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Court Rules Fan Subtitles On TV and Movies Are Illegal (thenextweb.com)

Posted by msmash on from the making-things-complicated dept.

A court has just ruled that making fan subtitles or translations is not protected by the law. From a report: A Dutch group called the Free Subtitles Foundation took anti-piracy group BREIN to court over "fansubbing." BREIN has previously been active in taking fan subtitles and translations offline, and the Foundation was hoping a Dutch court would come down on the side of fair use. The court didn't quite see it that way. It ruled that making subtitles without permission from the property owners amounted to copyright infringement. BREIN wasn't unsympathetic, but said it couldn't allow fansubbers to continue doing what they're doing.

11 of 137 comments (clear)

  1. Sucks, but derivative work by d34thm0nk3y · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That sucks, but, it's pretty clearly a derivative work...

    1. Re:Sucks, but derivative work by misexistentialist · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Is reading a book aloud derivative work? Maybe if you are selling it as an audio book, but sharing is caring, not work!

    2. Re:Sucks, but derivative work by dfn5 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Um.. no. Just like you can't just re encode a movie, you can't do a sentence by sentence translation, as the original material is copied in a form.

      I have been learning a foreign language over the last few years and the one thing I have concluded is that translation is an art form. One must convert the original language into a concept and then restate that concept in the target language in a natural way that makes sense to the target audience. The translation may look entirely different than the source material. And two people may translate the same material very differently. Transcription may be one thing but I would think translation would be protected.

      --
      -- Thou hast strayed far from the path of the Avatar.
    3. Re: Sucks, but derivative work by lactose99 · · Score: 3, Informative

      In the US this fee, usually to ASCAP, is paid by the venue not the artist.

      --
      Fully licensed blockchain psychiatrist
  2. Promoting Progress of Science and useful Arts? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    According to the United States Constitution, the purpose of copyright is...

    To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries.

    What is the pupose of copyright in the Netherlands, and how does this ruling support that purpose?

    1. Re:Promoting Progress of Science and useful Arts? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The purpose of copyright in Netherlands is the same as in UK and Sweden:
      1. To incarcerate and punish the nationals for the sake of foreigners and their wallets.
      2. To maximize the outflow of cash from the local economy into foreign wallets.
      3. To proudly look at the American owners, let your tongue out, and wag your tail so you can be called a good puppy boy
      and patted on the head for doing actions 1. and 2.

  3. Question is profit by gurps_npc · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If they are selling the movie without having paid for it, that's definitely copyright violation. But the fan subtitling people do not have to do that.

    If you do it yourself and do not sell anything, that's not copyright theft.

    If you buy the right to make and sell copies of the movie, then you are legally selling the item.

    If someone else pays you for your subtitles but you only sell them a timed set of subtitles without the movie, then you are not breaking the law. If they already have (or get) the right to display/sell the movie and they combine your time subtitles, then no one is breaking the law.

    --
    excitingthingstodo.blogspot.com
  4. Copyright is for the profit of the creator by LeftCoastThinker · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Copyright should not preclude fansubs or fandubs until there is content in that language for sale/rent to the public. If you won't serve a market, there is no reasonable expectation for financial benefit and thus fair use precludes you from shutting out fansubs and the like.

    --
    If you disagree, please post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like
  5. Unusual way to be offended by Whooty+McWhooface · · Score: 3, Interesting
    So, the there is a copyright violation because people are providing a service (subtitles) for movies/shows that were released without subtitles, either in other languages or in any languages because the studios were too damn cheap to provide them?

    So, if I see a fire break out and I put it out on my own, am I infringing on the work of the firefighter that either were not called or had not yet arrived?

    Sure, you are producing a textual version of the movie, but it would be utilized in conjunction with the movie/show. It's not like someone is going to read subtitles on a movie they have not seen and feel, "Gosh! Now I don't have to see the movie at all! I can't believe Bruce Willis was actually a ghost. Didn't see that one coming.... (Sorry for the spoiler, you should have watched it by now.)

    So are they actually upset because it is now becoming public how cheap and unsupportive the studio executives are to the hearing impaired?

    1. Re:Unusual way to be offended by pjt33 · · Score: 3, Funny

      I can't believe you would spoil Die Hard like that. Have you no pity, no compassion, no feeling for your fellow man/woman/small furry creature from Alpha Centauri?

  6. Former fansubber here by snarfies · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Back in the pre-digital days, I was part of a fansubbing group called Lupin Gang Anime. These days, I capture laserdiscs of the many titles that have never been reissued on DVD or better (https://www.otakubell.com/)

    I will continue to capture these endangered titles and put them on the internet. I will continue to do my best to preserve these titles from being lost. The only way I will stop is if I am locked up. Given the choice between following the law and doing what's right, I'll chose the later.