Without any actual evidence, the 40 years of careful research is nothing more than navel gazing. This research has been the equivalent of "don't you think this is true? here's why" which is not how any kind of science is established.
If the type system is broken, how is it broken? Broken meaning what? If you're going to make a compelling argument, you might want to start simply and at least give a practical example.
You've failed to come up with reasoning compelling that would cause someone with customers and a revenue stream to take notice. Would you put up with that kind of failure in your utopia?
My classical inheritance is intact, my multi-inheritance via composition (traits) is intact, I have lambdas. I have a lot less than that in other languages.
To whit, what does this have to do with what you or cannot do in PHP?
>> "It is very difficult to conceive of a scenario — short of nuclear winter — where an agency would be justified in allowing its cabinet-level head officer to solely use a private email communications channel for the conduct of government business,
I may be in the minority here, but I think this is perfectly acceptable and intuitive. I'm sorry we WANT to be able to monitor communication channels of officials. At the top executive branch level, that's impractical. If she was never issued an address, that's largely irrelevant to the nature of the agenda. The Law often conflicts with reality, so this doesn't surprise or alarm me. The statement about nuclear winter is laughably partisan.
> because you're using terms like "pounded in everyone's head"
The BB theory is the only one that is well-known, because it's the only one that is mentioned in modern (and not so modern) textbooks, when making any cursory reference to a number of phenomena. That doesn't make him a crank, it makes him savvy to the current state of education (largely, across the world). The crank part comes from promoting another theory as the only alternative.
> It's only good for making guesses about things you don't understand, and is worthless for evaluating things you understand.
You are intentionally perverting the meaning. Conscious understanding is less used than common sense. You survive because of common sense, not despite it.
> Fewer people working means fewer people paying income tax > Fewer people working does mean fewer people filing taxes. > Level of fraud is immaterial to that point.
Fewer people filing does not equal less work. They still have to calculate and decide to try to collect from non-filers and when to schedule that based on a predictive model paired with an existing workload. Which is easier, figuring out if your W2s match up with employers who have turned in theirs, or figuring out what you didn't claim (if there was something you omitted)? You really think the IRS doesn't care if you didn't make any money AT all for a year? You are required to file or the IRS takes additional action. Welcome to America. People who do not have legitimate incomes also tend to rise, which then lends to more fraud and more work to understand who misused who's social security numbers (sometimes random, sometimes stolen as mine has been) or who work for whom and what the record should reflect to produce the proper accountability for you as an individual. This includes fines, of course. I have seen it take about 5-7 years to catch up. Talk to a tax preparer or something before you see a fine for a few thousand dollars when you do get an income. Sometimes they are efficient enough to wait till you have money to try to do a takeback.
So there's a lot more gore and less funny than you would hope. Most of the movie is pretty lame after the Eminem interview, where you're still trying to figure out the movie's "style" and probably have a bit of hope left in you. Mostly it's a mish-mash of vignettes strung together to try to tell a boring story. Reminds me a lot of the terrible Dumb and Dumber To, but not as bad. I'm not sure that's a compliment. Go watch Top Five or the revamped TMNT, which are both better films.
> Alternately, nobody I know had even heard of the movie before the hacks
In the US, it's was pretty hard to miss. From the media coverage over the last few months to the previews that have been in theaters since March. Not to mention that Seth Rogan has been talking about it since he started filming and James Franco since at least the last Planet of the Apes movie (where his character was barely included).
> Papers that are not addressing AGW and take no position on AGW are irrelevant, no matter how many ad hominem labels you spew and assumptions you make.
That statement is incorrect. Such papers are specifically relevant. Scientific papers that do not take a position are not excluded as a factual record that serves as credible evidence. Irrelevancy would be based on insufficient rigor or correlation.
> Taking it further, the prototypal approach to OO that JS uses is, without question, superior to the classical approach
Please point to the study that demonstrates this. I would argue the opposite. Runtime definition of types (modifications to a prototype has the same effect) has never been shown to be more productive than static typing, so I have to question assertions that it's obviously true.
> Python would be examples of popular languages that would clearly be worse than JS on the web
Java on a browser wouldn't be Java anymore than javascript is (they share some syntax!). Any modern scripting language is going to have to deal with a browser environment in similar ways, so we can just treat them the same. Why isn't a scripting language appropriate? Yes you would have to design a syntax for portability and make a browser vm, but so what? That's part of implementing a language in what we currently have as a browser client.
Looks like JJ can do action scenes but just throws in stuff "to make it interesting"...like a lightsaber cross-guard! Also the intro dialogue? Phantom Menace level bad. The initial shot is obviously pre-finished. It slowly builds from raw to production level scenes. I have high hopes, but it will have bad parts.
> The day RH choices disturb any big company from their own ecosystem, they will be eaten alive.
If RH never made another release, there would be similar disruption. That doom theorycrafting is irrelevant to my question.
> RH *is* a business, Debian is a community effort
That's also irrelevant. They are distros from a business standpoint. CentOS being interchangeable with Fedora since forever. How they came to be is a footnote.
My question was about relative usage and some way to measure that metric other than guesswork, as a challenge to the assertion that RH is "a marginal player". systemd adoption in RH is mentioned in 100% of the "discussions" on the topic. So someone here is showing bias.
If you were going to address the issue in an objective manner, you might note Debian, tends to identify itself when you run fingerprinting on servers (e.g. Apache and Nginx). Debian tends to be the most common identifier! Nobody believes the bulk of the responses (with no OS identifiers) are all non-RH (some will be slack, some debian, some gentoo, whatever), so that's an interesting metric that isn't definitive.
I think I understood completely. Attempting to derail into some form of "RH can be replaced" discussion, is of no interest to me.
This discussion didn't seem to pan out any better than previous attempts to verify that there is a more prolific distro. Calling RH a marginal player is simply disingenuous, as of today.
I guess it can take years with sponsorship. That's a pretty hefty bar. I do think it's a little biased toward inactives, but that's common for this kind of system and I certainly don't think it changes the characterization of why Joey is out.
> I'm a FreeBSD/OpenBSD user, some of the development of Nginx was done in FreeBSD, and you don't even see packages for it in your list. See the flaw in your methodology?
No, I don't. Reduced earnings isn't an indicator of reduced use. Poor Debian at 0! EC2 alone guarantees Debian installations are vastly outnumbered, unless you can show me some data to the contrary. There are some marketplace images for server setups that are specifically Debian. I mean give me something, anything to point to, not just "red hat isn't making enough money".
> When RH (which is, both in business model and revenue, a small player in the IT panorama)
I continue to hear this and see absolutely no evidence of it. I see evidence to the contrary, in the US, India and Europe, over the last 20 years. Generally, it's RPM/RH that is first listed. It's not alphabetical. This isn't because they are lucky. The simple explanation is that RH is the most frequently used and therefore put at the top as a simple matter of UI layout (most common choices go to the top of a list, within reason).
Let's just pull some random packages out of the web -
This is a fun game, pick me a list that shows more Debian love! I would like to keep a pulse on things but I just don't see this assertion (that RH is the marginal market) bearing out as anything but wishful thinking.
Slashdot Mirror
Without any actual evidence, the 40 years of careful research is nothing more than navel gazing. This research has been the equivalent of "don't you think this is true? here's why" which is not how any kind of science is established.
[citation needed]
If the type system is broken, how is it broken? Broken meaning what? If you're going to make a compelling argument, you might want to start simply and at least give a practical example.
You've failed to come up with reasoning compelling that would cause someone with customers and a revenue stream to take notice. Would you put up with that kind of failure in your utopia?
My classical inheritance is intact, my multi-inheritance via composition (traits) is intact, I have lambdas. I have a lot less than that in other languages.
To whit, what does this have to do with what you or cannot do in PHP?
>> "It is very difficult to conceive of a scenario — short of nuclear winter — where an agency would be justified in allowing its cabinet-level head officer to solely use a private email communications channel for the conduct of government business,
I may be in the minority here, but I think this is perfectly acceptable and intuitive. I'm sorry we WANT to be able to monitor communication channels of officials. At the top executive branch level, that's impractical. If she was never issued an address, that's largely irrelevant to the nature of the agenda. The Law often conflicts with reality, so this doesn't surprise or alarm me. The statement about nuclear winter is laughably partisan.
> because you're using terms like "pounded in everyone's head"
The BB theory is the only one that is well-known, because it's the only one that is mentioned in modern (and not so modern) textbooks, when making any cursory reference to a number of phenomena.
That doesn't make him a crank, it makes him savvy to the current state of education (largely, across the world). The crank part comes from promoting another theory as the only alternative.
Did not have the +1 for you today, sir.
> Failing to define a term
The term is self-defined. Common sense. Common human sense(s). Not limited to, or originally stemming from, "parables" or "superstitions", et al.
> Common sense is fearing something without understanding.
Continuing to try to redefine the concept to fit your beliefs, is disingenuous.
> Common sense is wrong more than it's right.
This is inaccurate.
> It's only good for making guesses about things you don't understand, and is worthless for evaluating things you understand.
You are intentionally perverting the meaning. Conscious understanding is less used than common sense. You survive because of common sense, not despite it.
> Fewer people working means fewer people paying income tax
> Fewer people working does mean fewer people filing taxes.
> Level of fraud is immaterial to that point.
Fewer people filing does not equal less work. They still have to calculate and decide to try to collect from non-filers and when to schedule that based on a predictive model paired with an existing workload. Which is easier, figuring out if your W2s match up with employers who have turned in theirs, or figuring out what you didn't claim (if there was something you omitted)? You really think the IRS doesn't care if you didn't make any money AT all for a year? You are required to file or the IRS takes additional action. Welcome to America. People who do not have legitimate incomes also tend to rise, which then lends to more fraud and more work to understand who misused who's social security numbers (sometimes random, sometimes stolen as mine has been) or who work for whom and what the record should reflect to produce the proper accountability for you as an individual. This includes fines, of course. I have seen it take about 5-7 years to catch up. Talk to a tax preparer or something before you see a fine for a few thousand dollars when you do get an income. Sometimes they are efficient enough to wait till you have money to try to do a takeback.
reverting bad mod
> you need two sets of one way tickets: JFK->Phoenix->elsewhere and Phoenix->JFK->somewhere else
You missed the opportunity where you can only save on half the trip and pay normally for the other half.
The idea is that even JFK->Phoenix->elsewhere and Phoenix->JFK , you still save money.
So there's a lot more gore and less funny than you would hope. Most of the movie is pretty lame after the Eminem interview, where you're still trying to figure out the movie's "style" and probably have a bit of hope left in you. Mostly it's a mish-mash of vignettes strung together to try to tell a boring story. Reminds me a lot of the terrible Dumb and Dumber To, but not as bad. I'm not sure that's a compliment. Go watch Top Five or the revamped TMNT, which are both better films.
> Voting 3rd party just makes the problem worse.
In every way, it does not.
> Alternately, nobody I know had even heard of the movie before the hacks
In the US, it's was pretty hard to miss. From the media coverage over the last few months to the previews that have been in theaters since March. Not to mention that Seth Rogan has been talking about it since he started filming and James Franco since at least the last Planet of the Apes movie (where his character was barely included).
> Papers that are not addressing AGW and take no position on AGW are irrelevant, no matter how many ad hominem labels you spew and assumptions you make.
That statement is incorrect. Such papers are specifically relevant. Scientific papers that do not take a position are not excluded as a factual record that serves as credible evidence. Irrelevancy would be based on insufficient rigor or correlation.
> Taking it further, the prototypal approach to OO that JS uses is, without question, superior to the classical approach
Please point to the study that demonstrates this. I would argue the opposite.
Runtime definition of types (modifications to a prototype has the same effect) has never been shown to be more productive than static typing, so I have to question assertions that it's obviously true.
> Python would be examples of popular languages that would clearly be worse than JS on the web
Java on a browser wouldn't be Java anymore than javascript is (they share some syntax!). Any modern scripting language is going to have to deal with a browser environment in similar ways, so we can just treat them the same. Why isn't a scripting language appropriate? Yes you would have to design a syntax for portability and make a browser vm, but so what? That's part of implementing a language in what we currently have as a browser client.
Looks like JJ can do action scenes but just throws in stuff "to make it interesting"...like a lightsaber cross-guard! Also the intro dialogue? Phantom Menace level bad.
The initial shot is obviously pre-finished. It slowly builds from raw to production level scenes. I have high hopes, but it will have bad parts.
> money is not an issue when transportation of people is the matter.
How do you come to that nonsensical conclusion?
http://calwatchdog.com/2012/07..., I think we all remember the bridges to nowhere 10 years back, etc.
> The day RH choices disturb any big company from their own ecosystem, they will be eaten alive.
If RH never made another release, there would be similar disruption.
That doom theorycrafting is irrelevant to my question.
> RH *is* a business, Debian is a community effort
That's also irrelevant. They are distros from a business standpoint. CentOS being interchangeable with Fedora since forever. How they came to be is a footnote.
My question was about relative usage and some way to measure that metric other than guesswork, as a challenge to the assertion that RH is "a marginal player". systemd adoption in RH is mentioned in 100% of the "discussions" on the topic. So someone here is showing bias.
If you were going to address the issue in an objective manner, you might note Debian, tends to identify itself when you run fingerprinting on servers (e.g. Apache and Nginx). Debian tends to be the most common identifier! Nobody believes the bulk of the responses (with no OS identifiers) are all non-RH (some will be slack, some debian, some gentoo, whatever), so that's an interesting metric that isn't definitive.
I think I understood completely. Attempting to derail into some form of "RH can be replaced" discussion, is of no interest to me.
This discussion didn't seem to pan out any better than previous attempts to verify that there is a more prolific distro.
Calling RH a marginal player is simply disingenuous, as of today.
I see:
https://www.debian.org/devel/j...
https://nm.debian.org/public/s...
I guess it can take years with sponsorship. That's a pretty hefty bar. I do think it's a little biased toward inactives, but that's common for this kind of system and I certainly don't think it changes the characterization of why Joey is out.
https://www.debian.org/vote/20...
> You know only Debian developers are allowed to vote, right?
Anyone can become one.
> I'm a FreeBSD/OpenBSD user, some of the development of Nginx was done in FreeBSD, and you don't even see packages for it in your list. See the flaw in your methodology?
No, I don't. Reduced earnings isn't an indicator of reduced use. Poor Debian at 0!
EC2 alone guarantees Debian installations are vastly outnumbered, unless you can show me some data to the contrary.
There are some marketplace images for server setups that are specifically Debian.
I mean give me something, anything to point to, not just "red hat isn't making enough money".
> And then, Red Hat, 1.5B
> So yes, there's evidence that Red Hat is a small fish in the pool.
And Debian is 0. I'm not convinced this is a useful metric.
I know this is off topic but...
> When RH (which is, both in business model and revenue, a small player in the IT panorama)
I continue to hear this and see absolutely no evidence of it. I see evidence to the contrary, in the US, India and Europe, over the last 20 years.
Generally, it's RPM/RH that is first listed. It's not alphabetical. This isn't because they are lucky. The simple explanation is that RH is the most frequently used and therefore put at the top as a simple matter of UI layout (most common choices go to the top of a list, within reason).
Let's just pull some random packages out of the web -
RH nearest top:
http://www.aerospike.com/downl...
http://dev.nuodb.com/download-...
http://wiki.nginx.org/Install
http://cassandra.apache.org/do... (rpm mentioned before deb)
Debian nearest top:
http://dev.mysql.com/downloads...
This is a fun game, pick me a list that shows more Debian love!
I would like to keep a pulse on things but I just don't see this assertion (that RH is the marginal market) bearing out as anything but wishful thinking.