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Could VR Field Trips Replace the Real Thing? (theindychannel.com)

turkeydance shares a report from RTV6, which cites a new editorial in the journal Science that explores the question, "Could VR field trips replace the real thing?" Virtual field trips have been around for a while, but they used to be pretty boring: some photos, some text -- basically a Wikipedia entry. But they've come a long way. Nearpod and Google Expeditions let students immerse themselves in places they couldn't normally visit, like Antarctica or even Mars. These virtual field trips are safer and easier to organize than real outings, and they might soon be cheaper, too. Douglas McCauley, assistant professor of ecology at the University of California, Santa Barbara, says traditional field trips have already declined under budget constraints, so schools might be tempted to simply make a switch. McCauley says he's excited about the possibilities of VR. Taking students back to prehistoric times or forward to witness the results of climate change could be a powerful teaching tool.

58 of 96 comments (clear)

  1. Fuck no by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    By definition.

    1. Re:Fuck no by Opportunist · · Score: 2, Funny

      Fuck yes. By definition.

      Let's see... boring, tedious, about as educational as watching the wall paint dry... if they now somehow first add a bus ride that makes you throw up, they're pretty much already on par with a real field trip.

      And that should be easy in VR, most VR games already pull that off without even trying.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:Fuck no by paulej72 · · Score: 2

      You may not throw up from the bus ride, but the VR experience will get the same output.

    3. Re:Fuck no by Racemaniac · · Score: 2, Insightful

      If it's for big and well known things, fuck yes indeed
      - most of those museums/sights/... are completely overrun by tourist, tourist shops, .... completely ruining the experience
      - and even if you get a nice look at it, you can't stand there for a few minutes enjoying it since there are hundreds of people waiting behind you...
      - and just the ecological sense of going somewhere for seeing something like that etc...
      - and indeed, all the practical shit that comes along with it

      give me a decent virtual tour of any big monument/museum/... over going there! i might actually enjoy just being able to look at an important work for more than a few minutes, not be tired of a stupid travel to get there, not be bothered by tons of other people also wanting to see it and having to make photographs with their flash on, etc... etc... etc...

      now if it's for a nice relaxing vacation on some remote place just enjoying the fresh air and sitting in a tent, i doubt VR will replace that XD.

    4. Re:Fuck no by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      now if it's for a nice relaxing vacation on some remote place just enjoying the fresh air and sitting in a tent, i doubt VR will replace that XD.

      Well, sitting on a virtual beach, putting your feet into the water and letting the waves lap at them while actually you sit on your couch with your feet in a footbath... sure, it ain't the same but it's something you can have right here, right now, for cheap and whenever you feel like it.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    5. Re:Fuck no by Cinnamon+Beige · · Score: 1

      You all do realize that for some of the poorer kids, this would basically be a gigantic middle finger to them, right? I had some classmates when I was at the school mostly pulling from one of the local Projects who could be gotten farther than they'd ever have been in their life just by tossing them on a cross-town bus.

      This definitely did make field trips with them sometimes have the additional entertainment of getting to see them realize that the city was a lot more diverse than they'd thought--but if most school systems are like the ones I grew up around? Most of the administrative staff could easily be replaced with computer programs, which would do the job just as well as the humans doing those jobs now, and that would save distinctly more money.

      They'll probably go with VR field trips, though, and with whichever company offers the best kickbacks.

    6. Re:Fuck no by parkinglot777 · · Score: 1

      Actually not exactly, VR can't replace all field trips. If the sole purpose of a field trip is to see the place and nothing else, then VR may be used to replace the field trip. However, some types of field trips need more than just seeing because you need to use other senses in the field trip, e.g. geology, climatology, etc. In other words, some field trips can be replaced, but some others can't.

    7. Re:Fuck no by mikael · · Score: 1

      We did Geology field trips at our school. It's funny how our parents favorite picnic spots happened to be the best examples of specific geological features; beaches, granite cliffs, sandstone hills. To capture everything from the individual grains of quartz in granite would required HD video. To capture the stalactites and stalagmites in a cave would really require 360 degree video. Nothing would really replace of walking along the coastline of beach cliffs, seeing and hearing the waves on one side, feeling the wind and smelling the sea salt in the air.

      They have made similar VR videos to do things like walking down towards the bottom of a volcanic crater or exploring the surface of everything from the Moon to Pluto, but they don't duplicate the feeling of heat or cold. Others have covered the Space Shuttle and observatories. Seeing a full-size spacecraft in the same space as your living room is another experience.

      Our history lessons used to consist of scratchy scribbled sketches of various buildings from each era. A Google 360 Atreetview picture of a medieval town is several magnitudes better. Anything interactive like 3D game or walkthrough is even better.

      --
      Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
    8. Re:Fuck no by barbariccow · · Score: 1

      At best, instead of watching a movie when teacher drank too much the night before, he/she will pass our VR headsets and the class will "go on a trip" while teacher tries to nap-off the banging headache.

  2. VR = scam. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Never falling for that bullshit again. What a waste of money and time my HTC Vive turned out to be. Never again.

    1. Re:VR = scam. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      VR = Vomit Reality

    2. Re:VR = scam. by David_Hart · · Score: 1

      Never falling for that bullshit again. What a waste of money and time my HTC Vive turned out to be. Never again.

      You are aware of the upcoming VR port of Fallout 4? Or, maybe you aren't into gaming. In which case, yeah, desktop VR is a bit like when Blu-Ray players came out. The hardware is there, but little in the way of content.

      FPS Gaming seems to have the most buzz for VR content. Though, I wouldn't be surprised if we see some MMOs adopting it.

      My buddy has the Occulous Rift and it works quite well. I'm thinking, though, that it's probably better to wait for Gen2 hardware. The theory being that they will have fixed any bugs, made everything lighter and easier to use, and there will be much more content.

    3. Re:VR = scam. by barbariccow · · Score: 1

      I've played serious sam 3d. Honestly, it was fun in that it was new and different, but you could tell all the quick-twitch reflex requirements (aka skill) had to be removed so that you wouldn't die every second due to the far less sensitive controls.

  3. Why not both? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    There's no reason to "replace" anything. VR can be an immensely powerful learning tool. Kids can do a guided tour, then be left to their own devices to explore things that weren't covered, without fear of losing anyone. I say just start organizing three times as many fields trips, but make all the extra ones virtual.

    However, real world experience in certain places is also important. Young students should visit a real fire station and see and talk with the real people working. Middle school and high school students could probably replace trips to places like Washington DC, but could the grand canyon really be experienced properly in VR? University trips to dangerous places should still exist, for the experience necessary to learn how to act and survive there if you have to lead your own group some day.

    1. Re:Why not both? by K.+S.+Kyosuke · · Score: 1

      then be left to their own devices

      Heh!

      --
      Ezekiel 23:20
    2. Re:Why not both? by sabbede · · Score: 1

      Or they could go to a museum, and the museum would have virtual exhibits.

    3. Re:Why not both? by barbariccow · · Score: 1

      I remember very well my field trip to Washington DC. The experience could never be replicated with a VR headset. I already knew the history from books; seeing the monument was cool but didn't convey any information I didn't already possess. Seeing the massive homeless problem and having to be warned to stay away from the con men who frequent tourists was the real eye-opening thing for me. A VR tour of DC would obviously exclude all these negative things and jjust go further to paint reality with broad pink strokes of someone's ideals, and cause further detachment from the truth.

    4. Re:Why not both? by barbariccow · · Score: 1

      That's an interesting point. Since we are already trapped within The Matrix (well, some of us haven't unplugged..), this is clearly an attempt to ease the transition from dream to dream-within-dream.

  4. They can't, but... by RhettLivingston · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Field trips haven't just declined, they've been decimated. VR would be an improvement over nothing. VR that allows group participation (similar to conference type VR) with the teacher in the VR would be very useful.

    But, it would be better to look at this as something new that opens up doors that field trips never could. VR can take you anywhere from inside a molecule or cell to visiting anyplace on Earth at any time in history to walking on the moon. It's a potential boon to the learners that have to see things, walk around them, etc.

    1. Re:They can't, but... by Quirkz · · Score: 1

      Right. Why limit yourself to only seeing what you can in person? And that's not just a matter of location, but scale and interactivity, too. Why go to a planetarium, when you can go to the stars? Zoom out and see the whole solar system, zoom in and watch nuclear fusion in the core of the sun.

      Of course field trips ought to be a niche use. I'd love it at home, to be able to explore all kinds of things. Other cities and countries, national parks, outer space, the inner workings of machinery, you name it. Sure, being there in person can't be topped, but given the cost and time requirements of travel, I'd settle for a substitute most of the time.

  5. Short answer: by fredrated · · Score: 5, Insightful

    no. Add to them, ok. Replace them? Only for people that don't care.

  6. *might* be cheaper? by petes_PoV · · Score: 5, Insightful

    places they couldn't normally visit, like Antarctica or even Mars. These virtual field trips are safer and easier to organize than real outings, and they might soon be cheaper, too

    The guy claims that the reason (OK, one reason) for the decline in field trips is budgetary. Then the article tells us that VR trips might be cheaper?

    Well if they only "might" be cheaper (though I would expect them to be a dam' sight cheaper than a trip to Mars - or Antarctica) then that doesn't sound like they are addressing the issue claimed.

    However, the real reason field trips have declined is simply because of all the litigious parents and liabilities that schools incur, need to insure against and have to account for. Trips are simply not worth the hassle of organising and dealing with the fallout.

    Though I expect there are already parents gearing up to sue the arse of schools and teachers for the "stress" of making their little darlings wear a VR helmet - or the cost of their "destroyed" hair-do.

    --
    politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
    1. Re:*might* be cheaper? by 93+Escort+Wagon · · Score: 1

      If “cheaper” is the real issue... Viewmaster has been around for 80 years.

      --
      #DeleteChrome
    2. Re:*might* be cheaper? by Cinnamon+Beige · · Score: 1

      They'll help test scores very much if they either are to help you understand the material better--some subjects have to be seen, at least the first time, because that's what lets you get a sense of what the words to describe them actually mean--or are set up as an explicit reward for hitting milestones on time.

      The insurance, though, is definitely a significant issue, especially in school systems where you've got a decent chunk of the population who would consider insurance fraud a 'victimless' crime & if not a morally good act then at least a justifiable one because hey, they don't have to deal with an identifiable victim being unhappy where they can see it. One of the things that means it definitely isn't victimless? It raises the cost of getting insurance (and the hoops to get it to pay for anything) for everybody else there...

    3. Re:*might* be cheaper? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Yes but they never made a view master box factory edition.

    4. Re: *might* be cheaper? by Hal_Porter · · Score: 1

      The best option is to get rid of the risk assessments, introducing more dangerous field trips to fun destinations like Raqqa and go for a "(much) fewer but (much) stronger" graduates strategy.

      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    5. Re:*might* be cheaper? by barbariccow · · Score: 1

      A lot of kids took Physics 2 ( AP Physics now? ) because it was well known that everyone who managed to get at least a C got to go on the field trip to Six Flags (an amusement park with rollercoasters, aka physics applied to entertainment) toward the end of the year. Sure, you could have skipped school and gone by yourself, you didn't NEED the class to go, but it would be hard to assemble a group of your good friends to all skip the same day... And also, it was somehow cooler that it was school-sanctioned and not just an act of truancy. That field trip would have totally sucked if it was just riding rollercoasters with a VR headset. How can a VR headset mimic the feeling of your brain compressing against the back of your skull as you go from 0-60 in 2.3 seconds flat? And really the experience wouldn't be complete unless the school also was selling cups for $17 dollars with which you could fill with soda.

      Even while I was in high school, they removed the soda machines and replaced them with crazy fun-cool milk vending machines. Not until we had several weeks wherein we learned how to hack the soda machine to drop the cost to 0 (it would still require you to put in a coin, but it would be returned as change. We had a several-person team, one would load the quarter in, one would reach in the vending slot and pass it back to the line, and another would pass the coin up from the change slot back to the person loading quarters. Had to be quick so we wouldn't get caught, especially because 200 kids in line after school in the cafeteria wasn't a "normal" thing. How they didn't suspect something was up when the coke guy had to restock the machine every day yet there was probably only a few bucks in there from the normal run during the day when we restored the original pricing)

  7. Simpsons Did It by samoht · · Score: 4, Funny

    "You'll go where I go, defile what I defile, eat who I eat"

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1_bp8YKUPU/

  8. If you're talking about Antarctica or Mars... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    the question is the same as "Could VR Field Trips be better than not doing it at all?" because there's no way they're going there in any way otherwise.

    But seriously, why would anyone want a VR "woods simulator" instead of taking them to the woods, for example?

    1. Re:If you're talking about Antarctica or Mars... by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      TBE?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:If you're talking about Antarctica or Mars... by cascadingstylesheet · · Score: 2

      But seriously, why would anyone want a VR "woods simulator" instead of taking them to the woods, for example?

      Fewer cases of Lyme's?

      (j/k; I agree with you)

  9. Just Because You See the Bathroom with the VR by n329619 · · Score: 3, Funny

    Doesn't mean you're actually there. Please pull your pants back up and stop looking like you're about to do it in my living room.

  10. WTF??!? ... It's called "Field Trip" for a reason. by Qbertino · · Score: 3, Insightful

    VR will replace the screen for space and mecha games. In short, it will replace where it makes the experience *more* real, not less.
    So, no, VR is not a replacement for field trips and never will be.

    Captain Obvious was glad to help.

    --
    We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
  11. Sure it can by Solandri · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Once VR can reproduce:
    • 200 degrees (roughly human vision field of view) at 2 lines per arc-minute, or 24,000x24,000 pixels
    • a contrast ratio of over 1 million to 1
    • color gamut of about 170% sRGB
    • a full 3D sound field, not just stereo
    • smell
    • tactile sensations
    • (if it involves eating local cuisine) taste

    then it can replace real field trips. In its current state, it's just a slightly better version of a 3D movie.

    1. Re:Sure it can by coofercat · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure you'd need all of that for VR to be useful, although I'd agree that we're still no where near enough to be "good enough" for anything like a replacement of the real thing.

      However, if it's a way to take a trip inside a human body, or walk about on Mars or whatever, then it's currently *better* than the real thing, in so much as you'll never do the real thing. One could also argue that (say) visiting Easter Island is "better" than going there because the environmental impact of going there is pretty big. It's of course no where near as good as going to the woods with a few pals (or your school class or whatever), making a fire and cooking marshmallows. I don't suppose it's really trying to replace doing that though, as doing that ought to be relatively easy.

      Either way, give it another 20 years, and I'd imagine VR 'trips' would be something that kids in schools do from time to time. By then the specs will be closer to your list, and the content available will be more plentiful. A VR trip has to be better than no trip, but it might also displace real trips in some cases.

  12. Wouldn't hold my breath by grumbel · · Score: 2

    In theory, sure, you could make detailed 3D scans of everything and do it all in VR. But for that to happen, somebody must first put in the effort to create those virtual 3D tours as well as get the permission to produce them to begin with. Neither of which are easy. Museums like to keep their things under lock, they want the visitors to come and spend money there, not make themselves obsolete by having some amazing digital reproduction. Producing those 3D scans, that are detailed enough to replace a real visit, would also need a lot of money and technology.

    People have been making those same claims about revolutionizing teaching with every new technology. They did it with the radio, the TV, they did it with the multimedia CD-ROMs, with the Internet and so on. It never had all that much impact. If you really want to figure out how stuff works, you still need to go to a library and get a book. It's not that new technology couldn't do it better, but simply the result of there not being a viable business model to produce that kind of content on a scale that could impact teaching at large. People protecting their already established business models doesn't help either.

    1. Re:Wouldn't hold my breath by Cinnamon+Beige · · Score: 1

      You probably would have the museums charging for access to the scans, especially for off-site access. Preservation costs money to do, and is an ongoing cost. You're also not going to get some types of museums doable by VR until it's Holodeck-level realism--indistinguishable from real life, all senses reproduced--because of the nature of the museum. What we've got currently for VR is a very fancy 3D movie.

  13. Depends by houghi · · Score: 1

    Does a Real-doll replace sex with a real person? (Considering this is Slashdot, perhaps not the best comparison)

    (On a non-related subject. Does sex with a real person actually feel like having sex with a real-doll? Asking for a friend.)

    --
    Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    1. Re:Depends by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      No, but it's more likely to happen...

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  14. Can VR Replace $thing? by mentil · · Score: 1

    Answer: never completely. Part of the reason people go places isn't just to use their senses to experience the environment, but also to experience tangentially-related things. For example, going to Mount Rushmore is more of a "to say you've done it and cross it off your bucket list" thing; if you saw it in VR, could you really say "I've been there"? You can't bring back souvenirs, and there'll be limits to the area's size and how you can interact with it (scooping up sand, taking a swim, etc.)

    Good luck simulating Las Vegas in VR. How're you going to license the wide variety of music/comedy/magic acts? And wouldn't VR magic shows be kinda against the entire point? VR casino gambling will be simulated soon if it isn't already... but that won't give you free drinks or a nice hotel room. I'm waiting for the first drunken VR wedding where one of the avatars is a different sex from their actual one... accidental gay marriage, that'll be a hoot if one party is conservative (or accidental straight, even funnier?).

    Many people go on cruises or to certain exotic islands in part for the hookups. That isn't close to being simulated yet... and when it can, some people will skip the 'VR cruise' part and go straight to the 'VR brothel', although I guess that'd raise the question of why those people don't just go to a real brothel in the first place.

    --
    Corruption is convincing someone that the selfless ideal is the same as their selfish ideal.
  15. You ARE on such a field trip right now! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    It's called the "Early 21st Century History" course, so you can see for yourself how our ancestors ruined the planet and started WW3.

  16. To put it simply. by Ash-Fox · · Score: 1

    Could VR Field Trips Replace the Real Thing?

    Yes.

    Would it be any good and offer real education value?

    Probably not.

    --
    Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
  17. Magic School Bus?! by SCVonSteroids · · Score: 1

    Anyone?!?!

    --
    I tend to rant.
  18. How? by argStyopa · · Score: 1

    How would VR trips be cheaper than a normal field trip, when a single VR headset is 2-3x the price (to a district) of renting a school bus?

    --
    -Styopa
  19. Why bring climate change into it? by sabbede · · Score: 1
    Besides that the guy is an ecologist and like most academics probably thinks their field is more important than everything else.

    It just seems sleazy considering that there is a political component to it. Like he wants to force kids to share his fears about a possible future.

  20. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 1

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  21. Heck yes by fluffernutter · · Score: 1

    I'm totally sure we'll keep sending students to places like Antarctica and Mars instead of using VR.

    --
    Laws are rules for the court, but merely a bottom bar to hit for life. Think beyond laws in your actions always.
  22. Ready Player One? by s_p_oneil · · Score: 1

    This brings us one step closer to the world of "Ready Player One". On the plus side, if we end up in that big of an energy crisis, we'll already have this technology available before it gets to the point where no one but the top 1% can afford to travel anywhere. Maybe we could look at figuring out the best way to stack trailers on top of each other next.

  23. At some point by OneHundredAndTen · · Score: 1

    Not yet. The VR technology will have to improve significantly before that is sellable.

  24. Rekall - For The Memory Of a Lifetime by modi123 · · Score: 1

    Why bother with choppy and mass produced VR when you can go to Rekall and get a memory of your vacation? Cheaper, safer, and better than the real thing!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

  25. Just keep everyone indoors all the time by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 1

    Yeah sure just keep everyone locked up in some room somewhere all the time. No so-called 'VR' experience is going to ever be as rich as the real thing. If you're going to have a mindset of 'why not have virtual field trips instead of REAL field trips?' then why ever go anywhere for any reason? Why not take your 'vacation' at your desk at work, and pretend to be on a beach in Fiji with a headset on and a glass of warm salt water to stick your hand in? More and more like Wall-E, where people never even get out of their chair their entire lives. No thanks.

  26. Great idea! by superdave80 · · Score: 1

    Yeah, let's separate kids even MORE from the real world. Because they don't get enough screen time as it is...

  27. VR homeentertaining by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

    I guess I thee the biggest future for VR in home entertaining systems.
    Imagine you have a sports arena projected around you, are via internet connected with your friends or family, who appear inside of your VR simulation and you in theirs.
    You could define where you sit in the stadium and have part of the real audience for atmosphere reasons be projected into your simulation, probabaly with changed faces ...

    --
    Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
  28. SING IT WITH ME!!! by Ann+O'Nymous-Coward · · Score: 1

    putting your feet into the water and letting the waves lap at them

    "Goldfish shoals, nibbling at my toes!
    Fun, fun, fun, in the sun, sun, sun..."

  29. Greaaaaat... by jenningsthecat · · Score: 1

    These virtual field trips are safer and easier to organize than real outings...

    Sure! By all means let's insulate kids even more from the natural world, the realities of travel, the navigation of strange places, the social and psychological challenges of membership in large unruly groups, and the opportunity for casual exercise. Let's extend our micromanagement of their lives even farther, make their learning more targeted, and further decrease their independence and autonomy by ensuring that they acquire only approved knowledge in the approved fashion.

    Fuck all that! Let kids get dirty and stressed and stretched in the REAL world so they'll have some confidence and imagination and self-direction in the absence of computers and 'superiors' telling them what to do and how to do it.

    --
    'The Economy' is a giant Ponzi scheme whose most pitiable suckers are the youngest among us and the yet-unborn.
  30. Promises and disappointments by VeryFluffyBunny · · Score: 1

    Yeah, they'll promise amazing, interactive VR, resolution and details and infinite possibilities. When it comes time to actually implement the tech and deliver on the promises, it'll turn out to be 'Murica's speciality; minimum viable product from the lowest bidder. Sorely disappointing.

    --
    Debate is a form of harassment. Do not question my truth.
  31. Lord Dorwin, Chancellor of the Galactic Empire by at10u8 · · Score: 1

    "Ah, yes, Anacweon. I have just come from theah. Most bahbawous planet."
    ... and the analysis afterwards by Salvor Hardin ...
    Hardin continued: "It isn't just you. It's the whole Galaxy. Pirenne heard Lord Dorwin's idea of scientific research. Lord Dorwin thought the way to be a good archaeologist was to read all the books on the subject – written by men who were dead for centuries. He thought that the way to solve archaeological puzzles was to weigh the opposing authorities. And Pirenne listened and made no objections. Don't you see that there's something wrong with that?"

    Asimov answered the headline question with "no".