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Zhirinovsky to "Send Viruses to the West"

In another of many terribly funny quotes from Russian ultra-nationalist Vladimir Zhirinovsky, he's stated that Russians don't drink anymore, and they are poaching money from the West. This is almost as funny as The Onion's parody of Patrick Buchanan, who's said some funny things himself. Perhaps we can get those two together somehow. *grin*

10 of 177 comments (clear)

  1. Re:Who controls the money supply in Russia? by Alex+Belits · · Score: 3
    Sorry, submitted it before without editing

    And it looks to me like something similar is happening in Russia. *Something* is causing people there to barter, whether it's a black market (which would imply those trade restrictions again), a government reduction in the money supply (trying to fight inflation, perhaps?) or simply the chain reaction of people pulling their money out of the country to avoid what they see as a financially dangerous situation.

    While I am not up to date with the current development, I know how it started because I was there. I may omit or distort some details in this description, so I welcome other Russians (no American poltitcians and journalists, pls.) to correct me where I am wrong.

    USSR economy originally was handled by the government. Government handled prices and planning of distribution of products, so while money and contracts existed and worked, government had power to determine possible relationships between "companies", import/export, prices, salaries, etc. Some things intentionally operated at loss, getting funds directly from the government.

    When reforms started, originally the ownership wasn't changed, however some "companies" were switched to more money-based model -- they had to keep more of their profits, had more choice in prices, salaries and their relationships with others even though the "owner" remained the same -- government. In a lot of cases it worked, however old low prices became impossible to maintain -- "companies" became disinterested in keeping prices low enough to let the rest of the economy, still entirely sponsored by the government, coexist with them. At the same time government started encouraging the creation of small businesses that were privately owned and had nothing to do with government except paying (high) taxes. Of course, those businesses were interested in increasing prices, however since most of them had to buy raw materials and equipment from "companies" owned by government, they still benefitted from arftificially limited prices that were in use there.

    After some time prices became split -- everything under strict control of the government tried to keep their prices low, everything else tried to keep them upper to reflect production cost, supply and demand. While unrestricted prices were growing, government had to increase their prices and funds allocated for government-sponsored production, education, research, health care and defense. Inflation started, however with no mechanism that balances government-handled part of economy in the presence of [semi-]independent and private parts of the economy, spending started to increase fast, pulling the inflation upper. To make things worse, salaries of people still working for the government (what was a majority of the economy) became significantly lower than employees of private companies, so large number of well-educated people left government-handled industry.

    Government started industry "privatization" campaign in attempt to create a kind of balance in the economy that does not require government to constantly adjust things (what it was clearly incapable of), however "privatization" quickly turned into looting -- former managers and government bureaucrats became "owners" and "shareholders" of what they previously managed, and with their personal wealth increased by many orders of magnitude they didn't become interested in any kind of useful economic activity. The rest of population got nothing.

    With still unbalanced economy, disinterested and incapable managers and businesses owners, choking government-sponsored education and health care, inflation continued to grow. Businesses started to switch to banking, trade, import-export from their original activities. Underfunded government became a victim of widespread corruption -- it became less profitable and safe to operate a legitimate business than to bribe bureaucrats to accept some bogus contract, make something worthless or near to worthless, get money, then use them to bribe more bureaucrats. Organized crime expanded, stability decreased even less, and businessmen started looking for means to secure their money. Since investment became unsafe in this kind of conditions, they had to convert money into stable currency and leave Russia, continuing to operate their still profitable businesses in Russia from abroad.

    This caused more instability, less production and further deterioration of everything that remained in the hands of the government. In addition to inflation money became unreliable simply because the production decreased below the demand.

    --
    Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
  2. We sent them help? by tilly · · Score: 4

    They don't see it.

    The help we sent got swallowed up in the general corruption. Despite our claims of sending help the average Russian peasant has never seen it so bad.

    Let me give one example.

    Around 40% of Russian male prisoners have drug-resistant TB. Given the size of the prison system and the huge turnover, Russia is turning into the epicenter of an epidemic.

    Here in the US we can usually treat drug-resistant TB, even if it does cost thousands/person. In Russia? Not a chance. They get a shipment of drugs, throw it at the prisoners, run out and thereby produce perfect conditions to breed resistant diseases.

    The US has forgotten TB, "consumption" is a quaint word that most people don't really recognize.

    Well until the 40's it was the leading cause of death in the US. It is back in Russia, with a vengeance. Over the next 5-10 years a significant fraction of Russia will experience that endless cough, and watch their bodies slowly waste away as they are "consumed" by a disease that Western medicine is going to be helpless to prevent.

    Don't be too complacent - it is coming here as well and public health officials don't have a clue how to handle it. The death rate has been rising since the 80's. Unless we have a miracle, we will experience what happens when diseases evolve past our ability to treat them. Welcome back to seeing your once young and healthy friend Johnny die for no greater crime than encountering "bad air".

    Today this plague is theoretical in the West. But not in Russia. Russia once boasted universal health care. It was not great, but it was available, and people trusted it. No longer. The free market (and corruption, but people hear the words free market) changed all that.

    Take a second look at Russia. The social chaos. The poverty. The diseases. The crime. The drugs.

    They blame it all on the West.

    Sure, the West claims to have sent money. What money? They never saw the money. They saw lots of other things come from the West though. Bite the hand that fed them you say? Many of them would see it as justifiable self-defence!

    Regards,
    Ben

    --
    My usual seat in the cluetrain is at A HREF="http://pub4.ezboard.com/biwethey.ht
  3. Not true. by Sick+Boy · · Score: 4

    I've worked with 2 Russians, one of whom was a severe alcoholic and one who didn't drink at all. Therefore 50% of Russians drink, and this man is a liar.

    --
    Does narcissism count as a hobby? --Shawn Latimer
  4. The scary part... by mlc · · Score: 3

    The really scary thing here is that this politician is real, and is actually getting votes. It's one thing when some right-wing wacko (in your home country or abroad) makes scary statements in an attempt to get attention; it's quite another when that wacko (and I feel justified in calling these people wackos) starts to get votes (8% and rising, according to the article). While I hope this guy doesn't mean what he says, some of it resonates strongly with what people in this country are saying. When he announces that they don't have AIDS in Russia (which they do, of course), he sounds awfully like some right-wing people here in the US who claim that AIDS only affects homosexuals, or the immoral, or people whose last name begins with T, or whoever.

  5. Perception vs Reality by tilly · · Score: 3

    First I don't think that the Soviet system crushed itself. It just could not sustain an arms race with the most prosperous country on Earth. Additionally I cannot prove a thing, but I strongly suspect that the CIA had a part in the collapse of the Soviets. One of the more interesting articles that I have stumbled across is a 1984 article in the Whole Earth Catalog (not known for being a right wing publication) detailing how the 1982 events in Poland were orchestrated by the CIA operating with the Catholic Church in an experiment on using non-violent resistance. Given the events later in the decade I would not consider it beyond belief that said experiment was deemed a success and tried on a larger scale. (Proof, what is that? This is just a theory.)

    Regardless of that, you are perfectly correct about what the Russian economy is. However the people were told that they were getting a free market economy, they have been told they have a free market economy, and that is what they are blaming their troubles on.

    As for your dismissal, read some history. A signficant portion of economic reality is belief. What people believe is true, really is. Look again at Hitler. No, the Jews didn't hand away Germany in WW I. No, the Jews were not the cause of Germany's economic troubles.

    Yet Hitler managed to come to power, and acting at odds with all accepted economic principles really did manage to take a ruined country and put it together (while the rest of the World was collapsing into the Great Depression). He really did rebuild the country. He really did produce the finest highway system ever seen. He really did make Germans proud to be German. He really did restore the military. He really did conquer Europe. Had he not been an idiot and nutcase, he would have kept it as well!

    All of this despite the fact that his description of the causes of the existing troubles were completely loony, and despite (because of?) complete ignorance of how economics was supposed to work.

    Just because someone is utterly mistaken does not mean that they cannot be very effective. Particularly in areas where belief is so critical.

    Regards,
    Ben

    --
    My usual seat in the cluetrain is at A HREF="http://pub4.ezboard.com/biwethey.ht
  6. I'm not laughing by sugarman · · Score: 4

    I realize this is pretty up-tight, but making Zhirinovsky out to be some fun-lovin', practical-jokin' frat-boy is probably not in anyone's best interests.

    Its one thing to be cracking wise and making threats when you're in Delta House, but when you're a political leader who could (potentially) be controlling the world's second largest nuclear arsenal*, cracking wise about expansionism and assaults on other nations doesn't help your cred much.

    It didn't work well for Reagan, and we shouldn't be laughing at this wacko either. I'd treat his threats seriously. It may be easy to dismiss him as a nut when he only has 8% share, but that 8% change rapidly (just ask anyone from Minnesota).

    * alright, this may be FUD, I'm no longer sure of Russia's potential nuclear capabilities. Somehow I don't think they've gotten rid of everything yet though...

    --
    --sugarman--
  7. Bizarre humor indeed by tilly · · Score: 5

    He isn't stupid or crazy though. Never think that. His core constituency is anti-West. They have seen the West crush the Soviet system, lose them their empire, have a free market thrust down their throats only to bring utter poverty, disease, and hunger to them, and they don't like it. The more that he can make it seem that the West is afraid of him, the more they love him.

    The resulting antics seem foolish, stupid, and bizarre to Western eyes. But don't dismiss him lightly. A violent, dispossessed, and easily manipulated minority in the hands of a rabble-rouser is a very effective hand to produce a dictatorship. May I remind everyone of a similarly audacious "lunatic" who unified a country, restored its economy, hope, and pride? I am speaking, of course, of a once-Austrian who wound up leading Germany, Adolf Hitler.

    Sleep tight...
    Ben

    --
    My usual seat in the cluetrain is at A HREF="http://pub4.ezboard.com/biwethey.ht
  8. No. by BMIComp · · Score: 3

    Russians don't drink anymore? =P

    This guy's a little pzykotic. He blamed Jews for the Holocaust and WWII, since "there were too many Jews"... this guys a looney.

  9. "..aren't laughing now" by strlen · · Score: 3
    Please dont love at Jirinovsky. He's nothing to be laughed about. In fact, to some degree he summarizes the key points of what Russians want (I, being from a former U.S.S.R. republic do know what I am talking about).
    • Their pride restored. During the U.S.S.R. Russia was a powerfull nations, whos armed forces could turn New York into a powerdercake, whos scientists were among the best in the world, where there was no unemployement, there was no crime, there was no AIDS and alcoholism was being fought against (if you were found drunk on the street, be ready to smell boots and loose your liver).
    • Yankees go home. American cultural has infiltrated Russia much more then it has the rest of Europe. Every Russian girl dreams to be like an American slut. I doubt there is anyone in Russia who likes that.
    • Order. Crime began to climb rapidly in Russia after the fall of Gorrbachev and the U.S.S.R. Streets are dirty, buttons in elevators are burned out, the whole country looks like a project in NYC.
    If he comes to power, which he might, depending on how well Putin does (assuming he does get elected as the president) and how popular the communists become, many of US will know what a T66 is, just like we know what a Panzer is.
  10. Russia doesn't have a drinking problem? by / · · Score: 3

    Open letter to Zhirinovsky from his family:

    Please, Zhirinovsky, we don't want to see you hurt yourself or others. We miss the old days when you didn't come home from the Duma in the middle of the night and urinate on the living room floor. There are people who can help you -- they've helped themselves and they've helped others before you. We have a book we want you to read. You don't have to do it if you don't want, but all the same we hope you'll do it. We love you. And little Sasha wants some help assasinating rival political opponents. Who will teach him if you don't? Please, if you won't do it for yourself, do it for us.

    Tseluyem,
    Vasha Sem'ya

    --
    "If one is really a superior person, the fact is likely to leak out without too much assistance" -- John Andrew Holmes