Hehe, I'm not German but I live in Germany as well. I wasn't trying to promote the TU or anything, after all the news about the video were on Engadget, an American site.
The thing is, as you've said it, we usually receive our tech news from US-based outlets which sometimes portray the American market. That's not necessarily bad, but we're losing many good news entries in the process. Our physical location doesn't change that a thing. Even if you are in Germany or in Africa or in Canada, you probably receive your mainstream IT tips from on of the usual sources (Engadget, Slashdot, etc).
Needless to say, if one of these channels happens NOT to showcase a company or product or service, that company or product or service is like it never happened...
You know, maybe you're right. But this goes a lot deeper. It's like the coverage of Nokia in respect to Apple and Google. It's abysmal.
We live in a globalized world. Why you guys keep searching for news only in your neighborhood? Why other institutions and/or companies (non-US) never take the right coverage even if they have interesting products and services to portray?
The data exchanged by the widgets is ridiculously low. It's a non issue. Everyone using such a phone (and an iPhone too) have a flat rate connection now days. But even if not, you can always cancel them and regain your screen estate. See? The liberty approach from Symbian is a far cry from the militaristic iOS which is Steve's way or the highway.
HDR? Hahaha, you're talking me about a software tech that arrived just DAYS ago and it can always come to Nokia as we speak. I'm talking you about the raw hardware capabilities of the N8 against the iPhone 4. Both in video and still pictures.
As for the time issues. While working for the iPad as you say, hello?! They worked for the iMac/iPod since last century (1999) to say the least. Nokia in that time will have completely transformed itself to the Internet company it wants to become, having profits from hardware smartphones only as a minor segment.
But it's only speculation. All next year models from Nokia will have NFC and MeeGo is about to arrive in a fully customizable superdevice that will blow the competition out of the water.
Forget the Apple stock trends. They show the past. Time to sell those Apple stocks and cash out when you can. You'll become poor in no time.
Here we go again.. Do we really have to repeat ourselves?
They DID put decent devices in respect to the competition, that's why they were number 1 for the greater part of the last decade. They only thing they didn't do well was to calculate the disrupting effects of the iPhone approach in upper-level devices in 2007. THREE years ago and with real effects only the last year or so.
Apple is eating their lunch NOW, no one can say if it will be the case forever, especially when one misstep from Apple (close call with the antenna issues of iPhone 4!) can reverse the situation in no time.
Yes, I've wondered why some guys become fanboys. It's the moment when you lose touch with reality because of some fancy new way of presenting the same old technology as new yet again. That's why people now days almost always talk about Apple fanboys. It's the moment you become myopic and don't admit anymore that competition is closing the gaps and you don't have a such cool product albeit you pay a fortune to have it.
As a for the Symbian ecosystem, you obviously haven't tried Symbian^3 even for a demo. I thought fanboys were crying wolf about its resemblance with iOS? So how can it be horrible when you do almost everything the iOS do, but adding more freedom against obscure and ridiculous Jobsonian rules?
The developers care about openness. Only apps are missing for the moment from Symbian. The rest is all here.
C'mon, they can get that data over push technology or query the server every 15-30 minutes. As it does with your mail.
Hardware comparison is not easily dismissed by pure processor frequency numbers. The Symbian OS has been historically much more easier to the resources of the smartphone. This also explains the legendary battery life. You have to actually use the phone to say. Previews so far say that the N8 is fast like a snap.
And yes, the 12 MPixel camera blows the competition away. Search for some reviews, both for static pictures and video.:)
Give Nokia some time means be realistic. We gave time 10 years from 1998 when Bill was saving it with some pocket cash app to 2008 when the iPhone revolutionized the mobile apps world.
Just admit it. It's time to sell those Apple stocks...:D
How people operate? Hey, this has been Nokia's ability for the decade before Apple stole that crown. Give me a break and learn about the history of mobile phones, at least in Europe.
Apple indeed proved that you can succeed with a touch-screen phone only, but it was also a success made possible by the iPod that came before it and paved the way. The 2G and 3G iPhones were really ridiculous specs-wise, but fanboys would still use them.
Only last year (3GS) we finally had a nice, fast phone. So, seriously, it's only these last two years Nokia didn't have any alternatives to offer.
I know you're a fanboy, I can read it in your sig. Perhaps you even have Apple stocks so you want to influence here, but let's cut the crap and speak facts.
Apple disrupted the market in 2007. Nokia didn't have good alternatives to show. Now it has. And with the Qt, the days will be much more fan for Nokia customers now.
Qt gets raving reviews for desktop applications, imagine what it can do to the mobile business since it might be able to target even Windows Phone 7 and Chrome NaCl in the future.
You may think it's a mess, many others think not. I, for one, crave for some widgets on my home screen. It's instant information without having to unlock the phone and navigate to an app.
It's 2007. Hell, Steve didn't even care to give us info-bearing icons for the applications. Apart from the calendar icon, not even the temperature (weather) one carries any data WITHOUT opening an app first. This sucks. And it's getting old soon.
SE jumped ship for tactical reasons, not strategic. It still remains a Symbian council member. If Symbian^3 and ^4 prove to be successes it may always come back.
Maemo = MeeGo from most developers points of view. Same philosophy. No Jobsonian limits.
Give Nokia some time. Yes they lost precious time because they didn't invest early enough on an alternative OS, but now Symbian provides everything an iOS has. And on better hardware. Of course you can always be a fanboy and not see all that.
You obviously didn't get my example. I wanted to prove INDEED the only advantage of iPhone right now. Apps! But this will change soon now that the Qt SDK is alive and kicking. It's so much easier to port apps on the multitude of Nokia devices. Both top of the line MeeGos and cheapo Symbians.
As for the N8, it's just the begginning of the end. Expect Nokia U (the community-designed model) to kick ass once it arrives.
Admitting Apple is all about marketing is admitting you're an idiot that falls for commercials.
I don't give a shit about marketing, I do 99% of the stuff most people do with their iPhones using web interfaces and the most common apps that are available for all platforms.
Yes, there is a 1% of good and worthy apps that are iPhone-only, but high-prize contests such as this one by Nokia and AT&T will cover the distance soon enough. Now that the Qt toolkit is mature enough for mobile development, no good developer can ignore porting his/her best apps to the largest market.
Oh, and Nokia's comeback to the highest segment (call me N8) will do the rest. And don't get me started about MeeGo...:)
Having widgets that provide information (mails, notifications, weather, sports, etc) on your homepage is a... mess?!
What are you talking about, dude? The iOS homescreen is soooo 2007, only stupid icons that provide no info whatsoever. Hell, even the notification system in the iOS is a mess and even Apple fanboys admit it.
Maemo == MeeGo, for most purposes, don't worry. The Qt IS a driver for Symbian and MeeGo and everything because the real lack of Nokia today is in the apps department.
That's why they propose these $10 million app contests, what have were you thinking?
When Symbian/MeeGo finally get all the apps iPhones get, the superior Nokia hardware will do the rest.
Check this example. This is the current situation, damnit. iPhone gets all the apps so people believe it's "better". It's not. All phones can virtually do the same stuff these days, the thing is Nokia and others were lacking at their development tools. It was difficult and not worthy to create Symbian apps.
This is changing with the Qt. N8-class phones will do there rest.
Your comparison is off mark by a lot. The video game console market is a NICHE market where high-quality entertainment apps are a must.
The amateur developers of the 21st century are literally thousands and rising. They don't need to rotate the latest 3D graphics, they may use development tools for school or fun.
And customization-modding is a huge "after-market" if you allow me.
Come on, dude, seriously. The comparison with the car industry is totally inaccurate. For many reasons.
First, the automotive technology is much slower to develop. You don't have the disruptive leaps we see in the mobile devices' segment.
Second, GM went bankrupt for many more reasons than you can possibly imagine, not because it was selling low-profit cars. If that was the case, why was Ferrari ever bought from FIAT back in the 80s?
Third, when you finally take off your blindfolds and actually PLAY with a Symbian^3 OS (even on a simulator!) you'll see that it has nothing to do with previous generations albeit the name.
Fourth, the Qt toolkit is a major winner for every developer, amateur and professional. Hell, it can even target Mac and who knows if a crazy dude doesn't create a fork for iOS as well now that the third-party development tools are allowed again by dictatorial Apple.
You seem to forget history. In technology you only need ONE disruptive product or service and it can be done. Apple has been in the verge of collapse on its own for many many years in the late 90s but it survived. Nokia has been even more times in difficulty in its 100-year-old history.
The reason Nokia is not making much of profit is that it has lost the battle in the upper-class smartphones, those that have the highest margins. Apple is totally nonexistent in developing markets with relatively cheap models. Don't underestimate China, India, and South America.
And for God's sake, NOW the time is ripe, NOW finally Symbian^3 has nothing to envy and N8 is a hugely capable device.
It is dropping like rock by the lack of competitive devices (N8) and updated UI and development environment (Symbian^3). Both issues have been addressed now.
Just give them time, the double OS strategy (MeeGo/Symbian) using a simple development kit and SDK is genius and in the long run it will bear fruit. Hardware-wise Nokia has always been extremely strong. Now their OSes and tools are finally catching app with the competition.
Don't underestimate Qt. If Nokia doesn't fail with the marketing effort, Qt can alone save the day. It's spectacular what you can do with it!
See Tolleman's excellent reply. Your definition about dumbness and smartness in phones is pretty hazy.
For me (and for Nokia), a smartphone is a phone with an advanced OS that its uses are mainly extended by complex apps. By this definition Series 40 phones are dumbphones and Symbian are smartphones.
MeeGo, although technically smartphones can be much much more, if Nokia gets that right in the future. We will see.
Nokia has an excellent OS in Maemo/Meego, but still they keep beating this dead horse. Unbelievable. 'Nuff said.
And some dudes still fail to understand the ace on the sleeve of Nokia... the Qt SDK!
Who cares what you will be running in 2011 once developers will be able to develop cross-platform apps that run both on MeeGo and Symbian. Customers won't even see the difference and they will probably keep adoring their trusty Symbian smartphones with the huge battery life.
Too sad that opinions about global corporation doings are shaped almost always but their achievements in the American market and media outlets.
Yes Nokia/Symbian is still huge and prosperous, except for the US market. Many statistics you see around showing Apple or RIM or Google at half the market are simply not taking into consideration other markets as well.
Isn't this the perfect moment for Google to pass to Scala for Java-like development and Go! for the rest of it (critical native components)? To hell with Java the language. After all, what is really important is the JVM and they've already forked that with Dalvik.
Slashdot Mirror
Hehe, I'm not German but I live in Germany as well. I wasn't trying to promote the TU or anything, after all the news about the video were on Engadget, an American site.
The thing is, as you've said it, we usually receive our tech news from US-based outlets which sometimes portray the American market. That's not necessarily bad, but we're losing many good news entries in the process. Our physical location doesn't change that a thing. Even if you are in Germany or in Africa or in Canada, you probably receive your mainstream IT tips from on of the usual sources (Engadget, Slashdot, etc).
Needless to say, if one of these channels happens NOT to showcase a company or product or service, that company or product or service is like it never happened...
You know, maybe you're right. But this goes a lot deeper. It's like the coverage of Nokia in respect to Apple and Google. It's abysmal.
We live in a globalized world. Why you guys keep searching for news only in your neighborhood? Why other institutions and/or companies (non-US) never take the right coverage even if they have interesting products and services to portray?
Why nobody is talking about TU Braunschweig's efforts in this matter? Hell, we even have a video from them, drop Google's "secretly".
If the W3C says don't use HTML5 yet, they blew it. :p
The data exchanged by the widgets is ridiculously low. It's a non issue. Everyone using such a phone (and an iPhone too) have a flat rate connection now days. But even if not, you can always cancel them and regain your screen estate. See? The liberty approach from Symbian is a far cry from the militaristic iOS which is Steve's way or the highway.
HDR? Hahaha, you're talking me about a software tech that arrived just DAYS ago and it can always come to Nokia as we speak. I'm talking you about the raw hardware capabilities of the N8 against the iPhone 4. Both in video and still pictures.
As for the time issues. While working for the iPad as you say, hello?! They worked for the iMac/iPod since last century (1999) to say the least. Nokia in that time will have completely transformed itself to the Internet company it wants to become, having profits from hardware smartphones only as a minor segment.
But it's only speculation. All next year models from Nokia will have NFC and MeeGo is about to arrive in a fully customizable superdevice that will blow the competition out of the water.
Forget the Apple stock trends. They show the past. Time to sell those Apple stocks and cash out when you can. You'll become poor in no time.
Sell sell sell!
Here we go again.. Do we really have to repeat ourselves?
They DID put decent devices in respect to the competition, that's why they were number 1 for the greater part of the last decade. They only thing they didn't do well was to calculate the disrupting effects of the iPhone approach in upper-level devices in 2007. THREE years ago and with real effects only the last year or so.
Apple is eating their lunch NOW, no one can say if it will be the case forever, especially when one misstep from Apple (close call with the antenna issues of iPhone 4!) can reverse the situation in no time.
Yes, I've wondered why some guys become fanboys. It's the moment when you lose touch with reality because of some fancy new way of presenting the same old technology as new yet again. That's why people now days almost always talk about Apple fanboys. It's the moment you become myopic and don't admit anymore that competition is closing the gaps and you don't have a such cool product albeit you pay a fortune to have it.
As a for the Symbian ecosystem, you obviously haven't tried Symbian^3 even for a demo. I thought fanboys were crying wolf about its resemblance with iOS? So how can it be horrible when you do almost everything the iOS do, but adding more freedom against obscure and ridiculous Jobsonian rules?
The developers care about openness. Only apps are missing for the moment from Symbian. The rest is all here.
C'mon, they can get that data over push technology or query the server every 15-30 minutes. As it does with your mail.
Hardware comparison is not easily dismissed by pure processor frequency numbers. The Symbian OS has been historically much more easier to the resources of the smartphone. This also explains the legendary battery life. You have to actually use the phone to say. Previews so far say that the N8 is fast like a snap.
And yes, the 12 MPixel camera blows the competition away. Search for some reviews, both for static pictures and video. :)
Give Nokia some time means be realistic. We gave time 10 years from 1998 when Bill was saving it with some pocket cash app to 2008 when the iPhone revolutionized the mobile apps world.
Just admit it. It's time to sell those Apple stocks... :D
How people operate? Hey, this has been Nokia's ability for the decade before Apple stole that crown. Give me a break and learn about the history of mobile phones, at least in Europe.
Apple indeed proved that you can succeed with a touch-screen phone only, but it was also a success made possible by the iPod that came before it and paved the way. The 2G and 3G iPhones were really ridiculous specs-wise, but fanboys would still use them.
Only last year (3GS) we finally had a nice, fast phone. So, seriously, it's only these last two years Nokia didn't have any alternatives to offer.
I know you're a fanboy, I can read it in your sig. Perhaps you even have Apple stocks so you want to influence here, but let's cut the crap and speak facts.
Apple disrupted the market in 2007. Nokia didn't have good alternatives to show. Now it has. And with the Qt, the days will be much more fan for Nokia customers now.
Qt gets raving reviews for desktop applications, imagine what it can do to the mobile business since it might be able to target even Windows Phone 7 and Chrome NaCl in the future.
You may think it's a mess, many others think not. I, for one, crave for some widgets on my home screen. It's instant information without having to unlock the phone and navigate to an app.
It's 2007. Hell, Steve didn't even care to give us info-bearing icons for the applications. Apart from the calendar icon, not even the temperature (weather) one carries any data WITHOUT opening an app first. This sucks. And it's getting old soon.
SE jumped ship for tactical reasons, not strategic. It still remains a Symbian council member. If Symbian^3 and ^4 prove to be successes it may always come back.
Maemo = MeeGo from most developers points of view. Same philosophy. No Jobsonian limits.
Give Nokia some time. Yes they lost precious time because they didn't invest early enough on an alternative OS, but now Symbian provides everything an iOS has. And on better hardware. Of course you can always be a fanboy and not see all that.
You obviously didn't get my example. I wanted to prove INDEED the only advantage of iPhone right now. Apps! But this will change soon now that the Qt SDK is alive and kicking. It's so much easier to port apps on the multitude of Nokia devices. Both top of the line MeeGos and cheapo Symbians.
As for the N8, it's just the begginning of the end. Expect Nokia U (the community-designed model) to kick ass once it arrives.
Word of advice: sell your Apple stocks ASAP! :p
Admitting Apple is all about marketing is admitting you're an idiot that falls for commercials.
I don't give a shit about marketing, I do 99% of the stuff most people do with their iPhones using web interfaces and the most common apps that are available for all platforms.
Yes, there is a 1% of good and worthy apps that are iPhone-only, but high-prize contests such as this one by Nokia and AT&T will cover the distance soon enough. Now that the Qt toolkit is mature enough for mobile development, no good developer can ignore porting his/her best apps to the largest market.
Oh, and Nokia's comeback to the highest segment (call me N8) will do the rest. And don't get me started about MeeGo... :)
Having widgets that provide information (mails, notifications, weather, sports, etc) on your homepage is a... mess?!
What are you talking about, dude? The iOS homescreen is soooo 2007, only stupid icons that provide no info whatsoever. Hell, even the notification system in the iOS is a mess and even Apple fanboys admit it.
Maemo == MeeGo, for most purposes, don't worry. The Qt IS a driver for Symbian and MeeGo and everything because the real lack of Nokia today is in the apps department.
That's why they propose these $10 million app contests, what have were you thinking?
When Symbian/MeeGo finally get all the apps iPhones get, the superior Nokia hardware will do the rest.
Check this example. This is the current situation, damnit. iPhone gets all the apps so people believe it's "better". It's not. All phones can virtually do the same stuff these days, the thing is Nokia and others were lacking at their development tools. It was difficult and not worthy to create Symbian apps.
This is changing with the Qt. N8-class phones will do there rest.
http://graphics.thomsonreuters.com/F/07/GLB_SMPHN0710.gif
Who's falling again?! Ah yes, Apple...
Your comparison is off mark by a lot. The video game console market is a NICHE market where high-quality entertainment apps are a must.
The amateur developers of the 21st century are literally thousands and rising. They don't need to rotate the latest 3D graphics, they may use development tools for school or fun.
And customization-modding is a huge "after-market" if you allow me.
Come on, dude, seriously. The comparison with the car industry is totally inaccurate. For many reasons.
First, the automotive technology is much slower to develop. You don't have the disruptive leaps we see in the mobile devices' segment.
Second, GM went bankrupt for many more reasons than you can possibly imagine, not because it was selling low-profit cars. If that was the case, why was Ferrari ever bought from FIAT back in the 80s?
Third, when you finally take off your blindfolds and actually PLAY with a Symbian^3 OS (even on a simulator!) you'll see that it has nothing to do with previous generations albeit the name.
Fourth, the Qt toolkit is a major winner for every developer, amateur and professional. Hell, it can even target Mac and who knows if a crazy dude doesn't create a fork for iOS as well now that the third-party development tools are allowed again by dictatorial Apple.
You seem to forget history. In technology you only need ONE disruptive product or service and it can be done. Apple has been in the verge of collapse on its own for many many years in the late 90s but it survived. Nokia has been even more times in difficulty in its 100-year-old history.
The reason Nokia is not making much of profit is that it has lost the battle in the upper-class smartphones, those that have the highest margins. Apple is totally nonexistent in developing markets with relatively cheap models. Don't underestimate China, India, and South America.
And for God's sake, NOW the time is ripe, NOW finally Symbian^3 has nothing to envy and N8 is a hugely capable device.
It is dropping like rock by the lack of competitive devices (N8) and updated UI and development environment (Symbian^3). Both issues have been addressed now.
Just give them time, the double OS strategy (MeeGo/Symbian) using a simple development kit and SDK is genius and in the long run it will bear fruit. Hardware-wise Nokia has always been extremely strong. Now their OSes and tools are finally catching app with the competition.
Don't underestimate Qt. If Nokia doesn't fail with the marketing effort, Qt can alone save the day. It's spectacular what you can do with it!
See Tolleman's excellent reply. Your definition about dumbness and smartness in phones is pretty hazy.
For me (and for Nokia), a smartphone is a phone with an advanced OS that its uses are mainly extended by complex apps. By this definition Series 40 phones are dumbphones and Symbian are smartphones.
MeeGo, although technically smartphones can be much much more, if Nokia gets that right in the future. We will see.
"Signed by Symbian" is a thing of the past with the new Qt procedures. It's a much more straightforward procedure now.
See? This kind of non-updated information is that hurts Symbian, not the platform's capabilities themselves.
It doesn't matter to 99% of consumers if the platform is open source or not. Nearly zero consumers even know what that means
Who told you it's all about customers? I believe the OSS moniker is for the developers, professional and amateur.
Nokia really needs to rebrand their mobile OS line. Every time I hear "Symbian" I think of some odd mechanical sex device.
Heh, really? When I hear "Android" I think of a sex device too... in the shape of a puffy doll! :)
Nokia has an excellent OS in Maemo/Meego, but still they keep beating this dead horse. Unbelievable. 'Nuff said.
And some dudes still fail to understand the ace on the sleeve of Nokia... the Qt SDK!
Who cares what you will be running in 2011 once developers will be able to develop cross-platform apps that run both on MeeGo and Symbian. Customers won't even see the difference and they will probably keep adoring their trusty Symbian smartphones with the huge battery life.
If that's the case, then why are the phones running Symbian not too smart?
It depends how you define smartness. If your definition is "how many fart apps you sport" then they're probably happy they are dummies. :)
Too sad that opinions about global corporation doings are shaped almost always but their achievements in the American market and media outlets.
Yes Nokia/Symbian is still huge and prosperous, except for the US market. Many statistics you see around showing Apple or RIM or Google at half the market are simply not taking into consideration other markets as well.
Isn't this the perfect moment for Google to pass to Scala for Java-like development and Go! for the rest of it (critical native components)? To hell with Java the language. After all, what is really important is the JVM and they've already forked that with Dalvik.
....which kinda made me LOL.
You mean... Lima Oscar Lima, right?! :p