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Tesla Faces FBI Probe Over Model 3 Production Numbers (cnbc.com)
A new report from The Wall Street Journal says the FBI is reviewing Tesla's Model 3 production numbers as part of an ongoing criminal probe into whether the company misled investors. "Federal agents are reviewing Tesla's stated Model 3 numbers dating back to early 2017, the Journal reports, citing unnamed sources," CNBC reports. From the report: Tesla had previously said it provided documents to the Department of Justice regarding CEO Elon Musk's controversial take-private tweet -- a blunder that ultimately cost Tesla and Musk a combined $40 million in fraud settlement fees. Now Tesla says it also provided information to the Department of Justice regarding Musk's public statements regarding production numbers of its Model 3 sedan. Tesla says the company has not received "a subpoena, a request for testimony, or any other formal process," but the Journal reported Friday that former Tesla employees have received subpoenas and requests for testimony.
... the value of political contributions and tolerating Trump's 'Business' panel.
https://www.theguardian.com/te...
"Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the future of the human race." - H. G. Wells
I told you the profit they claim to have made was the result of accounting fraud.
... that government has no business regulating how The People interact among themselves; if there are individuals who believe Tesla has breached some contract (e.g., by lying), then let them sue for breach of contract.
This ongoing persecution of Tesla is what happens when you not only bless one particular organization with a monopoly on violent imposition, but also when you give that violent monopoly the power to pick winners and losers.
The government's sole role was supposed to be to protect the rights of each individual, especially the rights to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness (i.e., the pursuit of self-interest).
There needs to be a Separation of Business and State.
They are so communist and anti-capitalist.
Musk didn't cut any corners. He simply used "border-radius: 8px".
#DeleteFacebook
Both are serious issues, both should be investigated.
Unnamed Sources and "people familiar with the matter" are the best sources to turn to if you need to get rid of some shorts. AMIRIGHT?
Tesla say nobody has contacted them.
Sounds like "fake news" from shorts if they're asking about Model 3 production numbers before Model 3 production started. According to Wikipedia, first Model 3 came off line in July 2017. While that is 2017 and it isn't late 2017, it's definitely not early 2017.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
Since when is a profit on stock s a right?
So... they pulled out too early?
Giggity.
I tell you what won't be pulling out early: the uncircmsized 14 inch nígger penis JAMMED good and hard right up your nasty rancid POOPER, ravagina you for an hour with blood from intense anal tearing as the ONLY lube. You'll be shitting blood and nígger cum for days!!
I was going to ask for clarification on how this contributes to the discussion, as the above AC response seemed... odd.
But then I researched the term Giggity, (I haven't watched television, except Firefly and Agents of Shield, in almost two decades) and now the AC response makes perfect sense.
Upending the defense contract rocket launch industry, the auto industry, and scaring the shit out of the energy industry will likely inspire some rather powerful establishments to ass-rape Elon.
No further clarification needed :-p
"Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the future of the human race." - H. G. Wells
And car maker dinosaurs.
They'd do ANYTHING to get rid of Musk. Even resorting to getting the FBI in there to "find" something... "anything, dear god, please, anything!".
Next up: "Musk found dead from 39 bullet shot wounds and his head being chopped of by an axe. Death ruled an 'accident'."
I can't stand Musk, mind you.
Doesn't mean I want to harm him.
This sounds more like it would be the jurisdiction of the SEC, unless they found potential criminal activity beyond just allegedly misleading investors.
Said the Trump supporter, verbatim, without a hint of ironic understanding.
You mean like the Saudis, who own 5% of Tesla?
Your parent never said government has no business asserting power over individuals, so your reply is a logical fallacy known as a "straw man".
Next, it's possible for 2 individuals to agree that the contract which binds their behavior will be arbitrated and enforced by the government, making such arbitration and enforcement by the government a perfectly voluntary interaction.
However, as an aside, one can see that the government need not play a special role here either; why should this one particular organization ("government") be the arbitrator? The individuals in question could agree to another arbitrator. Well, this point is just too much for most of you NPCs to grasp, so let's not go there.
...
But then I researched the term Giggity, (I haven't watched television, except Firefly and Agents of Shield, in almost two decades) and now the AC response makes perfect sense.
...
You might try The Expanse. It's the best TV I've seen in a very very long time.
- The Sigless Wonder
Tesla price back up to $330, that short position must be hurting, ha ha ha!
Here is a helpful link for you:
https://www.usa.gov/debt
Cool, it's on Amazon Prime, thanks!
"Every time I see an adult on a bicycle, I no longer despair for the future of the human race." - H. G. Wells
Sorry, but money is speech.
When Romney famously said "Corporations are People", what you leftists heard was "A corporation is a person", but what sane people heard was "A corporation is made up of people"; in the United States, the government is not allowed to curtail the right of those people to say what they want, and because publishing a statement requires resources, the government cannot curtail the right of those people to spend as much money as they want on saying whatever they want.
DO YOU GET IT YET?
Here's how to improve this situation. Make the laws even more dependent on money; get rid of Democracy, and replace it with Capitalism, so as to achieve 2 outcomes: Every single decision a person makes with his own resources is now effectively a "vote" on how society should allocate its resources; and, the weight of that person's vote is a privilege determined by how well that person's prior "votes" served the rest of society (i.e., the weight of a person's vote is determined by how much capital he's gained through prior voluntary trade).
Democracy is a dumb man's first draft of Capitalism; it's time to upgrade to full Capitalism.
They'd do ANYTHING to get rid of Musk. Even resorting to getting the FBI in there to "find" something... "anything, dear god, please, anything!".
Next up: "Musk found dead from 39 bullet shot wounds and his head being chopped of by an axe. Death ruled an 'accident'."
"Yep, worst case of suicide we ever saw! Poor soul, he was just too high-strung." -- Combined Aerospace, Automobile, and Energy Industry Interests.
Musk is an existential threat to the established industries in those sectors as well as to those in government who get all those fat corporate contributions from them.
Tesla Model 3/Falcon9FalconHeavy/PowerWall == Tucker Tornado x 3.
Go read about what the government, in collusion with established manufacturers, did to Tucker and Tucker Motors while keeping in mind he only threatened *one* major industrial sector's established players and that the government is at least as corrupt today as then, if not more so.
Strat
Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
Has there ever been a company which has had to endure as much media sponsored market manipulation as Tesla?
Two days ago the news headline was:
"Tesla reports surprise profit, stock surges. Tesla reported its third-ever profit in its eight years as a public company. This exceeded average analyst expectations of losses of 15 cents per share on revenue of $6.32 billion."
Today more speculative drama chipping away at its integrity and success.
Did that "stock surge" burn someone? Did someone think "oh dear, I was wrong, I should have gotten in earlier" or are the shorties still dreaming they can topple it?
I would think their is a whole shit load of people that opened short positions above 350 that are still doing just fine. Personally I don't mind shorting but anyone investing in Tesla or shorting tesla is a fucking moron, way to much emotion rather than reality in the share price as it is hugely influenced by a mentally unstable CEO. far safer profitable bets out their for investing and for shorting.
Manufacturers money they may be loosing is worth it for them, if for anything else but the entertainment value of Musk's' new tech he develops. seriously couldn't say this about anyone else.
[($)]
Musk is not the least bit threat to any of the big auto companies. At least 2 are known to have much better self driving tech and long distance hybrid and electric cars exist and more are coming in 2019 and a huge batch will arrive in 2020.
Musk is the cartoon character running across the collapsing bridge scrambling against physics to reach the other side. Gravity always wins in the real,world. We are watching live day by day as Tesla slowly succumbs to the inevitable.
It does not release monthly figures, it does not give country wide break up...
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
Because the actions of a corporation are the actions of the individual persons who comprise the corporation, there is no logical fallacy in treating the corporation as a person; such an abstraction is simply a shorthand.
Just like Tim Cook cannot murder Satya Nadella, neither can Apple murder Satya Nadella; the law encodes this simply as "No person shall murder another person". That's the power of abstraction: Simplification.
A corporation is person who meets certain legal criteria; Tim Cook is a person, but not a corporation, but Apple is a person who also meets the criteria for being a corporation. That is why a corporation is called a legal entity; it is defined by the laws of man rather than the laws of physics.
For those unfamiliar with the evils players in the car industry that want to destroy telsa, you can watch a biography about a previous 4th american competitor that was destroyed: Tucker: The Man and His Dream
There is so much money at stake its surprising that they havent just gone ahead and murdered musk.
"His name was James Damore."
Attacking Musk/Tesla using SEC did not work, then it is time to try some other way (somebody seems thought, IMHO)!
When was there ever a separation of business and state?
Hell, we're still celebrating just the separation of church and state, let alone business and state.
Sweden Not a Socialist Success.
They would have needed to have perfect timing, Tesla's price has ever only been over $350 for a handful of weeks if you check the historical data.
I agree with you about Tesla as an investment, whether you are long or short it is a huge gamble.
The story is old news and Tesla made a statement they haven't received any subpoenas from the DOJ.
The story was conveniently (for some) released as the stock was hitting +8% in a bear market, and it promptly dropped to around 0% for the day.
After about 20 minutes the market realized the story was bullshit and the stock continued to rise 5% by closing time, but the doubt has been sowed and momentum slowed.
Tesla Model 3 Is #1 Top Selling American Car In USA
https://cleantechnica.com/2018...
The only three cars that sold more than this American success story were the Toyota Camry, Honda Accord, and Honda Civic.
Ask me about repetitive DNA
With a logo that is dick, I often wonder how Amazon Prime doesnâ(TM)t get to people, I mean what does it say about a company if they donâ(TM)t get what it means?
Then I remember they are the largest seller of dildos and it all makes sense.
Lawsuits are handled in governmental courts, so you're admitting that your government idea is already a failure. Indeed, the vast majority of disputes between individuals are already handled through "private" arbitration; literally, the real world has rejected your position and has instead embraced mine (perhaps without anyone even realizing it, as though they were guided gently by the "Invisible Hand" of Evolution by Variation and Selection).
Part of "leveling the playing field" is making the court system a lot more efficient; that is, the government (or some other system of organization) needs to help individuals enforce their property rights—the problem is a lack of property rights.
Anyway, you seem to contradict yourself. You see, I thought your government idea is supposed to be implemented of The People, by The People, and for The People, so whence come these angels who will supposedly deliver The People from evil? Whence come these men-with-guns and jackboots who will wield with inspiring virtue your huge, quasi-religiously revered monopoly on violent imposition? Even back in 1850, Bastiat was already impugning this absurd position:
Goddamn. He tore you a new one.
There is no such thing as "Intelligent Design"; those who have tried have just led millions of people to their shallow, watery graves.
Lawsuits aren't handled by "governmental" courts. In first-world countries, great care is taken to make the judiciary independent of the government.
Private arbitration is a company's wet dream. They get to stack the deck in their favor and if the arbitration is binding, there's no legal recourse either.
The real world has rejected your notion of 'freedom'. In every civilized country government and judiciary keep individual and corporate greed in check.
The nice thing about government as it's set up today is that it requires no unusual virtue. There are checks and balances in place on every government function. Is this ideal? No. Is it much better than the free-for-all you're dreaming of? You bet.
Sorry, asshat, wrong.
Because YOU have a car. Or, rather, your dad has one, and you want to drive it when you grow up. Making you an idiot too.
Is using government to interfere with people's interactions. If someone breaks your contract, then don't do business with them any more. Simples. That IS what the free marketeers like you say when it comes to a business shitting over customers: they will lost customers and go out of business, so there's "no need" for regulation.
Yet here you are demanding government be used like a hammer.
Whiney shithea.
But I guess you gotta find SOME "reason" why he's bad. Can't be you, YOU can't be the bad one, so your hatred for Musk MUST be because HE is evil. Just like that woman is a spawn of satan for making that innocent priest think naughty thoughts: he's holy, so it can't be HIM, must be HER!!!
Odd how people will see it as bad when they aren't the hate filled, never when they are.
They're probing this but still can't probe what really happened in Las Vegas Mandalay shooting, massive government corruption, sex scandals across congress or helping find the missing trillions from the federal reserve?
These days it's less of a gamble if you are shorting - just write a bunch of FUD as an article and post it to a crowdsourced "news" site like SeekingAlpha, and all of a sudden you are at the top of everyone's Google searches on that company! Your piece of shit "thesis" based on old information and wild ass guesses gets read by tens of thousands of people, but it's ok because 8 pages later after a login that nobody is going to register for is where it discloses that you are shorting, and really intend to manipulate the market.
Get enough people doing this daily (which Tesla has) and you start to build a narrative made largely of horse shit - they can't make cars; they are all broken as they come off the line; they have no cash flow; their debt will come due and they'll file for bankruptcy; nobody is buying the cars; they just have fields of cars laying about with no buyers; it goes on and on, and all of it is pure shit from a horse.
Any time there is good news from Tesla, within 48 hours there is fresh steaming horse shit on offer from the shorts, which the press is all too happy to run citing "unnamed sources" because they are succumbing to click-bait and are in the business of selling advertisements; nothing to lose there because Tesla doesn't buy advertisements.
Getting back to todays fresh equine excrement, Tesla says that they have received one request from DoJ months ago (reported as well then) and have had zero requests for info, subpoenas, interviews, or anything else of note since. But you have to have already clicked into the article to see that this is a huge nothing sandwich, and CNBC has already been paid for the ads, and the FUD headline is already out there on everyone's feeds.
A headline like "No movement in DOJ - Tesla investigation" doesn't get the same attention I guess... probably because no body will click on a story where you are literally reporting nothing. So instead they'll put out old stale news with unnamed sources saying shit that is old and stale, but they serve it up like fresh pie, only nothing at the end that it's old and stale.
Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
There is so much money at stake its surprising that they havent just gone ahead and murdered musk.
Musk's cult of personality is keeping him alive. Kind of like Snowden, or Assange. Staying in the news keeps him relevant.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
I bet dollars to doughnuts that the short sellers were all 95% democrats.
Yes, Camrys, Accords, and Civics outsell the Model 3 in sales. But that's just cars - what the US buys now is trucks and SUVs, and for that, it's led by Ford who sells one F series pickup every 35 seconds. Consumers in the US have been moving away from cars for a long time, and the fact is that even Toyota and Honda sell more SUVs and trucks in the US than cars. Of the top 12 vehicles sold (of which Tesla does not break the ranks of), three are for cars - the other 9 (including the top 6) are trucks and SUVs. But if you want to crow about the "4th best selling car in the US", by all means - go for it!
As far as success story, Q3 Tesla claims to have made ~$330MM in profit (even though their cash flow position increased by $700MM - were bills not paid?). Ford did about $1B in profit for Q3, and GM is expected to do around $1.8B in profit, for the quarter - without any curious increase in cash position that doesn't correlate with earned profit (how do you make $330MM in profit but your cash position increased by over double that amount, unless you're not paying out everything you're supposed to?)
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
Civil courts (like criminal courts) are a governmental institution.
There is no greater form of checks and balances (or separation of powers) than competition in a market; that's why we have never had and hopefully will never have One World Government—at the level of the nation state, there has always been total anarchy, kept in check by their competition, and the civility has improved among the powers only as those powers have increasingly (though begrudgingly) adopted for their interactions the principles of Capitalism.
Your parent comment explained incredibly clearly why this arbitration/enforcement would be, by definition, through agreement in advance, voluntary interaction. There is no interference or imposition.
That's an old talking point.
Now that the Saudis are investors the big oil conspiracy vanished.
Lawsuits aren't handled by "governmental" courts. In first-world countries, great care is taken to make the judiciary independent of the government.
You're kidding, right? The courts are most definitely part of the government. In the US, the Constitution clearly states it is one of the three branches of government. Judges are selected and approved by the other two branches.
Did you mean that great care is taken to make the judiciary independent of political influence?
As far as success story, Q3 Tesla claims to have made ~$330MM in profit (even though their cash flow position increased by $700MM - were bills not paid?). Ford did about $1B in profit for Q3, and GM is expected to do around $1.8B in profit, for the quarter - without any curious increase in cash position that doesn't correlate with earned profit (how do you make $330MM in profit but your cash position increased by over double that amount, unless you're not paying out everything you're supposed to?)
Capital expenditures. Auto manufacturing is an extremely capital-intensive heavy industry. Tesla is still growing rapidly, making huge capital investments and paying for previous capital expenditures.
Go back and look at nearly any capital-intensive heavy industry at the same point in time from their beginning. They were nearly all deeply in debt and were not yet showing a profit despite most not having the level of competition and heavy-handed regulation Tesla faces from mature businesses and government.
Quite frankly it's amazing as hell Tesla is still in business at all, never mind showing any profit whatsoever in the hostile economic/financial/regulatory/competitive world in which it was created and exists currently.
Strat
Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
Whatabout if we move the goalposts over HERE!
( Two fallacies in one post! Good Job.)
Your beliefs are blinding you to reality. Tesla is doing pretty well. Deal with it.
"You want to know how to help your kids? Leave them the fuck alone." -George Carlin
No, it is not. However, Bernie Sanders and his ilk love to point to Denmark and the Scandinavian countries, especially Sweden, as an example of the success of their beliefs. However, Sweden is nothing like what they want; that's what's so weird.
Who moved the goalposts?
It's not the #1 selling car.
You can't say Tesla is #1 selling car behind...then list 3 cars that are outselling
It. It doesn't work that way.
So, let's make this really simple. You have $1.4 billion in the bank. You make $330 million in profit. How much do you now have? HINT: If the answer is $2.1 billion, something wasn't fully accounted for...
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
You're arguing about to what degree they are fucking crushing it. Nowhere in your retarded point were you able to refute that they are not fucking crushing it.
Do you think your wife is going to stick around after she sees how much you lost?
I bought 330 shares at $245 a few weeks ago.
I'm literally buying a new Tesla today.
Life is good for people like us.
I'll make it even simpler.
Without being able to see Tesla's ledgers, any speculation...good or bad...is just that; speculation.
Strat
Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
Yep. And it may very well be some financial incongruities which are causing the FBI to probe...
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
Tesla has tweeted this story is untrue
Elon Musk stated that they had a goal and expectation of production numbers and profitability, however, many investors did not believe it to be possible. They pulled out....
Elon Musk and Tesla achieved, and even exceeded their stated goals. So the investors who pulled out, basically are crying cause they lost thousands by pulling out too soon. And so now Elon and Tesla are being investigated for providing accurate estimates regarding future metrics.
It almost sounds like the real issue, wasn't that Elon stated inclination to take Tesla private in order to tank the stock. But more so on that he knew they were going to be successful and gain a lot more value. Hmm...
So they "investigate" over a tweet but not over credible evidence.
I thought fake news was bad? Or are they swinging alternative facts this time around?