Nikola (Motors) is Suing Tesla (engadget.com)

An anonymous reader shares a report: Nikola Tesla invented alternating electrical current. Nikola Motors is a mobility company working on a hydrogen-powered semi truck. Tesla makes fully electric vehicles and last December unveiled its EV Semi. Nikola Motors is suing Tesla Motors over patent infringements, according to Electrek. Nikola alleges that Tesla infringes on three of its patents: fuselage design, a wraparound windshield on a semi truck and a mid-entry door. Nikola claims that these design similarities have "caused confusion" among customers and stolen away over $2 billion in business, and that if problems arise with Tesla's Semi (like battery fires or glitches with autonomous driving), they'll be attributed to Nikola. Typical patent troll stuff.

Comments

Patent Trolls

[Oswald McWeany]

I'm not sure what the laws on the books are for frivolous patent troll lawsuits, but it would be really beneficial to society if frivolous patent law suits were heavily discouraged by huge fines to the troll perpetrating them.

There is obviously a valid and just use for patents; but there is so much abuse of the system it is ludicrous.

Re:Patent Trolls

[SlaveToTheGrind]

The term "patent troll" typically describes a patentholder who is not actually practicing the patent but simply trying to monetize it.

Nikola has been actively developing its electric and hydrogen powered semi trucks for several years now and is targeting its first commercial sales next year. The complaint alleges that Tesla first tried to poach Nikola's chief design engineer, and then simply copied Nikola's patented design.

That doesn't strike me as being even close to a typical "patent troll" scenario.

Re:Patent Trolls

[DarkOx]

Looser pays as blanket rule places to much risk on "little people" being able to sue the well to do.

Joe SixPack highers a perfectly competent but not rock star attorney who charges reasonable rates. Wants to sue oh lets say for fun Donald John Trump Development Corporation. Lets also suppose its a legitimate not so clear cut legal question or contract dispute. DJTDC has a fixed legal staff with time on their hands and every incentive to make the case take as long as possible and explore ever legal avenue and option no matter how absurd; you think its fair to stick Joe with ALL of those costs no matter what unless he wins?

Sure frivolous suits are frivolous, which is why you can counter sue for Barratry and recover your costs and in some localities a judge may simple rule the loser should pay court costs if he/she feels the case was without merit. The system as fair as far as civil suits go. There are problems with patent law for sure but don't assume the rest of the legal system is as broken or a lot of really smart people have not already considered the options, and set things up the way they did for solid reasons.

Re:Patent Trolls

[rahvin112]

These are design patents, basically how the truck looks.

There are only so many ways you can shape a semi-truck that accommodates the wind pressures in the most effective way. Look around at any modern (built in the last decade) truck, they all look the same for a reason.

Personally having looked at the Tesla and Nicola pictures I think the trucks don't look anything alike when you account for the things that have to be the same (which also match all the diesel trucks being built right now).

If Nicola's design patents cover these items they are covering design elements that have been in use for decades on all the other trucks out there and will clearly be invalid. If they cover the unique design elements that make their design different than every other truck on the road out there I see little similarity between Nicola and Tesla.

Ultimately the company is upset for two reasons, poaching employees (whaaaaa, baby want a bottle), and the fact that Tesla is stealing all the big clients with a big rig that's better designed, isn't tied to Hydrogen and will be cheaper to run and operate using known and proven technology. Nicola on the other hand has a truck that can only be refueled in 3 places, has fuel costs that are higher than diesel, is using fuel cells with unknown life spans and who knows what maintenance costs.

They're upset they picked the wrong horse with hydrogen and want to stop Tesla so they can try to get more sales. It's just marketing by lawyer and I hope Tesla stomps them in court.

Re:Patent Trolls

[The Grim Reefer]

My usual suggestion is the loser pays is capped at the *lesser* amount that the parties paid for defense/offense.

I'd go a step further and would like to see the amount of money that either side can spend be capped as well. Or at least capped, to a reasonable amount, in relation to what the non corporation can spend. Depending on the patent it may very well be worth it for a large corporation to throw millions of dollars at a individual knowing that they will only recoup, say $20K, in legal fees when they will make hundreds of millions off of a patent. If a corporation needs to spend $50K for each dollar an individual spends to defend a patent, then they don't have much of a case.

Re:It's not frivolous.

[sabri]

Exactly. This is not a case of a patent troll. In this case, there is a company actually working on something, and Tesla has been poaching their employees. From the article:

Nikola unveiled its hydrogen-powered semi in December 2016. Elon Musk first showed off the Tesla Semi last December. Once you start looking at the drawings in Nikola's patents, or compare photos of concept vehicles, you'll see that there are some similarities between the trucks. Nikola also alleges that Tesla reached out to poach an employee and doesn't hold any patents for its truck design compared to Nikola's half-dozen.

This is not a patent troll. This is a company who is competing with Tesla.

And I'm not saying that they are right and will win the case.

Re:It's not frivolous.

[ColdWetDog]

These are Design Patents (think Coke Bottle). While perfectly valid legal entities, I think the term 'patent' is a bit of misnomer. More of a trademark kind of thing.

Still, something to get lawyers all hot and bothered about.

Re:It's not frivolous.

[DontBeAMoran]

Tesla has electric cars powered by DC batteries.

Nikola has alternative fuel vehicles.

Just to confuse the hell out of everyone, someone needs to start an AC-powered car company called Edison.

Re:It's not frivolous.

[DontBeAMoran]

Hey you, stop trying to introduce solid facts into my lame attempt at a weak joke.