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Tech To Blame For Ever-Growing Car Repair Costs, AAA Says (cnet.com)
A new study from AAA highlights the high repair costs associated with cars that have advanced safety technology. "[S]eemingly small damages to a vehicle's front end can incur costs nearing $3,000," CNET reports. From the report: The study looked at three solid sellers in multiple vehicle segments, including a small SUV, a midsize sedan and a pickup truck. It looked at repair costs using original equipment list prices and an established average for technician labor rates.
Let's use AAA's examples for some relatable horror stories. Mess up your rear bumper? Well, if you have ultrasonic parking sensors or radar back there, it could cost anywhere from $500 to $2,000 to fix. Knock off a side mirror equipped with a camera as part of a surround-view system? $500 to $1,100. Windshields are especially tricky. People who own cars with windshields that have embedded heating elements already have to pony up hundreds of dollars to replace what you might think is just a piece of glass. Factor complex camera systems (like autobrake) into the mix, and not only do folks get hit with the windshield replacement, they possibly have to find a trained professional to recalibrate all that tech behind it.
Let's use AAA's examples for some relatable horror stories. Mess up your rear bumper? Well, if you have ultrasonic parking sensors or radar back there, it could cost anywhere from $500 to $2,000 to fix. Knock off a side mirror equipped with a camera as part of a surround-view system? $500 to $1,100. Windshields are especially tricky. People who own cars with windshields that have embedded heating elements already have to pony up hundreds of dollars to replace what you might think is just a piece of glass. Factor complex camera systems (like autobrake) into the mix, and not only do folks get hit with the windshield replacement, they possibly have to find a trained professional to recalibrate all that tech behind it.
Subaru wants $57 for a replacement fan control knob. This is "tech"?
So, you like a man tranny?
I would be interested in knowing the breakdown of an automaker's sources of profit.
Are we now to a point where they sell a $25k car at a loss. However, they know the odds of a fender-bender are high, and it will cost the automaker $800 for the $8,000 repair.
Is the model moving to something closer to inkjet printers, banks and airlines? Get you in the door cheap, then nail you on the parts or fees.
The interactions I've had with people from parts suppliers indicate the mark-ups the automakers put on parts are insane.
I know, $15 for the H4 led bulb (and possibly $20 for the glass), and a standard screw driver. Its getting so dang expensive to replace the headlight on my 48 year old car these days!
The 7 year old family car; I changed the bulb without any tools and I believe a two pack of bulbs for around $20.
p.s. - The bumpers on my car are real steel, not some fiberglass with foam backing. A few years ago someone backed into one of my bumpers and tore theirs all to shreds, mine just needed a little buffing to get the honda civic stain out.
Oh, what a brave new world, that has uniquely shaped plastic headlights for every model of car on the road, that cost hundreds of dollars each to replace and throw light in shitty to moderately ok patterns until the plastic yellows and hazes up with age.
Yeah, everything's the techs' fault...
No, it is just one of the excuses, in fact any part, regardless of the "tech" it has will be sold to you for a ridiculous markup, especially if it is an original part. Take my Ford Focus for example, it has a known flaw in that the dashboard compartment lid plastic lock breaks easily. Then, for that plastic lid they charge you £90. That's probably a 10,000% markup. I wish someone would do a sort of "reverse-ifixit", i.e. calculate how much it would cost you to build a car if you bought all the parts separately. Bigger parts have a lower markup than that little piece, so the Focus won't end up costing £2 million as the lid might indicate, but still I expect parts sell several times their cost on average. A great consumer friendly law would be to limit the manufacturer part prices so that the cost of all the parts together are not more than say 2 times the cost of the car. Anyway, some wishful thinking there...
P.S. If you are curious, the grey market lids are still at around £30, because they just have to compete with a £90k part, so that opened a market for a little piece of plastic which you glue to replace the piece of the lock that breaks for everyone, and they charge you £15 for that!!! I.e. I have to go to a scrap yard to find something in my case...
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$7000 for a small dent on the fender.
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
It's a bargain if the safety feature prevented a $30,000 hospital bill.
Let's go back to no crumple zones where you can pound out a front end collision with a hammer and clean out the passengers with a fire hose.
My brother's 2 year old Nissan Sentra with 15k miles on it cost him $11500. It's a strippy. CD Player and a jack 3.5" for your phone, AC and an Automatic. About as basic as it gets (it's 2018, a CD player costs $5 bucks to make, no, it's not a "luxury" when they're that cheap).
Cars are more expensive because fewer and fewer people can afford them. That means fewer used cars. That means higher used car prices, which the car manufacturers see as cue to raise prices. Cars are also a necessity in most places. Even most major cities lack viable public transportation. When the commutes 90 minutes by car it's 3 hours by bus. That's not an inconvenience, that's a life altering event. The car companies decided how our cities were built before any of us were born (assuming there's nobody under 70 reading this). We're living with the consequences.
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Actually, my daughter plans on studying in China and then hoping to get a job with a western company and a western salary... then she can live in China, work at the world's top tech companies and live in a place where prices are cheap... at least until the Chinese decide to simply crash the world economy to further communism.
My son is 16 and already looking into micro-houses for when he gets older. We're considering buying a plot of land and populating it with 4-10 micro houses with parking for a single shared self driving car. We're hoping to be able to sell them for $25,000 a piece. We'll use a single centralized heater, have a single parking spot for cars, room for one electric moped per house, etc...
The idea is that at least until they have children (a LONG WAY OFF I hope) this would allow them to live with very little debt and spend the vast majority of their income on socializing and enjoying live while saving money for their eventual houses to raise children in... which may also be somewhat minimalist.
If food is readily accessible via delivery services and restaurants, and clothing can be washed by service (which will become increasingly more popular as the job market shrinks) and most forms of entertainment at home is computer rather than large sitting room oriented, what's the point of a big house or apartment?
I would move into one as well if I were single. I have an office where I spend most of my time (even recreational) and have little need for much space at home. I think 30m^2 would be far more than enough for me. I'm in a room about that big right now and can easily mentally design the room to meet all my needs.
So, yeh... cheaper housing would make perfect sense.
The technology is one bit, but is there any reason why there has to be a single unit which encompasses the front end around to the wheels, and integrates the lights and grill? As a result, you can't easily just replace a broken piece, you have to replace the entire assembly.
[One reason is fuel efficiency. The assembly has fewer gaps to catch the wind. Another reason is reliability, the assembly is constructed as a unit and doesn't rely on as many people being successful. But there are probably alternative approaches which could give similar results.]
This is where the cell phone right to repair shop needs to get busy. The problem arises because the sensors for your Chevy Corvette may be different, for no good reason, than your Chevy Silverado. Different mounting or whatever. Just like in the past your Lincoln Mark V could have front end parts at $800 but the exact same part from a ford truck might be $250. Different part numbers. Same exact part. Well now they do things like create skus based on trim parts that may not even be damaged. But they differentiate the parts you can order. TPMS sensors are particularly overpriced as OEM parts, and they are periodically replaced. Equivalent after market parts? They are significantly cheaper. Car key fob? Or keyed key? The exact same key at the dealer with a FOB, $180 for the pair $200 to program it. After market $25 for the pair, including instructions to program it yourself in the car. Factory parts can be hugely inflated because they stock so many skus for many many years. Standardization is the way to drop the prices. Fewer skus.
- Tjp
I am in wallow with my inner money grubbing capitalistic pig. ... Oink!
The news I just heard is that we found the guy with the PT cruiser that hasn't rusted to shit, and actually still runs.
Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
There are people that buy Ford F-series trucks for work purposes - a whole lot of them. However, there are plenty of people that buy them for image, and rarely actually use the vehicle for it's intended purpose of hauling things around. Some will use them on the weekend for towing other recreational equipment - camping stuff, boats, etc.
Also, many people that buy an F-series truck for a business may be better served by an E-series van - it's cheaper, and has roughly the same cargo capacity without the thievery and cargo getting wet if it rains. Any business working in agriculture or other outdoor work is probably served best by the truck, but construction contractors usually go with the van, because they can lock up all their tools and still have room for several 4x8 sheets of wood, wallboard, boxes of tile, etc. without the risk of having all of it ruined should there be weather.
But vans aren't "cool" so the F-150 is the best selling vehicle in the world by a long way.
Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
It's nice not to have to lift each piece of firewood over your head to put it in the truck. Also nice to be able to drop the firewood out of the truck without it bouncing away and having to move it again.
I'm probably getting old, but I like to minimize the work rather then maximize it and most new trucks are way too high and hard enough to get in, little well put anything else in. Nice to be able to see that boat that you're towing, especially when backing up to the lake.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
> I also drive an F250 Super Duty King Ranch ... YMMV
Your Mileage May Vary indeed.
It may vary between 10 mpg and 16 mpg.
The effects are not long gone. There are many cars that were purposefully destroyed under Cash for Clunkers that could have otherwise been dismantled and resold as used parts. Instead our lovely government had dealerships pouring sand into the engine and running it until it seized in order to qualify for the subsidy.
The amount of engines destroyed for no purpose was ludicrous, and the remaining fleet of cars where people could have gotten used parts to keep their car running now have much more expensive repairs, if they can find parts at all, for cars that really aren't that old and definitely were not uncommon.
Cash for Clunkers was a corporate giveaway to the auto industry with a very thin whitewash of "raising overall fuel efficiency" applied to sell it. It was wasteful in practically every way.
Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
Those highly deforming materials you're laughing at are designed to absorb energy then distribute it slower and more equally to reduce shock in an accident to increase passenger safety and reduce bodily injury.
While it's true those materials ultimately increase the monetary cost related to vehicle damage in an accident, they reduce risk of fatality or medical costs of injuries to the passenger(s).
If I have to choose between my car and my life I'll set the thing in fire and roll it over a mountain in a heartbeat. Sure, the cost sucks but I'm alive to pay for it and move on.
Not even a little bit true. Most repairs cost so much is people don't bother trying to do it themselves. It's amazingly simple to implement most car repairs these days with a modest tool box and a copy of the manufacturer repair manuals for the car. Combine that with the fact that you can order parts online for a fraction of what the dealer will charge you. My last air conditioning repair took a $25 (fried relay). The dealer wanted $750 to do the same fix that took me longer to type up in this comment than to do. (Open the hood, took off a plastic cover over the fuse box, found the relay, pulled it out with a pair of pliers, stuck the new one in.)
What it is, is advanced marketing techniques, improved market cornering, and a better legal understand to prevent lawsuits for shady business practices.
The tech, the tech, the tech. The new USB connector, which is the same as the old one, but with a slightly different shape you pay 20$ for. It costs the store 0.70$, and to make it probably less than a fraction of a penny. The 0.70 cents the store pays covers the shipping and logistics of it.
It's all market price gouging cornering. It's been going on for thousands of years. Greedy people try to corner the market and increase price at the max rate that won't cause rebellion on their products, and lobby to prevent competition, and any competition there is has to play by their rules or else they'll sue them to financial ruin, even if they lose the court case, the money the large company loses suing them is minor, compared to the threat of competition, and the small company loses its market entrance point, it gives time while financially ruining them for the large company to make competing products, and that's what they do.
You literally have people who know they have no legal ground to stand on, but just the effort to prove that will ruin your company, trashing companies, and making your prices higher.
However, I also blame the ignorant members of Congress, past and present, who ONLY considered that higher MPG might mean less air pollution, not the extra expenses we all quietly pay to get our rolling computers fixed, the complexity that befuddles the average person/mechanic and the extra wasted man-hours dealing with that complexity.
You're blaming the wrong people, well mostly. Governments (its a first world thing) are responsible for pushing clean and efficient, people demanded clean, as the city air used to be horrible, at least here. And there is only so much oil. Getting it can involve supporting horrible people, making a big mess digging it up now a days and there is a chance that CO2 affects the climate.
Car companies come up with all this other expensive shit. A car company decided to make the heating and air conditioning push button and controlled by a computer with resulting high costs to troubleshoot. A car company decided to save money by putting unrelated stuff on the same bus, including re-purposing computers in ways that make trouble shooting expensive.
Even the safety stuff the government now makes mandatory was usually developed and pushed by the car companies. And there, once again government is responding to a wish from the voting public for maximum safety.
The real problem is capitalism and the way people are. The automobile industry is mature and competitive, so they have to come up with gadgets and push them to sell cars and now the gadgets are complex and proprietary.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
In modern cars. I could not do it myself in my Citroen. The mechanic had special tools and an endoscope. For a Reno, you need to pull off the bumper amongst other things.
(I like French cars. So cheap second hand.)
You don't even need to look for überadvanced tech on today's cars.
On all new cars these last years, the use of LEDs instead of bulbs allowed to install super cool, super fancy lights everywhere -for instance the fashion for turnlights recently was to wrap a luminous line of LEDs all around the stoplights, or even with ultra-zen shape inflections.
Very sillily, I just thought 'Ahh, fashion...' in the beginning.
This, until I understood that, from now on, whenever one of your stoplight or turlight dies, you cannot switch a 20-cent bulb there*.
You now MUST get back to the original automaker, to politely ask for this complex plastic element, ultra-zen-shaped, that, obviously, no one else than them can provide.
(Oh, and the left side isn't the same as the right side, mind you, don't confuse!)
I'd say, you'll pay it not ten times, but one hundred times the bulb cost.
Ahh, but this is for fashion, isn't it?
(*) and even, have a complete light repair set within the volume of a smartphone, slipped somewhere in the car, allowing you to repair in 5mn straight in front of the cop if need be...
Herve S.
CFC was in 2009 and that's ancient history in the salvage business. The crushed vehicles were typically over ten years old. Who drives that ancient shit today? What parts shortage?
I worked in the used car/auction/salvage biz at the time and nothing about CFC rules required crushing the good components. Buyers had a limited time to strip profitable parts then were required to crush the hull, long block (engine sans accessories) and transmission.
Most yards bought CFC cars at auction then parted them out. Wholesale and retail consumers bought those parts. All the engine accessories not oil-wetted were unaffected by the silicate and remained salable. It was economic to crush many as scrap prices (an important part of US foreign exchange) were high, but the vast majority of CFC vehicles no one would miss.
Outliers make the news but any car or SUV over ten years old (specialty vehicles of course excepted) is worth so little most salvage yards crush them when over 100 hulls accumulate. (100 hulls make it profitable to call in portable crusher outfits who flatten the hulks then take them to the shredder.)
Salvage yards usually have limited space and make money by turning over stock. Those CFC vehicles you mourn would have been long gone by now with or without CFC.
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
Lessee, about 15 or so years ago, I had a Grand Voyager. One day, a window fell down. Took it to a mechanic, and he replaced the belt that raises and lowers it. $160. 8 or so years later, newer Grand Voyager, same thing: nope, the mechanic said, "we both know it's only the belt, but they've made it a sealeed unit, which includes the motro, but I have no choice now but to replace the whole thing (for twice the price).
Oh, and about needing computers... my ancient, deally beloved Toyota Tercel wagon, an '86, with a carburetor, no computer, was a) still passing emission tests and b) getting 35-36mpg in 2000.
Blame the car companies. They want you to buy a new car every two years, like back in the late fifties.