. When I go to a client or have a client come to me, I want myself and all my co-workers looking like professional bad-asses at work, not slackers. It's all perception.

    Long time ago, someone also told me to dress for the job I want, that's been somewhat successful.

    Appropriate clothing for the job being done is important.

  16. Re:Translation by cayenne8 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I've never seen a public school in the USA have a uniform for anything other than sports teams. Hell dress code has only gotten even laxer since I graduated in 2000.

    I don't know where in the US you are located, but where I live, pretty much all the public schools require uniforms, it was put in to keep the poor kids from feeling bad next to the better dressed wealthier kids.

    --
    Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
  17. Re:Translation by Marxist+Hacker+42 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    http://dilbert.com/strip/2017-03-29

    You're missing the boat. The lazy slacker is the most efficient employee you can have. He'll find a way to get the job done in a quarter of the time and a tenth of the cost- just so he can goof off the rest of the day.

    --
    SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
  18. Re:Translation by dcw3 · · Score: 4, Informative

    1. Dress codes (outside of safety) have little to do with working hard and more to do with enforcing unnecessary conformity.

    If you're an employee who deals with customers then suck it up. Your employer has every right to demand you dress appropriately, else you could be costing them business. Don't like it?...gtfo. Our office has a business casual dress code...don't come in wearing shorts or flip flops. If you want to be a slob, go somewhere else.

    I've also had occasion to ask HR to talk to a female employee about her exposing a bit too much...every day. I'm no Puritan, but sheesh, the office isn't a place to share your cleavage, or wear skirts that expose your panties.

    --
    Just another day in Paradise
  19. Re:Translation by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 2

    In America, about 20% of public schools require uniforms. This is an increase from around 12% in the 1999-2000 school year. Uniforms are more common in low income areas where classroom control and gangs are bigger problems.

  20. Re: Translation by SCVonSteroids · · Score: 2

    As for the uniforms, no, not that I'm aware of. At least not here in New Brunswick.

    Dresscodes shouldn't be super anal, but I wholly agree with dressing nicely when dealing with customers. Impressions go a long way, regardless of skill level. Combine both and you are set for life.

    --
    I tend to rant.
  21. Re:Translation by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 2

    And even the high executives shouldn't.

    Neckties constrict blood flow to the brain. Taking an IQ test while wearing a tie lowers your score by an average of 3 points. Neckties make you stupid, at least while you are wearing them.

  22. Re:Translation by epyT-R · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It is a cultural problem. A problem you've illustrated quite well. Why does a tie imply professionalism? Why not focus on how efficient your employees are and the accomplishments of your company instead of associating it with arbitrary fashion? This applies to your customers as well. I realize you're bowing to pragmatic reality, but fashion obsession is anything but professional (unless of course you work in the fashion biz).

  23. Re:Translation by epyT-R · · Score: 2

    By all means, if you work better in a shirt and tie, wear them. Someone who works better in shorts and T shirt should be able to wear that if he chooses (again barring safety concerns). You are making the typical mistake of projecting your mental state onto your others. Just because you need to dress the part and play-act it doesn't mean they need it too. Clothing shouldn't define the employee or the job, the skills possessed and the skills required should, respectively.

    Beyond specific safety concerns (eg a plastic suit for a clean room, or steel toed boots in a factory), clothing choice is entirely irrelevant and should be left to the employee's level of comfort. The fewer distractions at work the better.

  24. Re:Translation by serviscope_minor · · Score: 2

    Try a cravat instead. Couple of with a monocle. That look never goes pour of style.

    --
    SJW n. One who posts facts.
  25. Only because... by zifn4b · · Score: 2

    The only reason employees feel compelled to take the wheel is because they realize that their leadership is completely incompetent and delusional. We'd really actually like REAL leaders that actually do their job so we can just do ours but that's apparently like asking for the sun, the moon and the stars anymore.

    I think the best part is how there are plenty of articles about burnt out and overworked managers with self help strategies like delegating work. So, let me get this straight, you, the poor woe is me manager, that's sitting in meetings all day playing on your phone is so stressed out that you should get special privileges to delegate any work arbitrarily that you want to and get paid more money? Where's my special privilege? Why can't I delegate that fly-in on fire shit ball task that you want done yesterday? Double standard.

    --
    We'll make great pets
  26. No duh... by whitroth · · Score: 2

    So, first you let big business destroy unions in the US, when folks grandparents fought, in many cases literally, to form, and how you feel helpless.

    And a petition's going to get upper management to change their minds. I'm sure the idea of forming a union again never entered your pretty little libertarian-brainwashed heads....