You've only just now realized that Al Qaeda and Osama Bin Laden won beyond their wildest imaginations? We can fist bump about killing him and shouting "MURICA!! FUCK YEEEEAAH!" but even with Bush in front of his "Mission Accomplished" banner, we've still lost this fight big time by succumbing to the terrorist boogeyman to allow Big Brother to tuck us in at night.
Notice they said "poorly-designed abstraction layers" not "all abstraction layers." Oh and FYI, assembly langauge mnemonics are an abstraction layer so your comeback fails even more.
gbcox sounds strangely someone trying to shill this product with his hyper-defensiveness and the blatant falsehoods he is stating about Apple Pay (such as that Apple charges to use it which they don't). He seems to be the one spreading FUD more than anyone else.
And to respond to this as well in order to prevent gbcox's falsehood and my own misunderstanding from being taken as truth: Apple does not charge merchants to use Apple Pay.
How much does it cost to accept Apple Pay? Apple does not charge users, merchants or developers to use Apple Pay for payments. Your credit and debit transactions will continue to be handled by the payment networks.
When the product is released, they won't require you provide SSN, drivers license number or heath data.
Because you say so?
Again, they aren't stupid... they want you to use the service... not give people excuses not to use it.
Why should I believe they aren't stupid? Their past actions run contrary to your claims.
Regarding, why would you use it in the first place... the answer to that is discounts and promotions. That will be the carrot they use to gain adoption
They already have those available now with loyalty cards that are far easier to use than a QR code scanning app.
5 months after because, like I said, they are beholden to shareholders.
Sorry, but 5 months after the fact is a joke. I'm not going to trust security to a group of people that take 5 months after the
Every single breach you linked just happened. This takes time.
Oh really? So then when is Charles Geschke going to be ousted for the Adobe data breach that happened 12 months ago? Do you need me to keep bringing up counterexamples?
How much does it cost to accept Apple Pay? Apple does not charge users, merchants or developers to use Apple Pay for payments. Your credit and debit transactions will continue to be handled by the payment networks.
So are you telling me that Apple is lying? Otherwise, you're simply full of shit and spreading falsehoods.
The fact of the matter is the merchants are supporting CurrentC.
Did you have a point beyond stating a tautology? What relevance does that have to the fact that you haven't backed up your claims in any substantial way.
Kind of hard to use Apple Pay if they turn it off.
And to further add, I'd much rather trust a system that has built-in fraud protections not one that is created by retailers that have a horrendous security record and want me to give them my SSN# and direct access to my bank account. But I'm supposed to trust them because "teh shareholders won't allow another data breach!!" despite the fact that this is patently false.
What? Target's CEO resigned earlier this year [businessweek.com] after the breach severely impacted the company's already struggling bottom dollar.
5 months after the massive data breach. Ooooh boy that is quick and decisive action. Now, do you care to address The Home Depot CEO still being around? Care to address the Staples CEO still being around? Care to address the K-Mart CEO still being around? Care to show me which executive's head is rolling over the Dairy Queen breach? Would you like me to continue on with all the examples that run completely counter to your claims?
A singular example of an already poor-performing CEO being asked to step down does not prove your point in light of all the other data breaches where the CEO wasn't quickly fired for such a massive failure in security.
Apple charges a fee to processors to use their service.
Yes, so does anyone who processes credit card payments. And? Did you somehow expect them to use Apple Pay as a way to lose money? I don't see how recouping their costs as an "F-U fee" other than you're simply being an idiot. Especially when Apple negotiated decreased fees so their system is actually cheaper to use than it otherwise could have been.
Credit card companies charge merchants a fee to use their cards.
Yeah, and? Did you think this was going to be a revelation to me?
What is that link supposed to show me? It doesn't list anything about MCX accepting credit cards. It also does not back up your unsubstantiated claim about an Apple "F-U fee". The fee is simply the bog standard payment processing fee. And Apple having negotiated discounted processing fees would actually make them the opposite of an "F-U fee".
Because shareholders will oust another CEO if the shareprices tumble again.
Based on what history exactly? The CEO of Home Depot wasn't ousted over its data breach. The CEO of Target wasn't ousted over his company's data breach. Name me a single CEO that was ousted over one of these data breaches.
CurrentC will support all the major credit cards and you'll be able to choose which one you want to use... just like Google Wallet does now.
That's not what their own website says. They only support checking accounts, gift cards and store cards. So where are you getting this other info from? And if they are supporting CCs why would you choose to use CurrentC over simply swiping the card? The whole point of NFC payments is to make the payment process simpler. CurrentC seems to want to make it much more complex with no gain to the consumer.
The Merchants of course would love for you to use a debit card or their own store card, but they aren't stupid. They'll also support credit cards just to gain adoption.
Apparently they are. Since there is absolutely zero statements from MCX to back up your claim.
They won't be out any additional $$$ over what they would have to pay if people just used a credit card in the first place and they'll avoid the additional fee that Apple Pay requires.
[citation needed]
Apple on the other hand won't like it because they won't be getting their F-U fee.
Once it takes hold they will transition out of that, and leave the customers holding the bag for fraudulent transactions.
And now you know exactly why these merchants want this system. They hate having to be responsible for the fraudulent fallout from their data breaches. So instead, they will simply push the responsibility to the consumer. This is a feature, not a bug.
You understand why you get cash back though right? You get cash back because Visa/MC are charging so much extra they can afford kickbacks to the user.
You falsely presume I care.
By the same logic, CurrentC would be able to afford the same sort of rewards programs to get you to NOT use Visa/MC.
They could, but I'm not giving them access to my bank account. That is patently absurd.
Just because they haven't announced this doesn't mean they're not going to do it. If anything, I would expect more lucrative rewards programs because they're cutting out that middleman entirely.
They will also offer lucrative rewards to the next data breacher. At least with credit cards there is some level of fraud protection for the consumer. Good luck with the mess when the next data breach is checking account and routing numbers. Have fun getting most banks to do anything about it.
Slashdot Mirror
You've only just now realized that Al Qaeda and Osama Bin Laden won beyond their wildest imaginations? We can fist bump about killing him and shouting "MURICA!! FUCK YEEEEAAH!" but even with Bush in front of his "Mission Accomplished" banner, we've still lost this fight big time by succumbing to the terrorist boogeyman to allow Big Brother to tuck us in at night.
You clearly don't write software in the real world.
Notice they said "poorly-designed abstraction layers" not "all abstraction layers." Oh and FYI, assembly langauge mnemonics are an abstraction layer so your comeback fails even more.
Punishing billionaires and mulitinational corporations? You got a better chance of Pat Robertson officiating gay weddings.
so the question then becomes exactly what is the government protecting us from?
High-paying jobs?
Is anyone even remotely surprised by this?
I don't know ... The idea that consumers will behave rationally is pretty funny.
Yes, it is. Hence why I said what I did.
gbcox sounds strangely someone trying to shill this product with his hyper-defensiveness and the blatant falsehoods he is stating about Apple Pay (such as that Apple charges to use it which they don't). He seems to be the one spreading FUD more than anyone else.
And to respond to this as well in order to prevent gbcox's falsehood and my own misunderstanding from being taken as truth: Apple does not charge merchants to use Apple Pay.
How much does it cost to accept Apple Pay?
Apple does not charge users, merchants or developers to use Apple Pay for payments. Your credit and debit transactions will continue to be handled by the payment networks.
https://developer.apple.com/ap...
When the product is released, they won't require you provide SSN, drivers license number or heath data.
Because you say so?
Again, they aren't stupid... they want you to use the service... not give people excuses not to use it.
Why should I believe they aren't stupid? Their past actions run contrary to your claims.
Regarding, why would you use it in the first place... the answer to that is discounts and promotions. That will be the carrot they use to gain adoption
They already have those available now with loyalty cards that are far easier to use than a QR code scanning app.
So I have to maintain a store credit card for each place I want to buy from? What a joke.
5 months after because, like I said, they are beholden to shareholders.
Sorry, but 5 months after the fact is a joke. I'm not going to trust security to a group of people that take 5 months after the
Every single breach you linked just happened. This takes time.
Oh really? So then when is Charles Geschke going to be ousted for the Adobe data breach that happened 12 months ago? Do you need me to keep bringing up counterexamples?
Hmm, didn't mean to check post anonymous since that was clearly me.
Well, Google doesn't charge any additional fees to anyone for using Google Wallet.
Neither does Apple.
Apple charges for using Apple Pay.
Nope. From Apple:
How much does it cost to accept Apple Pay?
Apple does not charge users, merchants or developers to use Apple Pay for payments. Your credit and debit transactions will continue to be handled by the payment networks.
So are you telling me that Apple is lying? Otherwise, you're simply full of shit and spreading falsehoods.
The fact of the matter is the merchants are supporting CurrentC.
Did you have a point beyond stating a tautology? What relevance does that have to the fact that you haven't backed up your claims in any substantial way.
Kind of hard to use Apple Pay if they turn it off.
Again an irrelevant statement.
And to further add, I'd much rather trust a system that has built-in fraud protections not one that is created by retailers that have a horrendous security record and want me to give them my SSN# and direct access to my bank account. But I'm supposed to trust them because "teh shareholders won't allow another data breach!!" despite the fact that this is patently false.
What? Target's CEO resigned earlier this year [businessweek.com] after the breach severely impacted the company's already struggling bottom dollar.
5 months after the massive data breach. Ooooh boy that is quick and decisive action. Now, do you care to address The Home Depot CEO still being around? Care to address the Staples CEO still being around? Care to address the K-Mart CEO still being around? Care to show me which executive's head is rolling over the Dairy Queen breach? Would you like me to continue on with all the examples that run completely counter to your claims?
A singular example of an already poor-performing CEO being asked to step down does not prove your point in light of all the other data breaches where the CEO wasn't quickly fired for such a massive failure in security.
Apple charges a fee to processors to use their service.
Yes, so does anyone who processes credit card payments. And? Did you somehow expect them to use Apple Pay as a way to lose money? I don't see how recouping their costs as an "F-U fee" other than you're simply being an idiot. Especially when Apple negotiated decreased fees so their system is actually cheaper to use than it otherwise could have been.
Credit card companies charge merchants a fee to use their cards.
Yeah, and? Did you think this was going to be a revelation to me?
Less funny than giving your SSN# and direct bank account access to a bunch of retailers with a shitty security record.
The product hasn't been released yet and won't be until the 2nd quarter of 2015.
And yet MCX has plenty of detailed information on how the system works and what payment methods they will accept.
They have plenty of time to get their ducks in a row.
Translation: You have no actual proof.
The information on the website isn't up-to-date. http://www.forbes.com/sites/pe... [forbes.com]
What is that link supposed to show me? It doesn't list anything about MCX accepting credit cards. It also does not back up your unsubstantiated claim about an Apple "F-U fee". The fee is simply the bog standard payment processing fee. And Apple having negotiated discounted processing fees would actually make them the opposite of an "F-U fee".
Because shareholders will oust another CEO if the shareprices tumble again.
Based on what history exactly? The CEO of Home Depot wasn't ousted over its data breach. The CEO of Target wasn't ousted over his company's data breach. Name me a single CEO that was ousted over one of these data breaches.
CurrentC will support all the major credit cards and you'll be able to choose which one you want to use... just like Google Wallet does now.
That's not what their own website says. They only support checking accounts, gift cards and store cards. So where are you getting this other info from? And if they are supporting CCs why would you choose to use CurrentC over simply swiping the card? The whole point of NFC payments is to make the payment process simpler. CurrentC seems to want to make it much more complex with no gain to the consumer.
The Merchants of course would love for you to use a debit card or their own store card, but they aren't stupid. They'll also support credit cards just to gain adoption.
Apparently they are. Since there is absolutely zero statements from MCX to back up your claim.
They won't be out any additional $$$ over what they would have to pay if people just used a credit card in the first place and they'll avoid the additional fee that Apple Pay requires.
[citation needed]
Apple on the other hand won't like it because they won't be getting their F-U fee.
[citation needed]
Customers lose liability protection.
Once it takes hold they will transition out of that, and leave the customers holding the bag for fraudulent transactions.
And now you know exactly why these merchants want this system. They hate having to be responsible for the fraudulent fallout from their data breaches. So instead, they will simply push the responsibility to the consumer. This is a feature, not a bug.
Benefit to whom?
Black hats who will breach the system and be able to easily drain peoples' checking accounts where there is basically non-existent fraud protections.
Since something like CurrentC actually has a hope in hell of existing outside of the USA where direct banking is normal.
Why would anyone outside of the US give up the convenience of NFC payments or the security of pin-and-chip CCs for CurrentC?
Because merchants are probably going to start charging you a fee to use your credit card.
Good luck with that. The merchants who don't do so will likely see a huge influx of customers that will far more than offset the processing fees.
You understand why you get cash back though right? You get cash back because Visa/MC are charging so much extra they can afford kickbacks to the user.
You falsely presume I care.
By the same logic, CurrentC would be able to afford the same sort of rewards programs to get you to NOT use Visa/MC.
They could, but I'm not giving them access to my bank account. That is patently absurd.
Just because they haven't announced this doesn't mean they're not going to do it. If anything, I would expect more lucrative rewards programs because they're cutting out that middleman entirely.
They will also offer lucrative rewards to the next data breacher. At least with credit cards there is some level of fraud protection for the consumer. Good luck with the mess when the next data breach is checking account and routing numbers. Have fun getting most banks to do anything about it.