I totally agree with this. I used pico forever on my SuSE systems because I was familiar with pine. When I started mucking with OpenBSD, I had to use vi. Blech. Until I started using it more and more. And all of a sudden, I started LIKING it. This came in very useful when I was put in charge of a Sun box at work. OpenBSD makes you do things the hard way until you learn how to make it easy for yourself.
SuSE is only bloated if you let it be. You have the option to install a minimal installation or select every package you install (among like five other options too). If you go with the "give me everything" option, of course it will be bloated. That being said, I'll give you the fact that SuSE does install stuff in weird places that you have little control over (I gave up on Comanche because it couldn't figure out where SuSE dumped parts of Apache, nor could I).
I'm not complaining, I'm asking how applicable the FreeBSD book is to OpenBSD.
1) I HAVE used the man pages. "man make" doesn't say s#!+ about "make world". If you're a friggin' newbie, man pages won't help you find what you're looking for because you don't know what you're looking for in the first place.
2) I do use O'Reilly books. You should see my collection. Almost at my 3rd free book from them, but that doesn't help me with things that are completely intrinsic to the operating system unless that book is about the OS
3) Thank you. Seriously, thanks. I'll look into that. I forget that docs are there.
4) I didn't know if the 4.4 manual would be helpful or if it even still applied. How useful is an IPChains firewall book if you're running the newer/better IPTables (in Linux)?
5,6,7) Assume the case of no connectivity so mailing lists and websites aren't helpful in this context (though I read OpenBSD.org all the time, sometimes I _still_ can't find the answer).
8) Books != Better Documentation? Not necessarily true. People that write books have to sell books. Having to sell books means it has to be accepted by a large audience. Usually/Hopefully this translates into going into detail about a subject while keeping it simple enough for anyone to understand and comprehend.
I'm a big fan of OpenBSD, but Dead Tree documentation is minimal (I already have the Linux and OpenBSD Firewalls book, thanks - which is great btw but written for 2.5). I'm coming from a Windows world and I'm learning Linux and OpenBSD at the same time. I've never used FreeBSD, so how applicable would this book be to the other BSD's? For example, I just got a new OpenBSD install up and working beautifully. Usually I just buy the newest release CD and upgrade from there, but I've wanted to get into updating the software on a more regular basis. I thought I read somewhere that it's as easy as CVS'ing the source tree and "make world", but it doesn't mention this on the CVS page. I've poked around and couldn't find it in the first couple places I looked either (FAQ). Would documentation about this and other functions be applicable, or are the so BSD's vastly different that it's not worth getting this book as a potential reference? Thanks.
psxndc
P.S. Don't tell me to do a google search either. The reason I always look for books is I go for the scenario where I'm doing a fresh install and have no network connectivity
A) It sucks that you haven't been modded up. B) I didn't think about the bundling of the JVM with it. In that case though, wouldn't you then need to still sell specific versions since the JVM is OS/machine specific? How much of a footprint is the JVM on a disc? Maybe the publisher could put all the jvm's on the install disc and have the installer pick the correct one at runtime. But then does Sun charge your for licensing one jvm or X (x = number of jvm's). I am not up on Sun's licensing policy, but you do have to pay for any jvm you bundle with software you distribute if I recall.
Keep in mind that 1.4 is a long way off from being standard. It's in beta and while 1.3 is pretty well rooted among developers, the _industry standard_ is still jdk 1.2.2.
That being said, at Java One I saw a game written completely in Java. It was definitely an interesting concept and it seemed to run pretty smoothly (it was a FPS-type), but it was damn ugly. That may be just that they didn't have the artists necessary for the models, but it sure wasn't quake3. The technology is almost there, but other posters are right, Java isn't great at graphics. Almost, but not quite yet.
They didn't open up the second room? There is a second room, if you make a right as soon as you enter and go around up some stairs. More of every game and they had I think Madden and Rogue Leader in the small rooms.
Here's my breakdown:
Pikmin: I was never into Lemmings, so I watched some people play this and got bored.
Rogue Leader: Lotta fun, probably played this this most.
Luigi's Mansion: Went back to this one the most, but it did seem easy. A lotta fun trapping ghosts
Wave Race: Better graphics than the N64 version, but seemed to play the same. Cool, but not great
Madden: Looked and played like Madden on the PS2. Barely played.
Smash Brothers Melee: What is the deal with this game? I bought the N64 version because everyone said it was a great party game. I've left it out at a couple parties and barely anyone touched it. Everyone in line wanted to play this game. I played it and I don't understnd what the big deal is. Its a big button masher. Oh, and some eight year old tried to tell me it's pronounced muh-lee. Please.
Basketball: didn't bother playing.
I may go back this weekend, just for kicks. And to clarify, I don't think of the location as sandwhiched between Harvard and MIT. More like MIT and the Cambridge Side Galleria Mall.
wo/man's ability to come up with endless ways to give her/himself cancer. Good to see that people won't be tricked into using just one. Now they'll have two that don't compete.
Re:SuSE has done this for a while...
on
Debian On DVD
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· Score: 1
But what if you're only machine with a DVD drive is a windows machine? I'm not going to install and ftp server on my windows machine, that's for admn sure.
IGN said: "War is hell. Especially if it's real...";-)
psxndc
SuSE has done this for a while...
on
Debian On DVD
·
· Score: 4, Informative
and installing one DVD is a lot less "sitting in front of the computer changing disks" of a hassle. Only problem is: what if you have multiple machines, some of which only have a CD drive, with others having both? I know SuSE, at least with Professionl, give you both. Call me a SuSE fanboy, but I am.
Actually with the G-shock protection SONY has, my friends that have MD players say it's migh-impossible to make the MD skip. When I can save up enough, I'm going to get one. I want an easy way to bootleg concerts (for my own enjoyment, not for profit)
Actually, the SONY Metrion in San Francisco sells pre-recorded minidiscs.;-)
I think more people are aware of minidisc than you think, but see no need for it. Where minidisc is great is portable, fairly high fidelity (no, I am not an audiophile) recording. Great for concerts, "taping" of lectures, etc. Unfortunately most people don't have a regular use for this. On top of that, the real win for mp3 versus minidisc, is minidiscs only record real time. To transfer an hour of music from your mp3 collection to a minidisc player takes an hour of recording time. Why buy an MD player when I can get 2 hours of music in a couple of minutes from my PC to my mp3 player? This could change with the Net-MD, but I think they have some weird limited-number-of-check-in-and-out thing on it to prevent from biting the SONY-music hand that feeds it, but that too may be a stumbling block for MD's success.
Don't be so ignorant about Mac hardware and popularity
It just isn't a world I live in. I just didn't realize that PPC includes G3's and G4's. I thought it was only original PPC equipment. My mistake. To be fair, I think Mac hardware is fine, the little that I know. I even plan on getting an iBook when I scrap up enough dough. It's small, it's cheap, and I can use all the apps that other people demand (MS Word, etc) while giving me the Mac GUI and the UNIX stability. That's a pretty sweet combo.
Addendum: before I wrote this, I _did_ actually send the link to a friend that wants Linux on PPC hardware. The thing is, he's the only person I've ever met that wants to do so (or even still has a PPC).
First: Terra, more power to you. Second: Why? Seriously, are there that many PPC's out there? I really don't know. While any development for linux is great, is there a market for this? And don't tell me that Linux isn't about markets. I know Linux isn't, but a business that distributes it is and that's what Terra is, a business. Why not aim for newer hardware?
I'm not forgetting gamers (I have just about every console and portable since NES). If sore thumbs don't stop you from playing, they won't stop you typing.
One of the most annoying things to do when I used to play TFC was to move my hands out of position to type a message. I'd type my message and have to "refind" my hand placement. If the keyboard is sized down, it's very easy to reach all the keys with very little hand movement. And if it's layed out QWERTY style, its not a new interface to learn. You know where all the keys are in relation to each other. In fact, I'd wager it's no harder to learn to type on one than it is to get used to the new controller. Probably a day or two of a couple hour sessions at max.
Well, back in the day, Alt-H hung up your modem. A lot of 3|33+ BBS's had that as their login prompt ("Press Alt-H to login") just to keep confused newbies out. Maybe that's what the poster was going for...
Actually, it would be more like me walking to the Library in the bad part of town and getting jumped. I don't hang out on IRC, I just strolled by to see if I could get some help. I'm not actually in either camp because I use and really enjoy both. I just naievly assumed that since a number of/.ers post and support OpenBSD that they would be chilling on IRC as well. My mistake.
Slashdot Mirror
One person I can understand, but two? C'mon. So I mispelled Hear, Hear. And I thought _I_ had nothing better to do with my time.
psxndc
psxndc
1) I HAVE used the man pages. "man make" doesn't say s#!+ about "make world". If you're a friggin' newbie, man pages won't help you find what you're looking for because you don't know what you're looking for in the first place.
2) I do use O'Reilly books. You should see my collection. Almost at my 3rd free book from them, but that doesn't help me with things that are completely intrinsic to the operating system unless that book is about the OS
3) Thank you. Seriously, thanks. I'll look into that. I forget that docs are there.
4) I didn't know if the 4.4 manual would be helpful or if it even still applied. How useful is an IPChains firewall book if you're running the newer/better IPTables (in Linux)?
5,6,7) Assume the case of no connectivity so mailing lists and websites aren't helpful in this context (though I read OpenBSD.org all the time, sometimes I _still_ can't find the answer).
8) Books != Better Documentation? Not necessarily true. People that write books have to sell books. Having to sell books means it has to be accepted by a large audience. Usually/Hopefully this translates into going into detail about a subject while keeping it simple enough for anyone to understand and comprehend.
I'm a big fan of OpenBSD, but Dead Tree documentation is minimal (I already have the Linux and OpenBSD Firewalls book, thanks - which is great btw but written for 2.5). I'm coming from a Windows world and I'm learning Linux and OpenBSD at the same time. I've never used FreeBSD, so how applicable would this book be to the other BSD's? For example, I just got a new OpenBSD install up and working beautifully. Usually I just buy the newest release CD and upgrade from there, but I've wanted to get into updating the software on a more regular basis. I thought I read somewhere that it's as easy as CVS'ing the source tree and "make world", but it doesn't mention this on the CVS page. I've poked around and couldn't find it in the first couple places I looked either (FAQ). Would documentation about this and other functions be applicable, or are the so BSD's vastly different that it's not worth getting this book as a potential reference? Thanks.
psxndc
P.S. Don't tell me to do a google search either. The reason I always look for books is I go for the scenario where I'm doing a fresh install and have no network connectivity
B) I didn't think about the bundling of the JVM with it. In that case though, wouldn't you then need to still sell specific versions since the JVM is OS/machine specific? How much of a footprint is the JVM on a disc? Maybe the publisher could put all the jvm's on the install disc and have the installer pick the correct one at runtime. But then does Sun charge your for licensing one jvm or X (x = number of jvm's). I am not up on Sun's licensing policy, but you do have to pay for any jvm you bundle with software you distribute if I recall.
psxndc
That being said, at Java One I saw a game written completely in Java. It was definitely an interesting concept and it seemed to run pretty smoothly (it was a FPS-type), but it was damn ugly. That may be just that they didn't have the artists necessary for the models, but it sure wasn't quake3. The technology is almost there, but other posters are right, Java isn't great at graphics. Almost, but not quite yet.
psxndc
psxndc
psxndc
Here's my breakdown:
Pikmin: I was never into Lemmings, so I watched some people play this and got bored.
Rogue Leader: Lotta fun, probably played this this most.
Luigi's Mansion: Went back to this one the most, but it did seem easy. A lotta fun trapping ghosts
Wave Race: Better graphics than the N64 version, but seemed to play the same. Cool, but not great
Madden: Looked and played like Madden on the PS2. Barely played.
Smash Brothers Melee: What is the deal with this game? I bought the N64 version because everyone said it was a great party game. I've left it out at a couple parties and barely anyone touched it. Everyone in line wanted to play this game. I played it and I don't understnd what the big deal is. Its a big button masher. Oh, and some eight year old tried to tell me it's pronounced muh-lee. Please.
Basketball: didn't bother playing.
I may go back this weekend, just for kicks. And to clarify, I don't think of the location as sandwhiched between Harvard and MIT. More like MIT and the Cambridge Side Galleria Mall.
psxndc
wo/man's ability to come up with endless ways to give her/himself cancer. Good to see that people won't be tricked into using just one. Now they'll have two that don't compete.
psxndc
psxndc
psxndc
psxndc
psxndc
I think more people are aware of minidisc than you think, but see no need for it. Where minidisc is great is portable, fairly high fidelity (no, I am not an audiophile) recording. Great for concerts, "taping" of lectures, etc. Unfortunately most people don't have a regular use for this. On top of that, the real win for mp3 versus minidisc, is minidiscs only record real time. To transfer an hour of music from your mp3 collection to a minidisc player takes an hour of recording time. Why buy an MD player when I can get 2 hours of music in a couple of minutes from my PC to my mp3 player? This could change with the Net-MD, but I think they have some weird limited-number-of-check-in-and-out thing on it to prevent from biting the SONY-music hand that feeds it, but that too may be a stumbling block for MD's success.
psxndc
It just isn't a world I live in. I just didn't realize that PPC includes G3's and G4's. I thought it was only original PPC equipment. My mistake. To be fair, I think Mac hardware is fine, the little that I know. I even plan on getting an iBook when I scrap up enough dough. It's small, it's cheap, and I can use all the apps that other people demand (MS Word, etc) while giving me the Mac GUI and the UNIX stability. That's a pretty sweet combo.
psxndc
psxndc
psxndc
psxndc
One of the most annoying things to do when I used to play TFC was to move my hands out of position to type a message. I'd type my message and have to "refind" my hand placement. If the keyboard is sized down, it's very easy to reach all the keys with very little hand movement. And if it's layed out QWERTY style, its not a new interface to learn. You know where all the keys are in relation to each other. In fact, I'd wager it's no harder to learn to type on one than it is to get used to the new controller. Probably a day or two of a couple hour sessions at max.
psxndc
Why does it need to be a full sized keyboard. You can type pretty fast on these with just your thumbs after a little while.
psxndc
psxndc
Actually, it would be more like me walking to the Library in the bad part of town and getting jumped. I don't hang out on IRC, I just strolled by to see if I could get some help. I'm not actually in either camp because I use and really enjoy both. I just naievly assumed that since a number of /.ers post and support OpenBSD that they would be chilling on IRC as well. My mistake.