Trump Officials Planning Escalation of US-China Tech Trade War (arstechnica.com)

An anonymous reader quotes a report from Ars Technica: The Trump administration is looking to widen its trade war with China by restricting Chinese access to U.S. technology, according to reports from the Wall Street Journal and Reuters. "The Treasury Department is crafting rules that would block firms with at least 25 percent Chinese ownership from buying companies involved in what the White House calls 'industrially significant technology,'" the Wall Street Journal says. A separate proposal would institute beefed-up export controls preventing Chinese companies from buying these technologies from U.S. firms. The policies could be announced as soon as this week, the Journal says. In the past, the Trump administration has blocked multiple attempts by Chinese companies to buy U.S. semiconductor firms and imposed a sweeping export ban on Chinese smartphone maker ZTE after ZTE was caught selling U.S. technology to Iran and North Korea -- though the administration recently lifted the ban.

Comments

I smell a recession coming on.

[Anonymous Coward]

It remains to be seen who will bear the brunt of it.

Re:I smell a recession coming on.

[Anonymous Coward]

Damned right -- just target the former CSA, it's those a-holes and their nationalist, racist policies that are pissing everyone around the world off. I just wish we could undo the reconciliation, jettison the former Confederate States and round all those KKK and Evangelical fuckwads up put them there and pay Mexican migrants workers to build a wall around them, with no "big beautiful door" They have no place in our Society, the have no respect for Democracy, Liberty or Equality and they march around waving the Confederate and Nazi flags of the enemies of the USA. Fuck 'em

Re:I smell a recession coming on.

[ShanghaiBill]

Some how is this is the liberals doing?

At least in America, protectionism is popular with the left, and much less so with conservatives.

Trumpism is a blend of the stupidest policies from both left and right.

Re:I smell a recession coming on.

[Anonymous Coward]

the democrats will, like usual.

the republicans trash the country and economy.

that gets democrats voted in.

democrats fix the shit but also get the blame, because (shocker) they had to 'raise' taxes on the wealthy to do it (never mind the fact it was tax cuts targeting *those* that cause the mess usually).

those wealthy fucks smear the democrats while funding and bribing the republicans...

the republicans get back in power, make good on their under-the-table deals that got them their funding, and fuck shit up again.

rinse and repeat.

Re:I smell a recession coming on.

[tsa]

Trump may unfairly get the blame for the slump but he is the one who tells everybody he sees that he singlehandedly made the economy boom. He did nothing of the sort, in fact he made it boom slower and less, so he deserves the blame for the slump.

Re:I smell a recession coming on.

[Peter P Peters]

The rich can afford to wait out storms, and even get richer from recessions by buying low and selling high: be it stocks, co's, or real-estate. Recession bargain-hunting is Warren Buffett's main financial weapon, and he's arguably the richest dude on the planet.

Trump himself said the same thing back in 80's when discussing his wealth. NYC in the 70's was in a slump, and he knew that slumps are the best time to buy.
It could be that he might even engineer a recession in order to get some more bargains. He only cares about himself so anything is possible.

Trump may unfairly get the blame for a slump.

It's only unfair if it happens in his first 1-2 years like poor old Obama who inherited the country one of the worst positions in a decades. After that it's all you. You are the boss, you take responsibility.
FWIW, Australia with a mix of conservative and liberal leadership is currently into it's 26th year without a recession, the Dutch managed the same thing until the GFC screwed things up. So if Trump can't make the good times last a piddly 8 years he deserves blame.

Re:I smell a recession coming on.

[Dzimas]

The US economy will slip into recession this summer, and Trump will angrily state that it's because the rest of the world is ganging up on the USA after 8 years of weak government under Obama. He'll use Twitter to single out and humiliate opposing politicians - preferably female - and use anger and hatred to ride easily into a second term in office.

Clearly, the inmates are running the asylum

[rmdingler]

Protectionist trade policy is the knee-jerk reaction of the weak. Retaliation by not just the Chinese, but America's traditional allies in Europe, Canada, and Mexico will cost US jobs, not create them.

Protectionism is fine

[rsilvergun]

when you have an industry to protect. China has leverage because we've let them take over virtually all our manufacturing. We've kept a few of the heavy duty stuff in case we need to spin up for a war.

Thing is, Trump's base wants action and they want it now. Given that wages keep falling (inflation's 3%, wage growth's 2.5%, do the math) and 40% of Americans don't have $400 bucks in the bank I can't blame them.

This is what happens when you ignore a sizable portion of the country. They find somebody who'll listen. If you happen to be doing pretty well in this economy and don't want the boat rocked, well, tough shit. If you don't want desperate people destabilizing the world then you need to do something about their desperation. You'd think we'd have learned this from WWI and II.

Re:Protectionism is fine

[chill]

How are those Harley-Davidson people doing? I'm curious considering HD just announced they're going to move some manufacturing in Europe to avoid the tariffs.

That falls on the heels of their January announcement of closing a Kansas City, MO plant and consolidating work in York, PA. But overseas...they just opened plants in India and Brazil, with another opening in Thailand this year.

Any decent sized "American" company is a "global" company, but this President doesn't get that at all -- nor does his base.

Re:Protectionism is fine

[Zorpheus]

Well. I am not really a Trump supporter, but his point is: A trade war will reduce both import and export. But since The USA is importing more than it is exporting, he thinks the country will win more than it loses in the long run.
This is why China can't keep raising tariffs matching the US. But the US makes a lot of money by investments, which is partly compensating the trade deficit with China, and more than compensating the one with Europe. Also China was the biggest buyer of American state bonds. And a lot of trade in the world is done in dollars, which forces people to accumulate dollars and is part of what allows the huge American deficit.
So the retaliations on Trump's trade war will soon have to target the financial sector.
I don't know if this will be good or bad for the US in the long run. It could shift the US economy away from making income through investments, which only goes to a few people, back to making income through production, which can benefit more people. It could also put the world into chaos, just making everyone lose. It could also be just a threat, trying to force others to make concessions. But I think both Europe and China don't respond too well to such threats. They would never give in, because it would mean that the US could enforce other things afterwards, without a limit.

The big picture.

[Okian Warrior]

Protectionist trade policy is the knee-jerk reaction of the weak. Retaliation by not just the Chinese, but America's traditional allies in Europe, Canada, and Mexico will cost US jobs, not create them.

There were originally 6 good reasons for the tariffs:

1) Chinese manufacturers take our designs, make extras, and sell counterfeits as if they were original(*)
2) Chinese manufacturers steal our IP and trade secrets for other products
3) The Chinese violate licensing agreements (ie - hacked copies of software) and the government does nothing about it.
4) Chinese working in the US commit industrial espionage and send the information back to China
5) The Chinese government subsidizes certain industries so that they can sell goods under cost, driving industries from other countries out of business
6) (I forgot what the 6th big item was. Maybe allowing companies to do business with N. Korea?)

On #5 above, China has been subsidizing their steel production, pushing US foundries out of business. The US has only one foundry left that can make the steel plates needed for ships, so this is a national security risk. You can't make battleships without steel plates. See Canadian Aluminum subsidies.

Everyone who has taken Econ 101 will parrot the old saw "trade sanctions are bad", and everyone will wail and moan about how the sanctions have hurt *them* (so they must be bad - ya!).

China violates their trade agreements in every possible way, so much so that it would *almost* be better to not trade with China at all.

Note that for the first time in ever we have a businessman leading the country. This was not a capricious decision, it came from a long history of abuse. It's intended to fix the many and long-term existing problems, it's good for the majority of domestic businesses, and it was a campaign promise.

Take the long view.

(*) This has happened so frequently, it's a meme. Make your monitor or VCR or other electronic device in China, and see eBay flooded with counterfeit copies overnight. Does no one remember that?

Re:Fuck Trump

[Anonymous Coward]

What is wrong with protecting US jobs?

Why is it a good thing to transfer all of our technology to the Chinese Communist Party?

How is the average non-college educated US citizen better off after 20 years of globalism?

Try to think bigger than the price of your iPad.

I should add

[rsilvergun]

I'm not saying what they're doing is going to help, but I _am_ saying it's not likely to make things much worse for them. You're underestimating how bad off 40% of America is. Like the man said, what have you got to lose? For a lot of people there really isn't anything. That's what 40 years of declining wages means.

Re:I should add

[Jane Q. Public]

Not an argument.

That's like saying you shouldn't bitch when someone breaks your arm, because the next person in line got a broken leg.

Fallacious reasoning, plain and simple.

Re:About time

[Anonymous Coward]

It was good for Bezos and Jobs and all the other tech robber barrons.

I notice you don't want to blame the Waltons and Walmart for any of our country's ills. Not only did they help flood the market with cheap chinese crap for decades, they helped gut wages at the low end, shifted the cost of feeding their employees to the rest of us, while filling their own pockets. Now they hide in gated communities where they don't have to deal with results of their handiwork.

But sure, blame Bezos and Jobs. Amazon and Apple employ 10s of thousands of highly compensated employees who don't need "food stamps" in order to eat. Can you say the same for Walmart?

And Trump won't even pay Americans. His resorts bring in hundreds of foreign workers on temp visas because they'll work for even less than Americans. That's #MAGA for you.

(Not sure who the barrons are. Did you mean robber barons?)

Re:Fuck Trump

[Anonymous Coward]

He's not protecting jobs. Metal transformation jobs are now leaving: Harley Davidson moving manufacturing, Mid Continent Nail Corporation shutting down and dozens more to come. Don't worry, the rest of the world is more than happy about it! We'll gladly take your jobs!

that is a stupid remark

[aepervius]

People don't compare to folk half the world away, they compare to their immediate neighbors. That is why they elect fascist populist politician : because they want to get a better living and see the other 60% getting it. Not saying they are right, but simply that your remark is stupid.