Trump Proposes Joint 'Cyber Security Unit' With Russia, Then Quickly Backs Away From It (arstechnica.com)

In a series of tweets yesterday, President Trump proposed "an impenetrable Cyber Security unit" with Putin "so that election hacking, & many other negative things, will be guarded and safe." The news came as a shock to just about everyone who got word of it, including congressional members of his own GOP party. Less than 24 hours later, Trump decided against it, tweeting: "The fact that President Putin and I discussed a Cyber Security unit doesn't mean I think it can happen. It can't-but a ceasefire can,& did!" Ars Technica reports: "It's not the dumbest idea I have ever heard, but it's pretty close," Senator Lindsey Graham, a Republican of South Carolina, said of the plan. Senate Republican Marco Rubio of Florida tweeted that "partnering with Putin on a 'Cyber Security Unit' is akin to partnering with [Syrian President Bashar] Assad on a 'Chemical Weapons Unit."' Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin said that Trump and the Russian president decided at a meeting during a Group of 20 nations summit in Hamburg, Germany, to embark on a joint "cyber unit to make sure that there was absolutely no interference whatsoever, that they would work on cyber security together." But on Sunday, after it was clear that the plan was going nowhere, Trump took to Twitter and said no deal. That didn't stop Rep. Don Beyer, a Democrat from Virginia, from introducing on Monday an amendment to the 2017 National Defense Authorization Act that would bar a US-Russian cyber accord. He said: "Donald Trump's proposal to form a 'cyber security unit' with Putin is a terrible idea that would immediately jeopardize American cybersecurity... Trump must acknowledge that Russia interfered in the 2016 election and take strong, meaningful action to prevent it from happening again in future elections."

Comments

The mental gymnastics he displays are amazing

[Anonymous Coward]

That was an even bigger flip flop than when went from, "There was no collusion" to " Collusion isn't even illegal anyway, what me worry".

Just lol

[Anonymous Coward]

Our president tweets every half baked idea he has and then the rest of the government has to scramble to make sense of or defuse the tweet. It's all fuckin funny

Re:Just lol

[G-forze]

I find that unlikely, but if he believed it was a good idea for even a half of a second, then he is too mentally unfit to be president.

I think this has already been established.

Putin may even be blackmailing trump and Trump is doing what he can to accomplish Putin's goals to avoid the blackmail being revealed.

Everything that Trump does is motivated by growing his and his family's wealth. Russian banks gave loans to Trump, and that's why he's being so friendly towards Russia. Qatar did not agree to a loan, and look what happened to them.

Re:Just lol

[jandersen]

A bit like the Pythia at the temple of Apollo, who would generally speak gibberish, that her priests would then interpret. I don't know if it is funny, but perhaps it will be if we live long enough. But we are only about half a year into his precidency, and already Honey Monster is rushing towards a military confrontation with the beached whale in North Korea. I mean, think about that; the Chinese have since the Korea War, kept NK as a buffer between themselves and America's vassal state in the south, and they are increasingly assertive about their territorial aspirations. Will they just sit quietly by while Trump sends troops into NK, provoking them to use whatever nuclear weapons they have and escalating from there? Hardly - I doubt they are all that keen on Kim's perverse regime, but they definitely don't want American expansion in the region, and they do have an alliance with NK, which gives them a legitimate excuse to join the war. North Korea may be easy enough to flatten, but China isn't. The US may have enough weaponry to convert China to a slag heap, but not before they have sent their own missiles on the way - and they do have enough of those, without a doubt.

Re:Why is this a dumb idea really??

[buss_error]

But why is this a bad idea?

.

Would you form a joint intelligence sharing with them? Because this is sort of like forming a joint intelligence unit. If you've every dealt with operational security, you'd know why this isn't likely to work well. At best, it's reaching your unprotected arm into a snake pit every 15 minutes to count the snakes. While we may be able to get some small benefit, it would come at too high a cost in intelligence assets. For one thing, it would let them know how we conduct security, for a second, who is involved. And in intelligence, half or more of the battle is knowing who and how.

And I'll simply point out who leaked emails when, and where, as to the pure intentions of the Russian government.

Invite Jeffrey Dahmer to join neighborhood watch..

[bit trollent]

This is like inviting Jeffrey Dahmer to join your neighborhood watch after he kills your neighbors.

I know that the right wing has bought into Trump's treasonous collusion with Russia, but this is ridiculous.

This is a tech website. Do you actually mean to tell me you would willingly put a hacker that maliciously attacked your country on our cyber security team?

Re:Why is this a dumb idea really??

[dbIII]

But why is this a bad idea?

And thus the "right" shows that King comes before country and George Washington can go fuck himself in their eyes.
You know why it's a bad idea, you are just pretending that it isn't because you want to continue to follow Dear Leader.

Re: Come On

[Anonymous Coward]

Man, you don't know shit. You claim to have large org infosec background, but nothing you post indicates that

Trump should be enjoined from any Russian contact

[JoeyRox]

Considering Trump Jr. has admitted he met with a Russian lawyer (along with Kushner) during the campaign to get dirt on Hillary in combination with the revelation in today's NYT about an email Trump Jr. received specifically saying the information he was about to be provided by the lawyer came from the Russian government, this administration should now be considered captured by a foreign hostile government and thus enjoined from any contact or decision making related to that government until Robert Mueller's investigation has been completed.

Let's face it....

[JustAnotherOldGuy]

...this so-called president is an idiot who is in waaaaaaaaaaaay over his head.

The Russian government can't cop to a lower charge

[bit trollent]

The Russian government is not some guy that can be appealed to with leniency in criminal cases.

Russia is a hostile foreign adversary who has attacked us and has an ongoing cyberwarfare campaign against the United States.

It is idiotic to partner cyber-warfare defense with the very entity which is currently attacking you. We have allies like Israel and Germany. Why would we partner with our adversaries who are currently attacking us?

Trump's treasonous crime spree has gone on long enough. The Russian government is not your friend, even if it is as bigoted and anti-American as you are!

Re: At least he has ideas

[Anonymous Coward]

Or we could just get rid of medical insurance and pay the doctors, nurses, and hospitals directly via the government... but like whatever, helping people is fucked and I don't need anything from society. I made the device I'm typing this with metal I mined, refined, followed by teaching myself with no books or teachers how to transform and program to connect to slashdot... let alone the lack of help I got getting myself outta that fucking womb and then walked out of the hospital got a job and earned the tools to start this process.

You stupid fucking twat.

Re:Trump should be enjoined from any Russian conta

[quantaman]

I'd be more concerned that there WAS dirt to get on Hillary than who it came from.

In this case, according to Trump Jr. at least, there was no dirt, it was a dead end.

Who cares who gave it to them?

The FBI, seeking material assistance from a foreign government for a political campaign is illegal. If Trump Jr. is telling the truth then he broke the law.

The whole "Russia" thing continues to be a giant nothingburger than the left won't stop trying to push. No one cares.

The whole "Russia" thing is steadily getting worse. Though in one sense this news is slightly good news for Trump. The fact they sought out this lawyer in an effect to conspire with the Russian government suggests that at that time there were not (yet?) conspiring with the Russian government (otherwise why not ask their FSB contact directly?).

Re:It was done w/ Kevin Mitnick & others... ap

[quantaman]

See subject: Know WHO makes the best defenders? The most skilled OFFENDERS (this IS my racket, the defense side & was my job on several levels (code, network defense etc.) for decades)).

APK

P.S.=> It happens & Mitnick? He wasn't even very good to be straight up about it. Today's 'hacker/cracker'? WORLDS above his level... apk

Those were done AFTER they switched sides.

A company who uses a reformed black-hat hacker to penetration test their network is daring and innovative.

A company who uses an active black-hat hacker to penetration test their network is bloody moronic.

Re:Come On

[buss_error]

A corporate security team won't send assassins to inject your most valuable people with ricin pellets. Or strew Strontium 147 around their house. Or seduce their daughter. Or rape/sodomize your son. The Russians have. The Soviets, back in the day, simply preferred to kill them. So, in a measure, that's an advancement of sorts.

But sure, lets blame Russia for Hillary / the DNC being so contemptibly corrupt that leaking emails from them sank a presidential canaanite against a guy as easily beaten as Trump.

You seem to think I thought HRC was a good choice. I do and did not. Simply a better choice than President Trump. And I reviewed the postfix configuration posted to reddit thought to be HRC's server. It wasn't perfect, but I didn't see any glaring errors either. Did you review it? Do you even know postfix?

You are just another tool who has lost his functioning analytical mind to sheer raw hatred of Trump

I will admit that he is not as bad as I thought he could be. Which is not to say in any way I think President Trump is good. Simply that we have as yet had the NKPR lob a nuke on any major city. But I will remind you that one need not use a ICBM to deliver a warhead. UPS will do. Or folks with impeccably forged documents. I will remind you that the $50 and $100 dollar bill are the most difficult to forge documents, yet the NKPR forges them to the point the the Treasury Department and the Secret Service tag them as "Super Forgeries" and millions of them pass every day. Yet most of President Trump's supporters are focused on those with brown skin as a serious threat.

Fear and xenophobia are the stock and trade of the Republican party. Also, it would seem, extreme stupidity though I prefer to think of it as focused on issue I am not concerned about. If I absolutely loathed a policy like Obama Care for the past seven and a half years, I surely would have another to replace it once my party had secured the majority in the House and Senate. Yet, 150+ days into a majority house, senate, and white house, and soon Supreme court, I don't see anything at all being done.

I understand that you dislike the policy. I get that. I am, very unfortunately headed down hill from personal medical issues. I don't expect to be here next year. Such is the luck of life. I cannot get SSI Disability by law because I did not pay into SSI for over a decade. And because I left the job with a private policy before the 30 years it takes to "vest", I can't draw from it either. So my choice is to die at my desk, or starve. Largely because of public service.

So be it.

I did my damn level best for you, and your children. What I got was spit on, called a pig in the trough, and had my car and home vandalized and death threats and now I face declining heath because to give me anything is "feeding the pigs at the trough."

I get that. It's not how I treat people, but standards differ.

Yet you call me names when I did no such to you, and still do not. I understand you are unhappy with the status quo. I am too. But I don't let that keep me from trying to be kind. We are not enemies. We have a difference of opinion, a difference of standards. Let me tell you how I try to live. Look up my post on "Let's change the name", and try to apply it to your own stance.

Let me leave you with this thought: Be happy. Find something in your life that gives you joy, and share it with others. Anger is simply fear turned outward. A brave man may have many fears, but that does not keep him from doing the thing that is hard; the thing he most fears. Because a brave man dies only once, but a coward dies a thousand times.

You are not a coward.

Re:At least he has ideas

[DivineKnight]

As per the HHGTTG, he is fulfilling the role of the Galactic President admirably. People can't stop watching him, or talking about him, and in doing so, he is providing the very useful service of drawing attention away from those with real power. Remember, the role of the Galactic President is always filled by the most controversial candidate, the one who brings about finely tuned outrage.

Re:Why is this a dumb idea really??

[Anonymous Coward]

As for cyber security? Why not?

Because Trump proposed it, therefore there is a segment of the population who believes that it is inherently evil and wrong, because CNN told them so.

Note that I am not saying this is necessarily a good idea. There are legitimate concerns here. But this is where most of the condemnation is coming from, not from actual consideration of the situation.

Can we now end this experiment?

[MoarSauce123]

Can we end the experiment with a mentally unstable egomaniac as President? The project failed and running it any longer will only have long-lasting negative effects. Nobody can take anything that Trump does or says seriously. We run out of superlatives to describe his stupidity and ineptitude.

His private talk with Vlad was fruitful afterall.

[volodymyrbiryuk]

Another brainfart from the great orange leader. Next he is going to tell us that he wants to colaborate with Kim Jong-un to furthe nuclear disarmamanet. There will be so much winning.

Re:What is the hate about?

[l0n3s0m3phr34k]

I don't think Putin was trying to get Trump into office. I think his actual goal is destabilizing the underlying ideals of the US's democratic system itself. Trump is a symptom, not the disease itself. And it's not just the US that he is targeting, France was also a target during their most recent elections. I wouldn't be surprised if Russia's "electronic disinformation division" had a hand in the UK's Brexit campaign too.

The party of ideas = the one in power

[interkin3tic]

Democrats aren't in control of any of the three branches of government. A core of republican voters simply want the GOP to shoot down anything the center and left wants to do. On health care, the GOP was refusing to even make eye contact with democrats. It's like you're accusing a murder victim of being lazy for laying down and not moving.

During the Obama administration, it was the republicans who weren't coming up with any real noteworthy ideas beyond "NONONONO" and "Lets try reaganomics for a third time!"

That's what happens when you have a two party system and the far right hyper polarizes things because they're upset that a black man managed to get to be president. You get a one party system basically.

Don't worry. If free elections in this country are ever held again and Democrats get power, they might be the only ones coming up with "ideas" and it will be the republicans who do nothing besides whine they're not being given a seat at the table. Except probably not, democrats have so far been too spineless to actually do turnabout. I mean, when Obamacare was being formulated, they spent almost a year negotiating with Republicans, taking hundreds of amendments. Exactly one GOP congressperson voted for it despite it being a plan initially proposed by Newt Gingrich and implemented by Mitt Romney. And they labeled it as evil socialism. Who the fuck were they kidding? If democrats ever get in power again, they'll try a similar "be nice to the irrational bully" approach, and the GOP voters will still accuse the democrats of being dictators.

Re:The party of ideas = the one in power

[Ol Olsoc]

Democrats aren't in control of any of the three branches of government. A core of republican voters simply want the GOP to shoot down anything the center and left wants to do.

The problem at it's undeniable base is that Today's crypto-conservatism has no actual ideas, other than tax cuts.

When you are in command of the House, the Senate, the presidency, and have a majority of governors in the states, and still can't come up with anything, have had two different stabs at healthcare reform while excluding the enemy from the entire discussion, you have to face it, you are not competent. You cannot govern.

When you are in control of all those things, yet allow the longest crypto-war in US history to drain and weaken the country, while being able to whip yourself into a frenzy about which restroom that stupid-ass Caitlyn/Bruce Jenner takes a shit in, you cannot govern.

It isn't surprising that we have conservative versus liberal clashes. It's a great way to make a governance work. People oon the progressive side of the spectrum tend to have a lot of ideas they want to enact. Some are really stupid and/or impossible. Conservatives by nature tend to have less ideas, but in a healthy governance, oppose the stupid ideas, and let the smart ones go through.

And that's how we got to this point. Someone managed to get the conservatives to declare any but their own as the enemy. The managed to get elected by fanning the flames of trumped-up issues.

And now in power, are tripping over their tongues, not fit to govern even when they have a sizeable majority. But that is what happens when the fix for the nation's healthcare system is their only tool - a tax cut.

Re:The party of ideas = the one in power

[Ol Olsoc]

Is that like the liberal left and their only idea of throw money at it till it goes away?

You have none. Congratulations.

And do you really think that all the republicans are in a drum circle singing songs about how well they get along? McCain's and Graham's faction would LOVE Trump out of office because they could return to the war machine of selling weapons, something that President Obama and Hillary Clinton were all in on unless you missed the FACT that under President Obama they sold the most weapons to foreign nations of any president since WWII.

Perhaps I am arguing with a bag of weasels. Your unintelligent deflection argument ranks a zero on the scale. This is because people who make stupid deflection attempts are simply proving that they have absolutely nothing to ad to te conversation.

Obama and Clinton and selling weapons to foreign nations have absolutely nothing to do with this discussions. We are talking about you and yours having no ideas, and if you for a second think that that comment about people not even related to the subject at hand, that somehow arms sales by a couple Democrats trumps "The Republican Party has no ideas" - well you just proved my point. Problems wil go on, and you'll just blame blame blame.

Funny how people believe all the bullshit fed to them on the nightly news that this 2 parties are "ALWAYS" at odd with each other. If they are both cashing in on some underhanded deal you'd be amazed how well they can work together.

Funny how your attempt at defelection number two is just as successful at showing your utter mental bankruptcy as the first. It also brings up an interesting point. You anr yours are criminally weak. Can't fix problems, only whine and cry about how it's always the evil liberals, the Liberals who are so powerful that you can't defeat them even when they are in a significant minority. Sad.

This isn't about the previous occupant, or the person who didn't get elected to the POTUS. This isn't about CNN or MSNBC or FOX News.

It's about a political party that doesn't have a clue about how to govern, when having a clear majority, cannot put together a way to govern the country. Your defelction attempts are just showing that in a group of people who would try to equate a former president and a failed presidential candidate as somehow equivalent to the two failed attempts at passing a healthcare replacement bill, is clear proof that you have no ideas, only castigation. and therefore are pretty much a failure af governance.

Re:The party of ideas = the one in power

[Ol Olsoc]

Today's crypto-conservatism has no actual ideas, other than tax cuts.

If only. Today's crypto-conservatism has plenty of ideas. But they're all about how to sell tax cuts as something they're not.

That's still the concept that the answer to every problem is a tax cut. Different problems same solution. And works so well in the states where they implement it. Only not.

How to flatter people that they don't need to think too deeply about issues, that simplistic answers are fine - and then convince them of the specific simplistic answer that government is always the problem.

And have managed to get people who are living off the government dole to vote for people who will kick them off their lifeline. A work of genius, if only temporary.

As for government always being the problem, isn't it amazing that there are so many people running for positions that they claim to hate? This would be like me decideing that I want to be a technologist so that I can eliminate technology.

Yet people buy it. People seem to think that this person that claims to hate government is going to make it smaller if only he and all of his hombres are elected. Very few people try to get a job that they hope to lose. A political non-sequitur.

How to get the government to pay for things they want (and want to sell) while depleting it of resources to regulate the way businesses operate and treat their customers.

We are sadly in the Pecuniary extraction phase of a successful country, where the money is extracted into the hands of a few people. This has some important side effects. We're already ceding leadership positions in order to make a few folks wealthier. Science is next. A communist country is building the next Superconducting supercollider while we are all arguing about Caitlin/Bruce Jenner's proper room to defecate in, whether or not people have to make wedding cakes for gay people, and closing off science advisory. A country that discards science for political ideology is in trouble, and we are become the 21st centurey Lysenkoists.

I don't know if there is a fix for any of that, but just wait until the Yuan becomes the de-facto currency of the world, replacing the dollar. That's when we will know that we masturbated ourselves out of leadership. And the same people who put us there will demand answers and blame.

I suspect their cure will be:

A tax cut.

Re: At least he has ideas

[RazorSharp]

You clearly misunderstand what Obama did. He pushed a snowball down a mountain. By making the dismantling of Obamacare political suicide, he's made a single-payer system an inevitability. He didn't view the ACA as a perminant solution and neither did any of them Democrats who pushed it through congress. The fact remains that it's better than what previously existed and a step toward the only morally acceptable form of healthcare in a first world country, which is single-payer.