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Russia Suspected In GPS-Spoofing Attacks On Ships (wired.co.uk)

How did a 37-ton tanker suddenly vanish from GPS off the coast of Russia? AmiMoJo shares a report from Wired: The ship's systems located it 25 to 30 miles away -- at Gelendzhik airport... The Atria wasn't the only ship affected by the problem... At the time, Atria's AIS system showed around 20 to 25 large boats were also marooned at Gelendzhik airport. Worried about the situation, captain Le Meur radioed the ships. The responses all confirmed the same thing: something, or someone, was meddling with the their GPS...

After trawling through AIS data from recent years, evidence of spoofing becomes clear. GPS data has placed ships at three different airports and there have been other interesting anomalies. "We would find very large oil tankers who could travel at the maximum speed at 15 knots," said a former director for Marine Transportation Systems at the U.S. Coast Guard. "Their AIS, which is powered by GPS, would be saying they had sped up to 60 to 65 knots for an hour and then suddenly stopped. They had done that several times"...

"It looks like a sophisticated attack, by somebody who knew what they were doing and were just testing the system..." says Lukasz Bonenberg from the University of Nottingham's Geospatial Institute. "You basically need to have atomic level clocks."

The U.S. Maritime Administration confirms 20 ships have been affected -- all traveling in the Black Sea -- though a U.S. Coast Guard representative "refused to comment on the incident, saying any GPS disruption that warranted further investigation would be passed onto the Department of Defence." But the captain of the 37-ton tanker already has his own suspicions. "It looks like the Russians define an area where they don't want the GPS to apply."

194 comments

  1. GPS Spoofing by iggymanz · · Score: 4, Funny

    It's all fun and games until a ship runs aground or collides with something, and an eye gets poked out

    1. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      What is US Coast Guard doing in the black Sea? There is no US territory, unless they've annexed Turkey.

    2. Re: GPS Spoofing by bestweasel · · Score: 4, Funny

      They thought they were in the Mediterranean but something was wrong with their GPS.

    3. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Turkey is a member of NATO

    4. Re:GPS Spoofing by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 1

      It's all fun and games until a ship runs aground or collides with something, and an eye gets poked out

      Don't some weapons use GPS for, at least, some navigation? If so, then now there's now an exclusion area.

      --
      It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
    5. Re:GPS Spoofing by Hognoxious · · Score: 3, Funny

      Given that the first thing the Russians would do in an actual war would be to take out the GPS satellites I suspect there's an inertial and possibly a visual b@7;'[[*&)>..
      no carrier

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    6. Re: GPS Spoofing by Z00L00K · · Score: 1

      The USS John McCain and Fitzgerald incidents comes to mind.

      And even though the GPS system requires atomic clocks a system to cause trouble doesn't have to have the same precision - it just has to cause headache by offsetting incoming data.

      --
      If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
    7. Re: GPS Spoofing by Type44Q · · Score: 3, Informative

      These days only in name.

    8. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What is US Coast Guard doing in the black Sea? There is no US territory, unless they've annexed Turkey.

      Romania and Bulgaria are NATO countries like Turkey also. 3/4 of the Black see is NATO see with like 3 military ports where of course there are also US NAVY ships to counter the more and more hostile Russian fleet. Starting with invasion of Crimea by Russian troops the Black See looks more like the front line. The military presence on the Black See increased significantly and there are frequent skirmishes between military planes and military ships. You know the typical front line.

    9. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So, that somehow gives them right to poke their stupid noses into other people countries?

    10. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

      Incorrect, the ottoman Empire handed Crimea over in 1783, and Crimea was a separate SSR from 21 to 45, then part of the Russian SSR from 45 to 54, then a part of the Ukrainian SSR from 54 to 91, and then a part of an independent Ukraine from 91 to 2014.

      So. Try to keep up!

    11. Re: GPS Spoofing by nehumanuscrede · · Score: 1

      That would be a no.

      Modern weapons can use GPS as one method of in flight guidance, but rarely is it the only method available to it.

      In addition, those same modern weapons can use encrypted versions of said GPS making modifying the data just a wee bit more difficult.

      Have to go with all out jamming for that.

    12. Re:GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The US Navy seems to be doing a pretty good job at colliding with things without any help from the Russians.

    13. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      99% of their population voted to stay with Russia. So now you can just fuck off, if you aren't a Crimean resident. Democratic election is what American regime claims it is spreading throughout the world, what is more democratic than 99%.

      100% of my household voted for our parcel to secede from the union and be considered a territory of the principality of Sealand exempt from paying property tax and noise ordinances that apply to my neighbors.

    14. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      what is more democratic than 99%.

      letting the other 80% vote too?

    15. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Prooflinks somebody was discriminated against in that election

    16. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is your parcel a major peninsula with millions of inhabitants? Would you rather have a bloody stupid "democratic" war like you idiots stirred up in Vietnam and killed 2 million of natives in your genocidal quest to install a puppet "democratic" regime?

    17. Re: GPS Spoofing by cheesybagel · · Score: 2

      Nice excuse. Military vessels are supposed to have radar you know? What if they had to, shudder, fight an actual war where the enemy doesn't have their GPS transponder on to begin with?

    18. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      100%?

    19. Re:GPS Spoofing by skegg · · Score: 1

      It seems a small crisis is brewing in the South China Sea. Or thereabouts.

    20. Re: GPS Spoofing by ArmoredDragon · · Score: 1

      NATO grants itself that right.

    21. Re: GPS Spoofing by sysrammer · · Score: 1

      Nice excuse. Military vessels are supposed to have radar you know? What if they had to, shudder, fight an actual war where the enemy doesn't have their GPS transponder on to begin with?

      Mmm. Not to mention, in boot camp they're all issued with personal sets of Binocular Integrated Optical facilities Mk 1.

      --
      His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
    22. Re: GPS Spoofing by sysrammer · · Score: 0

      what is more democratic than 99%.

      letting the other 80% vote too?

      QFL (quoted for lulz)

      --
      His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
    23. Re:GPS Spoofing by sysrammer · · Score: 1

      Oh, come on, comrades, this is a funny old tech meme! Lighten up a bit on the mods.

      --
      His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
    24. Re:GPS Spoofing by sysrammer · · Score: 1

      The US Navy seems to be doing a pretty good job at colliding with things without any help from the Russians.

      Or...are they?! (Cue Twilight Zone riff)

      --
      His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
    25. Re:GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ?Did a couple of US Naval ships get spoofed by just who and where?

    26. Re:GPS Spoofing by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      Yeah, because we all need global positioning satellites, when we are either dead or hiding underground when the nuclear missiles fly. All I see is a propaganda scam to cover US naval officers illegally forcing right of even when those ships they are targeting with the US navies ego, can not make the manoeuvres they to force of them.

      Reality for a military vessel like a destroyer, if the captain of that vessel, ever allows a slow barely manoeuvrable merchant vessel, even on purpose, to ram it, they should be fired for inability to control their vessel. Maybe not in port but definitely when out to sea. They are paid to keep vessel and crew safe not ponce about with their ego or the ego of the regional commander.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    27. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They're not:

      "said a former director for Marine Transportation Systems at the U.S. Coast Guard."

      Good thing you're not on watch.
      "Sorry Sir I thought it was a Chinese stealth boat but it turned out to be four drunken tourists in a pedalo. Don't worry though Sir, we got em."

    28. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's the suggestion that the Russians are up to no good. Someone's sensitive about that. No idea who - it can't be the Russians because we keep being told they wouldn't do something like that.

    29. Re: GPS Spoofing by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 2

      99% of their population voted to stay with Russia. So now you can just fuck off, if you aren't a Crimean resident. Democratic election is what American regime claims it is spreading throughout the world, what is more democratic than 99%.

      00% of Chechnya's population wants independence - and Russia gives a shit about that. Fuck Putin.

      --
      Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
    30. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I agree, Chechen was a mistake. Fuck them, terrorists, filthy kidnappers, and child molesters.

    31. Re: GPS Spoofing by Reverend+Green · · Score: 1

      Probably those destroyers were way, way, way too dependent on networked computer systems for situational awareness. Most likely the captain had no idea anything was amiss until he felt the collision.

      It seems like American military doctrine is too focused on using hyper-modern technology to suppress civilian and paramilitary resistance to an occupation. Glitzy, unproven, unreliable high tech toys are are just great when you're fighting against goatherds with AK-47s.

      But we appear to have lost focus on fighting an a "real" war against an evenly matched opponent. All this over-networking may prove a real liability. Every networked system on a warship needs full redundancy from an always-active (not fallback) non-computerized human system.

    32. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL. 99%. Yeah. That sounds plausible. :D

    33. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Every networked system on a warship needs full redundancy from an always-active (not fallback) non-computerized human system.

      I picture Scotty shoveling dilithium into the warp core.

    34. Re: GPS Spoofing by blindseer · · Score: 1

      But we appear to have lost focus on fighting an a "real" war against an evenly matched opponent.

      I believe the opposite is true. We are seeing a military built in a way to fight World War 2 all over again that cannot deal well with "goatherds carrying AK-47s". I recall a US Navy exercise where someone brought in to command the simulated opposition force developed a plan that "sunk" nearly the entire flotilla. Despite the success of the opposition force in the simulation the US Navy tossed out anything that they may have learned and just called the simulation "unrealistic".

      I'm not saying that having a military that is capable of winning World War 2 again is a bad idea. The chances of another large scale war is very very low but just having that military capability has a deterrent factor that cannot be ignored, "If you seek peace, prepare for war". Having the capability and flexibility to successfully fight a guerrilla war is also necessary. What does that kind of military look like? I wish I knew. I think that there are people that do know, but the people in command don't seem to be listening.

      --
      I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    35. Re:GPS Spoofing by blindseer · · Score: 1

      It seems a small crisis is brewing in the South China Sea. Or thereabouts.

      Right, it sure is hard to know where the crisis is brewing when someone is spoofing GPS.

      --
      I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    36. Re: GPS Spoofing by blindseer · · Score: 0

      So, that somehow gives them right to poke their stupid noses into other people countries?

      Last I checked the "T" in "NATO" stood for "treaty". I assume the terms of the treaty allow for member nations to poke their noses into the business of other members. Seems rather logical to me. If you want the US to protect your territory from attack then people wearing US uniforms might, on occasion, enter your territory. If this bothers you then leave the treaty.

      --
      I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    37. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If stupid America is so STUPID then why have the Russians been stealing our technology for the past...60 years? Why do the Chinese do the same?

      I guess they are playing catch up by attempting to copy the dumbest country on the planet.

      Also if we are sooooo stupid then why do people from both countries want to come live here?

      Are they stupid too? I guess everyone is stupid but we are the least stupid

    38. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think you might be surprised about our capabilities to fight without advanced technology. People are under some impression Americans are soft... I invite anyone to test that theory

    39. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes there is. The Chinese are building islands and claiming the sea around them as Chinese territory. Then they are putting military bases and air bases on these islands angering every nation around them in the process

    40. Re: GPS Spoofing by gotan · · Score: 2

      Why? Because it happened at sea?

      For the Fitzgerald accident there is consistent AIS data that indicates that the freighter sent correct GPS positions. Also we don't see any ships in the vicinity being affected, their AIS-Data (in effect their position based on the GPS-data they received) should show anomalies if their GPS was affected by a spoofing attack.

      In addition the US-Navy doesn't use civilian GPS, it's questionable that their GPS-based-systems can be spoofed as easily. Also they should have redundant positioning systems (it is well known that GPS can be jammed, so it'd be foolish to have warships entirely relying on that, even normal ships should have redundant positioning systems). If the GPS-position deviates significantly from other positioning or is simply inconsistent with the current course that should raise massive warnings (on civilian ships it does). Finally the Navy personnel should have seen the other ship visually and on radar.

      --
      "By the way if anyone here is in advertising or marketing... kill yourself." -- Bill Hicks
    41. Re: GPS Spoofing by Gryle · · Score: 3, Informative

      I'm assuming you're referring to the 2002 Millennium Challenge Exercise. The popular accounts are incredibly one-sided (Malcolm Gladwell is a particular offender here) and ignore that many aspects of the war-game were unrealistic. For example, the red team leader, Van Riper, had small boats firing missiles that were physically beyond the capability of the boat to carry and having those same boats move as if they were unencumbered. While there is a lot to be learned from the reports of the exercise, it's not as bad as many people make it out to be.

      Source: Conversations with a participant of MC02.

      --
      Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not entirely sure about the universe - Einstein
    42. Re: GPS Spoofing by dave420 · · Score: 1

      Just because there is a treaty doesn't mean you can guess the contents of it to further your argument. The North Atlantic Treaty doesn't agree with your appraisal of its contents.

    43. Re:GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "You need to have atomic level clocks"

      Ok they have instantly lost all credibility with me. A 10MHz rubidium reference standard can be purchased on eBay for like $50 or so... they are trying to sensationalize "atomic level".

    44. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Minor correction. It never was a separate SSR. Between 1921 and 1945 it was an ASSR, or Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic. ASSR is a kind of status a degree below SSR. Every ASSR was nested into an SSR. Crimean ASSR was part of RSFSR at that time. Because indigenous Crimean Tatars were expelled from Crimea in 1944, there was no longer reason for Crimea to be an ASSR, so it was converted into a plain oblast in 1945 (still within RSFSR).

    45. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Mmm. Not to mention, in boot camp they're all issued with personal sets of Binocular Integrated Optical facilities Mk 1.

      As I recall, there's a tech manual called the BMR (Basic Military Requirements) for the Navy. I am certain it explicitly covers how to scan the horizon in a certain pattern to look for ships.

    46. Re: GPS Spoofing by Tjp($)pjT · · Score: 1

      Internationally it is still part of the Ukraine. So 91-2017, though occupied by Russia though the annexation is not recognized, and over 100 nations have said it is illegal internationally. And Kyivian Rus the former nation state that is Ukraine to day while Russia wasn't existing until the Duchy of Muscovy formed from Kyivian Rus then stabbed their parent in the back double dealing with Poland to split the territory after pledging to protect it; Kyivian Rus controlled Crimea for hundreds of years. Oh, Britain and France took control for a while, then ceded it back to the Tsars. And after the bolshevik revolution Ukraine the independent state controlled it for a while (about 12 entities held control for various periods of time).

      --
      - Tjp

      I am in wallow with my inner money grubbing capitalistic pig. ... Oink!

    47. Re:GPS Spoofing by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

      Where did, you learn to, write like William, Shatner, talks?

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    48. Re: GPS Spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As a peer pointed out, the Millenium Challenge 2002 wargames had some fascinating data. The use of motorcycle messengers to establish unconventional comms is neato.

    49. Re: GPS Spoofing by rtb61 · · Score: 1

      What a crock, you have sonar, radar, lookouts, officers on the bridge, coxswain in at the con. Only arrogance could have caused those crashes and forcing right of way. The, 'er', we didn't see the merchant vessel that anyone else could see from several kilometres away is no bloody excuse. No matter which way you look at it, a professional crew that could not fail to miss a major merchant vessel is either drunk, wildly incompetent or driven by massive erections. How incompetent, how egoistic https://www.youtube.com/watch?.... that incompetent.

      --
      Chaos - everything, everywhere, everywhen
    50. Re: GPS Spoofing by Reverend+Green · · Score: 1

      Eh... just doesn't seem very likely. Sorry.

    51. Re: GPS Spoofing by iggymanz · · Score: 1

      maybe they aren't islands, the GPS spoofing just makes them seem to sit still

  2. Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Baron_Yam · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The US military already encrypts GPS for themselves - it can still be jammed, but it can't be spoofed.

    Maybe it's time encryption was applied to civilian GPS as well. It's not like consumer electronics don't have the capability to handle the decryption, and it's not like you'd have to use the same keys as military GPS.

    1. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Nutria · · Score: 3, Informative

      it can still be jammed

      That's why the USN has started teaching Old School navigation methods again.

      --
      "I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
    2. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by MightyMartian · · Score: 2

      Welcome to the age of electronic warfare, where sextants and typewriters may be brought out of mothballs before it's all said and done.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    3. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Nutria · · Score: 4, Insightful

      where sextants and typewriters may be brought out of mothballs before it's all said and done.

      I think the Russians have already done that.

      --
      "I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
    4. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

      Wrong. Russia already spoofs GPS signals around Moscow to make it look like you're at the airport - sounds a lot like this. You can google the Moscow GPS events if you want.

    5. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by ctilsie242 · · Score: 2

      Encryption wouldn't be needed, but signing would be important. However, how does one offer this? An encrypted stream takes very little overhead to keep going with, because block and stream ciphers are very efficient. However, plaintext signing is a different ball game together. How do you sign a stream?

    6. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      You mean we might need to look up from our smartphones and see the world? Our musky cars might not know how to self drive anymore? Say it isn't so! Wah!!

    7. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      It is probably easier to spoof GPS around Moscow than it is to spoof GPS out in the sea.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    8. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by skoskav · · Score: 1

      The capability doesn't seem to be beyond the Russians either, as they seem to have been rolling out this kind of electronic warfare tech in recent years:
      Borisoglebsk 2
      Drone and UAV defense in Ukraine

    9. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Is so unfair blaming Russians for everything bad - hacking US elections and corporations, bombing Syria, invading Ukraine, stealing Crimea, shooting down airliners, political assassinations and now GPS spoofing. I have evidence that this is in fact done by the Chinese and when these wessels thought they were in Black Sea, they were really in South China Sea. This is how sophisticated Chinese technology is.

    10. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by mbone · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The US military already encrypts GPS for themselves - it can still be jammed, but it can't be spoofed.

      Of course it can be spoofed ("meaconned"), even if you assume that the encryption cannot be cracked. An attacker can receive the satellite signal and retransmit it. This signal will arrive at the target late, but it will still be valid - of course the attacker has to manipulate power / jamming etc to convince the receiver that the meacon signal is the valid one. You can be sure much thought has been given to this topic.

      The particular attacks in the original post appear to be related to protecting Putin. I doubt the military attacks get rolled out for such a simple purpose.

    11. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by MountainLogic · · Score: 4, Informative

      There is indeed a separate higher resolution encrypted feed for the military. Encrypting for civilian channel use is very impractical as many many devices lack the ability to update keys (no network connection). Encryption also burn clocks and batteries. With billions of devices being made all over the world by thousands of manufacturers keeping the keys private is unrealistic. Further with only one global key to crack by state supported entities it would not last long. (yes, the old /. meme of "imagine a Beowulf cluster" does apply here).

    12. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 2

      it can still be jammed

      That's why the USN has started teaching Old School navigation methods again.

      How old school? Sextants, paper and pencil or "Alexa? ..."

      --
      It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
    13. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by glitch! · · Score: 1, Informative

      How do you sign a stream?

      Break the stream into blocks (it probably already has blocks), get a checksum for each block, and sign the checksum. Send them on a separate channel if you don't want to modify the original stream.

      --
      A dingo ate my sig...
    14. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The military calls this, "corruptibility." Not every GPS used in the military is safe from signal corruption. For example, only the most recent Apache variant can safely use GPS for primary navigation specifically because of corruptibility concerns.

      This is a major concern for forces deployed near potential hot zones, like South Korea. Worse, NK commonly transmits corrupted signals. They common provide false NDB signals, complete with false identification. GPS jamming and corruption is also common there.

    15. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by msauve · · Score: 2

      "If you did with a spoofed signal, you'd need a rather powerful antenna given the range"

      So, you'd need something more powerful than the 26 W a GPS satellite transmitter puts out from 21000 km away? Wow, that's a lot. <rolleyes>

      --
      "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
    16. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Hognoxious · · Score: 2

      Russians have their own "GPS" and thus no need to spoof it, especially not in Russian territory.

      Eh? The point of spoofing it is to deny the enemy the use of it.

      It makes as much sense to say "Russians have their own submarines/bombers and thus no need to sink/shoot down the US ones".

      --
      Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
    17. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by cyn1c77 · · Score: 1

      it can still be jammed

      That's why the USN has started teaching Old School navigation methods again.

      Unfortunately, as recent incidents have shown, the lessons aren't going well!

    18. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Nutria · · Score: 1

      You refer to bumping into other ships?

      --
      "I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
    19. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They're already ahead of you: https://americanmilitarynews.com/2017/09/report-navy-must-use-pencil-and-paper-to-track-hazards-at-sea-get-more-sleep-in-response-to-collisions/

    20. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Baron_Yam · · Score: 1

      >Encryption wouldn't be needed, but signing would be important.

      Encryption's not my strong suit. Is that significantly different from using a private key to encrypt and publishing the decryption key? It's not like you're trying to protect the stream against decryption, you're just trying to prove who is sending the data.

    21. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by willy_me · · Score: 1

      That was not my impression on how GPS worked. The military GPS is the same GPS that everyone else uses. The difference is that the military can predict the noise that was added to the GPS signal - because they added it. Once you know the noise you can subtract it from the observed signal to get the ideal signal with optimal accuracy. So there is no encryption / decryption involved when observing a GPS signal. The encryption / decryption occurs when transferring / calculating the added noise - a completely different task.

      Long story short - encrypting civilian GPS makes no sense the way GPS works currently.

    22. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Xylantiel · · Score: 2

      As another poster says, what's needed is signing (authenticity verification) not encryption. I agree that this would be pretty difficult for devices that can't update, but it seems like it would be possible to periodically publish a public key that allows some sort of authenticity check for systems that can receive regular updates to this key. Though even then I'm unsure if one could defend against re-transmission attacks that do not alter the signals, just re-transmit certain ones with a carefully chosen delay. But it seems like it would be possible to build a receiver that could detect attacks without signing. If the signal is too strong for the reported location of the satellite, then something is very wrong. Since an attacker can't override a signal with a similar strength signal, this would make it possible to jam but not spoof. Though it may be that the signal strength cannot be computed with this much accuracy, or possibly not without a lot of information (weather) and computing power.

    23. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Sounds like Battlestar Galactica was right...

    24. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by WaffleMonster · · Score: 1

      The US military already encrypts GPS for themselves - it can still be jammed, but it can't be spoofed.

      All GPS receivers do is measure aspects of delay. These measurements become the basis for determining location.

      It is not necessary for an adversary to understand a signal to alter time of receipt and therefore modify calculated position.

      Maybe it's time encryption was applied to civilian GPS as well. It's not like consumer electronics don't have the capability to handle the decryption, and it's not like you'd have to use the same keys as military GPS.

      I would opt for better internal clocks within receivers and schemes such as RAIM to allow meddling to be flagged with high level of confidence.

    25. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've heard this before... make me laugh every time. Remember when that CIA Drone was brought down by GPS spoofing a few years ago. They don't know what the fuck they are talking about.

    26. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, you fucking imbecile, the GPS chipping sequence provides quite a bit of integration gain over broadband noise. In the case of the Mcode, the sequence is quite long.

      In addition, good GPS antennas look "up", which is often a difficult direction to jam from if you don't want a missile shoved up your ass.

      Go pick up a text book and learn something. It's all there.

    27. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by chihowa · · Score: 2

      What you're describing was Selective Availability and is no longer in use. What the GP was describing is the P(Y)-code, which is an encrypted PRN. All of this information is readily available these days and there's no need to rely on impressions.

      --
      If you want a vision of the future, imagine a youtube comments section scrolling - forever.
    28. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by rnturn · · Score: 1

      GPS satellites aren't easily reprogrammable communications satellites with spare "channels" available for nifty new purposes. (Not that future ones couldn't have those capabilities.) Then there's the "installed base" problem. Untold number of GPS receivers would be expensive paperweights if you start encrypting the C/A data.

      --
      CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
    29. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by sysrammer · · Score: 1

      Interesting. And they can track the exact machine used by its keystrokes, a nice little side benefit.

      --
      His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
    30. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Nutria · · Score: 1

      I know that was the case with "pivoting arm" typewriters (at least according to crime fiction) but am not sure that's valid with ball and daisy wheel machines.

      --
      "I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
    31. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      If you did with a spoofed signal, you'd need a rather powerful antenna

      Satellite signals for GPS are so piss weak that there's enough concern about harmonics from other frequency transmitters causing outages, let alone on the fundamental.

      If you want to spoof a GPS signal you can do it with a couple of hundred dollar SDR without an antenna attached and still affect every device in the vicinity of your house.

    32. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by elgatozorbas · · Score: 1

      An attacker can receive the satellite signal and retransmit it.

      In case the attacker only wants to shift the time a bit -which could be important for communication networks- this would not be too hard indeed. If, on the other hand, he wanted to do a spoofing of the position, that would require capturing the satellite signals and delaying them individually. For the civilian code, the separation of the satellite signals can be done easily by digital correlation. However, because the military code is not publicly known, the isolation of the signals can only be done using large dish antennas, each of which has only one satellite in view. One would need at least four of those, and they would need to track the satellite positions. While not impossible, this much less trivial, especially without being spotted, because the receiving antennas would need to be close to the target.

    33. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by guruevi · · Score: 1

      We're talking several ships in the ocean simultaneously, not sure if you've noticed but that's not the vicinity of your house, one of the boats is probably the length of your entire street and the boats probably can't see each other (distance of at least 14km between them).

      You need at least 2 antenna's, one for each frequency GPS uses (1.2 and 1.5GHz).

      How will you reposition a GPS signal for the area of a small city with the SDR? GPS has fairly decent signal discrimination (it kind of has to) and you need to be able to imitate not one but at least 3 around the poles if not 5 or more elsewhere separate GPS signals to be able to reposition a thing and it knows how to ignore 'bad' signals. Additionally, fixed GPS systems on boats have somewhat directional antenna's so you need to have a lot more power to be able to influence those.

      They kind of expected one or more satellites to go haywire in their lifetime and non-consumer equipment is also built on the premise that other things in it's vicinity may go haywire.

      --
      Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
    34. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by hey! · · Score: 1

      Old fart who actually remembers this crap here.

      Daisywheel with a fresh wheel is your best bet for covering your tracks. Over time identifiable damage occurs to the plastic coating of the daisywheel, so changing your daisy wheel every couple of weeks will effectively cover your tracks.

      Typeballs aren't a panacea. While they more uniformly manufactured than type elements in a conventional typewriter, damage through mishandling can occur. Swapping typeballs helps, but over time Selectric type machines develop patterns of misalignments that several correlated sets of characters. The motion of the typeball also creates characteristic irregularities in the embossing of characters into the page. Frequent servicing of your machine will make it harder to trace any document to a specific machine, but a forensic examination of a sample of sheets known to have been typed on your machine will reveal you've been monkeying with it.

      Now here's another possibility -- an old serial port laser printer hooked up to a dumb terminal. In most cases the imaging drum was part of the toner cartridge and regularly replaced. Some of those old serial laser printers had postscript interpreters, so you could even "edit" your document after a fashion.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    35. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      GPS events have happened stateside as well, as far back as the mid-late 1990s. Back then it was reported by aviators.
      The difference is that the US military acknowledged doing it, as part of tests.

    36. Re: Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      We're talking several ships in the ocean simultaneously, not sure if you've noticed but that's not the vicinity of your house

      Re-read my post. Specifically about a system with the antenna disconnected being enough to play around in your local house. I don't think you really appreciate just how weak the GPS signal is when it hits the ground. It's somewhere in the order of -130dBm everywhere. To put that in perspective it's about 1000 times weaker than the point where your phone goes from showing no bars to showing no service.

      Being able to fool multiple ships is not a case of any technical feat. Throw up a dipole and put a few watts up it, done.

      You need at least 2 antenna's

      Because after doing it with one the second one becomes some insurmountable obstacle? Also no you don't. You just need to fool the transceiver. Most of them will simply believe the strongest signals to be the true ones.

      How will you reposition a GPS signal for the area of a small city with the SDR?

      Dunno, take your pick. There are a variety of open source programs to spoof GPS signals using SDR. There are a constant string of articles about how to do it on hackaday for various purposes including (and disappointingly for our species) for the purposes of making your Pokemon go character walk without having to leave your basement.

      GPS signals are not complex. GPS-SDR-Sim is one such program: https://github.com/osqzss/gps-...

      GPS has fairly decent signal discrimination (it kind of has to) and you need to be able to imitate not one but at least 3 around the poles if not 5 or more elsewhere separate GPS signals to be able to reposition a thing and it knows how to ignore 'bad' signals.

      No it doesn't. In fact GPS receivers have no discrimination for the origin of the signal. All the discrimination is part of the protocol itself, and you can simulate all the satellites all over the world at the same time if you really wanted to. The math doesn't care.

      Additionally, fixed GPS systems on boats have somewhat directional antenna's so you need to have a lot more power to be able to influence those.

      Yes they are directional. But rarely with a gain larger than 2. Especially important with shipping is that they pickup signals from the entire horizon given the patchy GPS coverage in some parts of the ocean. The kinds of antennas that prioritise high-gain are actually in a different kind of shipping: namely in vehicle GPS systems from delivery companies.

      They kind of expected one or more satellites to go haywire in their lifetime and non-consumer equipment is also built on the premise that other things in it's vicinity may go haywire.

      Satellites going haywire is dealt with through overlapping coverage zones. Consumer equipment going haywire is dealt with through strict enforcement of regulations, and GPS systems going down is precisely why there's a major crackdown in some parts of the world right now on those cheap nasty 1.5GHz video transmitters you get from China.

      GPS on a physical level has no strength. GPS on a protocol level has no protection (except for the military and that only covers faking signals not causing signal outages). And above all, it is incredibly simple.

      I do really like the University professor's comments about it being sophisticated and needing atomic level clocks, since a) no you don't, you just need to generate suitable timecodes, and b) I have an "atomic level clock" on my desk right now. Rubidium standard. More accurate than the caesium fountains in old GPS satellites over a short time window allegedly needed to mess things up. Cost me $50 off ebay.

    37. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Nutria · · Score: 1

      Most HP Laser Jets didn't have PostScript interpreters. That the reasons host-based PS interpreters were created.

      Also, flaws in drums will be transmitted to the printed page, allowing them to be traced.

      --
      "I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
    38. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Tjp($)pjT · · Score: 1

      Anybody check GLONASS in the area? And with laser optical gyros, inertial navigation is adequate for navigation in the area.

      --
      - Tjp

      I am in wallow with my inner money grubbing capitalistic pig. ... Oink!

    39. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      However, because the military code is not publicly known, the isolation of the signals can only be done using large dish antennas, each of which has only one satellite in view.

      There's no problem tracking P-code even without he keys to decrypt Y-code. Sure phase tracking GPS receivers aren't cheap ($3000), but they have no trouble tracking both L1 and L2 frequencies without military grade keys, so I'm sure the Russian can handle this spoofing attack.

    40. Re:Time to add encryption to civilian GPS? by MountainLogic · · Score: 1

      Honestly, the bit rate is way too low to support encryption. And as you point out timing is everything and trivial microsecond replay attacks break even signatures.

  3. Not uncommon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The GPS protocol itself has noise built in to reduce precision for non-military applications. So testing this kind of thing doesn't seem too strange.

    1. Re: Not uncommon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not noise, but it chirps at 1/10th the rate of the military precision code.

      Noise was removed in 2000.

    2. Re:Not uncommon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      you're thinking of selective availability and that was turned off in 2000

    3. Re:Not uncommon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Who knows what he's thinking of, because it's never been "noise."

      The most precise signals remain encrypted for military use.

  4. 37-ton tanker ? by tomhath · · Score: 2

    Nice proofreading. That's not even a big truck. The article says 37000 ton

    1. Re:37-ton tanker ? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Funny

      TFA says "tonnes". Maybe we should just use gigagrammes for clarity.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    2. Re:37-ton tanker ? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I was wondering about that. Considering that the truck that delivers milk to my local dairy probably weighs more than 37 tons, a vessel weighing that much wouldn't much of a ship!

      dom

    3. Re:37-ton tanker ? by blindseer · · Score: 1

      TFA says "tonnes". Maybe we should just use gigagrammes for clarity.

      That's a great idea. Seriously. We already use the kilogram and milligram for indicating mass, why not a gigagram? Although I think you spell it funny.

      --
      I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
  5. their MO is blatantly obvious at this point by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    they're pulling these asymmetric strategies out of desperation. good god, it's like sharing the open Internet with every single shithead from Counter-Strike. they somehow think they aren't being obvious, too.

    guaranteed there will be the usual drumline of idiots in this very thread to say "where is proof huh? cyka blyat" and a few to bitch about the NSA with some saved up mod points on another few accounts to amplify. maybe we'll even see somebody freak out and post the usual DNC talking points straight from RT for some reason.

  6. sophistication by phantomfive · · Score: 4, Interesting

    These attacks have been known for a while, and are not hard at all. All you need is a radio that is stronger than the GPS signal. It's been demonstrated multiple times at DEFCON, and there are youtube videos that show you how to do it with a hackrf radio (for example, if you want to move to a particular place while playing Pokemon Go).

    Wikipedia suggests that Russia spoofs GPS whenever Putin is in the area.

    --
    "First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
    1. Re:sophistication by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 5, Funny

      Wikipedia suggests that Russia spoofs GPS whenever Putin is in the area.

      No! No hack, no spoof. Putin Strong, like bull. Forceful personality warps space around him. West just jealous they not have such leader.

      --
      #DeleteChrome
    2. Re:sophistication by Freischutz · · Score: 1

      Wikipedia suggests that Russia spoofs GPS whenever Putin is in the area.

      No! No hack, no spoof. Putin Strong, like bull. Forceful personality warps space around him. West just jealous they not have such leader.

      That's nothing! Our great leader has a furry alien parasite on his head that makes him hyper intelligent, the greatest negotiator of all time, a business genius without peer and he has good genes... good genes, great genes, absolutely amazing, wonderful genes, he is always a winner and his eloquence warps reality itself into ... an alternate reality, of ... alternative facts... and he gets two scoops of ice cream because he's an alpha male, not a one scoop pyjama boy.

    3. Re:sophistication by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "West just jealous they not have such leader."

      Yeah, but ours is orange.

      QED

    4. Re:sophistication by sysrammer · · Score: 2

      "Our great leader has a furry alien parasite on his head"
      That's the trouble with Tribbles.

      --
      His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
    5. Re:sophistication by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      No! No hack, no spoof. Putin Strong, like bull. Forceful personality warps space around him. West just jealous they not have such leader.

      For some reason I read that aloud in the voice of a North Korean news reporter.

  7. North Korea Smuggling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What is really happening, is that bad actors are trying to find ways to spoof the real position of ships that are going to North Korea by faking "screwed up GPS" or whatever.

    It is not hard to spoof or screw with GPS, it's not an encrypted system. Throw enough noise on the 1.2Ghz to 1.6Hhz frequencies and it will disappear.

    There are other "maybe"'s but it seems to me that if someone wanted to "hijack" an airline or a ship, his would be a way to screw with the autopilot.

    1. Re:North Korea Smuggling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Try spoofing your own GPS coordinates on your mobile phone. You'll end up with all sorts of regional spam from that particular location.

    2. Re:North Korea Smuggling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      If you're throwing noise at it that's jamming, not spoofing.

    3. Re:North Korea Smuggling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Hormel has regional SPAM?

    4. Re:North Korea Smuggling by sysrammer · · Score: 1

      Hormel has regional SPAM?

      Yes. "By 2003, Spam was sold in 41 countries on six continents and trademarked in over 100 countries (except in the Middle East and North Africa)." - wikipedia

      --
      His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
  8. "Atomic Level Clocks" are $120 on ebay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just search "rubidium frequency standard" on ebay. Add a picDIV from LeapSecond dot com and an Arduino and presto an *actual* atomic clock. Add some GPS spoofing code used to cheat Pokemon Go, your favorite SDR and an L-band RF amp (ebay) and wow, that's a really high barrier to entry. Certainly, only a world superpower could manage such a feat.

    1. Re: "Atomic Level Clocks" are $120 on ebay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Interesting. Didnâ(TM)t know they were that cheap. Would be cool to do an experiment and see how accurate they run on their own.

    2. Re:"Atomic Level Clocks" are $120 on ebay by Pseudonym · · Score: 1

      To successfully meacon a GPS signal, you need a very powerful transmitter, and an antenna which transmits circularly-polarised photons. That bumps the cost up a bit. We're talking a few thousand dollars rather than hundreds, but still, it's not quite as simple as you make out.

      --
      sub f{($f)=@_;print"$f(q{$f});";}f(q{sub f{($f)=@_;print"$f(q{$f});";}f});
    3. Re: "Atomic Level Clocks" are $120 on ebay by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      thats because when they have to be replaced every e.g. 5 years, they are sold on ebay...

  9. bug by bugs2squash · · Score: 1

    or maybe there's a bug in the AIS software

    --
    Nullius in verba
    1. Re: bug by Reverend+Green · · Score: 1

      To its author, that bug might be a feature...

  10. About a year ago by darkain · · Score: 1

    About a year ago, this same thing was reported on land as well in Russia

    https://news.slashdot.org/stor...

    1. Re: About a year ago by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In other words, Russia was also a victim of this. Therefore the two most likely culprits are Ukrainians or Muslims. Which do you suspect?

      - snruter rotsac

    2. Re: About a year ago by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

      You might want to, you know, at least look at the first sentence from darkain's link before commenting.

      The linked story was about Russians noticing their GPS not working in the vicinity of the Kremlin. It's quite easy to see why the Russian Government would want that; but it's rather more difficult to argue why Ukrainians or Muslims would be involved.

      --
      #DeleteChrome
    3. Re: About a year ago by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The article was posted by AmiMojo, so the answer is, as usual, "The Patriarchy."

    4. Re: About a year ago by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Duh, Ukraine obvious is smarter, tougher and better at cyber warfare than Russia, that's the only explanation if Russia isn't at fault. Plus Ukrainian men are more handsome and their genitalia larger.

  11. $50 Fix by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    No need for a new, encrypted GPS. The Razor IMU ($50 @ SparkFun) could fix this problem. Or we could just keep living in a world where DIY drones have better navigation systems than the world's largest ships.

  12. Vanish from GPS, eh? by tietokone-olmi · · Score: 1

    I thought all the satellites were too old to receive anything from earth, let alone from puny handheld units like as early smartphones were. Maybe that's why it's not called Wireless magazine?

  13. Pseudolite anyone ?!? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Since there is an airport very close to the location where this happened, maybe they were having problems with a a href=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudolite>pseudolite. These devices mimic the transmission of a GPS satellite, and they are sometimes used to increase GPS reliability in critical regions. If they are malfunctioning or improperly set, nearby GPS receivers start having troubles. Before invoking a USSR conspiracy, I would check if these devices have been installed or are under test in the region.

  14. Re:ofc by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If every single time we peek around the corner, we catch the bear with its paw in the cookie jar, then the narrative doesn't need much shifting.

    "It's a witch-hunt I tell ya!" cries the procession of witches.

  15. Anti cruise missile system? by bogeskov · · Score: 1

    To me it sounds like a system for confusing cruise missiles, making them drop out of the sky far from target.

    --

    1. Re:Anti cruise missile system? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For CMs, there is keyed, military GPS... Simple spoofing is not possible (apart from the owners of the GNSS, i.e. the US):

    2. Re:Anti cruise missile system? by PPH · · Score: 1

      Much more likely that the Russians are trying to thwart a much more serious threat. They are trying to keep Uber out.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
  16. AIS or GPS? by Known+Nutter · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Are we spoofing GPS here, or are we spoofing AIS? Just so we're clear... GPS is obviously GPS, but the summary seems to conflate GPS and AIS. AIS is a terrestrial based VHF system which takes GPS data from individual ships adds identifiers and transmits it to anyone who cares to listen, which usually means other ships and shore-side receivers. It sounds to me like it is AIS that is being spoofed -- which would be trivial compared to GPS.

    Keep in mind that AIS is just one of several redundant systems which ships use to navigate waterways and track positions of nearby vessels.

    No investigation has indicated suspicions that Russia did anything. The only one who suspects Russia is one captain of a tanker ship.

    --
    Beware of the Leopard.
    1. Re:AIS or GPS? by Solandri · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Yeah, I monitor AIS to help decide where to take my boat fishing (track where the charter sportfishing boats are going). It's fairly common to see glitches in AIS tracks. Ships traveling at warp speed are pretty frequent too. My guess is AIS glitches and reports the same GPS position for a while (as if the ship is stationary). Then all of a sudden it reports the correct location and it looks like the ship has traveled at high speed to the new location.

    2. Re:AIS or GPS? by laughingskeptic · · Score: 3, Informative

      The article clearly states that it is the GPS position that is being tampered with. AIS is the means by which the positions are reported, it is not the system for determining positions. These ships are reporting bad positions that they are getting from their GPS systems. The ship captains seem to be aware that their GPS positions are incorrect. As I type this the ship KAREEM JUNIOR is reporting that it is sitting on land at the Gelendzhik airport ( https://www.marinetraffic.com/... ). Before it jumped onto land it's reported path zig-zagged at sea off the Russian port of Tuapse. The link I provided will show any other ships that find themselves reporting positions at the Gelendzhik airport in the future.

    3. Re:AIS or GPS? by WaffleMonster · · Score: 1

      Are we spoofing GPS here, or are we spoofing AIS? Just so we're clear... GPS is obviously GPS, but the summary seems to conflate GPS and AIS. AIS is a terrestrial based VHF system which takes GPS data from individual ships adds identifiers and transmits it to anyone who cares to listen, which usually means other ships and shore-side receivers. It sounds to me like it is AIS that is being spoofed -- which would be trivial compared to GPS.

      It's talking about GPS spoofing where bad AIS data flows from bad GPS data.

      Quoting TFA:

      "Instead of displaying Atria's actual position, the ship's systems located it 25 to 30 miles away â" at Gelendzhik airport"

    4. Re:AIS or GPS? by leretard · · Score: 0

      one captain of a tanker ship

      and you keep treating the people who fall for the headlines like adults....

    5. Re:AIS or GPS? by BadDreamer · · Score: 1

      AIS is not used by the ship to navigate, and the ships navigation is broken by this spoof. So it can't be AIS.

      Also, as mentioned above, it is clearly stated that GPS is spoofed and nothing else.

    6. Re:AIS or GPS? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      To further illustrate the redundant systems, the article said the captains radioed each other. If someone really wanted to mess with these ships, they'd jam the radios too. Or better yet, use some algorithms for taking other captain's voices. "Everything is ok! Please proceed to be driving into iceberg now, ya?"

  17. You do realize.... by gerald.edward.butler · · Score: 1, Insightful

    that your meaningless rants about the left just make you sound like a douche-bag? Right?

    1. Re:You do realize.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's wrong? Did Russia kick your dog too?

    2. Re:You do realize.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yup. Douche-bag confirmed!

    3. Re: You do realize.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ^ Putin stole his Oreo cookies

  18. Re:Hey you swine by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    it's cute when the vatnik retards get all uppity and theatrical like this

    they think they're doing something novel, or really anything at all aside from throwing data points into a honeypot

    tick tock, ivan

    haha!

  19. A known attack vector since the 90's by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I worked for an aerospace research company in the late 90's. One project we worked on for a "three letter agency" involved adding error to GPS signals received by civilian aircraft. We were eventually able to modify position fixes in the aircraft from the ground by as much as 1km without tripping the GPS fix quality flag in the avionics. anything more than this required a very accurate clock beyond the PLL stabilized clock based off the GPS satellites we were using. This was a significant finding because aircraft were just starting to use GPS for IFR approach purposes. the only way to prevent this is to encrypt the clock stream from the GPS birds.

  20. Wrong by ArchieBunker · · Score: 1

    GPS signals are weak and easy to overpower. The protocol is 100% open and anyone can easily spoof positions with a HackRF and decent amplifier. The old positioning system (which name escapes) me was retired but was again re-activated for reasons exactly like this.

    --
    Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
    1. Re: Wrong by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lorans.

    2. Re:Wrong by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The new iteration is E-Loran.

  21. Want an overview of Russian government? by Futurepower(R) · · Score: 2

    Mod parent up!

    If you want an overview of the degradation of the Russian government, I suggest this book: The New Tsar: The Rise and Reign of Vladimir Putin, by Steven Lee Myers (2015)

    For those who want an overview of the degradation of the U.S. government, can you recommend a book?

    1. Re:Want an overview of Russian government? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For those who want an overview of the degradation of the U.S. government, can you recommend a book?

      "Killing Trump" by Bill O'Reilly comes highly recommended. Or so I'm told.

    2. Re:Want an overview of Russian government? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean the planned AntiFa november 4th revolution?
      They are planning a US wide violent revolution with killings.

    3. Re:Want an overview of Russian government? by leretard · · Score: 1

      Try "Mein Kampf" by Adolf Hitler.

      Different time, different place, extremely similar story.

    4. Re: Want an overview of Russian government? by Reverend+Green · · Score: 1

      That's gonna be a tough one, seeing as how there are maybe 1000 total antifa goons nationwide. And also seeing how they are just a much of anti-'s, grievance mongers without any real Ideology or positive goals.

  22. When in Russia by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Or near their military installations and bases, use GLOSNASS or go old-school, with programmable electronic computing devices.

  23. Interesting theory. GPS problems. by Futurepower(R) · · Score: 1

    Interesting theory. Link: Pseudolite Quote: Pseudolite is a contraction of the term "pseudo-satellite", used to refer to something that is not a satellite which performs a function commonly in the domain of satellites.

    Why pseudolites are used: Pseudolites preserve position information during GPS-denied conditions (June 2, 2016)

    More info about the development of radio frequency position information:

    Opening Up Indoors: Japan's Indoor Messaging System, IMES (May 1, 2011)

    There are, of course, problems:

    Danger, Will Robinson! Beware the IMES of Japan (Oct. 8, 2014)

  24. Link by Futurepower(R) · · Score: 1

    GLOSNASS is a Russian GPS system. (Aug. 25, 2016)

    1. Re:Link by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Isn't that the point that it is not the GPS system? Galileo is not complete yet. Neither is the Compass, which uses the same frequencies than the European system.

  25. Comment on GPS spoofing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    https://www.fleetmon.com/maritime-news/2017/19867/gps-spoofing-preps-worldwide-sabotage/
    You can also look up the Altria and find its true size. (in the photo section).

    1. Re:Comment on GPS spoofing by sysrammer · · Score: 1

      https://www.fleetmon.com/maritime-news/2017/19867/gps-spoofing-preps-worldwide-sabotage/
      You can also look up the Altria and find its true size. (in the photo section).

      I'm not sure I want to follow the link, but googling it let to this interesting tidbit from the Army's OPFOR guide http://www.apd.army.mil/epubs/...
      "Note: A GPS jammer the size of cigarette pack transmitting 4 Watts, can effectively deny use of GPS in an area ranging as far as 150-200 km. It is extremely simple to install one of these lightweight GPS jammers into a small UAV. Off-the-shelf remote controlled aircraft can also be modified to provide this capability. "

      --
      His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
  26. It sounds like they are mixing up 2 different by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It sounds like they are mixing up 2 different things, the "review" of the logs that speed them up and then stopped them for an hour sounds like a time based issue not a location based issue perhaps related to crossing between 2 of the 6? time zones in Russia, resulting in the systems clock auto adjusting to the time in the new zone. So the hour it was stationary for, were there 1 hours worth of log GPS log entries? so the resulting logs would have looked like 2 hours worth of log entries for a 1 hour time period, then 0-1 log entries for the next hour.

  27. Evidence? by leretard · · Score: 1

    Why is this the Russian state's fault exactly?

    Because "RUSSIAN HACKERS" has been branded into media-consumer-drones' "brains"?

  28. Russia is a friend of the world! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Do NOT let the lefties tell you otherwise! MAGA!

  29. Re: ofc by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Follow the money! Who profits more from "Russian misdeeds"? Leftists or Russia? BAMN!

  30. Welcome Mr. Bond, I've been expecting you. by lcllam · · Score: 1

    Now watch as I use it to steal nuclear warheads mwahahahahaa!!!

  31. Vanish from GPS? by rnturn · · Score: 1

    How did a 37-ton tanker suddenly vanish from GPS off the coast of Russia?

    What does this even mean? It seem to indicate that the poster thinks GPS is some sort of tracking system.

    --
    CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
  32. Oblig. by sysrammer · · Score: 1

    In Soviet Russia GPS spoofs you!

    I mention this in tribute to our favorite russkiy komik, a funny guy from the Cold War. It occurs to me, there must have been some expat Americans over in the USSR doing the comedy circuit. Is anyone aware of anyone?

    wikipedia: His humor combined a mockery of life under Communism and of consumerism in the United States, as well as word play caused by misunderstanding of American phrases and culture, all punctuated by the catchphrase, "And I thought, 'What a country!'"

    What a country.

    --
    His ignorance covered the whole earth like a blanket, and there was hardly a hole in it anywhere. - Mark Twain
  33. EditorDavid = ANother Buttmad Libtard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    We can't have a single day without a MUH EVIIIIIIL RUSSIANS story from EditorDavid. Hey David, do you work for DNS? Are you getting all this shit from Podesta or something?

    Keep on killing /.!

    1. Re:EditorDavid = ANother Buttmad Libtard by DewDude · · Score: 1

      The amazing thing I notice about people who use terms like "Libtards" is they always tend to be ignorant and they LOVE to post as an Anonymous Coward. Probably because you know if anyone knew who you were...they'd come punch you in the face.

      I suppose you get all of your news from websites with anonymous domain registration that claim to be American. You wouldn't know fake news if it bit your dick off.

  34. 37-ton tanker? by chris-chittleborough · · Score: 1
    A 37-ton tanker wouldn't be much use, and would hardly need a GPS.

    (It's only Monday, but I've already met my internet pedantry quota for the week.)

  35. So what about GLONASS? by Plumpaquatsch · · Score: 1

    Russia's globalnaya navigatsionnaya sputnikovaya sistema? Was that spoofed too?

    --
    Of course news about a fake are Fake News.
  36. Re: Circle Jerk RUSSIA Trolling!!! by Reverend+Green · · Score: 1

    You're an annoying dullard. Go back to Facebook.

  37. Until recently there was a backup /alternative by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Until recently there was a backup/alternative to the Satnav systems. Google the penny wise, pound foolish story of LORAN-C and E-LORAN.

    An in-place, functioning alterenative/complement to GPS that was robust and hard to jam. The LORAN system was thrown away by beancounters and politicians who couldn't comprehend the value of backups for life-critical systems

  38. Re: ofc by Reverend+Green · · Score: 1

    Senator McCarthy, so nice to see you again.

  39. Re: Hey you swine by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Excellent post, Comrade Li Feng!

  40. Why airports? by blindseer · · Score: 2

    Anyone else notice a pattern? It seems that when the signals are spoofed the reported location is at an airport. Why would that be?

    Is this to protect the airport? For example, a GPS guided bomb dropped on the airport would think it is on target when in fact it is 30 miles out from shore. Is it to protect other targets? They'd be willing to go sacrificing the airport (presumably a low occupancy area with few buildings, most of the area being runways and such) instead of a higher value target.

    Maybe it's just that an airport is a convenient place to hide the equipment and the device is re-transmitting it's own location to get around the problems of having to decode and re-encode the GPS signals.

    Maybe I'm seeing a pattern that isn't there.

    --
    I am armed because I am free. I am free because I am armed.
    1. Re:Why airports? by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Maybe it's just that an airport is a convenient place to hide the equipment and the device is re-transmitting it's own location to get around the problems of having to decode and re-encode the GPS signals.

      You don't need to decode and recode. Other than for the military GPS signals aren't complicated or encrypted. They are well described and open. Also there are freely available tools to create fake GPS signals. All you need to do is pump them through a transmitter, not even a very strong one.

  41. US Coast Guard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If this was actually issued by the US Coast Guard, I'm pretty sure they would have spelt Defense in the common American form.

  42. GPS goes in one direction by houghi · · Score: 1

    How did a 37-ton tanker suddenly vanish from GPS off the coast of Russia?

    Well, it didn't, because you can only receive GPS. Unless you are a satellite, you are not on GPS, so you can not vanish from it.

    --
    Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    1. Re:GPS goes in one direction by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      Just another example of terrible headline writing, with the added bonus of uninformed authorship, and a dose of failure-to-consult-experts, though in this case a minute with Wikipedia would have sufficed for an author of average intelligence.

      I know, big assumption there.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
  43. Re:ofc by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What if every time we peek around the corner, we see someone yelling about the bear with its paw in the cookie jar, but we never see the bear or the jar or the details on which cookies are missing?

  44. Sources of AIS errors by goatbar · · Score: 1

    Last week, I put together a quick write-up of the possible sources of trouble for AIS messages. It doesn't go into the needed depth on topics, but I would appreciate technical feedback and any links to people doing deep dives on any or all of the issues.

    GPS spoofing possibly seen in AIS data: http://schwehr.blogspot.com/20...

    And before that I've written quite a bit on the insanity that is AIS:

    AIS Integrity and Security - Part 0: http://schwehr.blogspot.com/20...

  45. Drones by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Allegedly, to down civilian drones. To prevent the usage in vicinity of airports, airfield and aerodromes, civilian drone manufacturers provide their drones with software and a copy of a navigational database which lists all such no-fly zones. When a drone is made to think it is in one of these zones, its software enforces an immediate emergency landing.

    That's what I heard of it; don't know how much truth in it. Sounds plausible.

  46. GLONASS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As Russia's GPS alternative takes off, it becomes more enticing for them to meddle with vessels which remain reliant on the US's older system.

    Hopefully competent government folks pause their spying on US citizens momentarily to get a handle on the situation and flesh out the appropriate contingency plans.

    Since all the prominent jobs and property ownership in the US remains confined to baby boomers too lazy to open PDF attachments, perhaps the best plan would be to learn Russian...

  47. GPS vs WiFi by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Not the same thing, but my phone tags pictures in Norway (I am in North America) when certain WiFi networks are in range, regardless of what the GPS is telling it. (The WiFi in question has a satellite link to Norway, it is on a vessel from Norway.) For some reason, that WiFi location data is weighted higher than the GPS.

  48. Now if your GPS ever misleads you... by ShamblerBishop · · Score: 1

    At least you know you can blame the Russians/reds/commies for that, too!

  49. corrections by nten · · Score: 1

    If you are spoofing the processing gain from the spreading code will apply to you too so that cancels. The marine GPS antennas are about 10dbi straight up and 0dbi at the horizon. They are tuned to be as close to a half sphere as possible because you get mist if your horizontal position accuracy from the satellites on the horizon so you need to hear those. So 26w plus 13dbi antenna minus 182 path loss is -155db at the ship antenna. Since you are really trying to spoof the horizon birds anyway the antenna gain cancels. Plus 142 path loss for 200miles gets you to -13dbw which us how loud you would have to be to match GPS. So 1w with a 0dbi antenna puts you 13db louder than GPS. That is doable.

    --
    refactor the law, its bloated, confusing and unmaintainable.