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Linux PC Maker System76 Plans To Design And Manufacture Its Own Hardware (liliputing.com)
An anonymous reader quotes Liliputing:
System76 is one of only a handful of PC vendors that exclusively sells computers with Linux-based software. Up until now, that's meant the company has chosen hardware that it could guarantee would work well with custom firmware and the Ubuntu Linux operating system... Starting in 2018 though, you may be able to buy a System76 computer that was designed and built in-house... CAD files for System76 computers will be open source, allowing anyone with the appropriate skills and equipment to build or modify their own cases based on the company's designs.
"We're prototyping with acrylic and moving to metal soon," the company says in a blog post, adding "Our first in-house designed and manufactured desktops will ship next year. Laptops are more complex and will follow much later."
"We're prototyping with acrylic and moving to metal soon," the company says in a blog post, adding "Our first in-house designed and manufactured desktops will ship next year. Laptops are more complex and will follow much later."
...but cool story bro.
When will they start manufacturing the CNCs used in manufacturing the computers?
I mean, really it's an odd way to sneak an ad onto /.
I mean, I'm so glad these new computer cases will be compatible with Linux. Really. I accidentally bought a case one time that wasn't, couldn't install Linux Mint or any other distro. Worked with Freebsd, but not Linux. Fortunately this will solve this well known problem.
Date of bankruptcy.
0 to Six months
Everyone wants to be apple these days
So buy an Android TV box, underneath it will be Linux, you won't have any issues finding drivers. It will have excellent processor speeds... current crop use 8 core 64 bit A53's at 2 Ghz, Audio will be fully supported, 4K HDMI will be fully supported. Some had USB3, one even had a hard disk in it, and one with an external SATA connector.
For Linux, Ubuntu ARM distribution works for me.
Price? Well mine cost $80. A T9SRPro, buit in handsight I should have gone with the sata one or USB3 one and paid a little extra.
Intel will give you driver issues and a lot less bang for the buck.
I RTFA and the source article and I didn't see anything to indicate they would be designing their own electronics. Instead, it seems like they will be building their own computer cases. Frankly, computer cases are far less important than the electronics that reside inside them. Having the CAD files to customize is nice but when their is a backdoor in every new x86 chip, it's kinda like putting on sunblock to protect your skin from the sun as you stare down a civilization ending 10000 meter tsunami wave.
Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
I live in Colorado where Sys76 is based. The original post may read like an ad, and my comment may sound like a shill, but check my post history. I'm not shill, I'm a real life Sys76 customer. Sys76 is committed to Linux on well-designed desktop/laptop systems. They have a legit business that focuses on systems designed for HPC and deep learning. I don't think they're super focused on mainstream consumer audience right now. From what I've seen they're really on the prosumer/commercial side of things -- looking to cash in on the deep learning craze, and put capable hardware and OS stack in the hands of interested people who want form-factors that fit into daily life. I'm impressed with their last-gen offerings, and I really look forward to what they'll be doing next.
tl;dr: real company, real product. Keep an eye on this.
Custom cases? or Custom Hardware? or Both?
In any case, these guys should put in the effort they are willing to make, on making the desktop experience much better, the priorities seem to be a bit misplaced to me.
we can get true libre in hardware to firmware i would be impressed otherwise why not just any laptop and put linux on it.
I read topics like this, really it does. Sadly none of you wizards have a target audience clearly defined. I am from Missouri, you must needs SHOW ME. Show Me how I can put funds in my PayPal/bank with this. What I is what I do. It is not what you do. godspeed you
Anyone know where I can get these and not be like isopropyl nitrite? I got bad vision damage lately because of the fakes on the market these days even though the knock off packaging says "Never Fake It" like it did in the old Rush days.
--BeauHD
The summary is badly worder.
The thing is :
up until now System76 were selling
- laptops which were simply re-branded laptops from other brand, to which they changed firmware and OS to a more free option
- desktop which were mostly of the shelf beige-boxes
i.e.: they were selling mostly 3rd party hardware
starting from next year, they also want :
- laptop that they make themselves (well, most likely they will be still produced in china. but the idea is that the models are now made by System76. Not Lenovo models with an alternate firmware and OS).
This is interesting because in the end it will enable them to better choose the component inside the laptop for Linux compatibility (avoid too much weird embed controllers)
- desktop designed by themselves too. (that won't be a much big change from the current beige box trend. A motherboard is still a motherboard).
but at least it will help with brand identity and will also help testing their design pipeline on a smaller scale before tackling the laptops.
Their blog post make it clearer (I swear I didn't click TFA's link ! I just clicked last week, when it was on Phoronix. Am I still /.-worthy ? :-D )
Sadly the summery sounds like you need desktop cases specially made compatible with Linux.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
I understand wanting to support the Linux community, but I thought one of the "big advantages" of Linux was that it was cheaper? Yet here, even without the Microsoft tax, it costs a lot more.
The thing is, unlike your custom self-build linux workstation, linux laptops not only come *without the Microsoft tax* (making them a bit cheaper), they also come *without the Bloatware/Crapware bonus* (making them not heavily subsidized by "Punch the Monkey to win big prizes !" and "Let's siphon all your data straight to all the marketeer we an find".
They also don't come with the *integrated by chinese almost-slave labour rebate*.
Laptop tend to be complex and weird (embed controllers, etc.) which requires a tiny bit of adaptation to make them linux-worthy.
- When you buy a big popular brand like Lenovo's Thinkpad Ts, Dell's Lattitude, etc. someone else would have done the debugging already (see ressources like Thinkwiki) and by that time it'll probably be upstream in vanilla kernel and standard distros. So you can probably just pop in a CD of Ubuntu or Linux Mint and it will install flawlessly.
- When you start with less popular manufacturer, you'd be in for a few small surprise : screen not turning on, kernel crashing at boot when trying to enumerate hardware, UEFI-Secure refusing the signature of your bootloader's shim, etc. You could be needed fixes in the firmware and/or workaround patched in the kernel. It might something really simple (just hacking a bit some settings).
But even that "simple" will by done by some who isn't paid in cents per day range.
So it adds up to the costs.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
why are these linux laptops ALWAYS Ubuntu?! put fedora on one and I'll buy it
More like Core i5 mobile. Certainly faster than my Core i3 laptop.
Chromebook's have had some success because they customize hardware and the OS to work together. This is also why Apple Mac's have worked so well, and why Windows struggles to work well in a vast hardware ecosystem. Linux also has this problem sometimes adapting drivers that only marginally work and regressions are happening far to much from version to version. System 76 has the right idea, but making your own hardware is costly and it also can lock a user into a certain operating system. Kind of working against the open source theme. But certainly making their systems work better would be a plus.
It's not difficult to find:
http://www.lightinthebox.com/t95rpro-s912-2g-16g-tv-box-android-6-0-octa-core-wifi-2-4g-5ghz-bluetooth4-0-3d-graphics-full-kodi-16-0-load-tv-box_p5410452.html
There are lots of these Android boxes, this $64 one is a 8 Cores at 2ghz, 16Gb flash. There are ones with SATA interfaces, one with built in drives, ones with USB, I just walked into a mall and bought one. It's more powerful than my last Windows computer (but then that has a Core I3 3217U and is hampered by Intel onboard graphics I think).
Really you can spend a lot of money, but these ARM chips are typically 2:1 the equivalent ARM, so an 8 core 64 bit at 2 ghz beats a 4 core 1.8 ghz Intel i3. I had zero issues with Ubuntu Arm for drivers, Logitech wireless keyboard/mouse worked faultlessly.
To make a competitive system, the real issue is, is the ability to convince Intel or AMD (or any other processor manufacturer) as well as BIOS/EFI vendors (if you're not going to write your own) that you are serious enough with enough resources to be successful in designing a system and maintain their IP.
Probably the most difficulty somebody who wants to design/build motherboards will have is showing these companies that they have sufficient security systems and protocols in place that the processor and support chip manufacturers (if they're different) can provide you with the datasheets and other documents necessary to design systems without them becoming public knowledge (ie available to their competitors).
Next on the bill is showing that you have the financial resources to make a serious go of it as they will have to provide you a ton of support (the processor manufacturers have to have at least one person dedicated to you full time if you are going to be successful).
Mimetics Inc. Twitter
I know several people who have the equipment to build motherboards at home (in garages and basements). I agree that it's not common and consists of surplus equipment they were able to get cheap and would not be as efficient as a properly equipped manufacturer, but they're out there and they can do the high BGA counts of processor sockets with a high degree of success.
Manufacturing the PCBs isn't the problem; see my other post.
Mimetics Inc. Twitter
Is this for people that confuse the box with what is in the box? A computer case cannot be "Linux hardware".
Most ACs are not even worth the keystrokes to insult them. Be generically insulted by this and ignored otherwise.
Windows is going to be increasingly difficult to field in secure applications due to the monitoring crap. Red Hat 6/7 are accepted in the DOD, provided you run the STIGS (pretty easy). Lots of money to be made.
I guess we're all systems now.
Dell sells Linux laptops.
Not on all of them, and not in all market.
But still, Dells are so much popular, that even for the few Lattitude that you can directly get with Ubuntu pre-installed, you can just pop your Suse CD in and install a tumbleweed, because of popularity, lots of people would have tester a tweaked what is necessary for the distro to work out of the box.
And the Microsoft tax is a myth. All the demo software they tend to put on pays for windows plus a bit more so Linux laptops can often be a bit more because they are unsubsidised.
Yup. Totally agree with you. That's why I was saying :
linux laptops not only come *without the Microsoft tax* (making them a bit cheaper), they also come *without the Bloatware/Crapware bonus* (making them not heavily subsidized by "Punch the Monkey to win big prizes !" and "Let's siphon all your data straight to all the marketeer we an find".
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
There are people that don't want this to happen.
1 - A lot of the hardware documentation that was open 5 years ago has disappered.
2 - If they came out with such a device - you can count on a trip ti FISA court.
Take the Ubuntu phone - it is not really Linux - it is an Android kernel with binary blobs that are there for our protection...
'They' put an end to this about 5 years ago - read about core boot...
Windows is going to be increasingly difficult to field in secure applications due to the monitoring crap. Red Hat 6/7 are accepted in the DOD, provided you run the STIGS (pretty easy). Lots of money to be made.
Tell me about it. Where I work, we've had discussions going on for more than a year now about what to do with mission-critical software that still runs on Windows. You know Windows 10 is bad when the legal teams are pushing for Linux even harder than the engineers and and developers are.
Almost nobody actually manufactures or designs anything outside a small handful of companies in any given area. The idea System76 is going to manufacture its own systems is laughable. They don't even ship with freedom friendly wifi or graphics cards as standard like a few other companies do. ThinkPenguin's one of the only companies that has invested any kind of serious money into designing laptops for GNU/Linux and there certainly isn't anything available commercially yet. And the objective of what ThinkPenguin's been working on is clear. They want hardware that is entirely in the user's ability to control the software running on it. That means you can't build off Intel or AMD's CPUs. You can't utilize any old keyboard controller. You can't do a lot of things because at the end of the day EVEN when you really do design something you are highly dependant on other companies to manufacture and design particular components and frequently almost across the board they're not cooperative. ThinkPenguin was successful in getting sources released for ATH9k-HTC which is the more recent USB N wireless Atheros chipsets. That almost didn't happen as Adrian Chad and Luis Rodriguez were overwhelmed and didn't feel the prior efforts had paid off. If it wasn't for ThinkPenguin's involvement we would not have wifi adapters today which are entirely in the users control. We still do not have laptops which can be entirely in the users control, but they are coming.
I have a System76 and Clevo hardware is okayish but if they can make something better more power to them.
Richard Stallman just became a fanboy.