Slashdot Mirror
Sega Dreamcasts and LAN Access?
I usually don't post nameless submissions, but this one was interesting enough that I figured it did deserve some attention. We've all heard about Sega's Dreamcast and how it has the capability to connect to the internet via it's 56k modem. So how does one go about connecting systems that are within a few feet of each other? Is it just me or do some of you think that Sega dropped the ball a bit when they didn't provide the Dreamcast with a way to connect to the local LAN?
... maybe you techs should stop playing games on that DC the boss bough you and do your job.
Perhaps you'd notice that the Dreamcast gives you a field you can use for additional init strings if needed when you set up your ISP account. And that this field is saved along with all the other account info.
Might I suggest you read the manual, too.
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
The DC modem is a module; the opportunity exists to attach other devices.
Sega haven't exactly made this fact a secret. Why not check out a DC-related web site (try www.planetdreamcast.com) before theorising about what a DC actually is?
--
Yes, somewhat faster then a modem but still a ton slower then a 10baseT network.
Does anyone know if the Dreamcast even supports null-modem connections?
-Brent--
I don't have a modem, but from the picture of the Dreamcast "builtin" modem at http://www.sega.com/console/index.shtml is seems clear to me that it probably connects to a high speed serial port. It would be quite easy to develop something that interfaced to ethernet instead of a phone jack.
It wouldn't surprise me if there was something in the works at sega to put Dreamcasts on the LAN, but it's probably of secondary importance to them.
I don't have my DC in front of me so I'll have to check it when I get home, but I could have sworn I saw a "serial link" port on the back of mine. If it DOES in fact have a serial port, why not use simple null modem connection to link 2 DC's together?
Yes this doesn't help for more than 2 but it's a start.
And I could not agree more about the DC's lack of LAN style connectivity, it would be GREAT to be able to replace the modem module with a 10mbps Ethernet module. The only other problem is finding enough TV's to support the networked DCs.
Getting a LAN party for PCs together is rather easy, but I don't think too many people will be packing up their DC AND 32" TV to go play Sonic Deathmatch.
Still, I'd love to see it as an option.
The whole reason the DC came with a regular phone modem is because it has the biggest established user base. Lowest Common Denominator. But, as some people have posted in threads above mine, Sega is going to release an ethernet adapter plug-in type thing, so it all works out in the end. As a cable modem user, I am a little bit mad I can't use it right out of the box, but I understand where Sega is coming from. On another note though, it the begining of the "article" it asks how to connect two systems together. I'm not even sure why you would want to do that, that's why there is 4 controller ports on the front. But if you did anyway, the PSX already has a thing that allows you to connect to PSX's together. So I guess it wouldn't be too hard for the DC to do the same thing if Sega really wanted them to do that.
And for the final time, THE DC DOES NOT HAVE WINDOWS CE AS IT'S ONLY OS!!! Every single time a DC story is ever posted on /., tons of ignorant people who hear the word Microsoft automatically think, without even bothering to check, that it means it always run's CE and doesn't/can't run anything else. CE is just one OS that can be used, the developer picks which one he uses. Sega also has their own OS that a developer could also use. It depends entirely on the game what OS it uses. Please get your facts straight before you start spewing off FUD.
Yeah... and do you remember when you'd have everything all up and working perfectly, and then those goddamned pesky dinosaurs would come stomping through the place and wreck everything? That used to really piss me off. (grin)
I used to set up two modems on two different PCs just a regular phone cable in between way back when there was just Doom. As I remember I had to pass some particularly cryptic AT-commands to the modems on each side, but it worked. I find it hard to beleive that Sega wouldn't provide some sort of support for this type of setup because it's so common and technically pretty trivial.
Of course it's not anywhere near as cool as having the systems set up on a LAN, but it's workable.
Sega does have to make a choice between cable and DSL, though.. I don't have cable, so I'm not sure how many cable modems out there have Ethernet hookups. Also worrying are those people who are now buying DSL modems on a card instead of an external modem with Ethernet jack.
To be honest, perhaps the most worrying of all to me is if they rig (is this possible at all? it might be...) it to not support hubs or PC NICs, only DSL/cable/etc, or if they did a DSL setup but gave special preference to people going through provider X...
Also keep in mind they have more opportunities for profit in their modem stuff than in opening their servers to ethernet hookup (and thus possibly to remote attacks). You can't ping flood a Dreamcast or the server it's playing on - do they want that? (And, on a more amusing note, do we want to introduce to Dreamcat the plague upon gaming society that is LPB whining? =D)
One thing is for sure, if the modem IS soldered on, the resulting controversy could just be a fatal kick in the jimmy, after the bad ROM fiasco.
I'm a LAN admin myself, and I'd rather shoot any one of my users in the head... ;)
Boy, I'm damn glad I don't have to call you to reset my password!!!
Strong data typing is for those with weak minds.
"Just think about where most LANs exist, in the workplace. How many workplaces do you think would allow Sega machines to be plugged into the LAN at the office?"
GRRR... you are obviously an admin. As Director of Information Technology for a rather decent sized company I will tell you that it has been my experience that LAN games relieve stress in the work place. They also tend to form a friendly and competitive bond between the people in your department. I allow scheduled LAN games during the week as long as work is completed and projects are on schedule. Running an IT department is like teaching elementary students with extremely high IQs. If we finish this assignment I will give you an extra five minutes at recess, ooh... ah. No not really, running an IT department is actually about taking a bunch anti-social computer nerds and give them a place to work were they feel comfortable and if LAN games keeps them productive and happy then so be it.
"I'm a LAN admin myself, and I'd rather shoot any one of my users in the head rather than allow them to play games on my LAN. "
By the way it is rather hard to imagine that you are only an admin with social skills such as these. Learn to lighten up and you'll go farther in your courier and in life.
Performance issues:
Let me tell you a little something, if you are running on 100BT Ethernet or better on your network it shouldn't matter that they are playing games. No one is going to be able to tell the difference except you and whoever is monitoring LAN traffic if anyone does that on your network.
GAMES PLAYED ON OUR LAN:
Quake II, Batlezone, Commanche 3, Longbow II, Dark Reign, CNC, and much more. The ones I listed were my favorites back when I had a chance to regularly join in.
"Stupidity is a virus not a virtue, if infected please kill it."
"Help me Obi-/.-Kenobi,your my only hope!" -$
Sega does have to make a choice between cable and DSL, though.
= -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I don't think this is the case. I have seen three different brands of cable modem and two different brands of DSL modems and both have plain 10Base-T on the back. The new cable modems @Home is using in Georgia have dual coaxial input and a 10/100 connection.
I don't have cable, so I'm not sure how many cable modems out there have Ethernet hookups.
I'm willing to bet all of them, since it makes little sense to invent new technology when 10BaseT ethernet is just so dirt cheap. Even if the cable modem doesn't need that much speed it's still much cheaper to get an ethernet card than rig some new proprietary connection. Although, some of the newer Motorola modems are using a USB connection. This is clearly not the option for techies since you can no longer connect to a hub and you are onyl supported with Win98.
Also worrying are those people who are now buying DSL modems on a card instead of an external modem with Ethernet jack.
Again, this isn't a move for techies since they will want the high speed connection to go to more than one computer (via a hub). Or, this is for techies who are smart enought to make that one computer the proxy/NAT machine and then put a plain ol' 10BaseT to a hub that has the other boxes (including the hypothetical high-speed DreamCast).
If you have an ethernet card on something, then by definition it support a hub...since the hardware is the same, just some connections (card to card or hub to hub) require a crossover. Assuming there was a switch to crossover or not (like on most hubs) this would be find.
I maintain that it would be way easy to ping or flood a Dreamcast connection if they went anywhere but a private network. Once I have the IP, it is maybe ten seconds work to get rid of some puny modem connection.
Or were you talking about ping flooding from the
DreamCasts? How the hell would you do that without access to the operating system?
Just my thoughts...
- JoeShmoe
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-- I wonder which will go down in history as the bigger failure: the War on Drugs or the War on Filesharing
I wish my fellow Linux geeks would get this message: THERE ARE CURRENTLY *NO* DREAMCAST GAMES AVAILABLE WHICH USE THE WINDOWS CE OS. ALL CURRENT DREAMCAST GAMES USE SEGA'S OWN KERNEL.
The reason: most pro game development houses found that the performance and other restrictions in Windows CE were simply unacceptable, and opted for the good ol' safe and proven iTron-based SEGA Kernel...
You know, if more of us anti-MS zealots knew this, maybe the Dreamcast would be viewed a bit more favourably as the games machine that proved WinCE isn't up to the task.
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
Here is a breif post on rumors of ethernet for the dreamcast.
Isn't is just as short-signed to ignore the number of homes that have cable modems or DSL and would like to run 10Mbit connection to that puppy?
= -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I'm hoping (for Sega's sake) that they are working on an addon module to enable a good ol' 10Base-T (or maybe even 10/100) connection.
Of course, if they simply upgraded the modem (by swapping out the part) to support home networking that would be a great solutions. Home networking is basically DSL connectivity within a household, something computer makers like Compaq are already doing.
I really, really, really hope Sega wasn't stupid enough to hard wire the modem on the motherboard. Anyone who has been around more than two years know that modem tech changes practically every six months, and I sure hope the Dreamcast has a long lifespan than that.
I don't even have a phone line in one of my residences because my cell phone is my primary phone and the residence has a cable modem. This means I can't even get digital cable service because the stupid GE box requires a regular phone line! (duh? TCI spend how many millions to enable two-way communication over their cable network, then decides on a cable box supplier that uses phone lines).
I also couldn't use DIVX, but I don't consider that much of a problem at all. =)
Just my thoughts...
- JoeShmoe
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
-- I wonder which will go down in history as the bigger failure: the War on Drugs or the War on Filesharing
http://www.gaming-age.com/ne ws2/november98/111998e.htm
http://www.gamenfo.com/Dreamcast/dr eamcast.html (ick, apologies in advance for the popup)
The 56k modem is in a pluggable module, so evidently Sega designed for this.
There is a serial port on the back of the console, but that seems to be better placed or suited for unit-to-unit connections rather than anything high speed (like ethernet).
More DC tidbits: drwiii Stupidly Disassembles his Dreamcast
--
The list of items rumoured to be in development for the Dreamcast include:
- Ethernet adapter
- Zip disk system
- DVD Player add-on
- USB port (part of the Zip addon)
- Higher capacity VMU's
- Serial link cable
I'd say that its just too soon for Sega to release this stuff - makes more sense to me that they'd wait for more multi-player games to be released that require things like the network adapter before actually releasing it.
The built-in 56k modem actually works quite well, and combined with the Sega keyboard it makes web browsing quite simple. I wish we had a trackball or mouse accessory though - I haven't heard of one being developed, and I try to stay on top of things like this.
So far, my guess is that there just aren't enough Dreamcast-owning people who *HAVE A NEED* for an ethernet adapter right now to justify the huge ramp-up production costs... but I bet that we will see this adapter soon.
Maybe within the next few months, when a few choice game software developers also release some good multiplayer games for the Dreamcast system this Christmas as well...
Now, the DC + Keyboard + eth0 + trackball mouse combo would be quite a killer setup, especially if the total cost were less than $300 (for all of it, including the DC). This would make for a very nice web-based data entry system for quite a few of my clients, games-machine capabilities aside...
j.
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
It's not too hard to make the Dreamcast talk TCP/IP over the network of your choice.
Items required:
1 Dreamcast
1 Linux box with reasonably quick modem
2 RJ-11 telephone patch cords
1 network
1 phone line simulator from Viking
Make PPP dialins work on linux box. Make PPP dialouts work on Dreamcast. Connect linux box to line simulator, connect line simulator to Dreamcast. Execute whatever sequence of button-pushage and disc-swappage required to initiate a call to the remote (several feet away) linux box. Enjoy.
Kid-proof tablet..