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Comic Book Publishers, Faced With Flagging Sales, Look To Streaming (nytimes.com)

Comic book publishers are facing a growing crisis: Flagging interest from readers and competition from digital entertainment are dragging down sales. Hoping to reverse the trend, publishers are creating their own digital platforms to directly connect with readers and encourage more engagement from fans. From a report: One of the biggest direct-to-consumer efforts is DC Universe, a platform from DC Entertainment and Warner Bros. Digital Studios that will offer streaming content, including original and classic TV series. DC Universe is "a huge opportunity" that offers "ultimate creative control," said Jim Lee, a co-publisher of DC Entertainment. "It allows you to look at wider adaptations of the source material."

[...] The Walt Disney Company, which owns Marvel Entertainment, said last year that it would create a streaming platform that would include Marvel movies like "The Avengers" and "Guardians of the Galaxy." Smaller comic book publishers are testing their own direct-to-consumer platforms. Image Comics, the publisher of popular titles like The Walking Dead and Saga, started a direct-to-consumer platform in 2015 to sell comic book subscriptions and apparel.

36 of 249 comments (clear)

  1. How about remove SJW crap by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Hrm, seems like they could just stop pumping it full of SJW propaganda and sales would come back

    1. Re:How about remove SJW crap by Presence+Eternal · · Score: 2

      I think the whole "millions of dollars" thing is a disingenuous attempt to make it look like you're punching up. It's pretty clear you'd feel exactly the same way if he got paid nothing at all.

    2. Re:How about remove SJW crap by Bing+Tsher+E · · Score: 2

      I read the whole Sandman series. Bought the issues as they were coming out, from #17 onward. That series wasn't like a lot of the stupid regular comics, though. Most mainstream comics, i.e. the 'Super Hero' ones, are tedious and two dimensional. Why anybody would read more than one or two issues is beyond me.

    3. Re:How about remove SJW crap by Calydor · · Score: 2

      Iron Man is a black teenage girl? So is the new Buffy.

      https://www.polygon.com/tv/201...

      --
      -=This sig has nothing to do with my comment. Move along now=-
    4. Re:How about remove SJW crap by Presence+Eternal · · Score: 2

      Nothing wrong with that; it fits the established canon.

    5. Re:How about remove SJW crap by Presence+Eternal · · Score: 5, Interesting

      You sound entirely reasonable, but I disagree with your point on not reading. The fact of the matter is we've seen very self-righteous and pervasive commentaries claiming that not reading/watching IS a sign of bigotry. Remember all the stuff written about choosing to not go see Star Wars, Ghostbusters, Wrinkle in Time, and others.

      Preceding that you may recall there was a huge mass of articles released in tandem claiming that it was time to do away with the identity of "gamer." I think there is at least some credence to the idea there is a systemic and concerted attack on a lot of geek culture. It might actually be an interesting thing to investigate. It'd take a strong constitution to deal with the filth that populates both extremes of the debate though.

    6. Re:How about remove SJW crap by samdu · · Score: 5, Insightful

      No, it wasn't a spinoff. Riri Williams, the young black teenage girl in question, literally replaced Tony Stark (whom they "killed" off) for years before they finally brought Stark back. The problems wasn't that they put Riri in the suit. The problem was that Riri was/is a TERRIBLE character. A terrible character that was part of Marvel's purposeful attempt to replace all of the classic characters with "diverse" characters, regardless of whether it made sense, was well written, or anything else that matters in fiction. The only thing that mattered were the characters' surface traits. I remember, back in the day, when Rhodey replaced Tony as Iron Man. It was a well written arc. It made complete sense based on what came before it. And Rhodey was/is a great character that had been built up over time. This had absolutely none of those things. So, while a certain loud group of people have shouted down (or tried) anyone who took issue with the direction Marvel took as being Nazis, fascists, homophobes, sexists, and racists, that characterization is without merit. Are there some of those people peppered in? Certainly. Because there are some of those people peppered into all groups. But there was/is a real, non-discriminatory criticism of Marvel's direction. And yeah, no one is forcing anyone to buy anything. Which is exactly why so many have stopped doing so. Thus, this article. And the swing and a miss by the industry to try to explain why sales are flagging.

    7. Re:How about remove SJW crap by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      On the one hand, I can't think of anything wrong or stupid about a story involving a black female teenager in a mech suit. Mech suits are cool, no matter who is in them.

      With good writers, one could spin compelling stories with any character, regardless of race, etc.

      But, on the other hand, the only reason that this specific combination was chosen was to contrast it against the white male original character. And this isn't the only story in which this has happened. There is, in fact, a huge push to replace all the classic characters with women and minorities, not because there is something compelling about this plotwise, but in order to push an obvious agenda of social engineering.

      And hell, if the whole agenda is just one of encouraging acceptance and respect, I don't even have a problem with that. But it is being grossly overdone, in an in-your-face and kind of insulting way, and the plots being produced are not compelling. "Oh look at me, I am a woman in a man's role" is just not good enough.

      Why is a female Thor better than, say, brand new IP about the goddess Athena? Athena was a strategic badass in greek mythology, no need at all to turn a man into a woman who is just-as-good-or-better.

      The answer is obvious. The goal is transparent. The push is to replace characters we have loved with more politically correct equivalents.....not to write badass stories with compelling plots.

      And that is precisely why their sales are dropping. But their idealism won't allow them to admit this, not even to themselves, so they put the blame on bullshit.

      Some talented startup is going to write some good comics in the next few years, and eat their lunch.

    8. Re:How about remove SJW crap by serviscope_minor · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Remember all the stuff written about choosing to not go see Star Wars, Ghostbusters, Wrinkle in Time, and others.

      No. I've never even heard "Wrinkle in Time", let alone read any commentary on it. Ghostbusters, I seem to recall got very lukewarm reviews, though I did see it.

      I think there is at least some credence to the idea there is a systemic and concerted attack on a lot of geek culture.

      Welcome to the big leagues, boyo!

      Here's the thing: it's not a systematic attack. Previously geek culture was basically a rather niche things, which means no one outside the niche cared about it, or had any desire to comment on it. Now it's about the most mainstream of mainstream culture.

      This means you have the full weight of all of the critics (and others) bearing down on it. And it will continue ot do so just like more or less everything else in the main stream. It is not a systematic attack, it's part of the burden of being popular. Critics tend to exist in the mainstream, subcultures tend to be pretty much critic free.

      Not all of the criticism will be fair, not all of it you will agree with. Some of it you might strongly dislike (but kind of know it is true anyway).

      But this is life in the mainstream. Deal with it.

      --
      SJW n. One who posts facts.
    9. Re:How about remove SJW crap by Kokuyo · · Score: 2

      I think I would read the hell out of an Athena comic. That sounds awesome!

      Strong women are pretty damn central interest of mine. My favorite works of fiction are Sunstone (comic book) and the Kushiel series (fantasy novels).

      That probably won't count for your typical REEEEEEing person of overwhelming opinion (just to avoid the term SJW), as there is sexuality involved in those and since I am an animalistic male, obviously my interests cannot go beyond that.

      For the non brain-damaged among us: I'd say it's pretty clear I dig strong female characters. It is one reason I like Captain Janeway, not despite her being an arguably poor Starfleet captain but precisely because. She was depicted to have flaws. She wasn't able to handle each and every situation with Picard's aplomb, because she was thrust into god damned hellish situations with no backup whatsoever.

      Contrast that with the old Wonder Woman or Spider-Woman TV series, where these women deus ex machinaed whatever outrageous power they needed o solve an issue. Now don't get me wrong, that is Superman's whole sick, being imbalanced, but I never liked him for that reason either.

      Failing is an integral part of making a character grow on you. Having flaws is important. Being a lecherous white dude with too much money and being too full of himself works for Stark because despite all this, he tries to do the right thing.

      Replace him with a black female teenager? Sure. I am an avid fanfiction reader, I don't balk at strange turns on established characters but just like fanfiction writers, you got to make the transition. There are only a limited number of fanfics that work despite the premise being "Well, this is different. Accept it and go from there".

      The moment I get the feeling the author deems me so dimwitted that they needn't bother with making something fit into canon, I get very, VERY annoyed with said author. And THAT more than anything makes me not want to read and much less buy this crap. You want to push your dogma? Go right ahead. I don't hold it against you. But make sure you pick me up on your journey gently and don't make me hop into a car going twenty miles an hour.

      And much less don't expect me to try after calling me names because I balk at the idea...

    10. Re:How about remove SJW crap by djinn6 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Yes, we'll "deal with it". Many of us "geeks" couldn't give one fuck about what other people think of us. Heck, we didn't care when other kids ostracized of us. And if daily harassment didn't stop us from liking what we like, what's a few click-bait opinion articles going to do?

      As for gamer culture, it's pretty clear the real gamers have already won. Steam announced that they're no longer going to try to police content and no amount of SJW screeching will put that genie back in the bottle.

    11. Re:How about remove SJW crap by terrycarlino · · Score: 2

      My anger is reserved for those who have so little confidence in their own ability to create minority characters with their own interesting back story and character development that they feel the only way minority characters can prosper is to steal the reputation and readership of established white male characters.

      Compare:

      Black Panther a Marvel character with a long history of his own. His well made movie was a blockbuster.

      Wonder Woman a DC character with a long history of her own. Her well made movie was the best of the entire DC releases.

      Ghostbusters an attempt to replace well loved male characters with women. A complete failure.

      Ocean's 8. Enough said.

      Replacement of major Marvel Characters with gender swapping and blackwashing. Sales plummet.

      Want to be successful? Create interesting minority characters who have their own story and their own mantel. Or have them steal the mantels of successful white male characters and see them fail as a property.

    12. Re:How about remove SJW crap by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 2

      So far the more diverse Star Wars have done well at the box office, it's the one about a white guy that flopped.

      Or was it the annoying android?

      A lot of Star Wars fans we not pleased with the direction that the movies were taking. And it wasn't merely the social justice aspect. It was that the story lines were getting rather bad, and plot holes, and a few things that made no sense. Taking a new Jedi and turning this new into a Mary Sue character, or Marty Stu if you please just annoys people - In addition, the people involved with producing the movies were pretty dismissive of any criticism. As Kathleen Sullivan noted:

      "I have a responsibility to the company that I work with. I don’t feel that I have a responsibility to cater in some way. I would never just seize on saying, 'Well, this is a franchise that’s appealed primarily to men for many, many years, and therefore I owe men something.'"

      That's pretty offensive. I've seen a lot of female Star Wars fans - many of them who are pissed at the new direction. But here's the interesting part - while giving lip service to her responsibility to the company she works with, does she not have the responsibility to make that company money? When she gave her giant "Fuck you!" to the fans who put the Star Wars franchise where it was - both male and female fans.

      Movies and comics are entertainment, and nothing else. You pick an audience and produce works that you believe will attract them to give you money in return for being entertained. Kennedy and Disney are allowed to Change Star Wars into an intergalactic version of Glee if they so wish. But will the people they have chosen to be their new audience give their money just like the audience they discarded?

      There is a vanishingly small but no zero chance that the reason that Solo failed was because it had a white man as the leading character. While that might be the case, you will need to explain how other movies with white male lead characters have excelled and made a lot of money for their producers in the same time period that somehow people decided that Solo needed to fail. Hard to defend the argument. Occam's razor says that since a lot of fans who were upset at being chased away and were vocal about it did exactly what they said they would do.

      It all comes down to this. The people that Disney needs to replace the people they abandoned need to step up and pay it forward. Solo, which was apparently a decent movie after Ron Howard took over and recued it from the disaster it was heading to after the people Kennedy used to produce it, was ignored by the abandoned fans, while the new socially conscious fans did not replace them.

      The movie is going to lose between 50 and 80 million dollars in the end. Disney will need to decide if they want to lose that much money in order to appease those who demand that matters that happened in a far away galaxy a long time ago must have 21st century social justice issues at the expense of good storytelling or not. One thing is for certain. The old Star Wars movies were pretty certain to generate a lot of money, and Disney and Lucasfilms could demand a lot of money and length of showing from the theaters. I suspect they will need to lessen the demands - a lot.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
  2. Price, content by harvey+the+nerd · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Prices are a little high, even allowing for inflation.

    Content, thin mags where much content is hmmm to ugh.

    1. Re:Price, content by Jason1729 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I logged in to say just this. In 1961 in the middle of the golden age of comics, a comic cost 10 cents and federal minimum wage was $1.15. (11.5 comics per hour).

      In 2018, the cover price of a DC comic (regular, plain old, non-special edition) is $3.99 and minimum wage is $7.25 per hour (less than 2 comics per hour). They are absurdly expensive today.

      Not to mention that I can buy an AAA video game a couple of year old on steam for the price of a few comics and get a heck of a lot more entertainment value for it. Comics today are about the worst rip-off possible in the entertainment industry.

  3. SJW Mafia Tactics by Kunedog · · Score: 2, Interesting
    After an extremely successful IndieGogo campaign, leftist comic book stores colluded to refuse carrying Jawbreakers, and to intimidate the publisher into pulling out:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?...

    Something that readers clearly want is being denied to them by the SJW cancer in the industry.

    Comic book publishers are facing a growing crisis: Flagging interest from readers and competition from digital entertainment are dragging down sales.

    What a surprise that you'd deliberately ignore the elephant in the room.

    1. Re:SJW Mafia Tactics by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Really, that 'white male lead is the problem' meme started as fucking joke in progressive circles. I was there, I saw the first appearance of it, and I had to chuckle, as I just knew the screams of rage that would cause from the knuckle-dragging basement dwellers.

      As you just went on to prove. Thank you.

      Problem is, every time the far left gets caught in some racist and sexist moment. it automagically becomes a joke

      But allow this knuckle dragger to go on here.

      We live in an age where one's commentary lives forever once on the internet.

      It is not remotely difficult to find examples of people claiming that white men are the problem a simple DDG search or Google search will provide examples - try it

      Huff Post White Men Of Academia Have An ‘Objectivity’ Problem https://www.huffingtonpost.com...

      White males are a problem population, according to Saida Grundy of Boston U. https://www.thenewamerican.com...

      https://www.damemagazine.com/2...

      Here's one that is an interesting read https://www.huffingtonpost.com... Authored by a woman of African descent, it is both racist and has a kernal of truth in it.

      I'm bored now - you want any more do the work yourself.

      Are there people that are considered "white" who are obvious racists? Oh hell yes. And history is littered with their crimes.

      But yes Virginia, there are people of all races and creeds and political affiliations that are racist. "white" is considered a race. Men are considered a sex. Unless you are referring to medical issues that might affect one group over another like the issues fair skinned people have in tropical sunny environments to issues faced by people with dark pigmentation face with Vitamin D shortage in northern environments, referring to angry white men is the same as referring to angry black men.

      And y'all can deny you are racist just as well as the guy who likes to dress in bedsheets and burn crosses on the lawns of people they have identified by race.

      tl;dr version: The far left shouldn't make jokes that look and read exactly how they feel. If you make a "joke" that reads exactly how people who are serious racists write, you'll have to forgive people who look at your "joke" and believe you mean the same.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
  4. Here's an idea that just might work by Opportunist · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Produce what sells and not what some loudmouths that never bought comic books (and never will) demand.

    Yes, it is actually that easy.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  5. Re:OUTED by ITRambo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    SJW's are a very pushy minority. The market is telling them to dial it back. I hope all of the entertainment industry realizes that they need to appeal to the morals and ethos of their customer, or lose the customers.

  6. Um... by your own admission the indiegogo by rsilvergun · · Score: 3, Insightful

    was successful. The comic is widely available.

    What you're referring to seems to stem from an article Buzz Feed ran here complaining that people who pushed for more diversity in comics were being trolled, harassed and threatened. Because everyone in the media likes to boil stuff down to a controversy they called the phenomenon "comicsgate".

    Pushes for diversity in comics have been going on since the mid-90s boom times. You can't pin the drop in sales on that because it's a nearly 25 year old movement in the industry. The goal isn't to be "SJW" it's to expand readership beyond young teen boys. Girls in particular are a desirable target demographic because, well, they read a lot more than boys (seriously, look it up, or ask yourself what the biggest hit books are and take a look at how they appeal to girls).

    The industry's flagging not because of diversity, it's flagging because the entire US economy's in the crapper for everyone but the top 10% or so and those people are busy enjoying their wealth instead of reading comics (the occasional Sultan in Dubai aside). The nerd economy in particular is hurting because of outsourcing and in-sourcing (e.g. H1-Bs). Comic book publishers have lost their last remaining base. They lost the kids to video games and now they've lost the nerds to, well, supply side economics.

    TL;DR, it's the economy stoopid (TM)

    --
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    1. Re:Um... by your own admission the indiegogo by samdu · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You've managed to point out the lunacy of the SJW movement and its lack of necessity all in the same post, attempting to disprove either. You are absolutely correct in that comics have been diverse (actually, it goes back WAY past the 90s). The problem is that SJWs saw and see the medium as wildly homogeneous and lacking any diversity. So they felt the had to do something about it. What they did was replace classic characters Iron Man (to a black, female teenager), Hulk (to a young asian guy), Thor (to a female), Captain America (to a black man), Ice Man (well, not replaced physically, but they made a character that had been straight since the 60s into a gay man), etc... etc... And even worse, they did it willy-nilly and badly. Stories ceased to matter. All that mattered was representation and making sure to poke straight white dudes in the eye at every opportunity on social media. The people that were buying comics before this upheaval spanned several generations who, mostly, never had a problem with a black woman leading the X-Men or a black man taking up the mantle of Iron Man. That these self-same people are rebelling at what Marvel is doing now should speak volumes. And it is. It's just that SJWs don't comprehend what they're hearing because they started from a flawed premise.

      You expand a market by bringing in new people. NOT by kicking your existing market out and trying to replace it with a market that doesn't yet exist. Comics tried the latter. It's failing miserably.

    2. Re:Um... by your own admission the indiegogo by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You expand a market by bringing in new people. NOT by kicking your existing market out and trying to replace it with a market that doesn't yet exist. Comics tried the latter. It's failing miserably.

      And how! This is what happens when entertainment industries take their marching orders from people who have ideology that can't handle anything but their own narrow views. It never works. And in this case, is tantmount to suicide.

      I have an idea. Maybe if we worked from a expansion outlook. There are a lot of popular female characters from a long time ago. I don't know of any gay characters, although there were rumors about Robin and Batman. We don't have to have a gay Green Lantern, or a Female Superman.

      Bring out some new characters, maybe?

      Let's have a seat and Old Uncle Ol will tell everyone soem stuff that I think traditional fans know already.

      Those teenagers that read these comics? Hey - they be doin a liddle projection there. Maybe fancyin' themselves as Batman or The Hulk, or Green Lantern. Or even da Joker, or Catwoman.

      Now here we got some Kid who thinks Green Lantern is cool, then suddenly Green Lantern comes out of the closet and says he prefers weiners. Oh man, would we have a field day with that poor bastard when me and the gang were kids.

      Gay Characters? No problem. Female? Oh fer crissakes, we've had dem fereva. People freakin' love Wonder Woman, and even Catwoman. But here's da thing. You don't grow yer audience by telling most of them Fuck you! Oh shit - don't tell mom I swore okay? You keep your core audience, and you introduce New Characters! Then maybe that kid that isn't sure of his or her sexuality can become a fan of a character that he or she can project to. And you don't make their gender preferences blatant. These are comics, and If people want to see stuff gender specific, rule 34 does a much better job than mainstream comics can.

      Who knew?

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
  7. Re:DC's aware of this by Hognoxious · · Score: 2

    Of course you have time for collecting them. Now reading, that's another thing.

    But look on the bright side - if they haven't been read they'll be worth more when you're sacked for being over 40.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  8. Re:OUTED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Shut the fuck up you white racists, Superman is now a proud black transsexual and you all can fucking eat it.

  9. Re:3 Top Reasons by SolemnLord · · Score: 3, Interesting

    1: They keep pissing off their established fan bases with needless changes, reboots, and retcons to appease the Butthurt Brigade.

    Continuity is a mess at the best of times, crossovers universally suck, and having to understand a byzantine layer of backstory doesn't draw in new readers. Ignoring that constant growing readership (which is what the big two's shareholders are undoubtedly demanding) is a fool's game, established fanbases die. Either literally or they drift off. New readers are a necessity to keep comics alive, never mind thriving. The movies and TV shows are immensely popular, but not turning into monthly readers despite people loving the characters.

    Endless crises on infinite earths are eyerolling and infuriating, I totally agree. Trying to manage literally decades of continuity is also untenable. Long-term serialization is both awesome and slowly rotting away comics' strongest characters. I doubt there's a good solution available at all.

    2: Comics are just too freakin' expensive per issue for the amount and quality of content you get.

    Agreed. Personally I think getting rid of Diamond would help. Not directly or immediately, but ditching that fucking cancerous system would help out retailers and make publishers more immediately responsible to their customers which in turn would, at least, bring back realistic capitalist supply-and-demand. That's just a pet wish of mine, though.

    3: The barrier to entry is so low now that previously ignored but still decent talent can punch their own meal ticket. Unfortunately, that allows for a lot more total and utter shit to flood the pool. But that is less important than the ability to go it your own.

    Is this a strike against it? You honestly seem to be arguing both ways here. Lower barrier to entry means more opportunities for new blood. Yeah, there'll be dreck, but let's not pretend that lots of established players aren't shit or that there's no absolutely exquisite new talent on the scene. New writers and artists mean new stories and new readers. All that matters then is getting the best stories into everybody's hands.

  10. The natural cycle by Stomper_Stoddard · · Score: 2

    I think this is just the natural cycle of the comics industry. What we are seeing is the end of the Bronze Age. The older generation of readers are dying off or moving on, all the mainstay writers and artists started in the 80's and 90's and they were new and interesting in the 80's and 90's, now they are old and stale. Just look at the state of comics in the mid 50's just prior to the Silver Age and then again in the mid 70's just prior to the Bronze Age. Comics in those time periods were lackluster and uninteresting written by people who had been writing the same stories with the same characters for a couple of decades and the readers who liked those stories were dying off or moving on.

    What is needed and what will eventually happen is the old writers and artists will price themselves out of the market, retire or die and a new generation of writers and artists will emerge who want to tell new and interesting stories, creating new characters or doing fresh takes on old characters. Most importantly, these new people will know how to speak to the new generation of readers who will also emerge.

  11. It's not really a movement by rsilvergun · · Score: 4, Insightful

    it's a small group of women running out of community colleges. It's blown out of proportion by right wing media out to make a boogie man (boogie woman?) to distract you from economic issues like wages declining as productivity raises.

    Even in as much as there's anyone seriously advocating for diversity they're doing it purely for economic reasons, usually either to reach new audiences for media they're selling or trying to bring in more workers to their businesses to drive down wages (re: silicon valley).

    Always, always, always follow the money.

    --
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    1. Re:It's not really a movement by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 2, Informative

      it's a small group of women running out of community colleges. It's blown out of proportion by right wing media out to make a boogie man (boogie woman?) to distract you from economic issues like wages declining as productivity raises.

      My career was at one of the biggest Universities in the US, and while blown out of proportion to some extent, it isn't as much as you might think.

      The females who stayed could look forward to what we called the yearly promotion plan, and the rule was that anything that any woman considered sexual harassment was officially sexual harassment.

      Universities are run by their football departments and Gender studies departments. The Football because it brings in money, and the Gender studies department because they never stop complaining. We're already heading toward 70 percent female 30 percent male, and it still isn't enough.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
  12. Re:Heres an idea by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 2

    Yeah, She-Hulk dates back to the late 70s, and was an attempt to make a new and interesting character based on the Hulk, not some SJW nonsense.

    --
    You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
  13. Re:For me, price by ConceptJunkie · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Yeah, I quit collecting comics (mostly Marvel) around 1992. They were too expensive for the value you got, and there were too many forced, artificial ways of driving sales without adding value (crossover stories that went on for dozens of issues, but went nowhere). When you're selling a product designed for kiddies and a professional thinks they're too expensive, you're doing something wrong.

    I miss comics, but everything I've seen and read about the industry since then makes me glad I quit.

    --
    You are in a maze of twisty little passages, all alike.
  14. Re:Heres an idea by dirk · · Score: 2

    It's funny, no one had an issue when a white guy replaced a white guy. When Bucky became Cap, no one was screaming. But when Sam Wilson does (the guy who actually makes the most sense) suddenly it is because of diversity. When white guy after white guy became Batman, no one complained. When white guy after white guy became the Flash, no one cared. When another white guy became Ant Man, no one cared. When Venom went from white guy to white guy, no one cared. But the minute it is someone other than another white guy, then suddenly it is only about diversity and it is a tragedy of epic proportions.

    --

    "Information wants to be expensive" - Stewart Brand, the same guy who said "Information wants to be free"
  15. Re:OUTED by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Wow - that was a strange post to have marked as a troll. Le't see if I can explain this situation in a manner that won't trigger anyone.

    Let us say that a group of people want 21st century politics brought into say, Star Wars movies or comic books.

    Let's say that want character's sexual identity to be a focus, perhaps more female and less male characters, Okay, so after discussions, the creators of the movies put people in place that will promote your agenda. This will be a radical shift, and will dismiss what the traditional audience wishes to see, which in these cases is obviously escapist entertainment with a good story line.

    So here is the most important part - if people with a political agenda succeed in turning away the traditional customers, then the people with that political agenda must become the new customers. Which is what I believe ITRambo is saying.

    We saw a huge fan revolt with Star Wars - Solo. And the weird Disney response was it was the fault of White males. https://www.tigerdroppings.com... Original article was on Forbes - they provide link but Forbes won't let me in.

    Aside from the blatant racism (white) and Sexism (males) it was failure to see the forest for the agenda.

    Point is - if you want your comic books and sci-fi movies to be politically correct, sensitive to who the characters like to have sex with - and display it - and socially inclusive, making these films about otherworld characters reflect 21st century shortcomings........

    You have to go to the movies and You have to buy the comic books, and You have to buy the action figures that the people You kicked off the train used to do. You own it now - so spend that money or you won't own it long.

    And seriously, if you feel you have to mark this little bit of good advice as troll, it only indicates that you can't take telling. Support your causes, not just complain.

    --
    The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
  16. I'm sorry to put out ... by Qbertino · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ... a bit of an anti-US rant but could you guys across the pond FINALLY PLEASE stop equating your frigging super-hero-comic-trash for "comics in general"? It is very annoying and it doesn't help that your keep repeating it.

    Franco Belgian / European comics - and Japanese / Asian comics - are doing excellent and the market for high quality grown up stuff is ever growing with small publishers popping up left, right and center all the time. I have to actively limit my time at the comic store these days lest I leave all my income there. In the last 3 decades the quality of available material has grown way beyond anything available in the US at measurable scale and it's safe to conclude that anyone living in the US probably has a very very limited view of what comics and grafic novels are and can be. ... So once again:
    Super hero comics are not comics in general. They are a very small fraction of comic genres in general and the quality of the material and the ever repetitive shite pulp publishers like Marvel and DC put out is bound to lead people getting fed up. This is no big surprise to anyone with a non-US perspective on comics. That US superhero trash doesn't sell anymore is actually a healthy reaction.

    --
    We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
  17. Minor nitpick by Synonymous+Homonym · · Score: 2

    I just want to say that "The Avengers" are John Steed and Emma Peel. ("The New Avengers" John Steed and Tara King.)

    Marvel's superhero team is just "Avengers", without the definite article.

  18. Re:OUTED by AmiMoJo · · Score: 3, Interesting

    But that was the one that was about a straight white male... Surely if diversity was the problem then the other three new-era films would have flopped and Solo would have been a huge success.

    Maybe it's just not a very good film, or we have reached Star Wars saturation point.

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  19. Wrong. by Qbertino · · Score: 3, Interesting

    don't worry... the SJW thought police will come after Japanese and European comics soon.

    No they won't. Because unlike marvel/DC pulp Eurocomics are so diverse it will make even the most progressive social issue proponents head spin. In fact, if there is any media genre that is proactively progressive it's Eurocomics and perhaps some modern high quality manga. Female heroes in abundance. And unlike prude USians teen sex, sex in general, naked people, handycapped heroes and other stuff too, without *anybody* doing wee-wee in their panties because of it. ... OMG you have so little of an idea it would blow your mind. Gung Ho has sexual and power abuse as a friggin sideplot!

    --
    We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca