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Russia Is Accusing the US of 'Direct Interference' In Its Elections (businessinsider.com)

schwit1 shares a report from Business Insider (alternative source): Russian Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova on Tuesday accused the U.S. of a "direct interference in our electoral process and internal affairs" following the State Department's criticism of Russia's decision to bar opposition leader Alexey Navalny from running in the upcoming presidential election against Vladimir Putin. "This State Department statement, which I'm sure will be repeated, is a direct interference in our electoral process and internal affairs," Zakharova wrote Tuesday on Facebook. In a statement shared with Business Insider on Tuesday night, a State Department spokesperson expressed concern over the Russian government's "ongoing crackdown against independent voices, from journalists to civil society activists and opposition politicians." "These actions indicate the Russian government has failed to protect space in Russia for the exercise of human rights and fundamental freedoms," the statement said. "More broadly, we urge the government of Russia to hold genuine elections that are transparent, fair, and free and that guarantee the free expression of the will of the people, consistent with its international human rights obligations." Zakharova pushed back. "And these people expressed outrage over alleged Russian 'interference' in their electoral process for an entire year?!" she said.

"Pointing out that the Kremlin is interfering in its own election is not interference," adds schwit1.


34 of 195 comments (clear)

  1. Pot, Kettle, Black by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    Russia's Precious Snowflake, Putin, can't handle the heat? Is that what I'm hearing?

    1. Re:Pot, Kettle, Black by dasgoober · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's not the heat. Putin wants to maintain the *illusion* that he won in fair elections.

    2. Re:Pot, Kettle, Black by Somebody+Is+Using+My · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Arguably, Russia's involvement in the US elections was aimed at this goal, at least in part. It has long been Russia's intent to smear the "great experiement" that is the United States of America's democracy; claims that the US is as corrupt and venal as anyone else have been part and parcel of their dialog for nearly a century.

      This is not only an attempt to weaken the US but also to make Russia's own politics look better in comparison. After all, if the United States - long champion of democracy - can't ensure honest elections, it is hardly fair to expect any other nation to do so either. Putin's own political maneuverings were suspect long before 2016. While Navalny, an anti-corruption activist isn't expected to win in the 2018 Russian elections, he has gathered a sizeable following who threaten Putin's absolute power. They will be very suspicious of Putin's victory, even were it completely on the up-and-up (which, it is widely believed, will not be).

      But by casting blame on the US, Putin can misdirect the blame; if the US can't secure their own elections from foreign influence, it's no surprise if poor impoverished Russia is even more vulnerable. Thus, if Putin wins /despite/ such influence, it only further legitimizes his victory.

    3. Re:Pot, Kettle, Black by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 2

      And Russians actually believe that?

      Independent polling gives Putin an approval rating of about 80%. So why wouldn't they believe it?

    4. Re: Pot, Kettle, Black by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Those approval ratings are apparently genuine.

      I know several Russians. They all generally approve of Putin, say he has made them "proud to be Russian", and given them back their self respect after the implosion of their empire and economy during the 1990s. And these are cosmopolitan Russians that regularly travel to the West. He is even more popular in the rural oblasts. Russians are proud of the way he stood up to America, and prevailed, over Crimea, the Donbas, and in Syria.

      So then why does he have to inhibit competition?

      Because he may not always be so popular. Also his popularity is not transferable. His deputies and cronies are nowhere near as popular as he is. If they allow a real contested election this time, they will be expected to do the same when Putin is no longer around.

    5. Re: Pot, Kettle, Black by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 2

      And what entity created the survey?

      The polls are conducted by independent journalists, many of them Western. Also, some polls include expat Russians living abroad, who have little fear of reprisals.

      Putin is genuinely popular with the Russian people. Why wouldn't he be? Americans don't like him because he has repeatedly outmaneuvered us and made the West look impotent. But Russians see all that as a good thing. Whey wouldn't they?

      Here are some hard facts that are never challenged by Russian citizens.

      The concept of "objective truth", disjoined from self-interest, has never really been part of Russian culture.

    6. Re:Pot, Kettle, Black by Arzaboa · · Score: 2

      You're spot on. Their chess game has moved more in the last couple of years than in decades. The fact that so many Americans even put them on the same level is a huge step. People now thinking they are comparing yabloki to yabloki, is a huge win for the Kremlin.

      --
      Apple's to Apple's, dust to dust.

    7. Re:Pot, Kettle, Black by gravewax · · Score: 2

      illusion? regardless of what we think of Putin he is actually incredibly popular over their and will likely win by a landslide even in a completely fair election.

    8. Re: Pot, Kettle, Black by david_thornley · · Score: 2

      I'm waiting for Mueller to finish investigating before talking about quantity of evidence.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
  2. Why do I suddenly feel gaslit? by sims+2 · · Score: 3, Funny

    Why do I suddenly feel gaslit?

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  3. Wait... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    There are russian elections? I thought it was all rigged in the first place.

    1. Re:Wait... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      You can vote for Putin, the dead guy, or the guy who isn't allowed to run.

    2. Re:Wait... by Freischutz · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You can vote for Putin, the dead guy, or the guy who isn't allowed to run.

      ...and the pustule riddled guy in the wheelchair who glows in the dark because he forgot to scan his food with a geiger counter.

    3. Re: Wait... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      WHAT!? We only get two choices here in America.

    4. Re: Wait... by RightwingNutjob · · Score: 5, Funny

      America is just like Russia. In America, you can stand in the middle of the National Mall, shouting 'Down with American Imperialsm!' and you won't be punished. Similarly, in Russia you can stand in the middle of Red Square shouding 'Down with American Imperialism!' and you won't be punished.

    5. Re: Wait... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The US and Russia are frighteningly similar. Both are authoritarian states which likes to pretend they are not, both have a population which is heavily indoctrinated "to love their country", do as you're told, ask no questions and never question the ruling class or political system.

      Not that I'd expect you to admit to it, or even recognize it though.

    6. Re: Wait... by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Informative

      America is not authoritarian. You may want to look up what the word means.

      "Authoritarianism is a form of government characterized by strong central power and limited political freedoms." Check. "Juan Linz's influential 1964 description of authoritarianism characterized authoritarian political systems by four qualities: Limited political pluralism," (Check.) "[...] A basis for legitimacy based on emotion, especially the identification of the regime as a necessary evil to combat "easily recognizable societal problems" (Check.) "Minimal social mobilization" (Check.) "Informally defined executive power with often vague and shifting powers." (Check.) ... you were saying?

      Russia is openly authoritarian, and does not pretend otherwise.

      That's not at question currently, but thanks for handwaving.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    7. Re: Wait... by RightwingNutjob · · Score: 2

      So Obama writing those orders despite congressional action or inaction to the contrary is Nothing To See Here Folks and Trump rescinding many of them is zOMG Executive Overreach...please.

    8. Re:Wait... by sabbede · · Score: 2
      Not rigged as such. One of the duties of the Russian President is vetting and approving candidates for President, so Putin simply exercises his legal authority and prevents anyone with a real chance from running. It's a huge, gaping flaw in the process that renders the elections totally illegitimate by democratic standards.

      The funny part is that the criticism from the State Department is nothing considering that in the past it went to much greater lengths to influence the outcome of Russia's elections. It's why Putin bears a grudge against Hillary.

  4. Hey, you put your chocolate in my peanut butter! by Kargan · · Score: 2

    You put peanut butter on my chocolate!

    --
    Palaces, barricades, threats, meet promises
  5. Ob by Hognoxious · · Score: 4, Funny

    In Soviet Russia, kettle mocks pot!

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  6. Huh? by msauve · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Pointing out that the Kremlin is interfering in its own election is not interference," adds schwit1.

    Of course it is. But, it's entirely aboveboard, unlike the secret (at the time) Russian interference.

    That's not to say the US isn't doing their own dirty tricks in secret, but that's not what the article is about.

    --
    "National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
  7. Re:Making a "statement" constitutes interference? by RightwingNutjob · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Kind of how asking certain questions can be racist, sexist, or xenophobic. Actually not 'kind of like,' but rather 'exactly like.' Allow me to illustrate with an example near and dear to the KGB:
    Alice: The CIA invented AIDS to kill black people!
    Bob: What evidence do you have of that?
    Alice: Racist!! Believe the victims!!1!!one

  8. Re:bad for you... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    As usual, things are only bad when other people do them to you. But are fine when you do them to them.

    Making public, fully attributed, on the record press statements isn't even remotely like what Russia has been doing to other countries. Its basically the opposite.

    The way I see it, the most interesting part of this story is Putin getting his panties in a twist over such a small thing. It reveals that, contrary to all of the shirtless photos of him performing as the most manly strong-man on the planet, he's actually deeply insecure about his position on top of the throne over there. And really, he ought to be.

    Putin served as a way for the corrupt-as-fuck Yeltsin to get off the throne without losing his head in the process, but who is going to do that for Putin? His corruption has grown 100x worse than Yeltsin. He's looted the country so much that he's now the richest man on the planet. Nobody is going to sign up to cover for him because there is no upside, you can't get much richer than Putin already is. But you can get deader.

  9. What election? by skam240 · · Score: 2

    What election? Putin has no legal political opponent that has any chance of winning.

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  10. Dear Russia by Patent+Lover · · Score: 4, Funny

    I have it on good authority that Vladimir Putin runs a pizza joint which is a front for child trafficking. Also, he was the cause for Benghazi. He wants to take your guns. He also has violated IT policy on several occasions. Please tell all your friends on Facebook or you face certain disaster.

  11. Re:Making a "statement" constitutes interference? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    According to the Democrats, truths told about your candidate is considered divisive and constitutes interference.

    So either both of these acts are interference, or neither of them are.

  12. Re:Ya Right by HornWumpus · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Russians know all that. They're not generally that stupid. Billions didn't magic their way into Putin's accounts.

    They don't care, at some level they appear to crave a Czar...Isn't he living in England?...Finland? (the actual Czar, by traditional succession) He should run.

    The only thing I know for sure: Everytime a foreigner attacks Putin, we make him stronger in Russia. Our meddling will be even less effective than Russia's was.

    The only thing that can save Russia is high oil prices.

    Saudi better be guarding Abqaiq. It sure would be a shame if something happened to it and Russia's problems get solved. What if the Saudis outsource security to Russians? Then again, how hard would it be to disguise a precision missile as some junk the Yeminis would be shooting?

    I don't get how it's still standing. Even surrounded by exclusion zones, defenses and covered by news blackout. Likely better defended than the White House. Has to be the world's most valuable and profitable target.

    --
    John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
  13. A joke by gman003 · · Score: 4, Funny

    We should hack their elections and make Hillary win.

    1. Re:A joke by CanadianMacFan · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Haven't the Russian people suffered enough?

  14. Re:bad for you... by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 5, Informative

    President Clinton interfered with Yeltsin's 1996 re-election, and of course President Obama directly funded the campaign to try to oust Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Yeah, we do interfere in other elections...

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  15. Re:Internal affairs by Mr+D+from+63 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Newsflash: Most countries try to influence other countries, and they do it in a lot more ways that social media and fake news. This has only become 'news' because certain people feel the need to believe this past US election was somehow different. Sad bunch of morons.

  16. Re: Making a "statement" constitutes interference? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    No, saying shit like "grab em by the pussy", and I'm rich they let me do what I want, makes you a sexist asshole.

    Stop skewing the truth.

  17. Re: bad for you... by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 2

    And they interfere with ours as was proven.

    [Citation needed]

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