Slashdot Mirror
California Seeks To Tax Rocket Launches, Which Are Already Taxed (arstechnica.com)
The state of California is looking into taxing its thriving rocket industry. The Franchise Tax Board has issued a proposed regulation for public comment that would require companies that launch spacecraft to pay a tax based upon "mileage" traveled by that spacecraft from California. Ars Technica reports: The proposal says that California-based companies that launch spacecraft will have to pay a tax based upon "mileage" traveled by that spacecraft from California. (No, we're not exactly sure what this means, either). The proposed regulations were first reported by the San Francisco Chronicle, and Thomas Lo Grossman, a tax attorney at the Franchise Tax Board, told the newspaper that the rules are designed to mirror the ways taxes are levied on terrestrial transportation and logistics firms operating in California, like trucking or train companies. The tax board is seeking public input from now until June 16, when it is expected to vote on the proposed tax. The federal government already has its own taxes for commercial space companies, and until now no other state has proposed taxing commercial spaceflight. In fact most other states, including places like Florida, Texas, and Georgia, offer launch providers tax incentives to move business into their areas.
This is so stupid that it makes my head hurt. Way to fuck over the private space industry, California!
Just cruising through this digital world at 33 1/3 rpm...
De-orbit it so it lands in California - preferably the governor's office in Sacramento. With a little sign saying "miles from California: ZERO".
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
I think it's fair to count the miles of road traveled just like the other forms of transportation. Travel off road should be exempted.
Inheritance is the sincerest form of nepotism.
Won't this encourage companies to launch their rockets from different states, possibly taking jobs with them? What is the point of this tax?
If I can be modded down for being a troll, can I be modded up for being an orc, or a balrog?
If you try to sit, I'll tax your seat.
For Texas. Which has a space launch industry of its own, low taxes, and a business climate that's already luring companies from California...
Lawrence Person (lawrencepersonh@gmailh.com (remove all "h"s to mail)
http://www.lawrenceperson.com/
Isn't this just California doing the thing it is best at?
Couldn't you simply write:
Way to fuck over the INSERT TYPE OF BUSINESS HERE industry?
That pretty much defines California. Hell, even Apple with more money than God built a campus in the shape of a wheel so they could role it out of the state when the taxes became too large a burden even for them.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
California is all for rocket launches - as long as they are zero emission and electric only.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
California loves taxes.
In most other states, for example, beverage containers have a tax ("deposit") that is meant to get all the containers taken away from public spaces, whether by gleaners or by thrifty citizens. In contrast, California sets the tax low enough that it's not worth redeeming unless you're desperate - figuring enough people will blow it off that the state can just keep the majority of it.
Dave Barry said it best: California taxes are high, government is incompetent and corrupt in contrast to Florida: taxes low, government incompetent and corrupt.
How about we stop trying to fund California (which by the way provides well more than its share of tax revenues to the federal gov't compared to its receipts) using taxes on new industries and new people who help us create new value, and instead remove the tax protections for entrenched old people who got here first, got theirs, and now are happy to put most of the share of the burden on everyone else? Prop 13, unions, local regulations that prevent affordble housing -- I'm looking at you.
Industry itself. Name me one place in the US where you have everything at your finger tips, literally without taking a huge dent in logistical and operating costs. This is why I operate in California and this is why so many still operate in California. I've heard stories of those that moved to Henderson, NV and it's not all roses over there either, especially when your logistical costs sky rocket and the huge labor shortage is preventing you from operating (Amazon in Las Vegas didn't last long, did it?).
And this is where California and its ridiculous taxation is quite well calculated. Not too much to force your hand and just below the level, as annoying as it is.
If this tax does pass, expect companies like SpaceX to move out of California, and either Sea Launch to be revitalized or a new company doing the same thing as Sea Launch (launching rockets from a platform in the middle of the ocean) to spring up.
Bull shit!
For those unable to read: CA is ranked #10 in one of those surveys and doesn't appear in the other list of the top 10 states for overall taxes.
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
Living in this state is simply Unreal. They can pry my 8 Ball out of my cold, dead hands.
You should turn signatures off.
I've worked at a couple smaller hardware based companies including on the East Coast and the Midwest, and now work at a place on the West Coast. There are plenty of other cities around the US that have quite a tech industry and worker pool to draw from, while having an interesting enough scene that you can get harder to find employees to relocate there. I've also seen start ups and companies built in smaller towns in the Midwest who draw in people looking for quieter towns and low cost of living.
The only place I've worked at that has had trouble getting employees to come out to them is the one I work at now on the West Coast. We have to pay employees almost double what similar employees were paid in other places with lower cost of living. Even then, some just refuse, because what coworkers pay for rent here on small place would be a 10-year mortgage payment on a huge place in one of the other cities. The company is expanding, and the land costs for the company are skyrocketing too, as opposed to the other places that could get large plots of land 5-10 minutes outside the city for almost nothing. The regulations seem harsher too, in terms of the number of people and permits needed for things we install within our current building. The only reason the company is here is because of inertia from the founders who already lived in the city, and they regret that choice.
There is some argument for creating a business near where the product will be sold, or near where you are trying to poach people from some existing similar businesses (specialists, or will need a large skilled labor force). But if your business simply needs some good programmers, engineers, and a couple specialists, you could setup shop in a lot of places.
There we go again...
If it moves, tax it.
If it keeps moving, regulate it.
And if it stops moving, subsidize it.
An classic observation by a former governor of California...
Yet somehow they provide the majority of all taxes collected. In 2012, the top 1% paid an average rate of 22% (the highest) and provided almost 40% of all taxes, top 5% accounted for almost 60% of collected taxes. Paying an average rate of 21%.
"With taxes you buy - civilisation"
How much taxation is enough? How much is too much? In exchange for what? Those are the issues, not some stupid generalizing whining of, "Waaaah, I want everyone to pay high taxes because if not, anarchy!"
With taxes you buy - civilisation
Yes, we know <eyeroll> But, you know, there's someplace between "California" and "Papua New Guinea" that still works well and isn't taxed to death.
San Francisco's city budget is about the size of Tennessee's state budget. At what point do we realize that something just isn't right about this? We have roads, sewer, a police force, schools, etc. They're paid for with a state sales tax that's 9.25%, about what CA pays. But we don't have a state income tax. We realize that we don't need it.
CA's tax structure is maniacal, and the wealthy people who set this up have no idea how badly they're screwing the middle and lower classes.
Do you have ESP?
that's the height at which air atmosphere stops and Outer Space begins, technically outside the country. So start listing mileage as only 62 miles until international space. treat like you would be shipping to Japan.
I was doing a ride-a-long with a local police chief in my hometown. We were driving around "the hang out spot" looking for kids firing off fireworks, which were illegal in the city, and called "littering". Saw this kid, teenager, firing off a bottle rocket. Had the headlights off, rolled right up next to him. Chief lowered the window, looked at the surprised kid, said..."I could write you a ticket for littering". Kid NEVER missed a beat. said.."how do you know it landed?". Chief looked at me, raised the window and we drove off, he said "well, can't argue with logic like that".
Well, yes, in a sense that is right. But what's more interesting is the fact that California as a state performs worse than most of the rest of the country, and that is because it is the most progressive state.
I didn't inject GDP in this, I was simply responding to someone else's simplistic analysis. But at 12% higher per capita GDP is actually underperforming given its taxes, cost structure, and resources.
Sorry, I have looked at those analyses and they don't work out. The idea that California finances the rural populations of other states is a myth.
Your roads argument is transparently false: roads are paid out of state and local taxes, and those are not traded off against federal taxes; in fact, California has some of the highest taxes on the state and local level.
Well, you are welcome to believe that. I consider California's government to be an utter disaster, and like many other people, I can't wait to leave.