The FCC is opening a dangerous door if they think they have authority over a protocol or applications-layer operation, such as AIM. They regulate raw
pipes, not applications.
Get with it, my friend. Protocols are raw pipes. The days when you could define a raw information pipe in terms of what it is made of are over. --
Freedom will not last long after it is outlawed. The only reason it is so prevailent today is because having it is a fad. This, like all fads will die down. New ways of being free will no longer hit the news sites, people will stop being noticed for being free, and it'll quietly die away until it becomes almost impossible to find someone who is still free. Now that won't be this month or even this year, but in a year or two mark my words - you had better have had it while you can.
And let's not forget the real problem here. Freedom by itself is not a threat to the Man - it's the threat of what people will do with it. As long as Freedom is not allowed, nobody (American or otherwise) will use it, meaning the Man won. We have to make Freedom 100% legal, or we'll be stuck in hell forever. --
Notice how a decent window manager puts the Close button at the opposite side from the other, less damaging buttons? Well, not all windowmanagers
should be like that, but they should be. In MacOS The close button is on one side and minimize/maximize are at the other side. This is so that it's hard to
accidentally close a window, and it's easier to focus on the button you want.
Amazing how otherwise rational people can argue themselves into coming up with wrong design decisions huh? May I draw your attention to the fact that it's not a close button, it's a STOP button for crying out loud. Put it where it's easy to hit. What's the downside of hitting it by accident? Move over one button and hit the reload button. And while I'm ranting, would you please tell me why 'accidently' hitting the stop button is worse than accidently hitting the reload, forward or back buttons? Sheesh.
You did notice that the article mentioned "He said product tests indicated that the new Crusoe chip afforded PictureBook users two times the stamina of
previous models. The typical session span with the Crusoe chip could last up to 5.5 hours."
Which is, in my opinion, pretty damned dismal.
You haven't used a laptop lately, have you? My 300 MHz VAIO gets about 1 hr. (Claims 6 - guffaw) If this machine in really *delivers* 5 hours of compute time, it's worth the price of admission. --
The Stop button (big X) should be just to the right of the Reload button, not all the way over on the right side. I can see the thinking is 'it's like a period, put it at the end of the sentence'. But I think this is superceded by: I always want it in the same place, where I can find it fast, near the other navigation buttons. Having it on the right off the location pre-sets messes this up.
A more important issue: suppose the Nautilus designers and I disagree on exactly where the best location for the Stop button is. How do I put it where I want it in *my* version? --
In every case: navigation buttons across the top; in the main window on the right, the object you're viewing is rendered - jpg, directory, info file, web page, whatever; on the left a panel gives you control over the object. Great: stuff everything into the same model as far as it will go. I don't see any blatent misdesign so far.
Is there a file edit view? Can I gdb an elf file, then <back> into the editor and <forward> in the debugger? --
they mention they have been in
contact with linus torvalds, i'm sure that for something this big he would have provided them with as much information about 2.4 as soon as possible.
You don't quite get it. (1) Linus doesn't have to provide anyone with information about linux, 2.4 or otherwise, because they can get that information themselves. It's open source, right? (2) Even Linus never knew and still doesn't know what the final 2.4 is going to be. Somebody out there is staying up all night as we speak preparing a killer patch that Linus doesn't know about. Linus will like the patch and include the patch. So much for Linus giving out prefered information to prefered collaborators. You got the wrong OS, son.
--
For the sake of Linux I would hope that this
company holds off on production of its distribution until the kernel is at least stable, if not fully released.
Don't worry too much about that. It will take *months* for the dust to settle on this pre-emption patch. There are just too many parts of the core kernel that are unanalyzed and unprepared for arbitrary preemption, let alone device drivers. The VFS comes to mind.
Even with full preemption the Linux kernel can still be only a soft-realtime system. There are too many drivers holding off interrupts for unknown amounts of time, and the scheduling algorithm is not deterministic. Treat this as experimental. If you want solid, hard realtime for Linux, use RTLinux or RTAI.
--
After a flurry of announcements, and even one attempted release, I haven't heard anything more. If I could get one of these 200 Meg floppy drives for $200 I wouldn't think twice. Especially built into a VAIO. All I can say at this point is: what the???
And when are we going to see an *open* hi capacity floppy standard? Why haven't we seen it already? --
"While I'm here, did Slashdot miss [Red Hat]'s GPL release of Source Navigator?"
No, they just chose to ignore it. I've submitted the story.
This shows an extreme degree of cluelessness in the Slashdot editorial suite. Source Navigator is probably one of the most significant releases of the year for kernel hackers, let alone regular application developers. Well, it just shows you the difference between a journalist and a true geek.
Moderate this down as usual - for some reason this always seems to happen when I criticize Slashdot's editorial policy. --
I cannot believe the people who claim they use Mozilla daily.
I hope you will believe me. I use Mozilla daily, although I don't use it all day. There are a lot of sites that Netscape just plain won't render and Mozilla will. Yes, there are still a lot of annoyances with Moz but it does function, and it's the reigning champ in rendering speed. I just posted with Mozilla. --
Hong Kong was essentially an untaxed economy, or at least then total level of taxation was very, very low. In spite of this, Hong Kong was still able to ship boatloads of surplus funds home to mother England and build up a such a huge surplus that they had great difficultly in making it evaporate before mainland China got hold of it. (To get rid of it they built a grandiose new airport.)
If Hong Kong could do it then so can every other government. It's time to stop thinking about how to *increase* taxation by technological means, and start thinking about how to *reduce the cost of governing* instead.
As far as we citizens go, I know of very few who support the concept of increased taxation, or the implementation of new taxes, or even the maintainance of taxation at its current levels. --
Yes, I'll me-too this and also say what a wonderful project this is. It's not ready for prime-time, which will be readily apparent if you hit this link. At the same time, I wouldn't be surprised at all if this project gets stable before Mozilla does, and it sure as heck is more light-weight.
There's no reason why Xbox won't support OpenGL. Even if it didn't come with opengl support right out of the box, it'd only be a matter of time before someone wrote the necessary drivers.
Microsoft could easily block OpenGL drivers though legal means. Just make a licence for the box that forbids development/deployment of any driver not approved by Microsoft. IMHO that's exactly the kind of stunt they intend to pull.
If Microsoft does manage to get a decent share of the settop box market you can expect all the usual evil business methods we have come to know and detest.
I fear that everybody - consumers, developers, competitors, distributors - are going to be taken for the usual ride if Microsoft's Xbox plans unfold as they intend.
The best form of protection the world could possibly get from dirty tricks connected with XBox is legal: if Microsoft wants to take a PC and call it an XBox, then the XBox will automatically become part of Microsoft's monopoly, and Microsoft will be prohibited in a rather direct way from playing games with its licence. That means the XBox will be a PC. That means we can put Linux on it. If we can put Linux on it, I really don't case what else Microsoft does with it.
On the other hand, if the XBox turns out not to be a PC, then I don't really care what they do with it: it won't be able to run PC games and, not having that single crucial advantage, it will be a lame duck in the market.
There are, of course, other responses to XBox than the purely legal. For example, if you are a game developer get a life and don't develop for it. That means don't develop for DirectX. If you are a decent developer you can make twice as much money doing network apps, or you can join the good guy game companies, for example, Loki. If you are not a decent developer, then by all means, continue developing developing for DirectX:-)
This post will surely bring out the usual astroturfing Microsoft moderaters, so if you are one of those, take note: Don't bother. I already marked it down. --
The first day was reserved for suits - they had to pay pretty big bugs to attend the show. I wasn't there that day, but judging by the number of suits still poking around the second day it must have been pretty heavily attended. The show was superbly organized and paced. There were big after-closing parties on Thursday and Saturday, and a dress-up dinner on Friday, with lots of goodlooking girlfriends/wives/girlgeeks in attendance. The aisles were constantly packed, and *everybody* was getting good traffic. Some boothes were really packed - particularly Corel's, which should tell you something about the level of interest in a distro aimed strictly at desktops.
I don't know exactly what the attendance figures were, but they were expecting 20,000 and it looked to me like they beat that. This year's show was three times the size of last year's, and that has happened every year for the last 4 years. It's a safe bet that next year's show will be 3 times the size again.
The last day included a job fair - graduating students getting jobs in Linux companies. Cool.
There was a continuous multiplayer drop-in game of Parsec going on about 6 computers, totally cool. Looks like Wing Commander, except the graphics are better. And no crashes at all, according to the Worldforge guy on the other side of the room.
I got a cute sqeeking toy penguin from HP for my wife, and lots of cute penguin pins. (See previous comment on what the penguin pins are good for;-) And, oh yes, a job. Hacking Linux fulltime.:-)
I really can't say enough good things about Linuxtag. --
I mean I used to support Linux and thought it was really cool; a rebel, upstart, underdog OS that really might give us a chance at something new and different!
Nice troll. Can I please translate the content for you? "Linux is just the flavor-of-the-day, soon, the small core of fanatics that actually use Linux will will switch to BSD or BEOS and Linux will disappear as a threat to Microsoft". "Oh, and by the way, can you guess who I work for".
OK, so *I* am one of those "uncool" people who jumped in in the last year. Does the fact that I just landed a job with one of the coolest companies in Europe, doing nothing but Linux, getting paid to do the things that I used to do for free mean anything? Ahh... I think it's kinda cool, don't you?
How about the concept of pinning those cute penguin pins onto the shirts of young pretty girls who know nothing about Linux, and thereby get drafted to the cause. You should see what happens after a few guys explain the meaning of the penguin to the girl, ok, she's going to be a self-appointed expert soon, and there is just no other advertising space that can compete. (By the way, any lonely geeks out there, this *works* - take note.)
The bottom line: You ain't seen nothing yet. This year is only the dawn of cool. --
Freenet could be used as a base for instant messanging. The Freenet project is looking for application writers to create protocols over Freenet.
Is anyone still reading this thread?
I have already made an informal proposal - the Nominis Network Presence protcol - along those lines. Nominis concentrates narrowly on net presense and message forwarding. These are the only two things in IM you absolutely need a server for.
I have a lot of respect for the Jabber initiative, but when it comes to secure, distributed network presence, putting all the processing in the server is just the wrong way to go. Let alone your contact list. Jabber is really intended as a messaging bridge and standard IM protocol and it runs on the server so all the protocol details are handled there. When you don't have a whole lot of different protocols to deal with it becomes a much better strategy to do everything in the client, except for the things that the client can't possibly do. --
Bzzzzt. Wrong. Have you used any recent builds? Mozilla's rendering speed is spectacularly good now. It's rendering everything I throw at it, even broken Frontpage stuff. (I've heard there *are* pages out there that don't render properly but I haven't personally run across one yet.) O'Rei lly waxes poetic about Mozilla's extensibility. (the idea of extending Mozilla's wsiwyg xml/html editor is particularly intriguing.) Mozilla skins are hot. Mozilla still does crash - though not as much - and there are still a few features missing. But to say Mozilla isn't looking good... just shows you missed the cluetrain. Try not to be late for the next one please.;-) --
On freshmeat yesterday, a GPL compressor for still and moving images that does Low Bit-Rate Image and Video Coding with Weighted Finite Automata, outperforming JPEG and is competitive with fractal and wavelet compression. Efficient enough to decode movies in software. I grabbed the code and checked out the demo images: it does seem to work. --
About a year ago, the US Federal Circuit (the US court with jurisdiction over patent appeals, answerable only to the US Supreme Court) decided that enforcement of a valid patent can never be an antitrust violation.
If true, then that would be truly startling, and obviously a very big win for people like Bill Gates. I don't see how such a lopsided result could ever stand up to scrutiny. Again, if true, the circuit court is looking more and more partial all the time. Witness the recent antics of the 9th circuit court in the Microsoft anti-trust trial. --
Too clueless to use MPEG, or too clueful? MPEG is still caught up in patents, licenses, and lawsuits!
That's not really a big deal in this case - to broadcast mp3 you need a one-off licence. Let's see Frauenhoffer try to gouge the Whitehouse! Mp3, even with its licence fees is far preferable to RealAudio, which is just a broken form of mp3. Both should have been supplied.
I was pleased to note that windows-media wasn't offered.
Where were you when all the previous stories about Ogg Vorbis were being posted?
I was there. In fact I'm on the vorbis devel mailing list. And have contributed.;-)
I look into my crystal ball and see many oggs there. --
Slashdot Mirror
I think the solution to script-kiddy wankerism is a revival of the demo scene.
How about fixing the holes? It's not like we haven't known about the problems with wu-ftp since forever.
--
The FCC is opening a dangerous door if they think they have authority over a protocol or applications-layer operation, such as AIM. They regulate raw pipes, not applications.
Get with it, my friend. Protocols are raw pipes. The days when you could define a raw information pipe in terms of what it is made of are over.
--
Freedom will not last long after it is outlawed. The only reason it is so prevailent today is because having it is a fad. This, like all fads will die down. New ways of being free will no longer hit the news sites, people will stop being noticed for being free, and it'll quietly die away until it becomes almost impossible to find someone who is still free. Now that won't be this month or even this year, but in a year or two mark my words - you had better have had it while you can.
And let's not forget the real problem here. Freedom by itself is not a threat to the Man - it's the threat of what people will do with it. As long as Freedom is not allowed, nobody (American or otherwise) will use it, meaning the Man won. We have to make Freedom 100% legal, or we'll be stuck in hell forever.
--
Notice how a decent window manager puts the Close button at the opposite side from the other, less damaging buttons? Well, not all windowmanagers should be like that, but they should be. In MacOS The close button is on one side and minimize/maximize are at the other side. This is so that it's hard to accidentally close a window, and it's easier to focus on the button you want.
Amazing how otherwise rational people can argue themselves into coming up with wrong design decisions huh? May I draw your attention to the fact that it's not a close button, it's a STOP button for crying out loud. Put it where it's easy to hit. What's the downside of hitting it by accident? Move over one button and hit the reload button. And while I'm ranting, would you please tell me why 'accidently' hitting the stop button is worse than accidently hitting the reload, forward or back buttons? Sheesh.
Argument rejected.
--
You did notice that the article mentioned "He said product tests indicated that the new Crusoe chip afforded PictureBook users two times the stamina of previous models. The typical session span with the Crusoe chip could last up to 5.5 hours."
Which is, in my opinion, pretty damned dismal.
You haven't used a laptop lately, have you? My 300 MHz VAIO gets about 1 hr. (Claims 6 - guffaw) If this machine in really *delivers* 5 hours of compute time, it's worth the price of admission.
--
The Stop button (big X) should be just to the right of the Reload button, not all the way over on the right side. I can see the thinking is 'it's like a period, put it at the end of the sentence'. But I think this is superceded by: I always want it in the same place, where I can find it fast, near the other navigation buttons. Having it on the right off the location pre-sets messes this up.
A more important issue: suppose the Nautilus designers and I disagree on exactly where the best location for the Stop button is. How do I put it where I want it in *my* version?
--
In every case: navigation buttons across the top; in the main window on the right, the object you're viewing is rendered - jpg, directory, info file, web page, whatever; on the left a panel gives you control over the object. Great: stuff everything into the same model as far as it will go. I don't see any blatent misdesign so far.
Is there a file edit view? Can I gdb an elf file, then <back> into the editor and <forward> in the debugger?
--
they mention they have been in contact with linus torvalds, i'm sure that for something this big he would have provided them with as much information about 2.4 as soon as possible.
You don't quite get it. (1) Linus doesn't have to provide anyone with information about linux, 2.4 or otherwise, because they can get that information themselves. It's open source, right? (2) Even Linus never knew and still doesn't know what the final 2.4 is going to be. Somebody out there is staying up all night as we speak preparing a killer patch that Linus doesn't know about. Linus will like the patch and include the patch. So much for Linus giving out prefered information to prefered collaborators. You got the wrong OS, son.
--
For the sake of Linux I would hope that this company holds off on production of its distribution until the kernel is at least stable, if not fully released.
Don't worry too much about that. It will take *months* for the dust to settle on this pre-emption patch. There are just too many parts of the core kernel that are unanalyzed and unprepared for arbitrary preemption, let alone device drivers. The VFS comes to mind.
Even with full preemption the Linux kernel can still be only a soft-realtime system. There are too many drivers holding off interrupts for unknown amounts of time, and the scheduling algorithm is not deterministic. Treat this as experimental. If you want solid, hard realtime for Linux, use RTLinux or RTAI.
--
After a flurry of announcements, and even one attempted release, I haven't heard anything more. If I could get one of these 200 Meg floppy drives for $200 I wouldn't think twice. Especially built into a VAIO. All I can say at this point is: what the???
And when are we going to see an *open* hi capacity floppy standard? Why haven't we seen it already?
--
"While I'm here, did Slashdot miss [Red Hat]'s GPL release of Source Navigator?"
No, they just chose to ignore it. I've submitted the story.
This shows an extreme degree of cluelessness in the Slashdot editorial suite. Source Navigator is probably one of the most significant releases of the year for kernel hackers, let alone regular application developers. Well, it just shows you the difference between a journalist and a true geek.
Moderate this down as usual - for some reason this always seems to happen when I criticize Slashdot's editorial policy.
--
I cannot believe the people who claim they use Mozilla daily.
I hope you will believe me. I use Mozilla daily, although I don't use it all day. There are a lot of sites that Netscape just plain won't render and Mozilla will. Yes, there are still a lot of annoyances with Moz but it does function, and it's the reigning champ in rendering speed. I just posted with Mozilla.
--
Hong Kong was essentially an untaxed economy, or at least then total level of taxation was very, very low. In spite of this, Hong Kong was still able to ship boatloads of surplus funds home to mother England and build up a such a huge surplus that they had great difficultly in making it evaporate before mainland China got hold of it. (To get rid of it they built a grandiose new airport.)
If Hong Kong could do it then so can every other government. It's time to stop thinking about how to *increase* taxation by technological means, and start thinking about how to *reduce the cost of governing* instead.
As far as we citizens go, I know of very few who support the concept of increased taxation, or the implementation of new taxes, or even the maintainance of taxation at its current levels.
--
You really break me up :-)
When are you going to leave the evil empire and come over to the side of truth and beauty?
--
Yes, I'll me-too this and also say what a wonderful project this is. It's not ready for prime-time, which will be readily apparent if you hit this link. At the same time, I wouldn't be surprised at all if this project gets stable before Mozilla does, and it sure as heck is more light-weight.
kudos!
--
There's no reason why Xbox won't support OpenGL. Even if it didn't come with opengl support right out of the box, it'd only be a matter of time before someone wrote the necessary drivers.
:-)
Microsoft could easily block OpenGL drivers though legal means. Just make a licence for the box that forbids development/deployment of any driver not approved by Microsoft. IMHO that's exactly the kind of stunt they intend to pull.
If Microsoft does manage to get a decent share of the settop box market you can expect all the usual evil business methods we have come to know and detest.
I fear that everybody - consumers, developers, competitors, distributors - are going to be taken for the usual ride if Microsoft's Xbox plans unfold as they intend.
The best form of protection the world could possibly get from dirty tricks connected with XBox is legal: if Microsoft wants to take a PC and call it an XBox, then the XBox will automatically become part of Microsoft's monopoly, and Microsoft will be prohibited in a rather direct way from playing games with its licence. That means the XBox will be a PC. That means we can put Linux on it. If we can put Linux on it, I really don't case what else Microsoft does with it.
On the other hand, if the XBox turns out not to be a PC, then I don't really care what they do with it: it won't be able to run PC games and, not having that single crucial advantage, it will be a lame duck in the market.
There are, of course, other responses to XBox than the purely legal. For example, if you are a game developer get a life and don't develop for it. That means don't develop for DirectX. If you are a decent developer you can make twice as much money doing network apps, or you can join the good guy game companies, for example, Loki. If you are not a decent developer, then by all means, continue developing developing for DirectX
This post will surely bring out the usual astroturfing Microsoft moderaters, so if you are one of those, take note: Don't bother. I already marked it down.
--
The first day was reserved for suits - they had to pay pretty big bugs to attend the show.
Heh.
bugs=bucks
*** Surfsup resolves *once again* never to post without previewing
--
The first day was reserved for suits - they had to pay pretty big bugs to attend the show. I wasn't there that day, but judging by the number of suits still poking around the second day it must have been pretty heavily attended. The show was superbly organized and paced. There were big after-closing parties on Thursday and Saturday, and a dress-up dinner on Friday, with lots of goodlooking girlfriends/wives/girlgeeks in attendance. The aisles were constantly packed, and *everybody* was getting good traffic. Some boothes were really packed - particularly Corel's, which should tell you something about the level of interest in a distro aimed strictly at desktops.
:-)
I don't know exactly what the attendance figures were, but they were expecting 20,000 and it looked to me like they beat that. This year's show was three times the size of last year's, and that has happened every year for the last 4 years. It's a safe bet that next year's show will be 3 times the size again.
The last day included a job fair - graduating students getting jobs in Linux companies. Cool.
There was a continuous multiplayer drop-in game of Parsec going on about 6 computers, totally cool. Looks like Wing Commander, except the graphics are better. And no crashes at all, according to the Worldforge guy on the other side of the room.
I got a cute sqeeking toy penguin from HP for my wife, and lots of cute penguin pins. (See previous comment on what the penguin pins are good for;-) And, oh yes, a job. Hacking Linux fulltime.
I really can't say enough good things about Linuxtag.
--
I mean I used to support Linux and thought it was really cool; a rebel, upstart, underdog OS that really might give us a chance at something new and different!
Nice troll. Can I please translate the content for you? "Linux is just the flavor-of-the-day, soon, the small core of fanatics that actually use Linux will will switch to BSD or BEOS and Linux will disappear as a threat to Microsoft". "Oh, and by the way, can you guess who I work for".
OK, so *I* am one of those "uncool" people who jumped in in the last year. Does the fact that I just landed a job with one of the coolest companies in Europe, doing nothing but Linux, getting paid to do the things that I used to do for free mean anything? Ahh... I think it's kinda cool, don't you?
How about the concept of pinning those cute penguin pins onto the shirts of young pretty girls who know nothing about Linux, and thereby get drafted to the cause. You should see what happens after a few guys explain the meaning of the penguin to the girl, ok, she's going to be a self-appointed expert soon, and there is just no other advertising space that can compete. (By the way, any lonely geeks out there, this *works* - take note.)
The bottom line: You ain't seen nothing yet. This year is only the dawn of cool.
--
Maybe this concept is somehow improved, but ISTR hearing about the identical concept 5 or 10 years ago.
--
Freenet could be used as a base for instant messanging. The Freenet project is looking for application writers to create protocols over Freenet.
Is anyone still reading this thread?
I have already made an informal proposal - the Nominis Network Presence protcol - along those lines. Nominis concentrates narrowly on net presense and message forwarding. These are the only two things in IM you absolutely need a server for.
I have a lot of respect for the Jabber initiative, but when it comes to secure, distributed network presence, putting all the processing in the server is just the wrong way to go. Let alone your contact list. Jabber is really intended as a messaging bridge and standard IM protocol and it runs on the server so all the protocol details are handled there. When you don't have a whole lot of different protocols to deal with it becomes a much better strategy to do everything in the client, except for the things that the client can't possibly do.
--
(Even Mozilla isn't looking good.)
;-)
Bzzzzt. Wrong. Have you used any recent builds? Mozilla's rendering speed is spectacularly good now. It's rendering everything I throw at it, even broken Frontpage stuff. (I've heard there *are* pages out there that don't render properly but I haven't personally run across one yet.) O'Rei lly waxes poetic about Mozilla's extensibility. (the idea of extending Mozilla's wsiwyg xml/html editor is particularly intriguing.) Mozilla skins are hot. Mozilla still does crash - though not as much - and there are still a few features missing. But to say Mozilla isn't looking good... just shows you missed the cluetrain. Try not to be late for the next one please.
--
On freshmeat yesterday, a GPL compressor for still and moving images that does Low Bit-Rate Image and Video Coding with Weighted Finite Automata, outperforming JPEG and is competitive with fractal and wavelet compression. Efficient enough to decode movies in software. I grabbed the code and checked out the demo images: it does seem to work.
--
About a year ago, the US Federal Circuit (the US court with jurisdiction over patent appeals, answerable only to the US Supreme Court) decided that enforcement of a valid patent can never be an antitrust violation.
If true, then that would be truly startling, and obviously a very big win for people like Bill Gates. I don't see how such a lopsided result could ever stand up to scrutiny. Again, if true, the circuit court is looking more and more partial all the time. Witness the recent antics of the 9th circuit court in the Microsoft anti-trust trial.
--
Too clueless to use MPEG, or too clueful? MPEG is still caught up in patents, licenses, and lawsuits!
;-)
That's not really a big deal in this case - to broadcast mp3 you need a one-off licence. Let's see Frauenhoffer try to gouge the Whitehouse! Mp3, even with its licence fees is far preferable to RealAudio, which is just a broken form of mp3. Both should have been supplied.
I was pleased to note that windows-media wasn't offered.
Where were you when all the previous stories about Ogg Vorbis were being posted?
I was there. In fact I'm on the vorbis devel mailing list. And have contributed.
I look into my crystal ball and see many oggs there.
--