Yes, we can and do survive without you hicks in the sticks. You couldn't survive without us, though. California can feed itself and we also feed you fools. We also provide you with welfare dollars. After you starve we'll come in and co-opt those high polluting power plants you have, or replace 'em with nukes!:D
The world, in fact, could do without you.
I for one apologize for the Civil War - we should have let you go. Now we're paying the price in that we have to listen to your tripe.
So cut us off then, retard. America's biggest food producer won't be able to supply the rest of you. That ought to drive your food prices up a tick or two. But don't worry about us - we can eat what we produce and survive on our own. Besides, we have the whole Pacific Ocean and endless fleets of supertankers to help us reach around the world. Don't even think for a moment that we're cut off.
BTW, in California we have something else called trucks that move goods throughout our state and to other places. We'll survive without you, but you'd starve without us.
And spare me about the energy b.s. If you had California's energy demands, you'd be knee deep in hot kimchi. As it is, storms rage through Jebediahland and cut you off from power for weeks at a time.
And if an Earthquake takes us down, once again, there goes America's biggest supplier of food. And the world's sixth largest economy. And a major exporter of domestic WELFARE dollars (which the red states heavily depend on). We'll be dead, and you'll be envying us - at least until that New Madrid thrust fault out in the midwest hits you completely by surprise like it did in the last century. Boy, what a mess that was. But then again dem dar Category 5 hurricanes are already wreaking havoc on your trailer parks.
Considering that California produces more food here than any other state in the country, that would mean that we can withhold our goods and our welfare dollars (which we contribute far more of and which you red states consume far more of) from you.
You can keep your oil, too. We'll do fine with importing ours, while building up our biodiesel & hydrogen alternatives. When you burn through all your oil reserves well badebadebadebadethat's all folks!
I say we go back into time and repeal the Tennessee Valley Authority and the Rural Electrification Act so that neo conservatives like your forefathers would not get electrical service in the rural areas of the country.
This way, the electric companies would not have to serve you and your parents most likely would have never survived to spawn you as they would have died of exposure.
Or, more likely, they would never have learned about the world beyond their tiny little farm, and would never have Beverly Hillbillied their way out to whatever sub/urban place you live now that has electricity.
We in the Blue States proudly endorse the FCC's move - in the hopes that more rural neo cons will be denied high speed internet access, thus hindering the spread of the plague that is your corporate statist "let them eat cake" line of thinking.
I say we start with the CEOs jobs. Or, in fact, putting them in jail for some of this crap.
You're asking me to choose between things like breathable air and a $25 DVD player. I happen to know Mr. Lung Cancer as he has visited my family a few times. Trust me, it ain't convenient.
I do not compromise on holding everyone - corporations and the regular person - to the same rules - so take your "hate the man" spiel and shove it. We'll still have our toys, but after the Democrats get done in America, things will be made a little cleaner and with a little more ethics.
Progress was going on long before corporations were given personhood in the 19th century.
Ban EVD from America? Won't someone think of the investors!
Now here's an interesting math question.
If the RIAA/MPAA bullet train shot out of Wall Street down the global Commerce Railway in 1997 and the Chinese EVD bullet train shot out of Beijing to careen down the Silk Road...... how long will it be before these two trains collide?
God, it's nice to see the Devil and Satan going mano y mano...
[apathetic elitist mode on] Who cares about the loss of $20? That's like 4 lattes for me. I lose $20 bills every time I step out of the car. People oughta stop whining about losing $20. This is America, land of the rich, remember? [apathetic elitist mode off]
Fewer jobs? You mean given a choice a person would rather be a factory worker sewing undergarments rather than a lawyer?
Very few people can pass the bar exam. If it weren't for offshoring, you could jump right into a factory job or an undergarment job right now and make money to earn your law degree. What job can you work to earn that kind of money nowadays? For a law degree you have to have cash to start with.
Or is the problem really the fact that many individuals do not make the choices that allow them to be lawyers, doctors, engineers, architects, composers, and all manner of higher paying jobs?
Horse before the cart. You need the lower paying jobs to pay for the education to get to the higher paying jobs.
And before you even start: grants & scholarships don't pay enough tuition, nor do they pay rent & bills.
Of course we could all be like that broker dude in "Pursuit of Happyness" and live on the street while we work our way up, but then you encounter worse problems when you're homeless - problems that can kill you a lot faster. See: exposure.
Do YOU want to work in a factory? A call center? As a code monkey?
A) Factory work is great while you're working up to something else. Now we do not have that. You're not going to go anywhere working at Wal Mart. Do the math. Take a Wallyworld salary and take rent out of that. See? The math always wins.
B) A call center is an excellent entry level job straight up into the higher strata of any given line of work. Case in point. I oversee the promotion of leads, supervisors and managers at the data center that I manage. They're promoted from the call center drones who learned our often secret, and always secure & proprietary financial services business process. Outside MBA's just wouldn't get it as well. I myself was a tech support drone and learned my employer's products & services before I got promoted to software testing, then project management, then management, then data center management. My six figure salary would never have come to be if I had not started out as a tech support drone. Tech support is a feeder job - it provides you expertise so you can move further up. And I've never seen a call center drone at any workplace who earned as much or less than any Wal Mart employee short of a manager. Take call center work overseas, and you cripple people's ability to work their way up into the system, by depriving them of any access to that line of work.
C) A code monkey. Boy oh boy, you and your softball challenges. You don't become a high value ace coder without attaining work experience as a code monkey. Sure, you can develop an open source project but how does anyone know your work ethic from that? How do they know what a team player you are? It's called prior work experience and the only way to get that is to start out as a code monkey. You will never have any level of coders in America when you get send the code monkey work overseas.
I work in software development. Software development is really just communication: Find out what the customer wants. Make it. Find out what the customer wants changed. Change it. You can't outsource communication skills because you are just redefining the customer.
Son, I got into in software development as a glass box tester. I fixed bugs, not just found & diagnosed them. I switched hit for developers when they got laid off or got sick. I overhauled the whole process of coding in my company. I innovated like crazy because I got an intimate understanding of the financial and coding trades that my employees would never get now if my boss (the owner) offshored our work (and he's rightfully scared as hell to give our customer data to anyone outside the Western bloc).
I know all about software development. We tried it your way, by having the code monkeys be "people" people,
"Your "gloom" scenario has nothing to do with outsourcing or globalism and everything to do with speculation, overconsumption, and risky financial behavior."
Except that outsourcing means 4 things: a) fewer jobs in the US b) a strong disincentive for people to learn IT skills c) the decimation of "feeder" jobs - lower end IT work that is necessary to develop work experience for higher end IT work
and most ominously: d) Americans' personal information being processed in poorer countries where ID theft is more lucrative, easier to carry out, and 150,000% impossible for the FBI to prosecute because it's completely out of their jurisdiction.
Even with products like the PDA cell phones with all-out broadband access competing with the blackberry, these people still don't feel they have to worry about the free market.
Which is why I decided to forego the blackberry and get a Treo.
Ayup, then all these free trade apologists will find it's too late to say "oops" when China starts doing stuff like, oh say, embargoing countries like the Arab league did with oil in the 1970s.
You benefitted from an economical anomaly for far too long.
The only thing people in rich countries have to do is to become more realistic about their consumption habits.
As somebody that has travelled extensively I can say the extravagant habits of people (both rich and "poor") in rich countries can't go unimpeded forever.
Tribalism, eh? Well, two can play that game.
If we cut down on our consumption, who will buy your stuff?
Those gas guzzling monsters you own, those houses that culd fit small african villages, all those gadgets (PS3 costs $500, woot!, that is half a years salary in many countries!) are putting you at a competitive disadvantage in a global market.
So your solution is to put everyone in huts in order to equalize things out? If we follow your line of reasoning, the entire world would become a hellish capitalist haven for the worst working conditions, highest pollution and fascist antidemocratic Governments (hello, I'm talking to you, China!), as well as collapsing factories, race-to-the-bottom wages with absolutely no vacation time for your kids or family.
Look, my corporate apologist friend, if you want prosperity for your country, then build your own base. Don't steal it from us. And spare me your hatred for the American worker, because you know what? You depend on our dollars.
I say we cut you off and make you swim on your own. America can swim on its own. Can you?
But markets are benign, for all your unsuferable whining about the poor US worker, many jobs are being generated by foreign companies investing in the US. If you do not want globalization, then those companies have got to go.
You're such a pathetic, boot licking corporate statist cur.
Markets are not in any way benign. They put profits over people's well being. As for jobs being generated by foreign investment, that's nothing compared to the jobs leaving the U.S. Hello, trade deficit?
And I'm all for free trade with Europe. Unlike whatever fascist antidemocratic sweatshop haven hell hole you come from, Europe actually respects workers' rights. We offshore to them and they offshore to us.
You can bow down before your corporate masters for the next 20 posts, but you know what? They'll outsource your job in due time, just as soon as you start asking for something better than polluted rivers, exploding/collapsing factories and sweatshop working conditions.
At least for America's workers, whose wages will never recover from the downward pressure of globalism.
America's booming IT industry is a thing of the past, as the entry level jobs needed to train people for higher end jobs no longer exist in America. Our IT industry will continue to shrink until it's completely gone, and all that is left in America are people jobs. The low paying cashier and medical clinic crap, with a smattering of middle class nursing jobs and doctors being crushed by malpractice premiums in malpractice award-capped states.
For globalism to succeed, successful nations must be impoverished.
Now where, you ask, is all the growth coming from? Simple. America is drowning in utterly unmaintainable consumer and national debt. Eventually that all has to be repaid.
Pray ye diligently that ARMs stop rising and that home prices stop falling in the superhot markets of today, or you may find yourself eating the words you're thinking of responding to me with - because that's all you'll have to eat when the shakedown comes.
An increase in demand no longer means a need for more people, nor does a decrease lead to the opposite.
Whether your demand is 1 or 100 DVD players, it takes the same amount of machinery to make it. That's why so few Americans are now hired to put out such phenomenal number of products.
And in IT, Americans can't move "up market" now because there are no entry level tech support/admin jobs from which people can get experience to move into higher level jobs.
Slashdot Mirror
Really? Then I guess you know what their power source was, right?
Coal?
Natural gas?
???
You just can't STFU, can you, you flaming retard?
:D
Yes, we can and do survive without you hicks in the sticks. You couldn't survive without us, though. California can feed itself and we also feed you fools. We also provide you with welfare dollars. After you starve we'll come in and co-opt those high polluting power plants you have, or replace 'em with nukes!
The world, in fact, could do without you.
I for one apologize for the Civil War - we should have let you go. Now we're paying the price in that we have to listen to your tripe.
So cut us off then, retard. America's biggest food producer won't be able to supply the rest of you. That ought to drive your food prices up a tick or two. But don't worry about us - we can eat what we produce and survive on our own. Besides, we have the whole Pacific Ocean and endless fleets of supertankers to help us reach around the world. Don't even think for a moment that we're cut off.
BTW, in California we have something else called trucks that move goods throughout our state and to other places. We'll survive without you, but you'd starve without us.
And spare me about the energy b.s. If you had California's energy demands, you'd be knee deep in hot kimchi. As it is, storms rage through Jebediahland and cut you off from power for weeks at a time.
And if an Earthquake takes us down, once again, there goes America's biggest supplier of food. And the world's sixth largest economy. And a major exporter of domestic WELFARE dollars (which the red states heavily depend on). We'll be dead, and you'll be envying us - at least until that New Madrid thrust fault out in the midwest hits you completely by surprise like it did in the last century. Boy, what a mess that was. But then again dem dar Category 5 hurricanes are already wreaking havoc on your trailer parks.
Considering that California produces more food here than any other state in the country, that would mean that we can withhold our goods and our welfare dollars (which we contribute far more of and which you red states consume far more of) from you.
You can keep your oil, too. We'll do fine with importing ours, while building up our biodiesel & hydrogen alternatives. When you burn through all your oil reserves well badebadebadebadethat's all folks!
Now everybody sing "Can you feel a brand new day" :)
I say we go back into time and repeal the Tennessee Valley Authority and the Rural Electrification Act so that neo conservatives like your forefathers would not get electrical service in the rural areas of the country.
This way, the electric companies would not have to serve you and your parents most likely would have never survived to spawn you as they would have died of exposure.
Or, more likely, they would never have learned about the world beyond their tiny little farm, and would never have Beverly Hillbillied their way out to whatever sub/urban place you live now that has electricity.
We in the Blue States proudly endorse the FCC's move - in the hopes that more rural neo cons will be denied high speed internet access, thus hindering the spread of the plague that is your corporate statist "let them eat cake" line of thinking.
Corporations are now slowing things down, big time.
Innovation now moves at the speed of patent expiration time.
I say we start with the CEOs jobs. Or, in fact, putting them in jail for some of this crap.
You're asking me to choose between things like breathable air and a $25 DVD player. I happen to know Mr. Lung Cancer as he has visited my family a few times. Trust me, it ain't convenient.
I do not compromise on holding everyone - corporations and the regular person - to the same rules - so take your "hate the man" spiel and shove it. We'll still have our toys, but after the Democrats get done in America, things will be made a little cleaner and with a little more ethics.
Progress was going on long before corporations were given personhood in the 19th century.
Steal an mp3 = zillions of dollars in damages
Cause health problems for thousands or millions = no damages?
And people tell me that corporations don't have special rights.......
hint: I mean, let's take away the corporations' special rights...
governed by a completely private and secretive Government.
How sweet!
Ban EVD from America? Won't someone think of the investors!
... how long will it be before these two trains collide?
Now here's an interesting math question.
If the RIAA/MPAA bullet train shot out of Wall Street down the global Commerce Railway in 1997 and the Chinese EVD bullet train shot out of Beijing to careen down the Silk Road...
God, it's nice to see the Devil and Satan going mano y mano...
[apathetic elitist mode on]
Who cares about the loss of $20? That's like 4 lattes for me. I lose $20 bills every time I step out of the car. People oughta stop whining about losing $20. This is America, land of the rich, remember?
[apathetic elitist mode off]
n/t
Plus, you stole my response. Right to the letter. Kudos, you must be a manager, if not then you should be.
Very few people can pass the bar exam. If it weren't for offshoring, you could jump right into a factory job or an undergarment job right now and make money to earn your law degree. What job can you work to earn that kind of money nowadays? For a law degree you have to have cash to start with.
Horse before the cart. You need the lower paying jobs to pay for the education to get to the higher paying jobs.
And before you even start: grants & scholarships don't pay enough tuition, nor do they pay rent & bills.
Of course we could all be like that broker dude in "Pursuit of Happyness" and live on the street while we work our way up, but then you encounter worse problems when you're homeless - problems that can kill you a lot faster. See: exposure.
A) Factory work is great while you're working up to something else. Now we do not have that. You're not going to go anywhere working at Wal Mart. Do the math. Take a Wallyworld salary and take rent out of that. See? The math always wins.
B) A call center is an excellent entry level job straight up into the higher strata of any given line of work. Case in point. I oversee the promotion of leads, supervisors and managers at the data center that I manage. They're promoted from the call center drones who learned our often secret, and always secure & proprietary financial services business process. Outside MBA's just wouldn't get it as well. I myself was a tech support drone and learned my employer's products & services before I got promoted to software testing, then project management, then management, then data center management. My six figure salary would never have come to be if I had not started out as a tech support drone. Tech support is a feeder job - it provides you expertise so you can move further up. And I've never seen a call center drone at any workplace who earned as much or less than any Wal Mart employee short of a manager. Take call center work overseas, and you cripple people's ability to work their way up into the system, by depriving them of any access to that line of work.
C) A code monkey. Boy oh boy, you and your softball challenges. You don't become a high value ace coder without attaining work experience as a code monkey. Sure, you can develop an open source project but how does anyone know your work ethic from that? How do they know what a team player you are? It's called prior work experience and the only way to get that is to start out as a code monkey. You will never have any level of coders in America when you get send the code monkey work overseas.
Son, I got into in software development as a glass box tester. I fixed bugs, not just found & diagnosed them. I switched hit for developers when they got laid off or got sick. I overhauled the whole process of coding in my company. I innovated like crazy because I got an intimate understanding of the financial and coding trades that my employees would never get now if my boss (the owner) offshored our work (and he's rightfully scared as hell to give our customer data to anyone outside the Western bloc).
I know all about software development. We tried it your way, by having the code monkeys be "people" people,
"Your "gloom" scenario has nothing to do with outsourcing or globalism and everything to do with speculation, overconsumption, and risky financial behavior."
Except that outsourcing means 4 things:
a) fewer jobs in the US
b) a strong disincentive for people to learn IT skills
c) the decimation of "feeder" jobs - lower end IT work that is necessary to develop work experience for higher end IT work
and most ominously:
d) Americans' personal information being processed in poorer countries where ID theft is more lucrative, easier to carry out, and 150,000% impossible for the FBI to prosecute because it's completely out of their jurisdiction.
And the separation of powers means exactly what, in your world? That Congress is free to ignore the laws they pass? That's BS.
Even with products like the PDA cell phones with all-out broadband access competing with the blackberry, these people still don't feel they have to worry about the free market.
Which is why I decided to forego the blackberry and get a Treo.
Ayup, then all these free trade apologists will find it's too late to say "oops" when China starts doing stuff like, oh say, embargoing countries like the Arab league did with oil in the 1970s.
Tribalism, eh? Well, two can play that game.
If we cut down on our consumption, who will buy your stuff?
So your solution is to put everyone in huts in order to equalize things out? If we follow your line of reasoning, the entire world would become a hellish capitalist haven for the worst working conditions, highest pollution and fascist antidemocratic Governments (hello, I'm talking to you, China!), as well as collapsing factories, race-to-the-bottom wages with absolutely no vacation time for your kids or family.
Look, my corporate apologist friend, if you want prosperity for your country, then build your own base. Don't steal it from us. And spare me your hatred for the American worker, because you know what? You depend on our dollars.
I say we cut you off and make you swim on your own. America can swim on its own. Can you?
You're such a pathetic, boot licking corporate statist cur.
Markets are not in any way benign. They put profits over people's well being. As for jobs being generated by foreign investment, that's nothing compared to the jobs leaving the U.S. Hello, trade deficit?
And I'm all for free trade with Europe. Unlike whatever fascist antidemocratic sweatshop haven hell hole you come from, Europe actually respects workers' rights. We offshore to them and they offshore to us.
You can bow down before your corporate masters for the next 20 posts, but you know what? They'll outsource your job in due time, just as soon as you start asking for something better than polluted rivers, exploding/collapsing factories and sweatshop working conditions.
This is the BIG question that everyone should be asking!
At least for America's workers, whose wages will never recover from the downward pressure of globalism.
America's booming IT industry is a thing of the past, as the entry level jobs needed to train people for higher end jobs no longer exist in America. Our IT industry will continue to shrink until it's completely gone, and all that is left in America are people jobs. The low paying cashier and medical clinic crap, with a smattering of middle class nursing jobs and doctors being crushed by malpractice premiums in malpractice award-capped states.
For globalism to succeed, successful nations must be impoverished.
Now where, you ask, is all the growth coming from? Simple. America is drowning in utterly unmaintainable consumer and national debt. Eventually that all has to be repaid.
Pray ye diligently that ARMs stop rising and that home prices stop falling in the superhot markets of today, or you may find yourself eating the words you're thinking of responding to me with - because that's all you'll have to eat when the shakedown comes.
An increase in demand no longer means a need for more people, nor does a decrease lead to the opposite.
Whether your demand is 1 or 100 DVD players, it takes the same amount of machinery to make it. That's why so few Americans are now hired to put out such phenomenal number of products.
And in IT, Americans can't move "up market" now because there are no entry level tech support/admin jobs from which people can get experience to move into higher level jobs.
Install your OS, drivers, patches and apps all at once. Back it up via dd in Linux, or use Norton Ghost.
IMO that trumps the "rootkit" solution.
LOL!!