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Artificial Intelligence Has Race, Gender Biases (axios.com)

An anonymous reader shares a report: The ACLU has begun to worry that artificial intelligence is discriminatory based on race, gender and age. So it teamed up with computer science researchers to launch a program to promote applications of AI that protect rights and lead to equitable outcomes. MIT Technology Review reports that the initiative is the latest to illustrate general concern that the increasing reliance on algorithms to make decisions in the areas of hiring, criminal justice, and financial services will reinforce racial and gender biases. A computer program used by jurisdictions to help with paroling prisoners that ProPublica found would go easy on white offenders while being unduly harsh to black ones.

30 of 465 comments (clear)

  1. Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by HumanWiki · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Pretty much all intelligent life on this planet has preference and bias that seems to stem from a very base level... Why would AI be any different?

    Besides, we as their creator are flawed beings so inherently, our creations will be also flawed.

    1. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by gnick · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Besides, we as their creator are flawed beings so inherently, our creations will be also flawed.

      I'm not sure this is a flaw. If the data shows a gender or race bias, the AI will reflect that. Some biases based on gender and race exist, regardless of what the PC version of existence is. You can call it unfair, but not inaccurate.

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    2. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by cayenne8 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Pretty much all intelligent life on this planet has preference and bias that seems to stem from a very base level... Why would AI be any different?

      Who wants to explain it to him?

      Not a problem.

      OP: You are 100% correct.

      People look for patterns in everything, including individual and tribal behaviors and trends.

      I can't really think of a stereotype that hasn't been or still is based largely on observable facts.

      It makes sense that AI that uses deep learning and other methods will likely see trends too.

      I mean, it should be simple for it to notice there aren't a lot of white guys on the floor with NBA teams.

      I doubt anyone human would refute that.

      So, why would it not be natural to observe the types and percentages of violent crimes committed by "X" race/gender categories?

      Bias...sure, but based on facts.

      So, yes...if intelligence is present (natural or artificial) , it will observe these trends, and base future trends and behavior upon these observational biases.

      If you have no biases, you could not operate in this world very well, as that you would wake up to a brand new world every day.

      The key is to keep the biases always in a state of adjustment based on changing trends.

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    3. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by gnick · · Score: 5, Informative

      AI, like humans, makes mistakes like "correlation = causation".

      AI doesn't care about "correlation == causation". It only cares about "correlation == correlation". Humans may infer causation, but that's not the fault of AI.

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    4. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by mean+pun · · Score: 4, Interesting

      What are they calling "bias"?

      We read constantly about so-called racism based merely on the fact that one race objectively exhibits a particular trait over other races.

      That's called data, not bias.

      Ok, let's start with the fundamentals. What exactly is 'race' here? You may think that's obvious, but all people have their own mixture of ancestors, so how are you going to sort everyone objectively into bins? If you can't do that, how are you going to objectively determine the traits of these supposed bins?

    5. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by dirk · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Or the data being fed in could be biased. Take for example the idea of repeat criminal offenders. The data may say that in New York City, black men are more likely to be arrested after release than white men. But for years stop and frisk was in place so black men where constantly being stopped and frisked and arrested for minor infractions. So yes, they are more likely to be arrested by that is not the same as more likely to reoffend. They are more likely to be caught because the police stopped them more. So yes, the algorithm fed that data would say black men would reoffend more and it would be true to the data, but not true to the actual facts. Bias can be in the algorithm but it can also be in the data itself.

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    6. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by XXongo · · Score: 4, Informative

      What are they calling "bias"? We read constantly about so-called racism based merely on the fact that one race objectively exhibits a particular trait over other races. That's called data, not bias.

      It's a tricky question. Just because something is data, does not mean that it isn't biased: data can be biased-- in fact, 90% of what we do in experimental science is understanding the bias in data and figuring out how to get an unbiased measurement out of a biased data set. Almost all data is biased one way or another.

      If, for example, white people caught shoplifting are usually given a warning and let off while black people caught shoplifting are arrested and prosecuted ("shopping while black"), the data will show a higher rate of shoplifting among blacks. You will need to go to the raw data to see the actuality. See: https://www.theguardian.com/la...

      An AI with no correction for bias will reflect the bias of society.

      The article linked is merely a summery of the propublica article, which is has more detail, here: https://www.propublica.org/art...

    7. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Rather than race, think of it as "culture". It's why first and second generation African immgrants vastly exceed 3+ generation African Americans in terms of economic and scholastic success. American black culture is the issue, not prejudice against blacks in general. Biases against blacks are because of the prevalent US black culture creating the dominant image of what a black person is. We have cultural biases, not racial biases... It's not DNA - it's culture.

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    8. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by sycodon · · Score: 4, Interesting

      You are suggesting that the AI program not only keeps track of race, but that it also uses race as a factor in making it's decision.

      That's a pretty harsh accusation.

      The reality is that i these situations, the race only becomes a factor when analyzing the data and you include race as a data point after the fact.

      That's how you get "disparate out", one of the more evil principles in the SJW tool box.

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    9. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by cayenne8 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Further, the fact that more people of a particular race are persecuted is not a reflection of bias in the data, rather a bias in the prosecution.

      Not necessarily....black people DO commit a large proportion of violent crimes than other races in the US, per capita.

      They are only about 13-15% of the population, but commit vastly more violent crimes in the US.

      Skip to about 1:09 on the video to get to the meat of the presentation.

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    10. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by nedlohs · · Score: 4, Informative

      No he's making a very simple argument.

      You have two sets of populations. Say, hypothetically, the exact same percentage of each set carries contraband around, Members of one set are stopped and frisked with no probable cause more often than the other. That set will have a higher rate of arrest for that contraband not because they are more likely to have it, but because they are more likely to be searched.

    11. Re:Did anyone think it would be otherwise? by karmatic · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "So there is a genetic reason to have bias about hiring people - some people are just "born lazy and ignorant"?"

      Not so much lazy and ignorant as a combination of factors. If you look at performance of individuals in western societies, factors representing success correlate pretty well with IQ, to a point. Generally, we see about 80-85% of performance being innate (genetic), while around 15-20% is environmental. We see the same thing in physical performance - no amount of work will make an Olympic athlete out of someone without the body for it.

      Black culture is certainly toxic, but it's also a reflection of genetics. They feed back on each other. There has been a ridiculous amount of money spent over decades trying to solve the black-white achievement gap, yet it doesn't work. It can't work.

      https://www1.udel.edu/educ/got...

      There are population differences between the black and white population in the US that are compounded by the effects of poverty, malnourishment, and poor education.

      Poor education, culture, and poverty feed back on themselves - it takes only a single student to disrupt an educational environment, so if you have a higher percentage of special needs students (or simply disruptive ones), there will be a greater percentage of classes where it's difficult for children to learn. The ability of a school to fund smaller classrooms is a function of its funding, which is often a function of where it's located and its taxbase. Poverty tends to concentrate individuals into areas where mass transit is an option, and so you get a perfect storm of a population that is already dealing with a lower mean IQ coupled with poorer education across the board.

      This is also why voluntary busing can help with education, but only to a point. If you bus the non-disruptive students to better schools, they benefit from being removed from their disruptive classmates. If you bus the disruptive classmates as well, you harm the education of wherever they are bussed to.

      I went to one of the former schools - black parents with above-average children who wanted their children to receive the best possible education would choose to send their children to my school. They were driven to succeed, and accountable to their families, and it did not adversely affect our education, but it helped theirs significantly.

      So, no, it's not that they are born lazy, or ignorant. Those traits may be present as a class as a function of IQ, but like anything else individuals are individuals, who vary greatly. We can draw conclusions about a population, and estimate likelihood based on those conclusions, but you never really know what an individual will do until they are given the chance to do it.

  2. fx(Race,Gender) = {Income, Crime} by xxxJonBoyxxx · · Score: 5, Insightful

    >> artificial intelligence is discriminatory based on race, gender

    Better keep the AI away from income and crime statistics organized by race and gender then. It could form some pretty political incorrect opinions pretty fast...

  3. Training data by Theaetetus · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's not that the AI or algorithm has a bias, but that it's trained or given inputs that have that bias. For example, in the parole system, the software was given inputs that included not just details of the crime and sentence, but subjective ratings by guards who may well be racist. As usual, garbage in leads to garbage out.

    1. Re:Training data by Theaetetus · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Can you cite where that "information" came from?

      https://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2017/07/05/algorithms-replace-your-biases-with-someone-elses-biases/:

      But as Wexler’s reporting shows, some of the variables that COMPAS considers (and apparently considers quite strongly) are just as subjective as the process it was designed to replace. Questions like:
      Based on the screener’s observations, is this person a suspected or admitted gang member?

      And:

      The New York State version of COMPAS uses two separate inputs to evaluate prison misconduct. One is the inmate’s official disciplinary record. The other is question 19, which asks the evaluator, “Does this person appear to have notable disciplinary issues?”
      ... An inmate’s disciplinary record can reflect past biases in the prison’s procedures, as when guards single out certain inmates or racial groups for harsh treatment. And question 19 explicitly asks for an evaluator’s opinion. The system can actually end up compounding and obscuring subjectivity.

      By definition, you can't claim that system is objective when it calculates a number based on "an evaluator's opinion".

    2. Re:Training data by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 4, Informative

      90% of murdered blacks were killed by blacks, whilst 83% of murdered whites were killed by whites. And 57% of all murders were commited by blacks. Was it 99%? no - but it wasn't far off from 90%, the real statistic...

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  4. Had to read pretty deep... by Junta · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So the real story in their cherry picked example is two fold:
    -It's wildly inaccurate, and Northpointe's product should be put out to pasture and never used, period.
    -A system is being used to influence punishment that is not open to auditing because 'proprietary'.

    Note that the systems explicitly did not have knowledge of race. So we have two possibilities:
    -Some criteria that correlates to race is triggering it
    -The system is perpetuating existing bias in perception and reality. For example:
          -"Was one of your parents ever sent to jail or prison?" could easily cause the ghosts of prejudice that caused unjust incarceration to recur today.
        -"How often do you get in fights at school?" Again, if one is subjected to racial tension, they may unfairly be a party to fights they didn't ask for.

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    1. Re:Had to read pretty deep... by b0bby · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes, I read through the ProPublica article and my takeaway is that the systems are flawed and should be reviewed and either fixed or scapped. If your algorithm is supposed to predict recidivism, and it fails to do so, then it's broken. The fact that it fails to do so in a racially baised way is really icing on the cake.

  5. It's simple, really... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    ....we just need to develop a SJW AI to harangue the other AIs about their biases, real or perceived.

    We can then offload all political nonsense to the AIs, who will be too busy fighting with one another to go full Skynet on the rest of us.

  6. Think of the children! by thegreatbob · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Or, rather, adopt the mindset that an AI is somewhat like a child. A child that grows up in a (racist/sexist/whatever)-ist household is statistically more likely to turn out fairly similar, as is a child whose school curriculum holds such biases. The people implementing/training these things are going to (hopefully subconciously) impart their own biases upon them, or at least the biases present in the training datasets. If you train a parole-bot with all of our (US, but probably most places) historical parole data, of course it's going to be quite racist! I don't know what the 'proper' solution is, but I feel like attempting to manually adjust the AI after the fact is a terrible idea; to me, it makes more sense to manipulate the training data set until you get a reasonable result.

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  7. Re:Biases are reality based by pastafazou · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Um, wrong. Blacks aren't more violent. Current popular black culture is violent, which is teaching black youth exposed to it to be violent. Asians aren't "good at math". Most Asian cultures put more of an emphasis on math at an earlier age than western societies. Non Asian students studying overseas from an early age are also "good at math". And children with an Asian ethnicity but born and raised in western cultures are just average at math.

  8. More generally, by tietokone-olmi · · Score: 4, Insightful

    AI has a transparency problem. A massive, huge one. This'll be made worse as people learn to trust the computer, and to regard it as their friend.

  9. Re:Of course it does snowflakes by thegreatbob · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'm going to argue that in the context of training AIs (neural networks, esp.) on data sets that we may very well be imparting biases on them. If the conclusions present in the data were arrived at by biased means (in this context, I'm suggesting historical prolific racism/sexism), those biases should be present in the behavior of the resulting construct.

    That aside, attempting to compensate by overriding the output of the AI with some sort of counter-bias indeed seems like a terrible idea.

    Probably making my points here less relevant, I did not see any direct references to neural networking; if these are all just human-programmed algorithms (lacking the abstraction of the neural net stuff), I don't have much else to add.

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  10. Re:Biases are reality based by Sasayaki · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Sure, and that's totally fair. The issue comes when, say, 60% of JobsRequiringNavigatingSkills are men and 40% are women, and people say "this is unfair".

    To be honest, though, it depends on the job. Men have, typically, much more upper body strength than women, so are more suited to being things like garbage men. Yet nobody's clamoring for equal numbers of women to be garbage *people*.

    Yet they are for firefighters, even though firefighting is basically a job where you turn upper body strength into saved lives, simply because they want to be seen as "equal".

    People are different and have different things they're good at and bad at. Most HR people are women even though that's a comfortable, high paid, safe job. And I'm okay with that.

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  11. Re:Biases are reality based by Dixie_Flatline · · Score: 5, Insightful

    You're jumping to the end too quickly.

    Blacks are convicted of crimes more often, certainly. Does that mean they're more violent, or that they get caught more? Or that they live in worse situations than whites? Are Asians particularly good at math, or do Asian parents favour certain qualities that lead to more favourable math outcomes? Are they in more stable communities so their kids have a better opportunity to study math? Is it cultural or innate? Are women actually bad at navigating, or is it that we're less likely to take little girls out to go camping and get experience at navigating? Is that your own bias, since I've always heard that women are better at navigating?

    We actually have statistics that white people just aren't convicted as often for drug offences despite having similar or higher rates of use and dealing. Based on conviction data, a machine learning system would internalise the bias that blacks are more likely to have an involvement with drugs, despite that not being true. Garbage in, garbage out, right?

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/new...
    http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/e...
    https://www.washingtonpost.com...
    http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/...

    (Notice that those articles are from 2009, 2011, 2013 and 2014—this is not new data.)

    So generalities are not necessarily based in reality. Indeed, your claim that 'Asians are good at math' is particularly bad since Asia is HUGE and there's no way everyone from that area of the world is good at math. And as a half-Chinese guy that's okay at math but much worse than my white partner, and who knows plenty of Chinese people that have no affinity for math at all, I feel like a lot of these generalities are based on folklore and a few selective tests that aren't really representative of ability.

    The USA and Canada are not the bastions of equal opportunity that they purport to be, not for everyone. First Nations people in Canada and black people in the USA are consistently disadvantaged through broad government policy.

    So all this to say that getting good, clean data for machine learning systems that remove human bias is incredibly difficult, since most humans are unwilling to admit their biases don't necessarily have a basis in reality, or are the wrong conclusions drawn from incomplete knowledge of data.

  12. Re:Biases are reality based by AK+Marc · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Blacks are convicted of crimes more often, certainly. Does that mean they're more violent, or that they get caught more? Or that they live in worse situations than whites?

    It means that the first 10 times Johnny White gets caught stealing gum, he gets a warning by the shopkeeper, the next 5 times the shopkeeper calls the cops and he's taken home by the cops, then the 16th time, he's formally warned, having that be the first time there's any formal record of his misdeeds. Tyrone Brown gets charged the first time, and gets 10 years "to make an example of him".

    That's why the conviction rate isn't a good statistic, the data shows that the entire system has biases.

  13. The problem is that the AI gets things wrong by XXongo · · Score: 5, Informative

    The problem is not that the data set reflects the reality. The problem is not that the AI makes mistakes, but that the particular mistakes the AI makes reflect the bias of the society that programmed it.

    The link in the summary is to an article which is itself a summary. From the original (here: Machine Bias There’s software used across the country to predict future criminals. And it’s biased against blacks.), the software attempted to predict the probability of future offenses of criminals on probation. It did not, of course, always get it right. But when the actual percentage of re-offenses was compared to the predictions, the AI got it wrong differently for blacks than for whites. Here's what the article said.

    We also turned up significant racial disparities, just as Holder feared. In forecasting who would re-offend, the algorithm made mistakes with black and white defendants at roughly the same rate but in very different ways.
    The formula was particularly likely to falsely flag black defendants as future criminals, wrongly labeling them this way at almost twice the rate as white defendants. White defendants were mislabeled as low risk more often than black defendants.

  14. Persecution by XXongo · · Score: 4, Informative

    "Further, the fact that more people of a particular race are prosecuted is not a reflection of bias in the data, rather a bias in the prosecution."

    In this case, "persecuted" was more accurate.

    Data is Data. It cannot exhibit a bias.

    I can only surmise that you're not an experimental scientist. Data has bias all the time.
    In physics (my field) the bias usually has no social consequence-- astronomical statistics, for example, are biased toward bright stars (since they're much easier to see than faint ones, and hence overrepresented in the data set). In social "sciences," however, the bias very often does have social consequences. SAT scores from children whose parents spend tens of thousands of dollars on SAT Prep courses, for example-- surprise!-- score better on SAT exams than ones who don't. The data shows a correlation of SAT score with parental income. Is this real? Better correct for the SAT-prep course effect before making a conclusion.

    Data is biased. All the time. Be ready for it.

    ...Plus, being from the Guardian, I am skeptical that they didn't twist the data some to obtain their desired outcome, which ironically touches on the subject of this story.

    Huh? MIT Tecnology Review and Propublica were the source. The link in the summary was this: https://www.axios.com/algorith... which linked here: https://www.propublica.org/art... and here MIT Technology Review

  15. Re:racial bias is faulty programming by butchersong · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You can't have AI that learns on its own and have AI that isn't racially biased unless you artificially code blocks to it reaching certain logical conclusions. Then of course you've just made a dumb AI. The entire point of big data is to ferret out patterns in the noise.

  16. Re:racial bias is faulty programming by AmiMoJo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    ... which is itself based on the observation that black people are more likely to carry illegal items.

    That's a circular argument. We stop more black people so we find them carrying illegal items more often, which must mean they carry more often so we should stop them more often.

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