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Windows 10 Now On 500 Million Devices, Up By 200 Million in a Year (arstechnica.co.uk)

Posted by msmash on from the growing-dominance dept.

At Build developer conference in Seattle today, Microsoft announced that Windows 10 is now running on 500 million monthly active devices. From a report: Little over a year ago, the company said that the operating system had reached 300 million systems. As the operating system nears the end of its second full year on the market, it's clear that it's going to fall a long way short of the company's original estimates. At launch, the ambition was to reach 1 billion devices over the first two to three years of availability, but this estimate assumed that Windows 10 Mobile would be a going concern, selling something of the order of 50 million or more devices a year.

123 comments

  1. Forced upgrades. by gfxguy · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It's pretty easy to hit that milestone when you force people to upgrade without their consent. Don't get me wrong - I have Windows 10 on both my desktop (dual boot) and personal laptop; I have it on one of my work laptops (the other is Windows 7/Linux dual boot). I'm probably one of the few people who like it, but I don't pretend like what MS didn't wasn't disgraceful.

    --
    Stupid sexy Flanders.
    1. Re:Forced upgrades. by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 1

      I'd pay $50 for a final "never try upgrading this PC to Anniversary Edition" fix. The forced upgrades when they fail again and again and again and again and again is a huge pain.

    2. Re:Forced upgrades. by hackel · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Uh...I can sell you that upgrade for a lot less. In fact, I'll GIVE it to you for nothing. See: https://www.linux.org/

      When a company repeatedly screws you over and over, it's downright foolish to continue using them. Try to learn from the past!

    3. Re:Forced upgrades. by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

      "The contract states that the show will cost $500 with rehearsal."

      "How much without the rehearsal?"

      "You can't afford it."

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    4. Re:Forced upgrades. by Kjella · · Score: 1

      I'd pay $50 for a final "never try upgrading this PC to Anniversary Edition" fix. The forced upgrades when they fail again and again and again and again and again is a huge pain.

      I got that for free last July when the free "upgrade" program ended. Sounds like Win10 got a -$50 value right there. Sadly despite the occasional good news on Linux games, it looks like Linux gaming is going nowhere with 0.76% market share on latest Steam survey. Some games are now starting to come out as DX12 exclusives while the list of Vulkan games remain very, very short and usually in beta as an alternative rendering path.

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    5. Re: Forced upgrades. by TheOuterLinux · · Score: 1

      I used to dual boot Mac OS X Snow Leopard and Xubuntu. I run OpenSUSE now and love it. It's sooooo much faster than Ubuntu based systems, except for maybe WattOS.

    6. Re:Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Except they don't allow most version of Windows and many editions to upgrade. I have four Windows machines, and none are allowed to upgrade to 10. They've gone out of their way to keep people from upgrading to 10. Microsoft is a very confused and inconsistent company. Some marketing people have gone on the record stating that they want people to use Windows 10 while others created policies that prevent us from using it.

    7. Re:Forced upgrades. by DontBeAMoran · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Only if you point me to the Linux version of all my favorite games.

      Oh, you can't? Then you're not offering a solution, you're just a fanboy praising for his team.

      --
      #DeleteFacebook
    8. Re: Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Good for you fuckwit

    9. Re:Forced upgrades. by sexconker · · Score: 1

      Run Linux on a CPU that has a built-in GPU (most Intel CPUs, any AMD "APU").
      Also get a real GPU.
      Run Windows in a VM, and pass the real GPU directly to the VM.

    10. Re:Forced upgrades. by Merk42 · · Score: 1

      Run Windows in a VM, and pass the real GPU directly to the VM.

      and then we're right back where we started

    11. Re:Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's an awful lot of work just to end up running Windows again in the end.

      What's the point, to not only run Windows but run it in a crappy virtualized environment too?

    12. Re:Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But messing with the display outputs / monitor inputs is a chore.
      Is there a monitor where you can switch the input through software instead of reaching out all the way to hit crappy buttons and menus?
      I guess so : "signage" displays that cost a small fortune with RS232 input, but a generic or "gamer" monitor would be better (perhaps with signaling through HDMI or Displayport if that's possible. It should be in theory by carrying USB 2.0 or CEC)

      If this is not possible or you need to buy some kind of ultra recent KVM switch : what a pain.
      Also, buying e.g. a 7700K or an eight core AMD is a relatively expensive proposition (in fact, installing Windows 7 on my crappy outdated PC would let me play thousands of games, solving the problem for about $0 even though I would play decade old shit)

      I might also as well run two separate computers : Windows gaming PC (any specs) and a "headless desktop" linux box that is the only one that gets Internet access (could also have any specs, including old PC, new PC or some quad core ARM with 4GB RAM garbage). Then for any web browsing etc., from the Windows 7 (or newer) desktop, use the linux headless box through X11, RDP and such (and access some audio/video media through Samba)
      Viewing youtube and such through X11, RDP, VNC or hopefully better would be stupid as fuck unless your set up is more "high tech" (use youtube-dl beforehand, or have a hardware H264 encoder just to beam a linux desktop over a one foot ethernet cable)

      Also need to set up some freaking Windows Update proxying / offline downloads.

    13. Re:Forced upgrades. by RotateLeftByte · · Score: 0

      Oh, so that is only 499,999,999 devices too many.

      Windows 10 is the worst OS MS every released. I'm so happy that I no longer have to use it at all.

      --
      I'd rather be riding my '63 Triumph T120.
    14. Re: Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But not for you turdface

    15. Re:Forced upgrades. by sexconker · · Score: 1

      No, you get a lot more control, and you only run Windows when needed.

      You can easily firewall off all of the bullshit "telemetry" from the Windows VM, block the forced updates, etc. while still having it function normally online for games and other shit. With an actual Windows 10 install, you need an external firewall to do this. The host OS handles it in this case. (Though you could still use an external firewall if you're already doing that, or you have multiple Windows 10 shits you need to block, etc.)

      You can freeze the Windows VM, snapshot it, move it wherever, etc. easily without having to worry about shit breaking.

      You can upgrade your hardware without worrying about tripping Windows Genuine Advantage or whatever the fuck they call their activation scheme now.

    16. Re:Forced upgrades. by sexconker · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The point is to have games and whatever other Windows-only critical applications you need when you need them, but to get away from Windows and it's "telemetry" whenever you can. With Windows in a VM, you can block the forced updates and spying. Windows as a host OS will subvert your attempts to block these things, and you'd have to run an external firewall. By running Windows in a VM, the external firewall is simply on the host OS.

    17. Re:Forced upgrades. by sexconker · · Score: 1

      As far as I know, at least with AMD cards, there's no more chore.

      You run your monitor off of the built-in GPU, and your dedicated GPU is given wholesale to the VM. Then you just run the VM fullscreen when you want to play a game. The game gets full access to the GPU, and your VM player pipes it all back out to the built-in GPU. I don't know if any noticeable latency is introduced, but I do know performance in game is supposed to be as good as native now.

      Running network for a Windows box through an external filter will also work, yes. But then that Windows box is tied to physical hardware with whatever activation malarkey they've got going that could trip on upgrades, you can't snapshot it easily, it's not portable, etc. I just think the VM option is easier.

    18. Re:Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Its called "putting Windows into a straightjacket"... Ghod KNOWS thats where it (and the maroons in Redmond who wrote it) belongs....

    19. Re:Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I guess all you maroons who play games on your computer are gonna be stuck with the shit abuse that MS heaps on their "customers"... oops.. I meant victims.. MS's customers are the companies (and government agencies) that MS sends all your data they collect... Those of us who don't waste our time with mindless computer games and only use our computers for work and therefore stay the FUCK AWAY from MS's steaming pile of shit OS...

    20. Re:Forced upgrades. by chipschap · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Well, I use my computer mostly for working purposes, I run Linux, I'm no fan of MS, and I'm not a video/computer gamer, but I have to say you're making an unfair judgment.

      There are people who enjoy computer games. There is nothing wrong with that. No doubt you, Mr. AC, enjoy some forms of recreation. What would make your choice better than someone else's?

      If a person enjoys a video game, more power to them. If that person needs to run Windows to enjoy a particular game of choice, that's a valid decision. Yes, it comes with some downsides, but it's nonetheless valid and who are we to say it's not?

      I don't and won't run Windows, but if someone else chooses to run an OS different from mine, or chooses a recreation different from mine, that's their business and their right.

    21. Re: Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Their comment told you that they believe in things for which there is no evidence. You're unlikely to have a productive conversation with them.

    22. Re:Forced upgrades. by pr0fessor · · Score: 1

      wine has a rather large list of retail games with a platinum rating....

    23. Re:Forced upgrades. by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      wine has a rather large list of retail games with a platinum rating....

      I've lost track of the number of times a game has performed well below its wine rating. Enough times to where I stopped trying, and just accepted that I would have a Windows PC. But it's running Windows 7, and I'm not planning to upgrade, so I'm also not planning to buy any games which won't run on Windows 7... or Linux.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    24. Re:Forced upgrades. by pr0fessor · · Score: 1

      I haven't had a linux desktop as my default for probably 15 years so I couldn't tell you how well wine works now... but I used it for a lot of games back then.

    25. Re:Forced upgrades. by donaldm · · Score: 1

      It's pretty easy to hit that milestone when you force people to upgrade without their consent. Don't get me wrong - I have Windows 10 on both my desktop (dual boot) and personal laptop; I have it on one of my work laptops (the other is Windows 7/Linux dual boot). I'm probably one of the few people who like it, but I don't pretend like what MS didn't wasn't disgraceful.

      It is funny how Microsoft announces the Windows 10 adoption when other sites state that Windows 10 is still around 26% with Windows 7 (48.5%) and other versions of Windows including "XP", 8.0 and 8.1 taking 15.58%. It appears Microsoft only give out figures if it suits them.

      The information I have given was in April 2017.

      BTW. All my computing devices have a Linux kernel. I don't run Microsoft anything although to be fair I have Windows 10 in a virtual machine and all up I have run that operating system for about an hour. Windows 10 does love to chat with machines that are owned by Microsoft (Wireshark is great) and that was when I thought I had the OS locked down.

      --
      There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
    26. Re: Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's Linux? I had to Bing it. So many versions it's confusing to someone like me who just wants to edit some photos and get online. It's just easier for me to stick with what came with my computer since it does what I want it to do well enough.

    27. Re:Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Thanks for your answer. I didn't know about the display beaming or have trouble believing it works (I guess worst case, you may use H264 or H265 frame-by-frame encoding on the guest's GPU and have that sent over socket-based network to the host. No special support except what AMD, nvidia or Valve might provide for game streaming)

      I have the feeling you would have activation woes by changing the hypervisor or host hardware though. Albeit I wanted to tell you I usually don't have activation woes on real hardware and so this wouldn't be something I would worry about very much.

    28. Re:Forced upgrades. by maugle · · Score: 1

      I voluntarily upgraded from 7. And I regret it.

    29. Re:Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I used to buy expensive computers to handle work and games. Now I buy cheap computers and run Linux on it for work. For gaming, I have a PS4 Pro.

    30. Re:Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Microsoft includes PCs, tablets, phones and consoles when they count their Malware 10 numbers.

    31. Re: Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I give the same answer to anyone asking about which version of Linux to use. Linux Mint. There is no need for anything else if you are a newb or if you just want a desktop OS.

      Linux Mint just works. It is easier to install and use than Windows.

    32. Re:Forced upgrades. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Worse than Windows Me? Now you are being ridiculous.

  2. That has to be the world's largest botnet. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I mean, what else do you call computers that are mostly hijacked without your consent in order to communicate with command servers to hand over your private information and receive commands you don't have control over?

  3. How many new PCs? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How many PCs are sold per year?

    I'd be curious to see the relationship.

    1. Re: How many new PCs? by TheOuterLinux · · Score: 1

      I don't think they sold as many as they want you to think. That's why they keep pushing cloud computing so hard to entrap people into a monthly fee when there are FOSS alternatives (LibreOffice, Firefox, GIMP, Inkscape, etc.).

    2. Re: How many new PCs? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yeah that was my point though.

      I would presume close to parity of new PCs to Windows 10 activations.
      If the new PC sales are less then that means people are moving to Windows 10 (but how many 5%? 25%?)
      If the new PC sales are more than that means people are holding off of Windows 10 (installing linux or older versions of Windows) (and same here 5%? 25%?)

      What's the trend of adoption?

      Raw numbers are great but context is important - like the old sports scores joke goes: "Those game scores are 5-4, 10-7 and 2-1" "Which teams?"

    3. Re: How many new PCs? by gfxguy · · Score: 1

      I have three laptops since Windows 10 came out (one for work, one for home, one for my son) that all came with Windows 10, but I've also upgraded my desktop, my son's desktop, and my wife's desktop. I have an older work laptop I'd love to upgrade to Windows 10, too (it's currently 7). I realize I'm in the minority here, but I actually like using Windows 10 (when I need to use Windows at all, anyway, most of the ones I use dual boot).

      --
      Stupid sexy Flanders.
    4. Re: How many new PCs? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I realize I'm in the minority here, but I actually like using Windows 10 .

      The only scope in which that is a minority perspective is "rabid Linux advocates" (like the loudest vermin on Slashdot). As always, there is a non-trivial "I don't like change" population, but they hate Linux and MacOS even more than any new version of Windows (despite the fictional assertions, Microsoft provides the longest maintenance and support duration on any OS build of anyone out there).

      There are uses for Linux, and MacOS is a prettier POSIX frontend. People who try to make morality assertions on matters of personal preference are among the more vile dogmatics. Use what you like.

    5. Re: How many new PCs? by LVSlushdat · · Score: 1

      I realize I'm in the minority here, but I actually like using Windows 10 .

      Well.. sure, Windows 10 arguably *looks* pretty spiffy and may actually *work* fairly well on appropriate hardware, but if you either don't realize (or don't care) about what a nightmare 10 is, prvacy-wise with its "telemetry", you are what I'd call a "sheep"... Those of us who know (and care) about this blatant in-your-face privacy violation by MS, don't use Windows.. In other words, the ONLY way to win with MS products, is to NOT PLAY.....

      --
      THANK YOU, Edward Snowden!! Americans owe you a debt of gratitude (whether they know it or not..)
    6. Re: How many new PCs? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The person to whom I am responding is just barely a Linux user. Fortunately, it is easy enough for even a moron to install. However, you end up with rabid fans, such as him, who don't actually understand what they are doing, or why. IIRC, they have maybe a couple of years of playing with Linux. I'm absolutely positive that they don't actually have a valid reason for their preferences and they're not technically competent enough to prevent any unwanted behavior, regardless of their OS choice.

      It's a shame, really. Slashdot used to have smart, and able, people. People like the above poster are why we don't even bother logging in anymore, if we even bother to visit.

  4. Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Sorry but I can't take this seriously considering the source; anyone have a link to statistics concerning voluntary installation of Windows 10? From a credible non-Miscreant-o-soft source only, please.

    1. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by ausekilis · · Score: 1

      Do you count all those computers that came with it pre-installed? After all, it was installed by the OEM...

    2. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you don't believe Microsoft's figure about the number of devices running Windows 10, then it fine to ask for a non-Microsoft source, but don't also change the definition of what's being counted.

    3. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      And does it count all the ones where users never actually ran Windows 10 and just installed a different OS?

      My current laptop came with Windows 10 installed, and a Windows 7 DVD if you wanted to upgrade... but I just pulled the hard drive out and plugged in an SSD with Linux installed on it.

      All that said, we finally replaced our old XP iTunes machine with a Windows 10 machine at the weekend, and it didn't suck as bad as Windows 8. So there does seem to be some progress in Redmond.

    4. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by squiggleslash · · Score: 1

      It's right there in the first sentence. The number is up 200 million over last year. Microsoft ended its Windows 7/8.x forced upgrades thing over a year ago, so we can reasonably suggest all 200 million are voluntary (or, well, as voluntary as installing the near-monopoly OS is.)

      --
      You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
    5. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Who cares? Voluntary or not doesn't come into it if they actively have a Windows 10 machine and have chosen not to throw it into the bottom of the ocean.

    6. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > It's right there in the first sentence. The number is up 200 million over last year. Microsoft ended its Windows 7/8.x forced upgrades thing over a year ago, so we can reasonably suggest all 200 million are voluntary (or, well, as voluntary as installing the near-monopoly OS is.)

      More than 200 million PCs and laptop are sold each year. As the vast majority are sold with Windows 10 already installed then the number of old machines 'upgrading' to Windows 10 is quite small, or is roughly equivalent to the number of new machines being re-imaged back to older versions.

    7. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      Do you count all those computers that came with it pre-installed? After all, it was installed by the OEM...

      An offer they can't refuse, so yes.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    8. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 1

      How about statistics concerning how many Windows 10 users, who bought a computer with it pre-installed, are too technologically uninformed/uneducated/flat-out-ignorant to know there's anything else they could have running their computer, or for that matter even know an 'operating system' from a hole in the wall? It's hard to have a choice when you don't even know there is a choice.

    9. Re: Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh, and how about statistics if the user has blond hair, freckles, is colorblind, or has a driver's license.

      Stop pretending to be smart. It's painfully transparent for those of us who actually are smart.

    10. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (whatever microsoft claims is the install base) - 37 = number of pissed off users.

      that 37 is the only ones, worldwide, that installed windows 10 (or purchased a new 'device' specifically because of it, like it, have had zero issues with it, and weren't paid or compensated for their positive opinion of it. thirty-seven.

    11. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      And it's still irrelevant. Using Windows 10 out of ignorance is still using Windows 10. Advertisers and investors don't care why you're using it.

      Personally I like it, but I also understand many people don't and that it's rollout could only be desribed a "dick move" but that doesn't change the numbers that MS reports to the people who give them money. ... Sadly .

    12. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 1

      Are you one of those people who aren't bothered by how much you're being surveilled in public places, or how much your ISP and other 'organizations' are logging and analyzing your Internet usage? One of those people who always say "I'm not doing anything wrong, so I have nothing to fear"? If you are then that explains a lot about your attitude on this subject. Or are you just a shareholder of Microsoft stock, and anything that makes them money is a good thing so far as you're concerned?

    13. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Are you one of those people who aren't bothered by how much you're being surveilled in public places

      You're reading things that I didn't say and didn't imply. This is a story about MS talking about how awesome they are. This is a thread about the relevance of MS's forcing actions. My entire point is and was that whether or not the user chose to install something or not is irrelevant to MS advertising it's figures.

      I've said nothing about privacy. I've said nothing about the impact to end users. I've said nothing about how I feel about the situation at all and only explained from a neutral point that the statistic Slashdot users are asking for is irrelevant in the context of MS's announcement.

      your attitude on this subject

      You know what says a lot about my attitude on the subject? Being able to understand what subject is actually being discussed.

      Or are you just a shareholder of Microsoft stock

      You're very quick to put labels on people. So let me put one on you: illiterate.

    14. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 1

      Microsoft claiming huge numbers of installed Windows 10 is disingenuous when it includes forced installations and 'stealth' installations on computers of people who don't even understand what's happening or what they're being unilaterally signed up for. It's about as legitimate as some authoritarian dictatorship claiming 'crime free streets' when the mechanism behind that is total marshall law and threat of being shot dead if you're out on the street after curfew.

      As to your last poke at me: Shove it up your ass, you fucking JERK.

    15. Re:Statistics on VOLUNTARY installations? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Disingenuous to who? Not to investors, not to partners, not to developers, and not to shareholders. These 4 groups are the only reason you would make a statement on your install base. They don't care if customers love your stuff, or customers use it because there's a gun to their head. They don't care if it's legitimate, they only care if its correct.

      As to your last poke at me

      I merely poked back. Doesn't feel good does it.

  5. Yay! by thegreatbob · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It's absolutely amazing what you can accomplish when you could not care less about people's choice in the matter.

    --
    There is no XUL, only WebExtensions...
    1. Re:Yay! by Sperbels · · Score: 1

      It seems to work for government, so why not software?

  6. Most impressive by easyTree · · Score: 1

    and a testament to the effectiveness of the automatic / forced update system.

    --
    Requiem for the American Dream
    1. Re:Most impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Forced? Microsoft decided to not allow most customers to upgrade to 10. They block it for several of the editions and only allow the last couple of versions to upgrade. At work, we have around 250 PCs for QA testing, and not a single damn one was allowed the free upgrade to 10. Microsoft is so embarrassed by 10 that they aren't allowing people to upgrade. My personal vista laptop boots 10 just fine with the install DVD, but Microsoft doesn't allow me to upgrade. It's an i7 with 64 GB of memory(yes, on a laptop), so it's more than capable of running 10, but Microsoft doesn't allow the upgrade.

    2. Re:Most impressive by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      Forced? Microsoft decided to not allow most customers to upgrade to 10.

      Users of retail/OEM copies of windows 7 were pushed strongly upgrading to windows 10. There were certainly at least accusations of outright forced upgrades though I don't know how credible those were.

      Users of 7 enterprise OTOH were not given the free upgrade. If they wanted to upgrade they had to do it through their volume license agreement and media (and depending on their status in said volume license agreement posiblly pay MS money).

      I'm not sure what happened regarding users of 7 pro whose systems were activated with a VLK.

      My personal vista laptop boots 10 just fine with the install DVD, but Microsoft doesn't allow me to upgrade. It's an i7 with 64 GB of memory(yes, on a laptop), so it's more than capable of running 10, but Microsoft doesn't allow the upgrade.

      That is one heck of a weird combination. Windows 7 was released in mid 2009. X79 (afaict the first Desktop platform to support 64GB) was not released until late 2011 and afaict it took some time after that for someone to be crazy enough to stuff it into a laptop.

      So either you got a machine with a Vista license over two and a half years after windows 7 was released. Your machine was downgraded to Vista for some reason (in which case you should have been able to get Win 10 by upgrading via win 7), you have a laptop with server hardware inside or you are making shit up.

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
    3. Re:Most impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > making shit up.

      Newegg has several ThinkPad laptops for less than $2k with 64 GB of memory. Sager has offered them for many years albeit at a much higher price. Why would call him a liar when such hardware is so common and cheap?

    4. Re: Most impressive by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They ended that well over a year ago. This number is for the last year.

      Are you willfully obtuse, or just stupid?

      I don't even like Microsoft. I just tire of stupidity being displayed at what was once a site for intelligent people.

    5. Re:Most impressive by petermgreen · · Score: 1

      Newegg has several ThinkPad laptops for less than $2k with 64 GB of memory.

      Interesting,

      Sager has offered them for many years albeit at a much higher price.

      Afaict the first Intel laptop/mainstream desktop platform to support 64GB was Skylake released in September 2015. Afaict the first Intel high-end desktop platform to support was sandy-bridge-e with the x79 chipset released in November 2011.

      It seems my previous post was off a little, On the one hand I found an reference to an x79 laptop only a few months after x79 was released but OTOH looking closer at the x79 laptops I found they seem to be listing a max memory of 32GB. I guess the manufacturers only put one ram slot per channel due to space constraints.

      If you can find a reference to a laptop with 64GB of ram from 2014 or earlier I would be interested to see it.

      Why would call him a liar when such hardware is so common and cheap?

      The combination of Vista, 64GB of ram and a laptop just doesn't ring true. Any one of those things? sure any two? possible all three? highly unlikely.

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
  7. Depressing... by hackel · · Score: 1

    I just can't believe Windows is still a thing in 2017. At least Linux still has them beat, thanks to Android!

    1. Re: Depressing... by LoopesSPT · · Score: 1

      I would use linux for everything but the problem is that wine can't run the "Hackshield/Gameguard" protected games and i mainly play MMOs and i don't want the hassle of changing OSs everytime i need to change between gaming and browsing the web or something else...

    2. Re: Depressing... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Wow...

      Android is not GNU. There is no GNU/Linux involved. They were quite clearly referencing Android.

      Go away.

  8. Oh fuck off by ilsaloving · · Score: 3, Informative

    It is now virtually impossible to get anything *other* than Windows 10 on computers. Newer machines with Kaby Lake or Ryzen processors effectively *force* you to get Windows 10. Microsoft is figuratively holding a gun to people's heads and saying, "You use Windows 10, or nothing at all."

    In other news, taco sales are through the roof! The fact that it's now mandatory for people to eat Tacos for dinner every day has *nothing* to do with it.

    Assholes.

    1. Re:Oh fuck off by irrational_design · · Score: 1

      I guess that depends on your definition of computers. I haven't used a laptop or desktop or mobile device running Windows since around the turn of the century.

    2. Re:Oh fuck off by ilsaloving · · Score: 1

      I'm ignoring Macs, Linux and Android for simplicity.

      Like it or not, Windows is still the 100lbs gorilla in the computer world.

    3. Re:Oh fuck off by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      "Windows is still the 100lbs gorilla in the computer world."

      Windows is a tiny niche product in the computer world.

      Most phones and tablets run BSD or Linux. Most servers run Linux. Only the legacy desktop market is still a big win for Microsoft.

    4. Re:Oh fuck off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Most phones and tablets run BSD or Linux. Most servers run Linux. Only the legacy gaming desktop market is still a big win for Microsoft.

      FTFY

    5. Re:Oh fuck off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not sure whether deliberate or not, but saying 100lb gorilla (instead of the usual 800lb gorilla) highlights how much smaller Windows is.

      100lb (45kg) is below the average female human weight, whereas 800lb (360kg) would be a very scary gorilla.

      (And I still know this, even though I don't come from one of the three remaining non-metric countries: US, Burma and Liberia.)

    6. Re:Oh fuck off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > Like it or not, Windows is still the 100lbs gorilla in the computer world.

      Lightweight and not intelligent ?

    7. Re:Oh fuck off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is there a tablet or phone with :

      - VGA and HDMI output. Both!
      Without the VGA, that 1680x1080 22" monitor isn't going to plug itself
      - four full size USB 2.0 ports for keyboard, mouse, USB thumb drive and misc
      - three 3.5mm jacks, not just one! forever a just-in-case but who are you to tell me it shouldn't have inputs
      - an OS with a task bar and Libre Office or something that does the same (get a document from USB drive, modify/compose a document, save it to USB drive, print to PDF)
      - that's about all, although for matching 8-year-old surplus desktops and even half broken netbooks it should come with 256GB storage as standard. 64GB is ok to store a thousand low res pictures and a few dozen documents and have a very large headroom, if your OS is very small
      - built in power supply for good measure

      bonus
      - stream 480p porn on websites without catching viruses or drive-by thing that corrupts google chrome

      that's about all.
      could also have : PS/2 port, micro SD reader, rj45 ethernet jack (for people who pay for their internet and have the internet next to the computer) (100Mb beats 2.4GHz wifi pretty well)

    8. Re: Oh fuck off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're proud of willfully ignoring the alternatives and claiming it is figurative force.

      Did someone swap Slashdot users for Reddit users, when I wasn't looking?

      Go away.

    9. Re: Oh fuck off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The best part about Slashdot is that posts almost never get deleted. Their idiocy will be, proudly, on display in perpetuity. I'm not sure why people are proud of their ignorance.

      I guess that I am out of patience. I've decided to stop helping and just start telling the idiots, like the one you replied to, to go away. Hopefully, they'll take the hint. Who knows? They might double-down.

    10. Re:Oh fuck off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "You use Windows 10, or not Windows"

      FTFY, and fine by me! Not using Windows.

    11. Re:Oh fuck off by irrational_design · · Score: 1

      Wait... what? There are far more computers running a variant of Unix (Linux, Android, iOS, MacOs, and all the other Unix distros) than running Windows. Just the install base for Android outstrips Windows.

    12. Re:Oh fuck off by ilsaloving · · Score: 1

      That is true, but the key factor is, "What's it used for?"

      The overwhelming majority of those unix variant system are used for playing Candy Crush Saga and Flappy Bird, or browsing Facebook. They are primarily consumption devices. While there have some inroads towards empowering those devices to do more (eg: Office 365, google apps, etc), they are still overwhelmingly used for consumption.

      I'm willing to bet that there are more computerized temperature control systems are at least equal to the number of desktop computers in people's houses, but no one is clamouring to compare those against Windows.

      Looking at desktop/laptop marketshare, where actual work is being done Windows is still the undisputable king. Businesses still primarily use Windows. Home users still primarily use windows. If your a PC gamer, you're virtually guaranteed to be using Windows.

      There is still a great deal of software that is only available for Windows. Most AAA games are windows only. Software like Quickbooks, which is a make-or-break tool for most businesses, is only available for Windows.

      Macs have... what? Maybe 15% marketshare, give or taken? Linux on the desktop is practically a rounding error.

      All this is slowly changing, especially as the mobile device market expands and diversifies, but we are not there yet. I am personally delighted that Microsoft has so completely and utterly failed in almost every market that doesn't involve desktops. But we still have to be realistic about the fact that, at least as of now, regular Windows computers still retain a very strong 'wag the dog' status.

  9. In Only Ten Years by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Windows 10 will be on 49.6 billion devices!

    1. Re: In Only Ten Years by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      99.9% of them in landfills

  10. Dear slashdot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't care.
    Enough with the MS crap

    1. Re:Dear slashdot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I care.
      Enough with the non-MS crap.

  11. Re:Comey asked DOJ for more money for investigatio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Trump is on his way to imprisonment

  12. Re:Comey asked DOJ for more money for investigatio by easyTree · · Score: 2

    Offences traditionally considered worthy of impeachment are treated with more lenience since the landmark decision in Clinton vs morality 2016.

    --
    Requiem for the American Dream
  13. Re:Comey asked DOJ for more money for investigatio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Trump is on his way to immortality

  14. It's being forced, basically by ErichTheRed · · Score: 1

    In all but an official announcement, Microsoft is telgraphing that Windows 7, 8 and 8.1 are completely dead. They want nothing to do with supporting downlevel operating systems at this point (because Windows as a Service) and anyone who wants to remain on Windows 7 is just not going to be tolerated for much longer. I'm getting the impression that the farthest back Microsoft is going to go in terms of support is the last LTSB release, and even then grudgingly so.

    Holdouts on the business side of things don't have much longer to buy systems that will correctly work downgraded to Windows 7. Windows 10 migrations are essentially forced at this point, at least for any new corporate hardware purchases, because Microsoft has stopped supporting Windows 7 updates on current-generation Intel CPUs. It'll run, but they have artificially blocked updates for Windows 7 if you have a 7th generation Intel chip (or whatever they have on the AMD side.) There was a small window where Microsoft allowed vendors to sell a subset of their business PC line that would be immune from this block, but that time is now over.

    I'm mostly OK with Windows 10 at this point, and most compatibility problems we've seen so far have been because of very old and very strange software we need to support. Still, between giving away the upgrade to consumers for "free" in exchange for usage data, and slowly pulling back business support for older OSes, no wonder the adoption numbers keep rising. The interesting thing to see will be once everyone's on "10," how frequently can they get people to jump to the next LTSB release? Consumers have no choice (CB for them,) and businesses not running LTSB will be upgraded automatically on the CBB schedule too.

  15. Re:Comey asked DOJ for more money for investigatio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's right. He will easily win his second term, with more votes than Reagan.

    Greatest president EVAR!

  16. Re:Comey asked DOJ for more money for investigatio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I'm not terribly old (43), but Trump is one of the best, and most clever, presidents we have had in a long time. He was absolutely in the right with firing Comey and eventually the country will see that.

    I have no doubt that in eight years we will sadly say goodbye to one of the greatest presidents. He won't be impeached. In fact, his ratings will only go up.

  17. Re:Comey asked DOJ for more money for investigatio by 0123456 · · Score: 0

    SJWs always double-down on the stupid.

  18. I guess the stats for stupidity are in: by TheOuterLinux · · Score: 2

    I guess it's about 1/14 if there are 7 billion people with 500 million systems. Though, it's not really their fault when you force updates to a system that spies on you 24/7 and limits what you can do with it, claiming it's for your "safety." No, you have a "store" you want all of us to use. Ever heard of FOSS or Linux? Micro$oft payed their way into the Linux Foundation and partnered with Canonical (Ubuntu) and have been trying their damnedest for decades now to destroy Linux and FOSS software so that we all end up under their control. We've got cloud computing for that now. You'd be amazed at how many people never even heard of Firefox or LibreOffice and you can thank Google and M$ for that. And now, you've got idiot millennials on FOSS related forums trying to get developers to make cloud app versions just so they can use it on their tablets. News flash, those tablets are throttled on purpose just to get you to suggest such a thing. Cloud computing is not for your benefit, only the developers and the company making money off of open source server software, basically using open source to destroy open source. If they wanted to put 4GB+ RAM and x86 in tablets they really could. I have a decade old laptop with 4GB of RAM. The iPad is 7 years old and was actually in development before the iPhone but didn't get released until later. So, how does selling new 2017 laptops with the same 64-bit version of the 32-bit specs but with only about 1.2 Gz at such high prices make any sense? Look how thin laptops are now. There's no reason not to make a tablet, or are they terrified people will just wipe it and put another OS on it?

  19. Re:Comey asked DOJ for more money for investigatio by ColdWetDog · · Score: 0

    How do you determine a bot's age?

    --
    Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
  20. Devices you say ? by dargaud · · Score: 1

    I'm running, I and will only ever run, Win10 into a bunch of virtual machines on a solid Linux DEVICE. They are certainly not running on their own DEVICE. I have enough security concerns as it goes, thank you.

    --
    Non-Linux Penguins ?
    1. Re:Devices you say ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We tried that since we need Windows 10 for testing, but it's just too slow to use even on a new i7 6700HQ with 64 GB of memory. Our testers refused to use to test on Windows on a vm. We had to switch to running Windows on the laptop with Linux on a vm. Of course, that sucks greatly since Windows keeps blue screening and rebooting for forced updates to it crashes the Linux vm, but it's better than trying to use that Windows garbage on a vm because it's just too damn slow to use.

    2. Re:Devices you say ? by blackpaw · · Score: 1

      Given we run 30 windows Vm's on a 3 node KVM cluster (Proxmox) I'd say someone had no idea how to configure windows for virtualisation. It runs just fine, windows 7, 2008/R2 and 10, desktop and servers.

      Xeon E5-2620, 64GB RAM

  21. Comment by WallyL · · Score: 4, Funny

    Cheap grab for attention/points/karma/laughs:

    Hello, Windows developer. Please select one of the following options for the new Windows "Free" Initiative:
    ( . ) Free as in freedom
    ( . ) Free as in beer
    ( X ) Free as in herpes

    ^ Thank you for your selection. Have a nice day!

    1. Re:Comment by Tough+Love · · Score: 3, Insightful

      ( . ) Free as in freedom
      ( . ) Free as in beer
      ( X ) Free as in herpes

      (x) Free as in convicted sex offender on parole

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    2. Re:Comment by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      (x) Free as in convicted sex offender on parole

      Like, hot teacher woman who screwed a 15-year-old boy or 19-year-old guy who screwed a hot 16-year-old girl?

      If that's the deal, I'll be ready to use Edge (blarg) or Word (ewww) to make a hundred pre-printed sex consent letters.

    3. Re:Comment by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      You know what we mean: sex offender like a 50 year old football coach groping pre-teen boys in the shower or a 70 year old presidential candidate using pick-up lines on a ten year old.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  22. Shit conference by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Not even a backpack. Theme of the conference is: did you invest in on premise infrasructure? Like predicatable costs? Aversion to shitty support from shitholistan? Well fuck you then. Azure or die!

  23. Weak by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

    Especially considering Microsoft's monopoly power over OEMs, you would think it would be four or five times this number. After all, Android arrives on over a billion new devices a year these days. Seems inescapable to conclude that Microsoft is now firmly second-rate.

    --
    When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    1. Re: Weak by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you retarded? You say they have a monopoly (over OEMs, which is stupid in its own right) and then point out the many other devices sold that, quite distinctly, aren't Windows.

      Reddit...

      That is where you belong. Go there. Do not return.

    2. Re: Weak by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      Are you eight years old? It is a matter of record that Microsoft exercises monopoly power in the personal computer market segment.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
    3. Re: Weak by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That was over twenty years ago. Go to Reddit. Slashdot is for people with an Above average IQ.

    4. Re:Weak by painandgreed · · Score: 1

      Especially considering Microsoft's monopoly power over OEMs,...

      That and business licenses. I'm wondering if my business' 5000 seats are listed in there as technically we're buying that many Windows 10 installs*

      *With the right to downgrade to something else because our software requires it, but that probably isn't recorded anywhere.

    5. Re: Weak by Tough+Love · · Score: 1

      Slashdot is for people with an Above average IQ.

      You being here would seem to contradict that.

      --
      When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
  24. 500M by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    500 million suckers!

  25. Counting reinstalls. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    enough said.

  26. Re:Comey asked DOJ for more money for investigatio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's definitely the first time I heard someone call Trump a Social Justice Warrior.

  27. Re:Comey asked DOJ for more money for investigatio by 0123456 · · Score: 1

    Like I said, you always double down.

  28. But they're not hitting milestones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Installs have been much slower than anticipated and they had to change forecasts already, that's the news.

    http://www.computerworld.com/a...

  29. Windows 10 S is free, missing free apps by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    With Windows 10 S a lot of people won't be able to quickly get up and running with their favorite OSS apps anymore, none of them are on the Windows Store damn near

    Now there will be a $50 barrier to using any free/libre apps

  30. I wonder if they are counting me? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I 'upgraded' my best desktop box to Windows 10, thinking that I pretty much had to in order to use Visual Studio at home, and also thinking that I could mitigate the telemetry bullshit using the available tools.

    Then, after doing all the work to try to turn off the telemetry, I realized that I simply didn't trust that I could actually do it - all of those settings, what did I miss? That next update - which settings did it change back for me?

    So, I turned off my best desktop box, and have never turned it back on again (except to attempt to load Ubuntu, which has failed every time due to the impossible hardware security bullshit now in place).

    I installed it, but I don't use it. I bet they are counting me.

    And here is my statement, spitting into the wind - Microsoft, I'm gone, and I not coming back. Linux is usable, Windows 10 is not - not for me.

    Lastly, on a separate subject, I think it's incredibly comical that they are releasing a product (Windows 10 Essssssss) where Joe Sixpack is going to say - what do you mean I can't Google with it?

    Good luck with that.

  31. wow by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I guess I'm the last one . None of my current PC has windows 10 on it
    and last time I check, you still need to get license for windows 10 - it's not free. Maybe free download
    but you still need to activate it

    and I don't see much features on windows 10 that I want to upgrade or update
    my current PCs

  32. Please share what you know by john5819 · · Score: 0

    You can easily firewall off all of the bullshit "telemetry" from the Windows VM, block the forced updates, etc. while still having it function normally online for games and other shit.

    You must know something others don't. From everything I've been able to learn so far, nobody has successfully blocked all Windows telemetry for more than a short period of time while still having Internet access. It certainly hasn't been for lack of effort.

  33. In other news, 200 million PC's have been sold by ET3D · · Score: 1

    In the past year, OEM's have shipped around 200 million Windows based PC's, I'm guessing.

  34. Taken with a pinch of salt. by tailgunner_050 · · Score: 1

    Big companies like Microsoft are always over stating these sorts of things. How many of these windows 10 machines get used daily by people is a more important statistic imo.

  35. Maybe so... by OneoFamillion · · Score: 1

    Then again, maybe it's because people don't have an choice. I was handed a hybrid HP laptop with Win10 and locked-down Insyde UEFI firmware. Haven't been able to install Linux on it yet, so I'm essentially using it as an offline PDF reader for now...