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Facebook VP Says Company Won't Use Experts To Fix Fake News Because It is Worried About Criticism (theoutline.com)

Joshua Topolsky, writing for The Outline: According to Axios reporter Ina Fried, the vice president of global communications, marketing, and public policy (phew!) at Facebook shook off suggestions that the network should use outside media literacy watch dogs as opposed to outsourcing its "fake news" problem to a "statistically representative" group of its own users. While speaking at the tech conference DLD (Digital Life Design) in Munich, he revealed that the real motivation behind the company's decision was one based almost entirely on optics. This shouldn't come as much of a surprise, as the company has been totally ignorant and outrageously slow in accepting responsibility for what has been a disaster for its users. While Twitter is turning to media literacy groups such as Common Sense Media and the National Association for Media Literacy for solutions to its own troll and fake news epidemic, Facebook continues to cower behind a broken concept that the company is a neutral platform where all of its participants are equally weighted.

155 comments

  1. How about no news at all? by gatkinso · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I just want to look at my friends kids and pet pics. Is that so much to ask?

    --
    I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
    1. Re:How about no news at all? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      On these blood-sucking platforms? Yes

    2. Re:How about no news at all? by OtisSnerd · · Score: 3, Informative

      Take a look at the F. B. (Fluff Busting) Purity add-on, it hides a lot of that unwanted junk on Facebook. It works with Firefox, Chrome, Edge, Safari, Opera, and Maxthon browsers, on Windows, Mac, and Linux. http://www.fbpurity.com/ I've been using it for over a year, and it's updated regularly.

    3. Re:How about no news at all? by tsqr · · Score: 1

      I just want to look at my friends kids and pet pics. Is that so much to ask?

      Same here, though the "news" doesn't bother me as much as the weird quizzes that appear to be designed to make you feel smart but in reality should be easy for anyone with an IQ over 80. Just keep scrolling.

    4. Re:How about no news at all? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Reporting you to the FBI for being a fucking pedophile.

    5. Re:How about no news at all? by cayenne8 · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Yeah, and it isn't like the group "Common Sense Media" is a neutral organization at all either...that would likely be going from bad to worse if FB used them too.

      If you see the worlds "Common Sense" on about anything these days....it is definitely a push for something for the hard left in the US.

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    6. Re:How about no news at all? by Austerity+Empowers · · Score: 2

      Except a lot of the fake news is coming from your friends political links.

      I wish they could find a way to ban all of it. Just go back to pictures of food and kids and those desperate "You don't care enough to hit reply" posts.

      I can feel some of their pain, any attempt to deal with "fake news" is going to scream censorship and bias to someone. The term has no actual meaning anymore, when actual news is being labelled fake, and fake news is being bought into by masses of tin-foil hat conspiracists.

    7. Re:How about no news at all? by DaMattster · · Score: 1

      I just want to look at my friends kids and pet pics. Is that so much to ask?

      Mod the parent up! I originally joined facebook to keep in touch with friends. After the last election and all of the negativity, I deleted my account. I am now 85 days free.

    8. Re:How about no news at all? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      This is trolling on so many levels. Simple verbal abuse on the face of it. Look deeper and you see it is actually smart attempt to silence somebody completely by branding them in a socially repulsive way - that is a civil death for you and done for personal entertainment not for any real deed. On the other level it is just a show of how deep we as a society fell - the accusation of this type similarly to meetoo nonsense are once thrown stick forever idiocy used as weapons ending any discussion.

    9. Re:How about no news at all? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      admittedly politicians and main stream media did a lot to make fake news accusations stick and fake news in comparison look at least as trustworthy.

    10. Re:How about no news at all? by swb · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Except a lot of the fake news is coming from your friends political links.

      This is the real crux of the problem. People on Facebook have become militantly political, down all the usual dividing lines. People I've known for 10-20 years who never appeared to have any political opinions are now rabidly political on Facebook.

      My own sense is that this grew out of Facebook enabling the easy re-sharing of links and pictures. At first it was just mostly dumb memes, but as election season hit it quickly became a way of sharing and ultimately manufacturing and reinforcing partisan outrage.

      I don't think Facebook can fix this without some heavy AI analysis of submitted links and images that eliminates the ability to re-share political ones without hindering the ability to re-share non-political content. News links might be more amenable to machine analysis, but images would be touch. The only other option is just disabling re-sharing of any of them, which I think users would find an unacceptable functionality limitation.

      An individual can "solve" this themselves by unfriending people who post too much political stuff, but my own sense is that means gutting even moderate-sized friend lists, rendering the entire thing kind of pointless.

      I've kind of abandoned it completely myself. I'm missing out on some socialization, but mostly I think it's false socialization with people in ordinary circumstances I wouldn't keep in touch with. A loss perhaps for some old friends and family, but not enough to make it worth putting up with.

    11. Re:How about no news at all? by coastwalker · · Score: 1

      Two and a half years for me, though I must go back in and harvest any email addresses I missed sometime. I'll use whatsapp and email to talk to people, Facebook can go fcuk themselves.

      --
      Facts are history now plebs have politics for religion on social media.
    12. Re: How about no news at all? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why do Mormons need to control dissent?

    13. Re:How about no news at all? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      The fundamental building blocks of Facebook is populism. A news delivery platform driven by populism can never be fair, accurate, complete, objective, or any other measure that one might want to apply. Conversely, it is the ideal group think platform. Yes, alternative ideas can exist and be put forth, but they'll only thrive based on their own popularity.

      FB would serve us all better by eliminating attempts to control news and just educate users on just how poor a news platform it is.

    14. Re:How about no news at all? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wonder if you intentionally wrote your post to resemble product placement in social media. Kind of like a featured post in Facebook especially when others have decided to recommend it.

    15. Re: How about no news at all? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pretty sure it was a joke, aimed at the guy who said he only liked looking at pictures of kids and pets on Facebook.

    16. Re:How about no news at all? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ... abandoned it completely myself.

      You'd rather avoid everyone than label people as annoying.

      ... I wouldn't keep in touch with ...

      Then unfriending them won't be an issue.

      ... gutting even moderate-sized friend lists.

      You want to be judged on the size of your friends list: That's what twitter is for.

      ... re-share political ones ...

      This is the crux of the issue: Facebook doesn't want to divide content into political or social, with appropriate censorship. That inaction is costing them page-views though subscribers, because of Facebook's monopoly position, can't desert Facebook entirely.

    17. Re:How about no news at all? by srichard25 · · Score: 1

      Facebook *could* solve this issue just by giving people the tools to easily reduce how much of the share spam shows up on their wall. But they won't do that because their bean counters tell them that more shares = more data = more money.

    18. Re:How about no news at all? by swb · · Score: 1

      I think it's a chicken and egg problem. You could allow people to reduce the amount of shared links and images people see in their newsfeeds. However, the easy sharing of links and especially images has caused people to become accustomed to low-effort posting and sharing, especially of images *and* it's impossible to really know whether you only got 2 likes because nobody thought your image was worth much or because it got no visibility.

      The users have basically been trained to pump out low-effort content (basically anything unwritten) and merely masking their output doesn't change much but produce empty newsfeeds.

      They could get tricky and limit just re-shared images and links (shared more than once), but they probably would also need to somehow low-rank posts with just images and links and no self-typed comments.

  2. DACA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    DACA...is CACA.

  3. Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Why should Facebook take any responsibility for content that is posted by their users? Why should they suddenly become a media curator, instead of a social network? Why is TFA written as though it was completely obvious and indisputable truth?

    Don't get me wrong, I hate Facebook as much as the next guy, but I hate the tone of this article even more and the righteous anger radiating from it is just revolting. It's like the author is begging for even more corporate censorship and is extremely pissed off that it's not being dished out in a timely manner.

    1. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Fake news, Russian interference.

    2. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by InPursuitOfTruth · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Prove it. I saw an alleged post by such yesterday. It was just a guy wearing a t-shirt making a joke. This isn't "fake news" cuz it is a joke, not news. When did making jokes become "election interference". When did FREE SPEECH become a threat?

    3. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      your utopia sounds nice, but here in the real world there is much more going on. theres a reason its illegal for foriegn governments to influence US elections.

    4. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      > Why should they suddenly become a media curator, instead of a social network?

      They've always been, ever since the newsfeed left the simple "newest first" algorithm. What gets buried, and why? That's an editorial decision, regardless if it's made by a person in real time or a programmer through implementing some algorithm or neural network or whatever.

    5. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Now you know how the rest of the world feels.

    6. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If FB were in China, they definitely would not allow the US to write obviously fake news articles. However, here in the US, stuff from Tweeterino is shared around as real news.

      An example of this is the purported tweet from Sheila Jackson about Trump wanting a war with "North Japan". This was shared far and wide as fact, and when people countered it with Snopes, Snopes is blown off as a "liberal" site, (although there isn't a comparable fact-check site anywhere else.)

      FB having free reign to allow slander/libel to happen doesn't happen in other countries, while they do allow foreign government meddling in US elections, which is a Federal crime, and in decades past, would have had the entire corporation shut down. Similar with the charge of giving aid and comfort to the enemy.

    7. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by bondsbw · · Score: 2

      It's not so much that free speech is a threat. It's that the truth tends to be more boring than sensationalism.

      --
      All my liberal friends think I'm a conservative, all my conservative friends think I'm a liberal.
    8. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by tsqr · · Score: 5, Informative

      your utopia sounds nice, but here in the real world there is much more going on. theres a reason its illegal for foriegn governments to influence US elections.

      Except for a few well-defined cases, it's not illegal for foreign governments to attempt to influence US elections. For example, In a decision that was later affirmed by the Supreme Court, the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia ruled that the foreign national ban “does not restrain foreign nationals from speaking out about issues or spending money to advocate their views about issues. It restrains them only from a certain form of expressive activity closely tied to the voting process—providing money for a candidate or political party or spending money in order to expressly advocate for or against the election of a candidate.” Bluman v. FEC, 2012.

      Note the word "expressly". If an ad paid for by a foreign entity speaks against the policy or behavior of a candidate (whether true or false), but does not explicitly say "Do not vote for " or "Vote for " , it's legal.

      Educate yourself..

    9. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why should Facebook take any responsibility for content that is posted by their users?

      Because certain people are convinced their opinions are irrefutable facts. They know what is good for you and they will educate you and make you see the light no matter what. Any dissent is obviously hate speech and propaganda. They are the good guys, after all.

    10. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      When you consider the Chinese government as a positive example on how to handle censorship, you might want to take a step back.

      Snopes is being blown off because they are full of themselves. They start with the conclusion and then twist their findings until they fit.

    11. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by lgw · · Score: 1

      And this has been the case for longer than America has existed, yet democracy seems to do OK. You think the anonymous handbills the Founding Fathers were printing to foment revolution were fair and balanced? Man, they'd make 4chan blush.

      Biased propaganda to influence elections is precisely what the First Amendment is there to protect - good thing too, as some "news" networks are 100% anti-Trump propaganda 24/7.

      I know it's fashionable with pseudo-intellectuals (e.g., TFA) to believe that the average person is incapable of making any important decision, and thus media should only exist to guide them to the decision make by their betters, but that's aristocracy, not democracy.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    12. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why should Facebook take any responsibility for content that is posted by their users? Why should they suddenly become a media curator, instead of a social network?

      Who give a shit who's ultimately moderating "news" in the world of social media. As long as the problem stays contained within Facebook, let the pigs continue to waller in their own shit-infested mudhole of stupidity and narcissism. The ignorance within is really no better than the days of AOL.

    13. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 2

      If FB were in China, they definitely would not allow the US to write obviously fake news articles.

      If they were in China, the Chinese Government would not allow ANYONE to write articles critical of the Government - fake OR true. If your article is pro-Government - fake or true - it would be published. Being fake or true would have nothing to do with it, it would come down to "is it critical of the Government".

      --
      Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
    14. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I know it's fashionable with pseudo-intellectuals (e.g., TFA) to believe that the average person is incapable of making any important decision, and thus media should only exist to guide them to the decision make by their betters, but that's aristocracy, not democracy.

      Having long been a Jeffersonian instead of a Hamiltonian, I am nonetheless bothered by the observation that far too many people buy religion from a scifi writer who wrote "the way to get rich is start a religion" and politics from a promoter who wrote "the art of the deal is to "tell people what thy want to hear." The Dunning-Kruger effect is far too widespread for comfort.

    15. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Prove it. I saw an alleged post by such yesterday. It was just a guy wearing a t-shirt making a joke. This isn't "fake news" cuz it is a joke, not news. When did making jokes become "election interference". When did FREE SPEECH become a threat?

      That free speech is dangerous and can threaten is not even a question. There’s always a side that has something to gain or lose by allowing or quashing it. It’s used and abused to start rebellions and revolutions.

      If you support free speech you need to accept and manage the risk, not deny it. Denying the risk is about the most irresponsible thing you can do with free speech.

    16. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Um. because Russia, a hostile foreign country, was using social media to influence American Democracy.

      We used to be kinda' proud of the peaceful transition of power for 240 years thing.

    17. Re:Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist' by painandgreed · · Score: 1

      If FB were in China, they definitely would not allow the US to write obviously fake news articles.

      If they were in China, the Chinese Government would not allow ANYONE to write articles critical of the Government - fake OR true. If your article is pro-Government - fake or true - it would be published. Being fake or true would have nothing to do with it, it would come down to "is it critical of the Government".

      It's been a while since I've had a good Chinese friend to explain things as they are in China, but it has less to do with "critical to the Government" as "critical to the social order". Certainly, the government is part of that social order, but they are also interested in so much more. Sex, violence, deviant acts, all would also be moderated. The Government has an idea of how China should be and act and anything/body who noticeably doesn't fit in that idea is a nail to get hammered down (or at best be allowed to go to Hong Kong).

  4. I hate to break it to Facebook, but... by Kierthos · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ... they're going to be criticized no matter what they do about this.

    I mean, if they hire an outside group to handle this, the user-base will complain that either the wrong group was picked, or that group was not conservative enough, not liberal enough, not whatever enough... you pick. Hell, they'd probably get accused of everything under the sun.

    However, the same thing will happen if they pick internal users to be their test-bed for this. "Oh, you picked the wrong users. They're too conservative, too liberal, whatever." It doesn't matter, there's bad optics no matter what.

    Doesn't mean that they shouldn't try. Just be prepared for the butt-hurt no matter what you do.

    --
    Mr. Hu is not a ninja.
    1. Re:I hate to break it to Facebook, but... by Provocateur · · Score: 1

      Not to worry, a least Russian FB users won't say anything about it at all; for some reason they're too busy looking at what their friends are up to now (Who's dating Ivan now -- Ivana know, tovarisch!)

      --
      WARNING: Smartphones have side effects--most of them undocumented.
    2. Re:I hate to break it to Facebook, but... by mwvdlee · · Score: 2

      Option A: Spend millions of dollars on curators and get criticized for it.
      Option B: Do nothing and get criticized for it.

      Oh, and option A has the added risk of accidentally blocking some not-entirely-fake news and getting sued because of it.

      --
      Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
    3. Re:I hate to break it to Facebook, but... by ctilsie242 · · Score: 1

      I wonder about option "C": Allow the user to pick their own review board. For example, have people from the Daily Kos, Breitbart, der Spiegel, CNN, MSNBC, Comedy Central, and other news organizations offer a review/weighting service for articles, with the ability for a user to pick and choose among them. This way, they are not stuck with what one groups deems as valid.

      This way, FB can't be accused of being partisan, since people can choose who (if any) reviews news articles and sets validity scores for them.

    4. Re:I hate to break it to Facebook, but... by mwvdlee · · Score: 1

      Having news company X review messages posted by news company Y. What could possibly go wrong?

      --
      Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
    5. Re:I hate to break it to Facebook, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wish "Ivan" would just fuck off back to VKontakte, and just leave us the hell alone. Authoritarian shitholes like Russia and China have no business being around us.

    6. Re:I hate to break it to Facebook, but... by Cederic · · Score: 1

      Well, Steam implemented their curator system and it's led to a wide and varied choice of game recommendations.

      Why not offer something similar for news curation? Yes, there'll be a large number of highly partisan curators. But the market will choose whether to stay with those, or to use the people with a more balanced perspective.

      If people only want news that matches their views then that's going to happen anyway. What Twitter have done is mandate that, and restricted it to a specific viewpoint.

  5. Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Right decision, wrong reasoning.

    1. Re:Good by Narcocide · · Score: 1

      All that needs to happen is users' and advertisements' countries of origin need to be properly unmasked, and all sock-puppet accounts connecting through VPNs or proxies need to be banned. Basically just a cursory effort towards enforcement of their existing TOS, actually.

  6. You sick fuck. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    You like looking at kids? SICK!!!

  7. Anti trust by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    At some point thes will get to a level of anti trust litigation if they continue down the road of censoring one political point of view and pushing another. They are trying to mitigate that.

  8. daca is be used to cut off sick kids from schip by Joe_Dragon · · Score: 0

    daca is be used to cut off sick kids from schip

  9. If It Is On The Internet, It Must Be True by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What idiot gets the news from Facebook. Besides aren't their users capable of critical thinking?
    I get all my fake news from Network TV.

  10. Fix what? by InPursuitOfTruth · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The concept that there is a "problem" is premised on several notions: - Only those in the US should have free speech on the Internet. - US readers are unable to think for themselves and scrutinize. They need a protective overlord. What would be more acceptable is tagging content that has certain attributes, then letting readers do what they wish with such tagged content. In fact, instead of debating what algorithms or filters FB, Twitter or any other potential big brother should have, how about letting readers customize their own algorithms and be empowered to control what they see in their feeds? Why isn't this concept being proposed?

    1. Re:Fix what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why isn't this concept being proposed?

      Because it all costs money and cuts into profits.
      Putting users in control of what they see goes against the very idea of forcing advertising down their throats.

    2. Re: Fix what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Because how can you trick black people to vote Democrat if they have access to proof that voting Democrat perpetuates their misery and economic enslavement?

    3. Re:Fix what? by edtice1559 · · Score: 1

      The reason that this is a problem is that it's easier to spread appealing lies than boring truth. As Facebook sells ads, they have a financial incentive to keep people engaged. But they recognize that if the platform becomes over-whelmed by falsehoods (aka "alternative facts") that people will stop engaging at all. Facebook works due to network effect so if an exodus were to start it may happen quickly. They want to clean up their platform and it has little to do with free speech.

    4. Re:Fix what? by geekmux · · Score: 2

      The concept that there is a "problem" is premised on several notions: - Only those in the US should have free speech on the Internet. - US readers are unable to think for themselves and scrutinize. They need a protective overlord. What would be more acceptable is tagging content that has certain attributes, then letting readers do what they wish with such tagged content. In fact, instead of debating what algorithms or filters FB, Twitter or any other potential big brother should have, how about letting readers customize their own algorithms and be empowered to control what they see in their feeds? Why isn't this concept being proposed?

      One can already filter and control what is seen in their own feeds. And when the signal-to-noise ratio gets too high, often the best way to control the feed is to fucking unplug from it. Many people have left Farcebook for this very reason, and have been better off without it.

      As far as tagging content goes, that's a dead idea from the start. Clicks and likes are all that matter these days, which is exactly why we continue to have a bullshit peddling problem. And as long as clicks and likes generate massive revenue, they will continue to be a priority. That means truth and facts will come second, which will never solve any problem of fake news.

    5. Re:Fix what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then how would Facebook show advertising?

  11. Facebook can't win by MobyDisk · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Facebook can't win here. If they spread fake news people blame them directly. And if they use a panel of experts than the experts are controlling the news people see. That's not good either. The article attacks them for the decision, saying it is marketing, but I think Facebook is right here. It isn't their job to be the news police.

    This simply isn't Facebook's problem. The users are to blame, and this isn't a new problem. Just like Slashdot or Reddit or any other internet forum, the content is provided by the users and it is not the responsibility of Facebook to tell people that they are idiots. Studies show that people click like on things, and then repost them, without even reading the articles. And most people don't seem to be able to distinguish political fact from reality even if they do read the articles.

    This problem happened before the internet. In the US, go to a grocery store and look at what news is available for purchase. It is 40% tabloids (AKA "fake news"), 40% celebrity gossup, 40% real news. Facebook is no different.

    This is why come to Slashdot: there are educated people here, and debunkers here. I go straight to the discussion first because half the stories are garbage.

    1. Re:Facebook can't win by tsqr · · Score: 2

      the content is provided by the users and it is not the responsibility of Facebook to tell people that they are idiots.

      I agree with respect to user-submitted content. But, when Facebook accepts payment for advertisements, Facebook is responsible for that content.

    2. Re:Facebook can't win by pots · · Score: 2

      And if they use a panel of experts than the experts are controlling the news people see. That's not good either.

      ... Why? What if, instead of calling them "experts," we called them "journalists"? Is that still bad? Even though that's how it is anyway, and how it has always been?

      You could make the standard argument about bias, but that's why we get our news from multiple sources (multiple journalists) instead of just one. Let's try a medical analogy: your rely on your doctor for medical advice, because you doctor spends all of his time on that crap and knows a lot more about it than you do. If you disagree with your doctor or don't like what he says, then you get a second opinion from another knowledgeable doctor who, let me repeat, follows developments in his field closely and knows more about it than you do.

      If you still don't like what any doctors are saying, and you're dumb, you might talk to some conspiracy theorist down the street who will sell you a bunch of leaves and tell you that they're definitely better than what "those pharma-shills" will give you, because these leaves are "totally natural man," and not full of that "mercury (or whatever) that you know causes autism."

      So. Is it a bad thing that the kook down the street isn't given equal status? Is it a problem that panels of doctors at the FDA and elsewhere control, to some degree, the advice that you get? If so, would we be better off if they weren't there? Supposing that there were no controls on who could call themselves a doctor and what advice they could give - we could expect a real caccophony of medical advice and products, all being pushed by interested parties. The volume of information would certainly be larger, but would we be better informed for that?

    3. Re:Facebook can't win by sundarvenkata · · Score: 1, Insightful

      "Educated people"? - Have you seen the Trumptards running amok in Slashdot lately?

    4. Re:Facebook can't win by edtice1559 · · Score: 1

      I'm glad that we have 120% news here. Good to know we are leading in that statistic. But this isn't a case of news for sale. With the Facebook news feed it's more like somebody shouting in your face. If the local grocery store let lunatics stand outside and harass customers with conspiracy theories, the business would lose customers. When people see fake news, they don't feel like engaging with Facebook. I don't know how big of a problem this is. I don't see much fake news but then I follow some very specific publications and probably have hidden "stories" enough times over the years that I'll see the debunking not the fantasy. But certainly you wont' have people engaging if all you can present is fake news. At least not if you present it consistently. (Maybe you could increase engagement within certain demographics)

    5. Re:Facebook can't win by Goetterdaemmerung · · Score: 1

      And if they use a panel of experts than the experts are controlling the news people see. That's not good either.

      ... Why? What if, instead of calling them "experts," we called them "journalists"? Is that still bad? Even though that's how it is anyway, and how it has always been?

      You could make the standard argument about bias, but that's why we get our news from multiple sources (multiple journalists) instead of just one. Let's try a medical analogy: your rely on your doctor for medical advice, because you doctor spends all of his time on that crap and knows a lot more about it than you do. If you disagree with your doctor or don't like what he says, then you get a second opinion from another knowledgeable doctor who, let me repeat, follows developments in his field closely and knows more about it than you do.

      To complete the analogy: Where do you go to get your second opinion when only doctors who have the same opinion are allowed to talk about it on the forum you use? Perhaps you can go to another forum where only doctors with a different opinion are allowed?

      The only end I see with this approach is building up the walls to your personal echo chamber.

    6. Re:Facebook can't win by pots · · Score: 2

      The thing about a second opinion is, it's not necessarily different from the first. The point of seeking a second opinion is not to keep talking to doctor after doctor until one says something you like. If every doctor has the same opinion, it's likely because that opinion is what is true.

      And I did provide an example of someone you can go to in order to get a differing opinion if that's really what you're after: the kook down the street.

    7. Re:Facebook can't win by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do you know what they call alternative medicine that works? Medicine.

    8. Re:Facebook can't win by MobyDisk · · Score: 1

      . But, when Facebook accepts payment for advertisements, Facebook is responsible for that content.

      Was the discussion about advertising content? I thought it was about fake news articles submitted by users. I suppose both are a problem. So then Facebook has to filter out news articles posted by ads. That still sounds like a slippery slope, although it does limit the scope. Maybe they just shouldn't allow political ads at all.

    9. Re:Facebook can't win by MobyDisk · · Score: 1

      We aren't talking about people going to a news site. We are talking about people going to a news aggregator site. Nothing stops us from going to a different site for our news. That's an important distinction. The site gets its news from the users. So it naturally reflects what the users are sharing. That's all it should do.

      We need to stop relying on social media companies and algorithms to apply human moral judgement to data. If my Mom shares a fake news article about how the president is secretly a martian invader who wants to eat children, then the system shouldn't judge it. It's up to the people around her to not click like and to not share it. It isn't up to the system to apply judgement.

      It's the old adage "garbage in, garbage out."

    10. Re:Facebook can't win by MobyDisk · · Score: 2

      No. Because they get modded down. And they get modded down by the users of the site, not by the admins. That's the key.

    11. Re:Facebook can't win by Goetterdaemmerung · · Score: 1

      The thing about a second opinion is, it's not necessarily different from the first. The point of seeking a second opinion is not to keep talking to doctor after doctor until one says something you like. If every doctor has the same opinion, it's likely because that opinion is what is true.

      And I did provide an example of someone you can go to in order to get a differing opinion if that's really what you're after: the kook down the street.

      What I think you are proposing prevents someone from finding the "kook down the street" because the forum is controlled by a governing body - in this case some consensus of "expert" doctors. What will happen is new ideas and medical procedures will be suppressed alongside the "kooks". Who controls the governing body? European doctors perform different techniques and drugs than US doctors which is different than Chinese doctors. What about procedures or drugs that are illegal in some places but widely used in other places? If you use set theory to only allow what is universally "correct" much information is excluded.

    12. Re:Facebook can't win by MobyDisk · · Score: 1

      When people see fake news, they don't feel like engaging with Facebook.

      The problem here is that fake news makes people engage with Facebook *more*! They don't seem to know the difference! And now that someone told them they have been fooled, they want to blame the messenger instead of their own dang selves. I really hope this is a wake-up call to educators.

    13. Re:Facebook can't win by pots · · Score: 1

      If you use set theory to only allow what is universally "correct" much information is excluded.

      This is certainly true, and is what I meant when I said, "we could expect a real caccophony of medical advice and products, all being pushed by interested parties. The volume of information would certainly be larger, but would we be better informed for that?"

      All of your questions are valid, but you seem to be phrasing them as though they were hypothetical. All of the things you say are true right now: we do indeed suppress new medical ideas and procedures, with the reasoning that the rejected procedures don't deliver on what they're supposed to be doing or that they are too harmful in other ways. ... Oh wait, I see what you're saying. No, I wasn't suggesting that only doctors have to universally agree in order for an opinion to be valid (different from true). I was just responding to the parent who was kind of sort of implying that agreement between experts in a field was a bad thing, indicative of group-think. It's generally more likely that when a lot of experts agree on something then it's because that thing is correct.

    14. Re:Facebook can't win by edtice1559 · · Score: 1

      Short-term this is true. And for some demographics it will be true forever. But it will also scare others away. FB recognizes that the additional engagement they are getting from some users is not worth the cost of having others leave the platform. Hence they want to resolve this. I don't think anybody realizes that they've been fooled. The mainstream media has a (mostly) liberal bias. The fake news media has a (strongly) grey-haired white republican bias. FB needs to appeal across demographics so that have to manage this tightly.

    15. Re:Facebook can't win by tsqr · · Score: 1

      . But, when Facebook accepts payment for advertisements, Facebook is responsible for that content.

      Was the discussion about advertising content? I thought it was about fake news articles submitted by users. I suppose both are a problem. So then Facebook has to filter out news articles posted by ads. That still sounds like a slippery slope, although it does limit the scope. Maybe they just shouldn't allow political ads at all.

      Didn't this whole controversy start with ads purportedly paid for by Russian actors?

    16. Re:Facebook can't win by MobyDisk · · Score: 1

      I think the Russian Facebook ads are what got the public aware. But the problem runs older and deeper than that. "Fake news" isn't just about Russian propaganda. It includes American propaganda. I've had acquaintances and family members passing around articles about Bill Gates' secret eugenics mission, various causes of autism, cures for cancer, proof Obama was born in Kenya, etc.

      Oooh! I just found this article on the history of fake news.

      Some time ago Slashdot linked to a study showing that users "like"d articles and shared them with others without ever even reading them. That's how the fake news goes viral. I am just glad that people are finally figuring it out.

  12. That won't matter by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When their users vote FoxNews and Breitbart as fake news, as they will, there will be an uproar among the deplorables and cries of 'censorship' among the hicks.

  13. branded as a traitor by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Take a look at the F. B. (Fluff Busting) Purity add-on, it hides a lot of that unwanted junk on Facebook. It works with Firefox, Chrome, Edge, Safari, Opera, and Maxthon browsers, on Windows, Mac, and Linux. http://www.fbpurity.com/ I've been using it for over a year, and it's updated regularly.

    soon this behavior will be punished with death, and they will start with you

  14. Good by Pyramid · · Score: 2

    No service should be filtering what you see based on unseen algorithms or so called, "experts". Give the individual a robust tool-set to make their own decisions.

    To those of you saying a system should be implemented, who exactly would you cede what you should see to? Who knows better than you?

    --
    ~Any apparent grammatical or typographic errors are caused by defects in your display device.
  15. broken concept that the company is a neutral platf by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yeah, this article isn't biased at all. So what, just because they don't use your Common Sense media or whatever, they are broken?
    Who validates that common sense is not Russian propaganda, or US propaganda?
    Not all facebook users are american after all.

  16. Great by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    The 'fact checking' is entirely political.

    The worst fake news are establishment media companies.

  17. Good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Censorship is bad and I don't trust Facebook to scrub my feed. I will evaluate the news (or fake news) that I read to determine what is true or not. Much of it is based on if I trust the website in question.
    Since when is Facebook supposed to play an editorial role? Next they'll say your ISP should filter out fake news.
    See how the "fake news" hype has harmed independent media: https://www.alternet.org/media/editorial-googles-threat-democracy-hits-alternet-hard

  18. Dear media please die already. by Charcharodon · · Score: 3, Insightful

    They are smart not to outsource their issue. Those so called "experts" out there all end up just peddling a different form of fake news. Facebook is already in enough hot water, bringing those dumbasses in would have just made things worse. In the end they are still destined for Myspace glory because they cant leave well enough alone.

    Just give me a way to block annoying sources of content, whether they be a person (the crazy Aunt) or a bunch of asshats trolling clickbait. I don't need you telling me what to think,

    1. Re:Dear media please die already. by Narcocide · · Score: 1

      I don't need you telling me what to think,

      Yes, you do. Clearly you also need me to remind you to finish your sentences.

    2. Re:Dear media please die already. by Charcharodon · · Score: 1

      Ms Delarco (my 8th grade English Teacher) stop stalking me. I passed your class you can't tell me what to do anymore.

  19. Also by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They are both immature and delusional about their own software (AKA 'AI'). Surely it can suffice. These days I'm convinced, regarding Facebook and their mentality, that they are half ignorant arrogance, the other half is simply being a dumbass. Fuckerberg got lucky in the right place and time, nothing more or less. He has no real, meaningful acumen to speak of, the man-child is a plebe. Just like AOL before them, they will go down in history as one of the most dramatic business failures in history, just wait.

  20. There's only one thing to fix about "fake news" by fustakrakich · · Score: 2

    The readers.

    --
    “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
    1. Re:There's only one thing to fix about "fake news" by BlueStrat · · Score: 1

      "There's only one thing to fix about "fake news""

      The readers.

      Well, actually educating the populace, especially in 'critical thinking' skills so they may do an effective job of parsing "news" for themselves, is right out, as neither side wants that!

      That kind of reckless action could bring about the end of FB and Twitter, et al, as well as put the vast majority of elected officials out of office and destroy both major US political parties. Oh, the humanity!

      Strat

      --
      Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
    2. Re:There's only one thing to fix about "fake news" by fustakrakich · · Score: 1

      Yes, the fundamentals are well apparent, but great effort is spent to evade them because then it becomes personal.

      --
      “He’s not deformed, he’s just drunk!”
  21. Really? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Are they really falling for the fake news meme?

    Or, are they going ahead with defining fake news as "extremist" news?

  22. Our engineers by Pablopelos · · Score: 1

    "Our engineers are aware of the problem and we have our top men on it." Maybe they should just turn it of and on again....

  23. Re:Msmash's boner is used to cut off sick kids by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Great, now we are going to be spammed with Russian stories about how great TRUMP is because this is a signal to Vladimir Putin that facebook has given up being the Speech Marshall of the Internet. If only Zuckerberg had gone in and had a chat with his teams and told them to actually *police* against fake news, we wouldn't have had the lead TRUMP had and wouldn't have had the KGB hacking into Americans and making them vote for that guy. Pretty sure that with a big campaign, we could get him impeached and get Hillary to finish up the last couple of years.

  24. Fake News about Fake News by Uberbah · · Score: 2

    The worst psyop since Saddam planning 911 and having WMD's is the propaganda about Russian propaganda.

    1. Re:Fake News about Fake News by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Except Russia's continual war on free countries everywhere is a fact you can't argue with -- and they've never stopped.

      Russians hate democracy and the rule of law like the Devil hates holy water

  25. Fake News Awards by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Trump rolled out the fake news awards last week. I read a WaPo "fact checking" them waiting to see the spin. They verified ALL the awards were for truly fake news, each story was a 1 time in a decade debacle for a news organization, and Trump listed 11 in 1 year.

    The WaPo then attempted to spin it as, "Fake news is OK if you print a retraction later", but many of Trump's awards went to stories that were never retracted, yet obviously fake. I think many were retracted only because of outrage and would not have been retracted if Trump wasn't Tweeting how fake they were.

    So I'm going to disagree with you. Fake news is news put out by a news outlet that they KNOW is false at the time, in order to do harm to someone. Its kind of hard to argue against any of Trump's Fake News Awards, not even the WaPo could do it (and they even got one themselves).

  26. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    And you, obviously, are the final arbiter of Truth and Fiction. Because you say so.

    You reject out of hand any criticism of your team, no matter how accurate or demonstrably true, yet will believe entirely the latest Russia Collusion story that comes with no named sources, no documents, and often no logic.

    Under your watchful gaze, not a single Russian collusion story has been deemed "false" or even questionable, despite being entirely unsupported by an iota of evidence.

    No thanks. You can keep your "truth" and I'll keep mine.

  27. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist by fizzer06 · · Score: 2

    tbannist may actually believe that everything he wrote is actually true. In the good old days, you know, when America was Great, people like him used to get jackets with long sleeves and rooms with padded walls.

  28. This is why we don't trust your "experts" by DeplorableCodeMonkey · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This doesn't violate Facebook standards. Or for those who won't read TFL:

    Group Threatening to Burn 'Activist Mommy' Alive Doesn't Violate Standards, Facebook Says

    Amazing how the examples in the linked article don't constitute a violation of standards on harassment and threatening violence. Must be like the Sarah Palin principle. You can say "someone should shit down Sarah Palin's throat" on national television and not be roundly condemned, but say anything about women on the other side, no matter how tepid the statement, and it's going to be a 2 minute hate session.

    1. Re:This is why we don't trust your "experts" by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      The left's visceral hatred of poor whites overflowed like a broken sewer when John McCain chose Sarah Palin as his vice presidential running mate in 2008. It would be impossible, and disturbing, to attempt to identify the single most offensive comment that leftists lobbed at Palin. One can report that attacks on Palin were so egregious that leftists themselves publicly begged that they cease; after all, they gave the left a bad name. The Reclusive Leftist blogged in 2009 that it was a "major shock" to discover "the extent to which so many self-described liberals actually despise working people." The Reclusive Leftist focuses on Vanity Fair journalist Henry Rollins. Rollins recommends that leftists "hate-fuck conservative women" and denounces Palin as a "small town hickoid" who can be bought off with a coupon to a meal at a chain restaurant.

      --
      Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
    2. Re:This is why we don't trust your "experts" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      Nothing says "journalistic integrity" like a website that exists solely to provide soft little pink boys a platform to whine that people aren't being nice enough to white supremacists.

    3. Re:This is why we don't trust your "experts" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      ah, little Troller Boy is still upset in defense of, again, the perennial martyr of the Right, the Great Sarah Palin, the least contributory of all of the losing VP-candidates throughout history, the one who all you have to say about is over the mean liberals and leftists who say such harsh words.

      How Sad that that's ALL you can offer about her. Or her drones.

      It's ok, we know you have nothing. No leadership. No integrity. It's trolling all the way down for Dumb-Ass-Troll.

    4. Re:This is why we don't trust your "experts" by Cederic · · Score: 1

      Without knowing anything about pjmedia, your comment does reek of racism.

      Based on the comment to which you replied, highlighting that advocating painful murder isn't against Facebook policies is relevant to this discussion and fuck all to do with white supremacy.

    5. Re:This is why we don't trust your "experts" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Without knowing anything about pjmedia

      That isn't impressive. Ignorance is no defense.

    6. Re:This is why we don't trust your "experts" by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 1

      She exposed the classist, hateful bigotry among people who claim to be morally upstanding but when it came time to stick to their principles, instead chose to speak truth to the powerless.

      --
      Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
  29. Re:Msmash's boner is used to cut off sick kids by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 1

    Trump might be impeached, but replaced by Hilary? No, that's not how this works. If Trump is removed from office, we get Pence--he's veep and next in the line of succession. If they get Pence as well (and I haven't heard of any proceedings against him) then it'd be Speaker of the House--that'd be Paul Ryan. And Orrin Hatch after that. Hillary, holding no office in the line of succession, isn't anywhere in there. In fact, the list I found goes 18 deep and there's not a single Democrat on it.

  30. Follow the money... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Translation: Facebook doesn't want to fix their broken system as it would reduced advertising revenues. Something that "Chaos Monkeys: Obscene Fortune and Random Failure in Silicon Valley" makes clear when Facebook set up their advertising system.

  31. Too Big To Jail by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If it had been a low level staffer running their own private email server and conducting State Department business, they would be in jail. But since it is the Secretary of State and the Democratic Candidate for President, Hillary got a free pass.

    Go on, tell me the one about past Secretary of States using private email (for non-State Department business), so I can have a good laugh at your expense.

    1. Re:Too Big To Jail by Narcocide · · Score: 1

      Actually despite this practice being forbidden it's completely common. That is why she got away with it; they'd all have had to turn in their own servers too.

  32. Compulsive LIAR by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Trump lies so frequently that any word out of his wretched mouth should be viewed as fake news.

  33. ...and they still claim theyre not a media company by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They keep wriggling around the fact that they are a media company.

  34. Re:Msmash's boner is used to cut off sick kids by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    that doesn't matter. The Liberals don't use logic, or thoughts, it is all emotional. They figure they can impeach all the republicans and establish single party rule politburo. Anything else is unacceptable.

  35. Their Pool, Their Rules by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They want a pool everyone can have fun in without shit floating in it.

    I understand it but I also wish them luck. There are a lot of people who love to shit...

  36. They shouldn't even try by gettin2old · · Score: 1

    There is no reason people can't read all sorts of things and make a determination on what to believe. They do it all the time. UFOs, Aliens, bigfoot,and yes even politics. Facebook stay out of it. Be a platform, period.

  37. That's already in. by DrYak · · Score: 2

    I wonder about option "C": Allow the user to pick their own review board. For example, have people from the Daily Kos, Breitbart, der Spiegel, CNN, MSNBC, Comedy Central, and other news organizations offer a review/weighting service for articles, with the ability for a user to pick and choose among them. This way, they are not stuck with what one groups deems as valid.
    This way, FB can't be accused of being partisan, since people can choose who (if any) reviews news articles and sets validity scores for them.

    This is also how accidentally FB works now already.

    The only difference is instead of paying professional for their view, it pools the data that it has for free : the opinion and behaviour of your friends.

    It also has the same big draw-back : it creates a biased bubble. Except that currently the bubble isn't based on partisan media, but on what you talk with your friends and what popular in your circle. And currently the bubble costs nothing.

    What you're proposing will just cost FB more money (gotta pay the reviewers) while not filtering that much bullshit out (to be broad you'll have to hire reviewer from all range of political inclination - and thus invariably you'll end up with lots of not so bright influencable people who have elected to rely most on media that has the same extremist bias).

    In short: your racist uncle will just pick some alt-right media as they favorite reviewer, your whinny step daughter will pick her favorite feminazi SJW media.
    And they'll both end up re-posting/forwarding the same shit as before.

    --
    "Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
  38. They're responsible for their interns by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why should Facebook take any responsibility for content that is posted by their users?

    I can't think of a reason, but (and it's a big but)...

    Why should they suddenly become a media curator, instead of a social network?

    Facebook cannot exist without companies, especially the media that they compete with, telling people to use Facebook. Follow our Facebook page. Load our web page that has a like button, and please click that like button. Use our login system.

    Our company directly competes with Facebook: every time a local business buys an ad from them, that's an ad they didn't buy from us. And yet we also spend money to try to get more of our users to use Facebook. And part of that, is that we pay a person to post on Facebook. That is a paid, professional voice. It's a person, and also not. It's a Facebook user, and also not. It's strictly commercial activity. And without all of us (not just our company but others like it) Facebook would be very quiet and your feed would have less in it.

    As a user, that is something you would probably like, I'm sure. But maybe that's because you would like to be on Facebook less. But Facebook wants you on more, and so they need their competitors misguidedly making content for that platform at their own expense. If your company is on Facebook, you should be thinking of yourself as their unpaid intern. And through a certain type of twisted logic, that sort of makes Facebook responsible for what its unpaid interns are doing.

  39. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist by Archangel+Michael · · Score: 4, Informative

    Its actually worse than that. There is plenty of evidence of Russian Collusion to rig the election, and it is all Hillary, DNC and the Deep State.

    Hillary/DNC paid for the Russian Dossier
    Russian Dossier was filled with Russian Propaganda from FSB
    Hillary's Husband (Bill) was paid millions of dollars from FSB sources for "speeches"
    Hillary signed off on Uranium One, in spite of an ongoing investigation into Russian trying to corner the Uranium market.
    Obama Justice Dept and FBI agents were actively colluding to overturn the election
    Obama and Justice Dept used the Fake Russian FSB Dossier to get a FISA court warrant to spy tap Americans, namely the opposition party.

    This is just what we KNOW. I realize that the GP post doesn't account for any of this, because he's probably watching CNN or MSNBC which is talking about how much diet coke and McDonalds Trump consumes, or something equally inane. Or perhaps its on the ScarJo speech at the Liberal Women's march about how awful men are, especially James Franco, while ignoring that she praised Woody Allen or her cuddling up and beaming at Roman Polanski getting a Hollywood Award of some kind.

    The selective nature of their outrage is humorous. Their disdain for average people (who knew these people were gross pigs long before Hollywoudn't) extends from Hollywood to the beltway.

    --
    Agent K: A *person* is smart. People are dumb, stupid, panicky animals, and you know it.
  40. Re:Msmash's boner is used to cut off sick kids by schwit1 · · Score: 1

    Impeachment(bringing of charges) does not remove the President. Just ask Bill Clinton. The Senate would have do a trial after impeachment, and good luck getting 2/3s there for conviction.

    What would be the "high crimes and misdemeanors" to start the impeachment process?

  41. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    You might have half of it (*). But can you explain that other disaster, that Trump won? There were plenty of other candidates running, and by the election, Trump was already a known liar, and projected great weakness, incompetence, and a generally anti-American attitude. After he took office, all of these impressions got confirmed. He turned out to be as much of a shithead as he seemed. And that has jack shit to do with lefists losing their minds; people from left to center or right all agree on this president's worthlessness. It's not controversial, and you can ask nearly anyone, even on the right. (I'm not saying this is the problem, but it's the symptom.)

    But the fact of the matter is, people did still vote for him, and those people were only able to do so by ignoring reality. And lying (e.g. screaming "fake news" whenever someone quotes Trump) is how you do that.

    Free speech became a problem when people stopped valuing truth. When the word "evidence" became a bad word, speech lost everything about it that people value. It's worthless if it's only going to be purely religious.

    We need to protect religious speech, but we shouldn't elevate it over speech about the real world. When we do that, speech is no longer particularly worth protecting. You can have religious speech anywhere, and even if it isn't free, it'll be good enough for people who use faith instead of perception. America, though, needs more. The utility value of free speech is why everything we like about America happened.

    (*) Except you don't. Whatever traitorous things Hillary did, weren't why she lost. Take those away and I think we still would have voted against her. I would have. Are you seriously saying you would have voted for her if you hadn't known about whatever the fuck you're talking about (was it the emails?)?

  42. they already started messing with the flow... by maybe111 · · Score: 1

    what is this talking about? but I agree with others, no news on facebook would probably be better.

  43. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I wish any time my boss reprimanded me I could say "well I'm obviously better than the one you didn't hire, therefore I'm free of any and all criticism."

  44. Re:Msmash's boner is used to cut off sick kids by Chris+Mattern · · Score: 1

    So then it would go to Ryan.

  45. Drip, drip, drip, ... by rnturn · · Score: 1

    The bucket of reasons for bailing out of Facebook continues to fill. At some point, people are going to decide that they can get their cat video fix somewhere else; somewhere that doesn't unload propaganda and "fake news" on them on every visit (the FB Purity plug-in can't eliminate it all, after all). This goes for other sites that chose to follow Facebook's model, too. (Talkin' about you LinkedIn).

    --
    CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
  46. Re:broken concept that the company is a neutral pl by Narcocide · · Score: 1

    Stupid and wrong question. The right question is why are foreign nationals being allowed to lie about their identity to begin with? It's against the TOS but they seem to be making a lot of fuss to avoid letting people notice that they're not even bothering to enforce the one clause that could have prevented all of this.

  47. The problem with censors. by fish_in_the_c · · Score: 2

    Is they will always favor themselves and censor those things that criticize them.
    The problem with having no censor is people will have to decide for themselves what is true or false and will sometimes get it wrong.

    The argument that 'The normal individual can't be trusted, or expected, to know what I true and false' Is the greatest argument against any kind of democratic rule that can be made. It is actually however the reason why our constitution created a republic with strong states rights. In as much as we have moved away from that model we have made it much easier for small groups of people to control the population.

    --
    âoeTolerance applies only to persons, but never to truth. Intolerance applies only to truth, but never to persons.
  48. Haha! So FREE! So BRAVE! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    15 years from Beacon on the Hill to Fascist Cocklovers Butthurtia.

    Putin is laughing his ass off at you.

  49. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you were doing the job your employers hired you for, why are you being reprimanded? For that post you made on slashdot 10 years ago? Or because their guy didn't make the cut?

  50. Looks like FB is just like the Republican party by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Don't police your own as long as they go further to the chaotic & right as planned

  51. Two blatantly partisan groups by Attila+Dimedici · · Score: 1

    OK, because Twitter is turning to blatantly partisan groups. The founder of Common Sense Media is Jim Steyer, the brother of Tom Steyer...Tom Steyer is to the Democratic Party what people think the Koch brothers are to the Republican Party. The National Association of Media Literacy is composed of administrators from various universities and environmentalist groups (which leads me to believe that they are people who believe that Republican=Nazi).

    --
    The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
  52. The problem isn't fake news by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's first past the post voting.

  53. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist by tbannist · · Score: 2

    And you, obviously, are the final arbiter of Truth and Fiction.

    Aren't we all our own final arbiters of Truth and Fiction?

    You reject out of hand any criticism of your team, no matter how accurate or demonstrably true,

    I don't have a team in your politics, but I recognize bull shit when someone writes it. Claiming that Hillary Clinton "got away with actual literal treason" is bullshit and you ought to know it too. It's not because I think Hillary Clinton is innocent as pure driven snow, for example, if you want to claim she committed gross negligence in handling classified documents, and should get jail time, I'll disagree with your position (and I'll back up my disagreement with facts), but I won't question your grip on reality.

    yet will believe entirely the latest Russia Collusion story that comes with no named sources, no documents, and often no logic.

    Not really, I think it's pretty unlikely that Mueller will find any damning evidence that Trump actually colluded with the Russians to win the election. I find it amusingly ironic that a book that the Trump White House has declared as Fake News, Fire and Fury, actually does a pretty good job of explaining one potential reason why collusion at the top level of Trump's presidential campaign is unlikely to be found: Trump never planned to win. If that claim is true (I find it more amusing than convincing, given the source), then Trump couldn't have collaborated with the Russians to win the election because he never wanted to win until after he did. If Trump planned to lose the election, and managed to screw it up by winning, then he has a pretty good defence against that accusation, but frankly, Trump probably can't admit that until after the 2020 election because if he says it, then his followers might realize they'd been manipulated and duped by a con man, and then they might not vote for him in 2020...

    Anyway, I'm not sure what you think I should be believing or not believing here. Mueller is definitely investigating and indictments have been laid against people, and people have plead guilty. That's more than an iota of evidence for something, according to my perspective. Or am I supposed to believe that there is no Mueller, no Mueller investigation, and the whole thing has been made up by the media?

    No thanks. You can keep your "truth" and I'll keep mine.

    No, you won't. You're going to share your truth every time you post, just like I am. You don't have to like or believe what I write, but you can't stop me from making fun of the crazies who write ridiculous posts. Don't worry, though, I also make fun of the crazy liberals, when I see them, it's just there really aren't that many on Slashdot any more and when I do see them, the Warriors for Trump have already beaten me to the punch...

    --
    Fanatically anti-fanatical
  54. facts appear biased by cnewman · · Score: 1

    Fact-checking experts will appear partisan in today's political climate where one party lies much more than the other party does. Unfortunately, a popularity contest simply won't be able to distinguish what is factual and what is a false propaganda. Partisans (on both sides) will consider truthful anything that reinforces their distorted world-views or tribalism. Human brains are not good at distinguishing truth from falsehood without extensive training and practice; just think about why social engineering, magic shows, and scams are so effective.

    It would be a great service to Facebook users if fact-checking expertise was available for widely forwarded political links, but I'd prefer it's visual only (not impacting the algorithm) unless the user opts-in to a higher-fact-check feed.

  55. Eliminate news from FB or do better... by LeftCoastThinker · · Score: 1

    Either eliminate news from FB altogether, or hire people from both sides of the aisle and set guidelines for what actually is fake news (i.e. demonstrably false in a plain language reading based on facts already proven).

    The problem that Facebook, Twitter and Google have is they all exist in an alt left echo chamber and can't figure out why 60% of the country gets pissed at them when they use "fake news" as an excuse to censor legitimate conservative news sources and stories. Not agreeing with a story does not make it fake news...

    --
    If you disagree, please post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like
    1. Re:Eliminate news from FB or do better... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "...Twitter and Google have is they all exist in an alt left echo chamber..."

      Agreed, that is a big part of the problem.

  56. Russiaphobic complaints hit US right in the face by Uberbah · · Score: 1

    Except Russia's continual war on free countries everywhere is a fact you can't argue with -- and they've never stopped.

    The CIA has overthrown dozens of governments since WWII. Can you name the last one overthrown by Russia without going back to the USSR? You can skip Crimea unless you want me to explain how much of an idiot you are, as the population wouldn't have voted to join Russia if your literal neo-Nazi pals hadn't taken over Ukraine in a US-backed coup. Furthermore....

    Which country has illegally attacked a dozen countries this century?

    Which country had a worldwide kidnapping and torture program?

    Which country spies on the electronic communications of every person on the planet, including allied heads of state?

    Which country has a policy of bombing weddings and funerals, then follows up those strikes with "double taps" to murder any rescuers?

    Which country has a gulag on the island of Cuba RIGHT NOW?

  57. It's not up to FB by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's not up to FB to police the veracity of posts. I think it is ridiculous to expect them to.

  58. but, that's so passe' by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The Clintons took in piles of cash from the communist army of China in the '90s and they both skated by unmarred, as did Al Gore who acted as a bag man in some of the transactions which themselves were tied tot he transfer of ballistic missile guidance and reliability tech to China (google: loral, hughes, china, clinton, jonny chung)

    1. Re:but, that's so passe' by AutodidactLabrat · · Score: 1

      The Clintons took in piles of cash from the communist army of China in the '90s and they both skated by unmarred,

      Says no one with any factual knowledge.

  59. you lefties have no sense of introspection by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Sarah Palin was getting very favorable ratings (about 70%) as governor of Alaska from all voters, including Democrats... until she became John McCain's running mate against Barack Obama and instantly all the Democrats hated her. McCain at that time was the most popular Republican among Democrats and was routinely fawned over on Democrat-oriented TV channels like NBC.... until he challenged their chosen candidate, Mr Obama.

    Are you truly asserting that Palin is a bigger self-proclaimed victim than Hillary? REALLY? How many book tours have Palin been on to peddle books about how some grand conspiracy occurred to cheat her out of power? How many women did Palin trash in order to hush-up her husband's womanizing, while pretending to be a champion for women and opposed to womanizing men and being outraged that anybody would DARE question her about it?

    Do you ever even bother to read what you write and think about it? Do you have ANY self-awareness and conscience?

    As soon as Palin was on the anti-Obama ticket, it became ok to say ANYTHING about her. She was stupid, evil, rapeable, David Letterman was joking about raping her then-underage daugher on network television... the most hateful, vile, evil, bile excrement flew out of the pie holes of every leftwing "tolerant and loving, unjudgemental" liberal. There is simply NOTHING a leftist cannot say or do against her for the crime of opposing Obama. A leftwing hacker hacker her e-mails and exposed them to the world and liberal news outlets like the New York Times were encouraging their readers to help dig through the archives to "crowd source" the search for dirt.

    More recently, Trump called Rosie O'Donnel a pig, and the cries from the left were that by calling one woman a pig, he had called ALL women pigs. By that reasoning, every evil slur flung at Palin by you people on the left is something you have slung at ALL women (I find that idea absurd, but it's the rules your side seems to champion).

    There are either rules, which apply to all equally, or there are none. You do not get to have a one-way mirror of rules for civility where you and your "tolerant and non-judgemental and inclusive" pals can fling all the hate you want but your opponents cannot say anything you do not like.

  60. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If you were doing the job your employers hired you for, why are you being reprimanded?

    because I'm not doing what I said I'd do during the interviews
    ...Or because I don't work well with my coworkers
    ...Or because I have a total disregard for the employee handbook

  61. Re: Totally unbiased opinion by TFA's 'journalist by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You actually "know" none of this, there's a few nuggets of truth, but most of what you just posted it typical Glenn Beck/Alex Jones/WND/Breitbart trash.

    You did hit all the alt-right-wing talking points, though, so good for you.

  62. Biased much? by RightwingNutjob · · Score: 1

    Facebook continues to cower behind a broken concept that the company is a neutral platform where all of its participants are equally weighted.

    Are the phone companies accountable for what conversations you hold over their networks? Is the US Postal Service responsible for the content of letters? Come off it guys. You don't get to play thought police in politics and you don't get to play thought police in business. In fact, you don't get to play thought police at all. If you don't like the way people are voting, convince them otherwise or suck it up and deal with it. Don't wrap yourself in flag and scripture and purple robes to tell us what we should and should not be saying to each other.

  63. Re:Msmash's boner is used to cut off sick kids by GlennC · · Score: 1

    They figure they can impeach all the republicans and establish single party rule politburo. Anything else is unacceptable.

    And this is different from the "Republicans" desire for single-party rule how?

    --
    Go on, citizen, stamp the vote card. R or D, your choice.
  64. Russiaphilic complaints hit YOU right in the face by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Well, most of those are true of the Soviet Union, though your intent is obviously to blame the USA. As for the last one, who invented the concept and practice of the gulag to begin with?

    I mean, you do realize the whole prison-camp-for-political-exiles you are talking about is NAMED for the camps the Soviets had on the Gulag Archipeligo, right? There's even a book about it, won a Nobel Peace Proze, maybe you've heard of it ...

  65. The REAL Truth by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Facebook didn't want to block CNN, Washington Post, and the New York Times.

  66. history vs current events by Uberbah · · Score: 1

    Yes, the Soviet Union - which collapsed over 25 years ago. Whereas everything I just mentioned is current events - Guantanamo Bay continues to hold people without trial RIGHT NOW.

    Dumbass.

  67. Same old problem by ebvwfbw · · Score: 1

    Used to be we'd say that any fool with a printing press can print stuff. That was because a lot of people if they saw it in print they thought it was true. Some news people published crap. They came up with a word for that Yellow Journalism - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... . Today CNN fits that bill to a T with their supposed un-named sources when in fact there was no source. It was just speculative bullshit. A good example right now is the collusion delusion. There is no source, there is no proof, yet here we have an expensive investigation over bullshit. Washington Post has been found to have made up stories with no basis in fact at all. Sometimes they'll say something like it was a composite, made from multiple people. Yea, for a sensational story - yellow journalism.

    People need to know to believe only about 10% of what they read in the main stream media. Other sources are usually a lot more reliable.

  68. Re:Msmash's boner is used to cut off sick kids by AutodidactLabrat · · Score: 1

    Agreed absent an extraordinary writ by the Supreme Court predicated upon a Constitutional crisis, to the effect that the election was invalid. Even then, it would be a redo.

  69. It has everything to do with the issue by DeplorableCodeMonkey · · Score: 1

    The reason everything you claim to hate is on the rise is because of people like you who support the dehumanization of your opponents. How do I know you support it? Because you went into an emotional hissy fit the moment I broke with the Narrative by showing that no one trusts the people you like because they say "expressing abstract racism is BEYOND THE PALE" but curiously can't find a rule violation in threatening to burn someone alive.

    Funny thing is, I don't even like Sarah Palin. I really don't, but I recognize a fundamental principle: advocating grabbing random women you disagree with and forcing them to submit to having a massive dump fed down their throat like a duck undergoing foie gras is the epitome of "speech that is unacceptable no matter what."

    1. Re:It has everything to do with the issue by Cederic · · Score: 1

      I fear you may have replied to the wrong person.