Slashdot Mirror


Police In China Are Scanning Travelers With Facial Recognition Glasses (engadget.com)

Baron_Yam shares a report from Engadget: Police in China are now sporting glasses equipped with facial recognition devices and they're using them to scan train riders and plane passengers for individuals who may be trying to avoid law enforcement or are using fake IDs. So far, police have caught seven people connected to major criminal cases and 26 who were using false IDs while traveling, according to People's Daily. The Wall Street Journal reports that Beijing-based LLVision Technology Co. developed the devices. The company produces wearable video cameras as well and while it sells those to anyone, it's vetting buyers for its facial recognition devices. And, for now, it isn't selling them to consumers. LLVision says that in tests, the system was able to pick out individuals from a database of 10,000 people and it could do so in 100 milliseconds. However, CEO Wu Fei told the Wall Street Journal that in the real world, accuracy would probably drop due to "environmental noise." Additionally, aside from being portable, another difference between these devices and typical facial recognition systems is that the database used for comparing images is contained in a hand-held device rather than the cloud."

48 of 87 comments (clear)

  1. Glassholes! by freax · · Score: 3, Funny

    Police in China are now the new Glassholes.

    1. Re:Glassholes! by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 3, Insightful

      As someone who has serious issues remembering and recognizing faces (an iPhone 3 with a broken camera would outperform me), I would like a device like this. Something that remembers faces of people I meet and pops up their name when it sees them again.

      Personally I don't have an issue per se with police (or surveillance cameras) being equiped with face recognition software, or with roadside cameras equipped with ANR. The issue I have with these is their use cases, and the way the extracted data is used. And those uses always get expanded once the tech is in place. Police can be flagged automatically about criminals under an arrest warrant? Great. But the same tech can be used to grab people with outstanding parking tickets, or people critical of the government, or even completely innocent people who happen to be near a crime scene. ANR can be used to flag stolen vehicles... great. But it can also be used to track every citizen across the highway network, and you can be sure politicans will come up with good reasons for doing so.

      We (some countries) already have decent privacy guidelines, and decent checks and audits in place on the way such sensitive data is used. But what we don't have is a check on use cases. We're not going to stop invasive technology like this, but we can push for much stricter rules on how it can be applied. Potential benefits should always be weighed against the right to privacy and potential harm to innocents, and those potential benefits should be tested; if they aren't realised, the use case should be invalidated. And negligence or misuse should be treated as a criminal case.

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    2. Re:Glassholes! by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      As someone who has trouble remembering names I'd also like something like this.

      The Chinese state is much more open about watching people, and markets it as being for their benefit and protection. For example, as you drive through junctions in China you often see a flash of light, which is the LED flash bulb illuminating your face so that the camera can photograph it. In the UK we have the same system but they use ambient lighting and paint the cameras grey so you don't notice them, and certainly don't advertise the fact that they are doing it.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    3. Re:Glassholes! by rmdingler · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As someone else who has trouble remembering names, I would rather continue struggling through the several seconds of social disjointedness before having every personal interaction recorded, and probably then uploaded and stored.

      I find it disturbing that of innovations imagined in the last few decades of science fiction, many of the technologies presently developing the fastest are those that benefit the surveillance state.

      --
      Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.

      Ernest Hemingway

    4. Re:Glassholes! by burtosis · · Score: 1

      And in 10 years we will be probably be debating if the camera in our smart underwear really is that invasive. Between new sensor technology and computers in general getting better, smaller, and cheaper all the time, and inexpensive ubiquitous data connections I think we are past the point of no return.

    5. Re:Glassholes! by MobyDisk · · Score: 1

      ...before having every personal interaction recorded...

      It doesn't need to record anything. It's such a shame that so many companies use cameras and microphones to record things that they shouldn't. Now we are afraid of what should be perfectly reasonable technology.

    6. Re:Glassholes! by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Who said anything about recording and uploading? I just want local facial recognition of people in my personal, encrypted database.

      You know, like how my brain has locally stored memories that allow me to recognize people, only with more reliable retrieval of the associated name.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    7. Re:Glassholes! by Bryansix · · Score: 1

      What you don't realize is that the NSA is about a decade ahead of what the general public can get its hands on regarding surveillance. If you are worried now, you are late to the party.

    8. Re:Glassholes! by rmdingler · · Score: 1

      What you don't realize is that the NSA is about a decade ahead of what the general public can get its hands on regarding surveillance. If you are worried now, you are late to the party.

      Let's say, "If you are worried now" is broken up into two inclusive subsets:

      Are you worried now for the first time ever?, and

      Are you worried now once again? would comprise, right at with rounding, 100% of participants. That's as inclusive as Drew Barrymore attending her "friend's" wedding at a Grunge concert.

      Sure, it's always some people's first go-round with surveillance-a-phobia.. hey, are you calling me, Some People?

      --
      Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.

      Ernest Hemingway

    9. Re:Glassholes! by rmdingler · · Score: 1

      Take heart. If your smart underwear prediction is spot-on, we'll have posters who make tinfoil underwear a thing.

      --
      Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.

      Ernest Hemingway

    10. Re:Glassholes! by rmdingler · · Score: 1

      If you're worried now isn't an all-inclusive subset of people who just began worrying today.

      --
      Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.

      Ernest Hemingway

    11. Re:Glassholes! by chihowa · · Score: 1

      Almost nothing is done locally anymore, even though so much of what is shipped off to "the cloud" was able to be handled by the processors available twenty years ago.

      If some company sells a product that does anything at all for you, they'll design it such that they can slurp up as much personal information as possible.

      --
      If you want a vision of the future, imagine a youtube comments section scrolling - forever.
  2. Oh well by dohzer · · Score: 1

    Google and Facebook are already doing it with my own phone!

    1. Re:Oh well by dryeo · · Score: 1

      And they're possibly sharing the facial recognition data with the Chinese government... AIn't that wonderful.

      I worry more about the American government. China has no extradition treaty and doesn't give a shit about the other side of the world whereas America has shown itself not to give a shit about foreigners rights, including extra-judiciary murders and leveraging extradition treaties.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
  3. China leads the way by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Once again the fearful USA is left behind by the boldness of China in adopting and utilizing advanced technology. Under globalism, those who do not keep up are destined to be left behind in the dust. There is also a significant first-mover advantage as whoever adopts these technologies first realizes a distinct advantage over the timid ones who wait too long. The American response has been one of avoidance and evasion. Why? Because Americans seem to fear that if they stare at reality squarely, they will find reality staring back in a most discomforting way.

    A lot of smart people are starting to argue in favor of the China Model. It avoids the pitfalls of American dumbocracy, of which the hazards are only too clear after the results 2016 election. Political meritocracy has a lot of upside, in fact a better word for it might be "vertical democratic meritocracy". Democracy works well at the lower levels of government. But, in a huge country, as you go up the political chain of command, the issues become more complex and mistakes become more costly. Thereâ(TM)s a need to institutionalize a system to select and promote leaders with superior qualities. China has it, and America is trying with all its might to pretend globalism doesn't exist and it can still get by with its antiquated system. Democracy on the bottom, experimentation in the middle, and meritocracy on top is a good way of thinking about how to govern a large country.

    --
    Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
    1. Re:China leads the way by TheDarkMaster · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Meritocracy don't work if the criterion for selecting who has the most merit is their bank balance or in which family he was born. Many people think they have merit when in fact they only got there because they have rich parents and rich friends.

      --
      Religion: The greatest weapon of mass destruction of all time
    2. Re:China leads the way by gtall · · Score: 1

      Political meritocracy is where a change of rulers causes the old clan running the show to become immediately unmeritorious and scheduled for re-education, the latter conveniently maxes out their remaining years among the quick as they are destined to be unmeritorious during this time.

    3. Re:China leads the way by AHuxley · · Score: 3, Informative

      What "of which the hazards are only too clear after the results 2016 election"?
      The US voted and the election was won. Every state had its vote counted.
      Give a good speech, have a good candidate and win the states needed.
      Re "China has" Communism that gave the world the Cultural Revolution https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
      Re "promote leaders with superior qualities."? China was filling its university system with students who did not pass entrance exams. It's not "superior qualities" when the only question is about been loyal to the Communist party.
      So now China has to use facial recognition glasses to track people who would spread freedom and democracy.

      --
      Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
    4. Re:China leads the way by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 1

      Fortunately, that's not what the Chinese use. Officials rise on good performances. Compare this to the US system where officials either rise on advertising spending (elected government) or having went to an Ivy League school (unelected government).

      --
      Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
    5. Re: China leads the way by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      You obviously have no idea how the Chinese work:

      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_in_China
      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elections_in_China

      You rise by who you know and who can buy off, nothing more.

    6. Re:China leads the way by larryjoe · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Furthermore, the fatal flaw in the Chinese system is the inability to peacefully change leaders, governments, and laws. The current US president's tenure and his party's hold of much of governmental power will eventually end regardless of how much that president and party attempt to hold onto power. The US system allows the election of "undesirable" leaders but also provides a way to get rid of those undesirables. In the Chinese system, the undesirables never leave. The Chinese Communist Party has an unbreakable grip on the country. It remains to be seen if the current Chinese president will yield power at the traditional end of his terms or if he will adopt the Putin model of government.

    7. Re:China leads the way by AHuxley · · Score: 1

      AC "Can you imagine the software identifying the wrong person as a dangerous criminal?"
      That would make a powerful fictional action movie script.
      A bad corporation was having local law enforcement problems in one state.
      Some network alternations at a city and state level.
      Photograph every city and state investigator.
      Feed that altered data back into a federal facial recognition system as local sovereign citizens.

      --
      Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
  4. Interesting times.... by meerling · · Score: 1

    Face recognition just isn't good enough yet for that kind of risk.
    They have way too high of a false positive rate, but odds are the higher ups will pull a coverup to hid that and claim great success instead.
    As to a portable version with much less processing power, it's just begging to be less accurate.
    Of course there will also be false negatives that will let wanted criminals get away, unless they're caught by the normal methods, but I'm more worried about the innocents that will be jailed.

    1. Re:Interesting times.... by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

      Face recognition just isn't good enough yet for that kind of risk.
      They have way too high of a false positive rate, but odds are the higher ups will pull a coverup to hid that and claim great success instead.
      As to a portable version with much less processing power, it's just begging to be less accurate.
      Of course there will also be false negatives that will let wanted criminals get away, unless they're caught by the normal methods, but I'm more worried about the innocents that will be jailed.

      As long as positives are treated as "possible" suspects and not "definite criminals" false-positives aren't a problem. Just check their ID and see if they are the right match or not. I can leap to assumptions about how police in various countries might act, but I can't say with any accuracy.

      I'm not opposed to police using facial recognition glass to find suspects in a crowd; I am opposed to them (or videos) being used as a log of who went where- if non-criminals are tracked and logged with their movements recorded... that gets into the "too creepy and authoritarian" path. As long as the glasses are just used to identify "possible-suspects" where a computer algorithm legitimately makes a match, I'm ok.

      Don't log the negative faces- and everyone is innocent until proven guilty... that's the golden rule here.

      --
      "That's the way to do it" - Punch
    2. Re:Interesting times.... by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · · Score: 1

      China seems willing to sacrifice innocent people for "societal improvement" or whatever euphemism they're using..

      --
      Your ad here. Ask me how!
  5. Go to the source. by Gravis+Zero · · Score: 4, Informative

    Engadget just reposted what Gizmodo wrote which reposted what WSJ and Sixth Tone wrote.

    These are the real sources:
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/c...
    http://www.sixthtone.com/news/...

    --
    Anons need not reply. Questions end with a question mark.
    1. Re:Go to the source. by Baron_Yam · · Score: 2

      I started with the WSJ article but submitted the Engadget link because the WSJ is paywalled.

    2. Re:Go to the source. by swell · · Score: 1

      I don't suppose that /. gets a kickback from various favored links(?) Over and over, regardless of the story, they find a link to NYT, Engadget, etc. Almost never is the link to a source.

      --
      ...omphaloskepsis often...
  6. We are on the way to becoming a Betazoid-like race by guacamole · · Score: 1

    The technology will inevitably make it so that people have no privacy or secrets whatsoever. The technology will soon allow every member of the society to know the location and activities or every other member. Everyone will know others' secrets, and then there will be no secrets between the humans, except those in their thoughts.

    The next logical step is that we either adopt telepathic theology or evolve to become a race of telepaths, that like in the Star Trek.

  7. I already feel safer by houghi · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Luckily they are not in the cloud, because that would be unsafe. It is much better to give each individual the database, because what could go wrong?

    Or does 'In the cloud' now means 'On a server'? (Was this an example of a rhetorical question).

    Not looking at the privacy issues here, just at the technical side of it. Having it on a dedicated server should be a lot safer. The time might go a bit up, but not to seconds. That way when one gets into the wrong hands, it will not be able to abuse it. For a criminal knowing if he will be recognized or not with his fake beard is very interesting information.

    Combine it with fingerprint recognition and it should be a lot safer again. Say a device gets stolen and they cut of the police persons finger. That device can still be useless as the device can be blocked from elsewhere. You just block the secure access from that device.

    Because what they are doing now is selling the database and you get a free device with it.

    If I where a criminal (disclaimer: IANAC) I would not like that they use it, but the way they did it would give me a lot of options.

    --
    Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    1. Re:I already feel safer by Baron_Yam · · Score: 2

      Some notes for you:

      1) Bandwidth is an issue. Live video streaming from every cop wearing these simply is not practical.

      2) Power is an issue. Sure, it takes some cycles to do the processing, but in a portable unit you don't need to constantly transmit a high bandwidth stream.

      3) Encrypted devices that don't allow direct reading of the database and will lock every 12 hours are possible. And they have a very limited hardware interface, so you'd need someone to steal the device and crack it to get more than a cop's shift out of it.

      4) The stored information would be (more or less) public record. People wanted by the police or people with convictions and release conditions being watched by the police - stuff you'll see published by your local news media or in FOI-accessible court records.

      In short, so long as they can't scan and track every face and keep logs over long periods of time for data mining, this device isn't really a big problem. However, it ought to be looked at closely (at least in those nations where we care about privacy) so that it doesn't become a monster as the technology improves.

  8. Re:The Moon is a Harsh Mistress by DivineKnight · · Score: 1

    Some people want to explore the Universe, other want to rule the Earth.

  9. Re:We are on the way to becoming a Betazoid-like r by DNS-and-BIND · · Score: 1

    Are you kidding! Our elites will never allow this system to survive them. They're getting their asses kicked right now from leaked emails and documents, and you'll be damn sure this kind of crap doesn't happen again.

    --
    Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!
  10. Re:We are on the way to becoming a Betazoid-like r by gtall · · Score: 1

    "telepathic theology"...media saturation by Franklin Graham and His Merry Band of Rich White Folk?

  11. Re:The Moon is a Harsh Mistress by gtall · · Score: 2

    Space is amazingly big, so big you wouldn't believe it. And filled with radiation. Get over it, the Universe hates us as evidenced by the cue balls it periodically tries to bean us with.

  12. Re:We are on the way to becoming a Betazoid-like r by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    The technology will soon allow every member of the society to know the location and activities or every other member.

    No. No it won't. It will allow 'the authorities' and the 1% to know everything about everyone else. This information will not be available to the rest of us.

  13. Re:Meanwhile in the USA by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Well, that's one way to keep them off the streets. It's like a social program that the Republicans like.

  14. Prosopagnosia by iTrawl · · Score: 2

    Can I get one with a reduced database containing just my friends and people I've met a few times? I need the thing to project a HUD onto my retina and tell me who they are and maybe some metadata about what they do and how we met. People don't like it when I walk past them like they don't exist, and I don't realise I'm doing it.

    --
    "Everybody's naked underneath" -- The Doctor
    1. Re:Prosopagnosia by Baron_Yam · · Score: 1

      This exact use would be so awesome for me. I'm OK with faces, but linking them to names is really, really difficult for me unless I know the person very well... which can make business meetings awkward for me.

      If it could be made more subtle, I'd love a set of camera/HUD glasses that would remind me of people's names and where I know them from.

    2. Re:Prosopagnosia by ChunderDownunder · · Score: 1

      With men outnumbering women by some margin due to China's population policies, I'd be wary that this technology allows lonely police officers to woo girls. Officer sees attractive woman, looks her up online and instantly knows all her secrets from social media. Creepy.

  15. Re:C'mon, that's unpossible by Opportunist · · Score: 1

    Dude, that's racist. On the racism scale of black to white, that's at least Mexican.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  16. The people feel so safe now by volodymyrbiryuk · · Score: 1

    China really took the Orwellian path.

    --
    sudo rm -r -f --no-preserve-root /
  17. Fake news by Excelcia · · Score: 2, Funny

    Fake news. We all know that all Chinese look the same.

  18. Re:Two Words by ChunderDownunder · · Score: 1

    Kelsey Grammar - that's the school in Little Britain, yeah?

  19. Re:We are on the way to becoming a Betazoid-like r by Oswald+McWeany · · Score: 1

    Everyone will know others' secrets, and then there will be no secrets between the humans,

    I know what you did last summer.

    --
    "That's the way to do it" - Punch
  20. Computer assisted/enhanced police work by VeryFluffyBunny · · Score: 3, Interesting

    To me this looks like an example of how these technologies should be used. Rather than for illegal dragnet surveillance and profiling that turns everyone into a suspect, they're using facial recognition to help cops do what they've always done: Look for criminal suspects for whom the police already have probable cause or an arrest warrant. It's probably a lot cheaper and easier to manage than the massive databases of innocent citizens that the NSA, CIA, FBI, DEA, etc., are collecting and is far less likely to suffer from false positives and negatives.

    --
    Debate is a form of harassment. Do not question my truth.
    1. Re:Computer assisted/enhanced police work by VeryFluffyBunny · · Score: 1

      Turns out I was wrong. The Chinese seem to be using this to identify political activists, religious minorities, and people with debts. That's going a lot further than probable cause or warrants. Seems China's just as bad with tech as every other government :(

      --
      Debate is a form of harassment. Do not question my truth.
  21. Not surprising by joe_frisch · · Score: 1

    I would expect an authoritarian government to use all the tools at its disposal to run the country efficiently. Its not something I want to see happen in the US, but seems in line with Chinese policies and not particularly evil.