Slashdot Mirror


It's Time For Academics To Take Back Control Of Research Journals (theguardian.com)

Stephen Curry, a professor of structural biology at Imperial College London, has a piece on The Guardian today in which he outlines the history of the relationship between commercial interests, academic prestige and the circulation of research. An excerpt from the article: "Publish or perish" has long been the mantra of seeking to make a success of their research career. Reputations are built on the ability to communicate something new to the world. Increasingly, however, they are determined by numbers, not by words, as universities are caught in a tangle of management targets composed of academic journal impact factors, university rankings and scores in the government's research excellence framework. The chase for metricised success has been further exacerbated by the takeover of scholarly publishing by profit-seeking commercial companies, which pose as partners but no longer seem properly in tune with academia. Evidence of the growing divergence between academic and commercial interests is visible in the secrecy around negotiations on subscription and open access charges. It's also clear from the popularity among academics of the controversial site Sci-Hub, which has made over 60m research articles freely available on the internet. Over-worked researchers could be forgiven for thinking that the time-honoured mantra has morphed to "publish, and perish anyway."

74 comments

  1. Pretentious by 110010001000 · · Score: 0

    The summary is pretentious enough. "Caught in a tangle of management targets"?

    1. Re:Pretentious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      > The summary is pretentious enough. "Caught in a tangle of management targets"?

      I don't see anything wrong with the language. Do you have a problem with the wording or the substance of it?

    2. Re:Pretentious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think it boils down to 'You talk like a fag!'.

    3. Re:Pretentious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They used words to express ideas? Pretentious bastards! Why can't they use emojis like everyone else?

      Translation: Caught = trapped. In a tangle = in a tangle. Management targets = targets set by management and/or managers. There, that wasn't so bad, was it?

    4. Re:Pretentious by 110010001000 · · Score: 1

      Why not just say "management sucks"? Talk American.

    5. Re:Pretentious by PopeRatzo · · Score: 2

      The summary is pretentious enough. "Caught in a tangle of management targets"?

      Translation: "I need more one-syllable words!"

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    6. Re:Pretentious by PopeRatzo · · Score: 0

      The institutions, run by the elite tier of academics, are in bed with the the journals. It's not broken; it's working precisely as intended.

      You stupid sonofabitch. Who do you think edits the journals? They're supposed to be in bed together.

      Or would you be more comfortable if we turned to "regular folks" to edit the Journal of Computational Physics?

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    7. Re:Pretentious by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      I've been listening to a bit of Marillion recently, I'm sure it's a line from Fugazi.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    8. Re:Pretentious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh. I'm guessing you'd prefer Betsy DeVos and the Trumpenreich personally lord over the Three Tomes of Acceptable American Knowledge?

    9. Re:Pretentious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pretentiousness is a reflection of the reader, not the writer.

      Pick up a book instead of voting for a crook.

    10. Re:Pretentious by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      You stupid sonofabitch. Who do you think edits the journals?

      Mostly? No one. If they were actually doing a reasonable job of copyediting, then I wouldn't have a problem with them. Instead, they'll let poor English through, but just to show that they're doing something worthwhile they'll make some gratuitous changes that alter the meaning. I saw a particularly amusing example of this where someone had cited some of our work and used an acronym. The editor had obviously searched for the acronym and expanded it without considering the context and inserted a blatantly incorrect expansion.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    11. Re:Pretentious by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      Mostly? No one. If they were actually doing a reasonable job of copyediting,

      When "editing" is used in regard to scientific journals, it doesn't refer to copyediting, but to the editorial process of assembling and vetting content. Peer review for example.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    12. Re:Pretentious by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      Oh, you mean the thing that's done, for free, by volunteer academics? Yes, I do that. No, I'm not paid for it.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    13. Re:Pretentious by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      Oh, you mean the thing that's done, for free, by volunteer academics? Yes, I do that. No, I'm not paid for it.

      Nor should you. Paying academics to edit journals would open the system up to a lot of corruption. When you write a paper that is published in the journal, you are also not being paid directly.

      It's just part of the job. When you're a scientist, you're expected to publish in peer-reviewed journals. You're also expected to participate in the peer-review process for other scientists.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    14. Re:Pretentious by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The summary is pretentious enough. "Caught in a tangle of management targets"?

      That part of the 'summary,' and the rest of it as well, is not a summary. It is a word for word quote. I think you see the 'summary' as pretentious because you have a feeling of inadequacy or have otherwise determined you are not 'good' enough. What do I know though? The only thing I'd be willing to bet on is the potential for your labeling this comment as pretentious.

    15. Re:Pretentious by TheRaven64 · · Score: 2

      So what is the part of for-profit journals that is worth the money that they're paid, if they're not editing and they're not paying reviewers and they're not producing paper versions that anyone cares about?

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    16. Re:Pretentious by PopeRatzo · · Score: 2

      So what is the part of for-profit journals that is worth the money that they're paid, if they're not editing and they're not paying reviewers and they're not producing paper versions that anyone cares about?

      I agree with you about all of that, except your conflation of editing and proofreading.

      For-profit journals are a scam. Not the journal part, but the for-profit part. Where there is a need for journals, there's no reason they should be for-profit. But then, I agree with Pierre-Joseph Proudon that all profits are little more than a tax on productivity.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    17. Re:Pretentious by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      What do young servant schoolboys have to do with this?

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
  2. Yes, but that's like by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    This other industry.

    Eventually, talent won't be running the show - professional managers will, or it probably won't survive. And the managers won't necessarily have the best interests of the talent first, and sometimes not even second or third.

    1. Re:Yes, but that's like by phantomfive · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I guess from the perspective of an academic:
      1) They got into science presumably because they want to do science, not run a journal.
      2) Running a journal is a lot of work for no extra pay
      3) The university pays for their Elsevier subscription anyway, so they get access to all the other papers already (and non-PhDs don't do science anyway).

      --
      "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    2. Re:Yes, but that's like by gwolf · · Score: 1

      It depends what you mean by "to run". Some research institutes publish their own journal. Being its chief editor is a honor for the designated scholar - And, if the journal is good and visible, gives them quite a bit of exposure, which translates into academic "points".

    3. Re:Yes, but that's like by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      2) Running a journal is a lot of work for no extra pay

      If you're doing online-only publication, it's not that much harder than being on the programme committee for a conference (actually, less so, because you don't have such hard deadlines) and academics are expected to do that for the good of the subject and for no extra pay.

      - An academic who spent a large chunk of his Christmas holiday reviewing a big pile of papers for an ACM conference.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
  3. Sci-Hub won't last by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Sci-Hub is not the solution. The issue is twofold: First, scientists (still) believe they must publish; they don't -- do achieve something in your field of research, and the world will know. Second, publications must be controlled by researchers and only stuff that really matters should be published. Science needs a shift or values and priorities, a Second Renaissance.

    1. Re:Sci-Hub won't last by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      First, scientists (still) believe they must publish; they don't -- do achieve something in your field of research, and the world will know.

      You're not a scientist, right? How do I know? Because you're wrong on both counts.

    2. Re:Sci-Hub won't last by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      First, scientists (still) believe they must publish; they don't -- do achieve something in your field of research, and the world will know.

      You're not a scientist, right? How do I know? Because you're wrong on both counts.

      Or rather, publishing in journals is *how* scientists A) demonstrate they achieved something in their field of research and B) let the world know about it.

    3. Re:Sci-Hub won't last by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      do achieve something in your field of research, and the world will know.

      How? Are they psychic? You may not have noticed but most academics (at least in the fields I'm familiar with) would rather pull out their own fingernails than hold a press conference (or network for that matter), and the ones that do enjoy big-noting themselves are not necessarily the ones with anything worth saying.

      Second, publications must be controlled by researchers and only stuff that really matters should be published.

      We do this already. It's called peer review and impact factor. It's relatively easy to get crap published in a low impact-factor journal that no-one will read or care about. It's really freakin' hard to get anything but work that really matters in a high impact factor journal. Want to read the "stuff that really matters" then go high impact. Want to read work in progress that might turn into something that really matters (or help you come up with something that really matters)? Read medium impact factor and conference proceedings. Want to read any random shit? Congrats, you have way too much spare time on your hands.

    4. Re:Sci-Hub won't last by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Said by someone who obviously has never spent a day in research. Publishing is important, because science requires communication. Quality control already exists in the form of peer-review, and there are many levels of "stuff that matter" that can still be potentially significant. It's just that the processes are imperfect.

    5. Re:Sci-Hub won't last by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >Quality control already exists in the form of peer-review,

      In my field, peer-review is a joke.

      At least ten percent of the papers say "x can not be determined, and thus was ignored", when there are numerous studies that demonstrate "x can be determined".

      Roughly 30% of the studies that claim "no correlation was found", and make a big deal about that, when, based on their research design, the expected outcome is that no correlation will be found. The downside is that because of that research design, these utterly clueless researchers, think that there are no correlations,because they are under the impression that apples are a species of African Swallows, that live under the ocean.

  4. What's The Problem? by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 2

    There seem to be several "open source" journals, but I'm wondering how seriously they are taken, especially to the University Gods that dish out tenure? I don't know...

    But also, how about some of these "prestigious" universities publish their own damn journals?

    In the end, the for-profit journals that one apparently has to be published in will continue to flourish as long as the university communities themselves publish in them, judge peers by them, and pay the astronomical subscriptions to them.

    In other words, these people complaining about the state of "professional; journals are in control of the entire situation.

    --
    If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    1. Re:What's The Problem? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

      As a biology-related researcher, eLife, eNeuro, the PloS journals (especially PloS Biology), are pretty highly respected. But the biggest name journals, Nature (the whole family), Neuron, Science, and the Proceedings of the National Academy of Science are all non-open (though PNAS has an open-access option). Usually, we take the open-access option if we can.

    2. Re:What's The Problem? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      To get funding (from government or industry) you need to be able to show how good you are. Current metrics are based on number of journal publication and rank of journals published in. Unfortunately for largely historical reasons the high rank journals tend to be the expensive walled gardens. No funding = no job = even less income than the pittance you currently survive off. That's a pretty strong incentive to play nice with the status quo.

      Obviously this has to change (and I suspect it will), but it's non-trivial to change it. The people who set the rules (and often make funding choices) are the so-called "leaders in the field" who have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo and outsiders who seek guidance from same.

  5. Whatever... by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

    Happen to the free exchange of ideas?

    1. Re: Whatever... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Free? Are you some kind of commie?

  6. some of us are trying by oldmacdonald · · Score: 1

    See the quantum journal http://quantum-journal.org/ for an example.

  7. All they need to do is keep their publishing right by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If academics agreed to retain their right to publish original articles on their own web page, things would be fine. Why would anyone agree to give away the right to put their own work up on their own web site?

  8. Why do they even need the publishers? by EvilSS · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I mean, really, why do they need them? Other than putting stuff onto actual paper, which these days seems somewhat pointless since most of this will actually be consumed digitally anyway. Are you telling me the academic world can't work out a way to coordinate peer review and put out papers without the help of massive commercial academic publishers?

    And if they do, how the hell has Amazon not stepped into the field and undercut everyone? About the only thing I can see the publishers have going for them is momentum and legacy at this point.

    --
    I browse on +1 so AC's need not respond, I won't see it.
    1. Re:Why do they even need the publishers? by Phillip2 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Scientific Publishing is, largely, about brownie points, rather than communication.

      We get forced to use publishers because that's how we are judged; it's not a question of whether the publishers are doing anything actually useful.

    2. Re:Why do they even need the publishers? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Scientific Publishing is, largely, about censorship. Being able to control what gets published.

      Exactly like Wikipedia. And hollywood.

    3. Re:Why do they even need the publishers? by WrongMonkey · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I mean, really, why do they need them?

      You publish in the journal where your work will get read (and hopefully cited). If you publish in a top tier journal, like Science or Nature, then every working scientist will at least read the title in their weekly Table of Contents email. If you publish in a highly regarded specialist journal, then most of the people in your field will read the abstract. My highest cited paper was rejected by Science because the topic wasn't of "general interest to the scientific community", but it has 230 citations in an impact factor 4 journal because it was useful for researchers in my field.

      But if you dump your paper in an open source journal (like PLOS ONE) nobody is going to bother reading it because PLOS ONE publishes 20,000 papers a year with no filter on quality or content.

    4. Re:Why do they even need the publishers? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      230 citations in an impact factor 4 journal

      Wow. Impressive.

      In the two fields I write in, an average paper is only cited a handful of times. Ten times is considered a success. The top handful of people get well over a thousand cites, seemingly regardless of what they write, but that's the nature of elitism.

    5. Re:Why do they even need the publishers? by Evil+Kerek · · Score: 1

      There is no peer review anymore. The scientific method is barely given a nod anymore. The crap getting published these days where no one has replicated the results or, worse, if you don't agree with it, you are ostracized is the norm. It goes hand in hand with the un-abashed bias displayed by the media. If you are quipping the latest trend, no one will hold you accountable, much less check your work.

    6. Re:Why do they even need the publishers? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Careful there, those are some dangerous ideas! (Dangerous because they're true, and the truth can get halfway around the world before the MSM can regain control of the narrative. )

    7. Re:Why do they even need the publishers? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The pareto distribution of research citations. That sounds like a nice meta-research paper. :P

  9. Possible Solutions by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are some truly ridiculous subscription fees to obtain access to journal papers. The alternative is billing the author for open access fees, where the paper is available freely as soon as it's published. This sounds great except there are some very sketchy open access journals. Some of them are referred to as predatory open access journals, which collect open access fees but don't actually send papers out for peer review.

    I'm relatively new in my career as a scientist, and I don't have that many publications to my name yet. I received an email from a company asking me to be an editor for a new journal. It was pretty obvious that my contact information was harvested somewhere and not reviewed prior to contacting me. The journal doesn't have any publications yet, but there are plenty of sites indicating that the company is a predatory journal publisher. They've also been accused of contacting reviewers for the peer review process and sending out papers regardless of whether the reviewer agrees or declines to review the paper. They seemed very sketchy to me. Obviously I declined.

    I'd like to see most journals be under the control of professional societies rather than for-profit publishers. Some of the publishers are okay, but there are many that are extremely sketchy. I'd also like to make all reviews public to make the process more transparent. I understand that the concern is retaliation for negative reviews, but if there is no anonymity in the process, it's difficult for someone to retaliate without putting their name on it. I've had some very fair reviewers, but also some very unprofessional ones. I'd like to see more transparency in the review process, to limit the possibility for abuse.

    If academics are going to be judged on publications, they should only be judged on their publications within reputable journals and those run by professional societies. Take away the incentive to run up the number of publications by paying predatory open access journals to publish their manuscripts.

  10. How about by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The value in publications is in the selection mechanism that gives things published a pedigree.
    Doing that with publishers was necessary in the 1900's.
    Another way to skin that cat this century might be.

    The author originates a paper and makes it available to the public in multiple places on the Internet.
    The author computes a crypto hash of the paper and adds the publication to a blockchain.
    Folks can review the document and put their review, including a rating, in the blockchain.

    Then all we need is a mechanism to scan the block chain and rate the reviewers and the papers.
    Multiple competing algorithms can provide this value different ways, but access to the paper is free.

    We may be moving from publish or perish, publish good stuff or perish and also publishers perish?

  11. We're starting to hear a lot about 'impact factor' by Applehu+Akbar · · Score: 1

    The impact factor of a journal is supposedly the moving average over the latest two years of the number of citations to papers published in it. Is the IF of web journals and open publication sites counted in this ranking, or is this still another private club for the legacy journals?

  12. They cannot. by Gravis+Zero · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The issue here is less about greedy journals and more about the fact that universities are being run like businesses which results in the "publish or perish" expectation. The system has become completely mismanaged into being a capitalist nightmare where you do what they want or you lose what you love. I believe this could be remedied if it became exceptionally difficult to revoke tenure, requiring that colleagues agree to it. The greedy journals problem can easily be done away with by freely releasing the research and only allowing non-profit journals to publish their work.

    TL;DR: The problem is the culture of university administrations, not with the researchers themselves.

    --
    Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
    1. Re:They cannot. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I believe this could be remedied if it became exceptionally difficult to revoke tenure, requiring that colleagues agree to it.

      You realize that tenure is exceptionally difficult to revoke. If you have tenure, you basically have to commit crimes before they consider firing you. Getting tenure, however, require a great deal of journal publishing. Also once you have tenure, if you don't perform, you don't get any sort of raise.

    2. Re:They cannot. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      you are being really anti-semitic right now ;)

  13. Simple Folk Editors by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Pi are round. Pi is not squared."

  14. Yes, need to publish [Re:Sci-Hub won't last] by XXongo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Sci-Hub is not the solution. The issue is twofold: First, scientists (still) believe they must publish; they don't -- do achieve something in your field of research, and the world will know.

    It is the new researchers who need to publish. Yes, once you've established a reputation in your field, people will know who you are. But that very often takes decades. Until then, you need publications to show you have a track record of good work.

    (And even then, the reputation is usually phrased in terms of what you published: "e.g., "X published one of the seminal papers on bismith selenide semiconductors." And it will be two decades between when you published your paper and when the rest of the world starts putting bismuth selenide in their high-end devices.)

  15. Open Source [Re:What's The Problem?] by XXongo · · Score: 3

    There seem to be several "open source" journals, but I'm wondering how seriously they are taken, especially to the University Gods that dish out tenure?

    Some are, some aren't.

    The problem is, the entry barrier to putting up a website and giving it a prestigious journal title is pretty much zero. So there are literally thousands of "open source journals" that have no redeeming merit whatsoever, and the ones which are actually real tend to get buried in the clutter.

    1. Re:Open Source [Re:What's The Problem?] by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 2

      The problem is, the entry barrier to putting up a website and giving it a prestigious journal title is pretty much zero. So there are literally thousands of "open source journals" that have no redeeming merit whatsoever, and the ones which are actually real tend to get buried in the clutter.

      Perhaps if the better ones were endorsed by one or several real and respected Universities?

      --
      If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
    2. Re:Open Source [Re:What's The Problem?] by Hognoxious · · Score: 2

      This. Oxford, Cambridge, Hahvahd, Hull, Yale and Trump-U[1] could set up a co-op, non-profit, joint venture, call it what you like.

      With that branding It'd be more than awesome, it'd be the gold standard.

      [1] Maybe let the Sorbonne and that one from Canada that sounds like it's Belgian in too, so they don't sulk.

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    3. Re:Open Source [Re:What's The Problem?] by Elky+Elk · · Score: 2

      It doesn't need to be endorsed by a university, a learned society is sufficient. My highest cited papers have been published in the open access 'Atmospheric Chemistry and Physics' which is run by the European Geophysical Union, its nowhere near nature or science in impact factor, but it is a respectable mid tier journal. The writer pays up front for hosting/typesetting etc the cost of which you put into your grant.

      Its much more open than a traditional journal. They publish the initial submission, the reviewer comments the response to reviewer comments and the final paper. In addition, members of the scientific community can add comments in the same way as the reviewers, albeit not anonymously.

    4. Re:Open Source [Re:What's The Problem?] by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      You know what else most of the universities on that list have in common? They own publishers, which make money from for-profit journals.

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    5. Re:Open Source [Re:What's The Problem?] by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some respectable people are already doing this. For example eLife was sponsored by the Wellcome Trust, HHMI, and Max Planck Society. eNeuro was founded by the Society for Neuroscience. As I said in my other comment, they are both well-respected and known within our fields.

  16. you missed step 3: "... profit!" by XXongo · · Score: 1
    The mechanism you suggest would be just crying out for people to game the system.

    I'd bet that a month after the rating system was announced, people would start setting up sock puppet robots and selling ratings.

  17. Computational Physics, Sure by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The institutions, run by the elite tier of academics, are in bed with the the journals. It's not broken; it's working precisely as intended.

    You stupid sonofabitch. Who do you think edits the journals? They're supposed to be in bed together.

    Or would you be more comfortable if we turned to "regular folks" to edit the Journal of Computational Physics?

    However, for real physics this might be a problem.</flamebait>

  18. Yes, but there are lots of "fake" journals by twasserman · · Score: 2
    Back in the day, there were a few journals that were recognized as having high standards for refereeing and publication. In academic computer science, these were the journals that were the most important for promotion and tenure, and even carried greater weight than some of the highly selective conferences. Promotion and tenure are the keys to long-term (perhaps lifetime) careers in the most prestigious universities, and that situation remains largely unchanged today.

    As we look around the world, though, it's clear that there are many thousands of academics in universities of varying quality who would also like to have their work published, even if it's not in, for example, one of the ACM's or IEEE's Transactions journals. So we now have a slew of journals focused on computer science, some of which are, to be polite, not very selective about what they publish, as long as the authors pay the publication fee. There are also more and more low-quality journals that publish online using an open access approach. Many of these journals use highly credible names, and it's easy for a novice to confuse them with well-known and higher-quality journals. If you do a search on "fake journals in computer science', you will see that there are hundreds of such journals; if you go to the web page for such a journal, it looks real, complete with editorial board members who hold academic positions. Life would be simpler if these fake journals didn't exist, but most of them seem to find enough paying authors to put out new volumes of their journals. If your papers are continually rejected by the program committees for various conferences, this may be the only way to publish your work, even if it's not very good. Indeed, some of these journals have published papers that were generated by bots.

    In principle, there is nothing wrong with submitting your work to be published in one of these fake journals. You can tell your Mom that you are a published author, and you can include this "publication" on your CV, but it won't help you to become a full Professor at a reputable university.

    If you are not an academic at an institution that evaluates your publication record for promotion, then this whole process probably seems silly to you. In that case, you can view the promotion process as a game where you play by certain established rules, just as people in industry tend to play by a different set of rules to get promoted and earn raises.

    1. Re:Yes, but there are lots of "fake" journals by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What these fake journals are doing is essentially fraud

  19. Science is Still Communicated by World of Mouth by Yergle143 · · Score: 0

    Nobody reads.
    The combo of conferences and the lecture circuit is how impactful science is circulated.
    The journal article provides the details to the interested.
    The ONLY purpose of a journal is to assure that someone reviewed the work.

    1. Re:Science is Still Communicated by World of Mouth by WrongMonkey · · Score: 4, Interesting
      Maybe this is something that is field specific. I've heard that in computer science conference presentations are more important than journal publication. Maybe that's true.

      But speaking as an actual laboratory scientist: I read. My colleagues read. Conferences presentations are either "work in progress" or "broad summary of everything in our lab for the last 5 years", depending on the venue. There is no way that a half hour talk or a single poster can actually provide the detail necessary to understand and evaluate cutting edge research.

    2. Re:Science is Still Communicated by World of Mouth by TheRaven64 · · Score: 1

      There's some truth to the grandparent. There are enough papers published now that the ones that I'm most likely to read are ones where someone says 'this was an interesting paper, you should read it', rather than simply reading all of the ones published in relevant journals (on top of the pile of ones that I have to review).

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    3. Re:Science is Still Communicated by World of Mouth by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And ~70 years or so ago, you were supposed to be familiar with pretty much everything published in the hand full of journals in your field. If somebody cited "Williamson 1932" the anticipation was that you'd know the article that they were talking about and there was no necessity to go to the trouble of actually writing down the title of the article.

    4. Re:Science is Still Communicated by World of Mouth by toupsz · · Score: 2

      Computer scientist here. Computer scientists read too, communication is not by word of mouth. It is true, however, that conference proceedings for good conferences are considered at least as good, if not better, than most journals. The pattern is more that you publish and give talks on original work, then develop a synthesis of multiple pieces of work + new data into journal articles (which is substantively different than other fields). My understanding of this is that it came about due to the speed at which the field came into existence and the need for faster publishing models, though that's not entirely the case anymore.

      Now if you'll excuse me, I just pulled 10 papers to my tablet that I need to read. :P

  20. Re:We're starting to hear a lot about 'impact fact by WrongMonkey · · Score: 1

    Of course you can count impact factor for web journals or open publications. Its just a statistic, like average word count or average daily site visitors. There is no governing authority of impact factor.

  21. Re:We're starting to hear a lot about 'impact fact by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Uh, isn't Thomson whatever they are / were sold to now the governing authority? AFAIK you don't get a score if they don't give you one.

  22. Academics by sexconker · · Score: 1

    Academics are already in control. This is what they devolve into when given the opportunity.

  23. Stephen Curry by antdude · · Score: 1

    Wait, he does more than playing basketball? [grin]

    --
    Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
  24. some rallying cry that is by micahraleigh · · Score: 1

    Spoken behalf of fabricated resveratrol, carbon dioxide, and medical research.

    ... but if this gets the government of California to stop funneling money into how you shouldn't even be in the SAME ROOM as your cell phone, I'll call it a win.