I'm not dumping on Linux simply because I'm unfamiliar with it.
This is insight into my thinking, for what it's worth (probably nothing to you), on what lead me to buy the product discussed in this very article (Asus EeePC running Linux) and return it in the end for a Windows PC.
I don't think the difficulties I ran into getting the EeePC to work were anything to shake a stick at. Your argument that it's all because I'm used to the Windows way of doing things is ridiculous in my opinion. 1+1 and 2*(3!^2)/36 may reach the same result, but that doesn't necessarily mean that finding one easier has to be because of habit. Not saying that Windows is the former and Linux the latter in terms of the scale of difference, but rather just making an illustrative point. It's like making the claim that installing something via the command line and compiling yourself is of equal difficulty as pulling from a repository.
I want Linux to succeed as much as anyone (see e.g. my other posts on how I've tried it many times over the years and admire its ideals), but pretending like there's no problems with its usability is not helping the cause.
My bad, whatever the notepad (little n) equivalent was called. Pico is what I am most used to, but that's not what it was. And no, it was not VI or Emacs either.
But whatever, clearly there's no way for me to prove semi-anonymously over the Internet that I don't work for MS.
Interesting, and that's probably damning criticism of Office. However, we're talking about the OS. My Vista (yeah yeah, I know) computer supports multiple languages fine, only requiring me to select them in Control Panel.
And really, despite anything you may think to the contrary, that is a world of difference from Googling on how to install language support, the most pertinent results all being forum posts, and having to enter in incantations on the command line to do it.
No, I am surprised that the only way to edit what programs appear in what tabs of the GUI is through editing a config file that is so sensitive that a screw up can hose my ability to boot the GUI.
Thanks for the helpful comment. I'm sure I will try Linux again in the future again. I'm a sucker for the ideals behind it, and the sweet promise of incredible power once you can really get it going. I try it again every few years. My most recent experiences with GG and the EeePC weren't great, but hopefully II will be different!
There's a very large gap in usability between: 1. Googling on how to install language support, the most pertinent results all being forum posts, and having to enter in incantations on the command line to do it, and after spending several hours, still having it not work. 2. Going to Control Panel, selecting locality, add language and choosing my languages.
That is not "isn't Windows" that's "god this sucks". I understand this may be only a problem with the distro that came with the EeePC. That also doesn't change the fact that I'm not going to deal with this BS to use a tool and returned my EeePC.
Customizing the shell is not at all like customizing the start menu; it's really half way into software development, and not something end users should be doing. Windows doesn't allow it at all, except with third-party software that's even more complicated to set up than what you saw on Linux. If you want to pick a different theme, you can do that with the GUI. You were following instructions meant for people who want to make their own theme.
Okay, maybe I wasn't using the right terminology, though I get the feeling I probably was. On the default install of the gui on the EeePC, I wanted to change the programs that were available in different tabs. This requires editing config files in a text editor.
My previous most recent attempt had involved installing Ubuntu (GG I think) on an older computer. I wanted to create a silent system, so I bought a 2GB flash drive. Ubuntu said it needed 2GB to install. It lied, it needed 2.001 GB to install, and kept dying without a good explanation of what was going on. Another few hours lost.
Yes, the installer should've told you that it didn't have enough disk space, but it also should've been obvious that what you were trying to do wouldn't work. If you have 2GB of space and need exactly 2GB to install, where are you going to save things and install new programs to? Also, what happened was probably not that Ubuntu needed more than 2GB, but that the flash drive had less than 2GB of free space on it; some space is used up in overhead, and some storage makers use a different measurement system to inflate their numbers.
I believe the number if I recall correctly is 2GB to install, less after install because it deletes things it has unzipped. I needed only a very basic system that could run Firefox, etc. No matter how you spin it, it is a bug that it didn't check for disk space beforehand, that it didn't have a proper error message for failing to install, and that the minimum disk space for install was misreported. I later discovered that this bug had already been reported, but not addressed, on the bug tracker.
Needed to install a VPN client. No support from my company, since I'm probably the only one who needs a Linux VPN client. I managed to get it working myself nonetheless, that was a moment of pride. However, it was much more unstable in its connection than the Windows clients I use on other computers. It would just randomly lose the connection, forcing me to redo work.
The problem is probably with the internet connection, not with the software.
The connection worked fine on the Windows computers.
A quick look at Wikipedia shows that Microsoft apparently has hired astroturfers to send letters to newspapers and to edit Wikipedia articles. However, I remain somewhat skeptical of the common belief here that there are Microsoft astoturfers trying to change public opinion via Slashdot forum posts.
I'm probably going to get modded troll or flamebait for this, but everything I am about to say is 100% true to the best of my recollection. And no, I am not an astroturfer for MS. In fact, I'm not sure despite how often that term is thrown around that MS actually hires any astroturfers, or at least I have not seen any direct evidence of this.
Anyway, you can lump me in as another story similar to your friend's. I'm a computer programmer and consider myself to be in around the 95%+ percentile of techsavvyness. I can do stuff in the command line, and am not freaked out by it, but a good 75% of my attempts to follow instructions online on complex operations still falls into what I like to call the 'magical incantation' method of making things work, where you get a command that will supposedly do what you need, and you enter it in exactly like you are told to invoke the result. Along the way, you wince everytime you see an error message or warning pop up, not knowing whether or not this is the expected result or something is wrong with the incantation.
I got an EeePC loaded with Linux. Like everytime when I try Linux every few years, I came in bright eyed and hopeful, thinking this time would be different.
I needed to get foreign languages installed on it. Spent approximately 3 hours following forum posts and hacking at it. Everything apparently installed, but it just would not work, no additional language options appeared. No idea why, maybe a conflict with something Asus installed.
I needed to get Blackberry charging drivers installed. Found some magical incantations that were supposed to compile and install the drivers. They didn't. Couldn't figure out why.
Wanted to customize the shell, the way I would customize a start menu. Found out that this involved editing config files in notepad, and if I screwed up with a typo, this could potentially be a major problem. Was told I could create some safety margin by making a mirror of the config file in my user directory and editing that. For some reason, changes to the config file in my user directory were not followed by the machine.
Needed to install a VPN client. No support from my company, since I'm probably the only one who needs a Linux VPN client. I managed to get it working myself nonetheless, that was a moment of pride. However, it was much more unstable in its connection than the Windows clients I use on other computers. It would just randomly lose the connection, forcing me to redo work.
After probably around 10 hours invested in trying to make this thing work, I said screw it, and returned it and got a Windows machine.
My previous most recent attempt had involved installing Ubuntu (GG I think) on an older computer. I wanted to create a silent system, so I bought a 2GB flash drive. Ubuntu said it needed 2GB to install. It lied, it needed 2.001 GB to install, and kept dying without a good explanation of what was going on. Another few hours lost.
I will commend Linux for its improvement. I've tried it a number of times now, and in the beginning it was insanely difficult to do anything. Now it works fairly well as long as you don't try and do anything that's unanticipated. If you do, you're right back in command line magic incantation online forum land. If you can get it working, it's twice as powerful as Windows ever was, but good luck reaching that without a good mentor or LUG.
You're right, I'm sure if I poured a few hundred hours into it, I could become extremely comfortable in Linux. However, I just wasn't (and am not) willing to attempt the learning curve, not when it's this steep.
Incidentally, I believe that the penalty for attempted murder shouldn't be lighter than the penalty for murder proper (all else being equal: manslaughter, first degree murder, etc). You shouldn't get off on a lighter sentence because you're a crappy shot, or because your victim is tough as nails.
Well then you'll be pleased to know that is true. Generally in the US, the only difference between attempted murder and real murder is that attempted murder isn't eligible for the death penalty.
Actually, that issue has been taken care of to a certain extent. Under the Protect Act, that same 22 year old could face up to 30 years in prison if he paid for the sex, for engaging in consensual (legal in Europe) sex with that 17 year old when he returns to the US. If she was less than 16, then he would face prison even if it wasn't paid.
You have to set the bar somewhere, and then stick to it. Sure, you can be more lenient on edge cases, but you still need to say "the limit is X", or the whole legal system is a farce made out of "fuzzy rules we're kind of supposed to follow".
In particular, when we get to the 17-yo case, it's as simple as this: did you think, in good faith, that she was of age? If yes, you should be home free. We're talking reasonable doubt here. It's reasonable to think a 17-yo is 18 or 19. If it was publicized as kiddie porn in any way, I don't care if she's 15 or day shy of 18. You had the information available, you're screwed.
First off, the fact that the bar must be set somewhere is not a total defense of the law. At least two issues jump out at me.
First, the question that should be asked is the bar in the right place? On its face, 18 appears to be a rather irrational cutoff. 17 year olds are well into the realm of sexuality in terms of their own desires, and only a liar or a gay man would claim that there are no 17 year olds he is sexually attracted to.
Second, there is a long-standing understanding of rules versus standards in law, with rules used in some places and standards used in others. Rules are bright line, and easy to follow. Standards are sensible, but more administratively burdensome and less consistent. An example of a standard in law is the civil claim of intentional infliction of emotional distress (i.e. you can sue someone for being a real asshole, but they better be a real asshole). It is not obvious on the face of the issue to me that the rules approach we have been using in the case of the 18 rule is better than a standards approach (for example, maybe setting the cutoff at onset of puberty).
With regards to your second point, are you suggesting that is the approach we should take, or that is the approach that is taken? Since I'm not sure that a subjective belief can get you off of a charge of possession of kiddie porn, though I haven't researched this and am no expert on the subject.
Lastly, with your approach, assuming that it is a statement of how you believe things should be, what if someone has pictures of naked 18 year olds, but was duped into thinking they were of 16 year olds and hence kiddie porn. If we're going to only look at the mental state of the perpetrator, should we send him to jail on a totally victimless crime?
I disagree with the meme that the 360 Arcade is mostly useless or missing a lot of capability. It comes with a 512MB memory card, plenty for saves, which means it plays all the retail games just fine, which is all a majority of owners want it for.
360 is actually the cheapest of the 3 consoles now after the latest price cuts. 199 for the base model which plays all the games, and it can be had even cheaper after deals, I think around 170 from Dell. I've never seen a deal on a Wii I think.
Except that the PS3 Linux locks you out from the graphics system, such that no one is really looking at it seriously as a hobbyist dev station. Why would you develop for a crippled PS3 Linux when you can just develop on uncrippled PC Linux?
Jeez, did I got modded Troll on this by a Slashdot editor? What aspect of this is trolling, and who could be being trolled by it? I think I made a perfectly valid point on the concept of using the number of comments as a measure of worthiness to be on the front page.
If you read his comment again, you'll see from the context that he means Apple is overpriced with respect to what he is willing to pay, and that people who are willing to pay extra are being irrational because they don't provide enough additional value. It has nothing to do with the economics point you are making.
I'm not so sure number of comments is a good metric of justification to be on the front page. By that rationale, everytime Slashdot posts some story about snake oil free energy (see e.g. this), and it gets 800 replies talking about how the article is total trash, Slashdot has no editorial standards, and that even the editors of/. apparently don't read or think about the articles before publishing, those posts justify their place on the frontpage too.
Of course, Slashdot continues to post all of this, and the ad money continues to flow in from all the commentators, so maybe you're right. Maybe traffic is the only metric that matters.
And don't forget about the fact that besides the announcement at the conference today, we also got a Monday article and a Friday article on rumors on what would be announced at the conference, both on the front page.
Now subtract the standard deduction, which gets an individual a minimum of $5350 off taxes. Subtract the personal exemption of $3500. How much tax does a person who makes $8850 a year in Idaho pay?
This is an extreme example, but there are other scenarios that can result in lower individual taxes than corporate, but I think this at least provides a basic counterexample.
Finally, I am not conflating withholding with deductions. My point was to let you know that what you get to spend has already had taxes taken out from your GROSS. Maybe you've tuned your W-4 to accurately reflect your annual income. But the business only has to pay estimated quarterly payments on PROFIT, not gross. Given a human and a company, with the same numbers of income and expense, the company will be paying less tax. Period. You pay taxes on GROSS, minus allowed deductions. The company pays taxes on NET PROFIT.
I still don't like this characterization of the difference between individual and corporate taxes though. Both individual and corporate taxes are phrased in terms of taxable income, which is gross income net of deductions. Even if you haven't tuned your W4, you're eligible for a refund on overwithheld tax, because the tax is on net income, not gross.
Slashdot Mirror
I'm not dumping on Linux simply because I'm unfamiliar with it.
This is insight into my thinking, for what it's worth (probably nothing to you), on what lead me to buy the product discussed in this very article (Asus EeePC running Linux) and return it in the end for a Windows PC.
I don't think the difficulties I ran into getting the EeePC to work were anything to shake a stick at. Your argument that it's all because I'm used to the Windows way of doing things is ridiculous in my opinion. 1+1 and 2*(3!^2)/36 may reach the same result, but that doesn't necessarily mean that finding one easier has to be because of habit. Not saying that Windows is the former and Linux the latter in terms of the scale of difference, but rather just making an illustrative point. It's like making the claim that installing something via the command line and compiling yourself is of equal difficulty as pulling from a repository.
I want Linux to succeed as much as anyone (see e.g. my other posts on how I've tried it many times over the years and admire its ideals), but pretending like there's no problems with its usability is not helping the cause.
My bad, whatever the notepad (little n) equivalent was called. Pico is what I am most used to, but that's not what it was. And no, it was not VI or Emacs either.
But whatever, clearly there's no way for me to prove semi-anonymously over the Internet that I don't work for MS.
Interesting, and that's probably damning criticism of Office. However, we're talking about the OS. My Vista (yeah yeah, I know) computer supports multiple languages fine, only requiring me to select them in Control Panel.
And really, despite anything you may think to the contrary, that is a world of difference from Googling on how to install language support, the most pertinent results all being forum posts, and having to enter in incantations on the command line to do it.
No, I am surprised that the only way to edit what programs appear in what tabs of the GUI is through editing a config file that is so sensitive that a screw up can hose my ability to boot the GUI.
Thanks for the helpful comment. I'm sure I will try Linux again in the future again. I'm a sucker for the ideals behind it, and the sweet promise of incredible power once you can really get it going. I try it again every few years. My most recent experiences with GG and the EeePC weren't great, but hopefully II will be different!
There's a very large gap in usability between:
1. Googling on how to install language support, the most pertinent results all being forum posts, and having to enter in incantations on the command line to do it, and after spending several hours, still having it not work.
2. Going to Control Panel, selecting locality, add language and choosing my languages.
That is not "isn't Windows" that's "god this sucks". I understand this may be only a problem with the distro that came with the EeePC. That also doesn't change the fact that I'm not going to deal with this BS to use a tool and returned my EeePC.
Customizing the shell is not at all like customizing the start menu; it's really half way into software development, and not something end users should be doing. Windows doesn't allow it at all, except with third-party software that's even more complicated to set up than what you saw on Linux. If you want to pick a different theme, you can do that with the GUI. You were following instructions meant for people who want to make their own theme.
Okay, maybe I wasn't using the right terminology, though I get the feeling I probably was. On the default install of the gui on the EeePC, I wanted to change the programs that were available in different tabs. This requires editing config files in a text editor.
My previous most recent attempt had involved installing Ubuntu (GG I think) on an older computer. I wanted to create a silent system, so I bought a 2GB flash drive. Ubuntu said it needed 2GB to install. It lied, it needed 2.001 GB to install, and kept dying without a good explanation of what was going on. Another few hours lost.
Yes, the installer should've told you that it didn't have enough disk space, but it also should've been obvious that what you were trying to do wouldn't work. If you have 2GB of space and need exactly 2GB to install, where are you going to save things and install new programs to? Also, what happened was probably not that Ubuntu needed more than 2GB, but that the flash drive had less than 2GB of free space on it; some space is used up in overhead, and some storage makers use a different measurement system to inflate their numbers.
I believe the number if I recall correctly is 2GB to install, less after install because it deletes things it has unzipped. I needed only a very basic system that could run Firefox, etc. No matter how you spin it, it is a bug that it didn't check for disk space beforehand, that it didn't have a proper error message for failing to install, and that the minimum disk space for install was misreported. I later discovered that this bug had already been reported, but not addressed, on the bug tracker.
Needed to install a VPN client. No support from my company, since I'm probably the only one who needs a Linux VPN client. I managed to get it working myself nonetheless, that was a moment of pride. However, it was much more unstable in its connection than the Windows clients I use on other computers. It would just randomly lose the connection, forcing me to redo work.
The problem is probably with the internet connection, not with the software.
The connection worked fine on the Windows computers.
A quick look at Wikipedia shows that Microsoft apparently has hired astroturfers to send letters to newspapers and to edit Wikipedia articles. However, I remain somewhat skeptical of the common belief here that there are Microsoft astoturfers trying to change public opinion via Slashdot forum posts.
I'm probably going to get modded troll or flamebait for this, but everything I am about to say is 100% true to the best of my recollection. And no, I am not an astroturfer for MS. In fact, I'm not sure despite how often that term is thrown around that MS actually hires any astroturfers, or at least I have not seen any direct evidence of this.
Anyway, you can lump me in as another story similar to your friend's. I'm a computer programmer and consider myself to be in around the 95%+ percentile of techsavvyness. I can do stuff in the command line, and am not freaked out by it, but a good 75% of my attempts to follow instructions online on complex operations still falls into what I like to call the 'magical incantation' method of making things work, where you get a command that will supposedly do what you need, and you enter it in exactly like you are told to invoke the result. Along the way, you wince everytime you see an error message or warning pop up, not knowing whether or not this is the expected result or something is wrong with the incantation.
I got an EeePC loaded with Linux. Like everytime when I try Linux every few years, I came in bright eyed and hopeful, thinking this time would be different.
I needed to get foreign languages installed on it. Spent approximately 3 hours following forum posts and hacking at it. Everything apparently installed, but it just would not work, no additional language options appeared. No idea why, maybe a conflict with something Asus installed.
I needed to get Blackberry charging drivers installed. Found some magical incantations that were supposed to compile and install the drivers. They didn't. Couldn't figure out why.
Wanted to customize the shell, the way I would customize a start menu. Found out that this involved editing config files in notepad, and if I screwed up with a typo, this could potentially be a major problem. Was told I could create some safety margin by making a mirror of the config file in my user directory and editing that. For some reason, changes to the config file in my user directory were not followed by the machine.
Needed to install a VPN client. No support from my company, since I'm probably the only one who needs a Linux VPN client. I managed to get it working myself nonetheless, that was a moment of pride. However, it was much more unstable in its connection than the Windows clients I use on other computers. It would just randomly lose the connection, forcing me to redo work.
After probably around 10 hours invested in trying to make this thing work, I said screw it, and returned it and got a Windows machine.
My previous most recent attempt had involved installing Ubuntu (GG I think) on an older computer. I wanted to create a silent system, so I bought a 2GB flash drive. Ubuntu said it needed 2GB to install. It lied, it needed 2.001 GB to install, and kept dying without a good explanation of what was going on. Another few hours lost.
I will commend Linux for its improvement. I've tried it a number of times now, and in the beginning it was insanely difficult to do anything. Now it works fairly well as long as you don't try and do anything that's unanticipated. If you do, you're right back in command line magic incantation online forum land. If you can get it working, it's twice as powerful as Windows ever was, but good luck reaching that without a good mentor or LUG.
You're right, I'm sure if I poured a few hundred hours into it, I could become extremely comfortable in Linux. However, I just wasn't (and am not) willing to attempt the learning curve, not when it's this steep.
Incidentally, I believe that the penalty for attempted murder shouldn't be lighter than the penalty for murder proper (all else being equal: manslaughter, first degree murder, etc). You shouldn't get off on a lighter sentence because you're a crappy shot, or because your victim is tough as nails.
Well then you'll be pleased to know that is true. Generally in the US, the only difference between attempted murder and real murder is that attempted murder isn't eligible for the death penalty.
Actually, that issue has been taken care of to a certain extent. Under the Protect Act, that same 22 year old could face up to 30 years in prison if he paid for the sex, for engaging in consensual (legal in Europe) sex with that 17 year old when he returns to the US. If she was less than 16, then he would face prison even if it wasn't paid.
Reference
You have to set the bar somewhere, and then stick to it. Sure, you can be more lenient on edge cases, but you still need to say "the limit is X", or the whole legal system is a farce made out of "fuzzy rules we're kind of supposed to follow".
In particular, when we get to the 17-yo case, it's as simple as this: did you think, in good faith, that she was of age? If yes, you should be home free. We're talking reasonable doubt here. It's reasonable to think a 17-yo is 18 or 19. If it was publicized as kiddie porn in any way, I don't care if she's 15 or day shy of 18. You had the information available, you're screwed.
First off, the fact that the bar must be set somewhere is not a total defense of the law. At least two issues jump out at me.
First, the question that should be asked is the bar in the right place? On its face, 18 appears to be a rather irrational cutoff. 17 year olds are well into the realm of sexuality in terms of their own desires, and only a liar or a gay man would claim that there are no 17 year olds he is sexually attracted to.
Second, there is a long-standing understanding of rules versus standards in law, with rules used in some places and standards used in others. Rules are bright line, and easy to follow. Standards are sensible, but more administratively burdensome and less consistent. An example of a standard in law is the civil claim of intentional infliction of emotional distress (i.e. you can sue someone for being a real asshole, but they better be a real asshole). It is not obvious on the face of the issue to me that the rules approach we have been using in the case of the 18 rule is better than a standards approach (for example, maybe setting the cutoff at onset of puberty).
With regards to your second point, are you suggesting that is the approach we should take, or that is the approach that is taken? Since I'm not sure that a subjective belief can get you off of a charge of possession of kiddie porn, though I haven't researched this and am no expert on the subject.
Lastly, with your approach, assuming that it is a statement of how you believe things should be, what if someone has pictures of naked 18 year olds, but was duped into thinking they were of 16 year olds and hence kiddie porn. If we're going to only look at the mental state of the perpetrator, should we send him to jail on a totally victimless crime?
I disagree with the meme that the 360 Arcade is mostly useless or missing a lot of capability. It comes with a 512MB memory card, plenty for saves, which means it plays all the retail games just fine, which is all a majority of owners want it for.
360 is actually the cheapest of the 3 consoles now after the latest price cuts. 199 for the base model which plays all the games, and it can be had even cheaper after deals, I think around 170 from Dell. I've never seen a deal on a Wii I think.
Offtopic, but in response to your sig, I think you have atheism confused with agnosticism.
Knowledge:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_display_standard
Except that the PS3 Linux locks you out from the graphics system, such that no one is really looking at it seriously as a hobbyist dev station. Why would you develop for a crippled PS3 Linux when you can just develop on uncrippled PC Linux?
Anyone have a link to the creepy Tom Cruise video?
What did Greenpeace do to cause Apple to machine the MBP out of a single piece of aluminum as opposed to joining multiple smaller pieces?
Jeez, did I got modded Troll on this by a Slashdot editor? What aspect of this is trolling, and who could be being trolled by it? I think I made a perfectly valid point on the concept of using the number of comments as a measure of worthiness to be on the front page.
If you read his comment again, you'll see from the context that he means Apple is overpriced with respect to what he is willing to pay, and that people who are willing to pay extra are being irrational because they don't provide enough additional value. It has nothing to do with the economics point you are making.
I'm not so sure number of comments is a good metric of justification to be on the front page. By that rationale, everytime Slashdot posts some story about snake oil free energy (see e.g. this), and it gets 800 replies talking about how the article is total trash, Slashdot has no editorial standards, and that even the editors of /. apparently don't read or think about the articles before publishing, those posts justify their place on the frontpage too.
Of course, Slashdot continues to post all of this, and the ad money continues to flow in from all the commentators, so maybe you're right. Maybe traffic is the only metric that matters.
And don't forget about the fact that besides the announcement at the conference today, we also got a Monday article and a Friday article on rumors on what would be announced at the conference, both on the front page.
Now subtract the standard deduction, which gets an individual a minimum of $5350 off taxes. Subtract the personal exemption of $3500. How much tax does a person who makes $8850 a year in Idaho pay?
This is an extreme example, but there are other scenarios that can result in lower individual taxes than corporate, but I think this at least provides a basic counterexample.
I still don't like this characterization of the difference between individual and corporate taxes though. Both individual and corporate taxes are phrased in terms of taxable income, which is gross income net of deductions. Even if you haven't tuned your W4, you're eligible for a refund on overwithheld tax, because the tax is on net income, not gross.