Since they know Linux well,everyone should, and therefore, there should be as much support for it as with Windows.
Of course if they know Linux as well as they think, they'd be writing the driver themselves.
The problem is not with those that are knowledgable, it's with those who THINK they are knowledgable. They rant and scream because they cannot sort the problem out themselves and are disappointed with themselves, so they blame someone else.
I've been using Linux for more than 5 years now and admin a number of Linux machines where I work. This being said, I am still very happy to explain any part of it in average (not condescending) terms to anyone who is interested and has a question.
Plus the mysql.org domain was only created on the 4th of June this year by the WHOIS records. With that and the content of their website it seems they're trying to pull a fast one to me.
[whois.networksolutions.com]
Registrant:
NuSphere Corporation (MYSQL8-DOM)
14 Oak Park
Bedford, MA 01730
US
Domain Name: MYSQL.ORG
Administrative Contact:
Markman, Peter (PMN366) ns-domains@PROGRESS.COM
NuSphere Corporation
14 Oak Park
Bedford, MA 01730
US
(781) 280-4000 (781) 280-4035
Technical Contact:
Goulet, Denis (DGM500) ns-techdomains@PROGRESS.COM
NuSphere Corporation
14 Oak Park
Bedford, MA 01730
US
(781) 280-4000 (781) 280-4035
Billing Contact:
Buckley, Judy (JBL1071) ns-billdomains@PROGRESS.COM
NuSphere Corporation
14 Oak Park
Bedford, MA 01730
US
(781) 280-4000 (781) 280-4035
Record last updated on 06-Jul-2001.
Record expires on 04-Jun-2002.
Record created on 04-Jun-2001.
Database last updated on 12-Jul-2001 04:15:00 EDT.
In summary, everybody learns things a little differently. If you don't already know any programming languages, it might be easier for you to learn something that doesn't use Object Oriented concepts -- such as BASIC or Pascal.
I heartily agree. It's much more important to first gain an understanding of 'how to program' rather than 'what language to learn'. Once you the general ideas behind programming (and hopefully learning good programming practices along the way), then you can program in anything - it tends to be just a case of picking up the language reference book and having a go.
I started on BASIC when I was about 10 on a Dragon32. Enjoyed that a lot and then in my first year of college I taught myself C with the aid of a reference book.
I've done a reasonable amount of VB, and it is easy to learn (IMHO), but I'm wondering if that was because I was already familiar with programming or not. I go back and forth on thinking whether to recommend it to beginners or not. I agree that clouding things with OO can frustrate matters whatever language you're in so it's important to get the 'basics' (no pun intended) down first before moving on to other concepts. I guess you could do that in VB, you can still write functions etc, just tuck them in a button.click procedure or whatever and go from there.
To me, procedural languages work better, but that might be just that they work better for my way of thinking. I tend to find I enjoy C more than VB.
Of course you could always try learning PHP:D.. it's very C like in its syntax, plus you don't have to worry about compiling and things crashing on you, so you could pick up a few simplistic C functions (helloworld.php ?) without too much hassle. Then maybe try doing it in C. Start small and work up.
Hmm.. let me see, there's a slight problem with this logic...
From the article:
This means, for example, that in our above real-world example, we
could replace the harddrive and the CD-ROM drive and substantially
upgrade our RAM without having to re-activate our Windows XP
installation.
However, if we completely re-installed Windows XP, the information in
b) would be lost and we would have to re-activate our installation,
even if we had not changed our hardware.
Replace the hard drive but you DON'T reinstall the OS??.. eh??.. how the hell are you doing that? (assuming ONE hard drive in the system, i.e. the one that has windows on it to start with).
Well, since it's hit slashdot and I'm getting lots of mails asking if
we're aware of the situation, I thought I'd post a plan explaining
distributed.net's perspective on David McOwen and the State of Georgia.
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/07/08/215320 6 for details
distributed.net can confirm that at least some part of what's being reported
is accurate. We were subpoenaed for information relating to Mr. McOwen's
participation in the RC5-64 project and supplied that information as
requested. We also spoke at length with representatives of the prosecution
to make sure they understood the actual impact of the dnetc software on
the machines and networks in question.
However, part of the subpoena restricts us from commenting on the details
of pending litigation. Especially since we do not know the details or
circumstances of the alleged activity, we do not want to do anything which
would endanger either party's position in this case. We trust that the
community understands our position in this matter.
In the more general sense, not commenting at all on the specifics of this
case, it is never a good idea to run the distributed.net client software
on computers you don't own or administrate. In the four years or so that
we've been in operation we've been dragged in to a handful of situations
where people have lost their jobs, positions, and scholarships by thinking
that forgiveness would be easier to obtain than permission. Nobody,
especially distributed.net, wants to see this happen.
It's important to keep in mind that the literal resource consumption of
the client (which is as close to "zero" as can be) is often not the only
factor important to a business. The existence of prize money with the
RC5-64 project is discomforting to many organizations. One tactic which
has proven to be very effective is to provide an affidavit that you will
donate any winnings to a charity if a client you installed on a company
or university machine finds the winning key. In many cases, this has been
key to a participant receiving permission to run the client on non-owned
resources.
Another frequent stumbling block is with service and support contracts
which prohibit non-certified software running on workstations or servers.
Your university or employer may risk losing support on their equipment if
software is installed that hasn't been explicitly mentioned in the support
agreements.
The bottom line is, always get permission first. It might not be as
difficult to get permission as you think. And if you can't get permission,
don't install the client.
We hope for a speedy and just resolution to this case, whatever that
outcome should be, and that we never have to be involved in another one.
$400 at the start, no, not 'expensive'. I guess I was thinking more in the long term after the planned obsolesence and proprietary add-on devices that BECOME NECESSARY. Suddenly it's all getting more expensive and those that are locked into it get to pay through the nose for it. Good luck:>
Of course the people that bang-on about using consoles on a TV then come out and complain about comparing the outfit cost INCLUDING 'a nice monitor'.
You don't always have to go to the latest and 'greatest' to get kick-ass performance. The cost savings can be huge, and why by the latest stuff when it's going to be obsoleted in roughly the same period of time anyway.
GeForce2 GTS is my example.. very good graphics card.. costs about 1/3rd of a GeForce3. Nothing really NEEDS the power right now, so it's a waste of money.
With the advances in graphics cards, PCs look better for gaming to me. Consoles make (made?) a big point about being simple and portable. Once you started adding more and more shit to them they just become very expensive proprietary PCs. Seems a bit strange somehow..
PS: Anyone else notice the/. 'enhancement' of making you wait 20 seconds before posting anything?.. seems quick quips aren't 'allowed' any more... jeez..
Exactly. Latency is the real trick. Sure bandwidth is important but it's not much point if it takes ages to get it going. For example you can have a lot of bandwidth to your house this way: I fill up a 40GB disk and travel to your house with it, but the latency sucks.. it takes me a long time to travel there and hook up the drive compared to you actually starting to download the data with a modem.
When at the chip level and serveral requests are made constantly, the latency problem really kicks in.
We'll just lots of lurching drivers with worn out brake pads who speed, get a 'warning' from the GPS thingy that's about to rag on them, then slow down.
Lather. Rinse. Repeat.
I still don't like the idea of being spied upon. If you're an employee for a trucking company, I can see it.. there time is money and they want to make sure you're not off lazing around in the truck stops, plus they have an image to protect hence the speeding tracking. But for personal motoring it's going too far imho.
Have you ever driven in a 30 mph zone in England?;>.. come to that, ever driven in england?:)
You're lucky to have a two-lane road (i.e. one lane one way, one the other), after all the parked cars... normally it's down to 1 in side streets (yea, you have to take turns):) - I'm thinking of Leicester here...
And with all the traffic I doubt you'd be able to accelerate anywhere.. let alone maneuver out of the way of anything.
Yea.. it's strange. Here's an email I got back from Freedom Support (names and email addresses removed):
Subject: Ref: HD0000000034496 Support Linux!
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:29:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: FreedomSupport@freedom.net
To: xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Hello,
Thank you for your interest in Freedom.
While we have every intention to continue our efforts with Linux in the future, at this time, this is not possible. We have not had as much interest as expected, so we are following the market tendencies until these prove otherwise.
We are compiling this feedback, and will make it available to our Product Managers, which are responsible for these decisions.
Regards,
xxxxxxxxx
Freedom Support Team
I don't know whether that's marketting snow or if they really do want to support Linux, maybe we'll see in the future..
Thank god with Linux you can actually DO something about bloat. Linux user skill (on average) has gone from mainly very compentent to mainly 'whiney-ass Windows lusers' in a suprisingly short time. Right now you can configure your particular setup as you see fit, removing programs and areas of the filesystem you don't use. WTF is wrong with that?
Slashdot Mirror
... and Hitler, well, he happened to think only aryans were human.
While amusingly he himself did not even 'measure up' to the aryan 'ideal'.
--
Delphis
Since they know Linux well,everyone should, and therefore, there should be as much support for it as with Windows.
Of course if they know Linux as well as they think, they'd be writing the driver themselves.
The problem is not with those that are knowledgable, it's with those who THINK they are knowledgable. They rant and scream because they cannot sort the problem out themselves and are disappointed with themselves, so they blame someone else.
I've been using Linux for more than 5 years now and admin a number of Linux machines where I work. This being said, I am still very happy to explain any part of it in average (not condescending) terms to anyone who is interested and has a question.
I guess it's just a personality thing, huh?
--
Delphis
Plus the mysql.org domain was only created on the 4th of June this year by the WHOIS records. With that and the content of their website it seems they're trying to pull a fast one to me.
[whois.networksolutions.com]
Registrant:
NuSphere Corporation (MYSQL8-DOM)
14 Oak Park
Bedford, MA 01730
US
Domain Name: MYSQL.ORG
Administrative Contact:
Markman, Peter (PMN366) ns-domains@PROGRESS.COM
NuSphere Corporation
14 Oak Park
Bedford, MA 01730
US
(781) 280-4000 (781) 280-4035
Technical Contact:
Goulet, Denis (DGM500) ns-techdomains@PROGRESS.COM
NuSphere Corporation
14 Oak Park
Bedford, MA 01730
US
(781) 280-4000 (781) 280-4035
Billing Contact:
Buckley, Judy (JBL1071) ns-billdomains@PROGRESS.COM
NuSphere Corporation
14 Oak Park
Bedford, MA 01730
US
(781) 280-4000 (781) 280-4035
Record last updated on 06-Jul-2001.
Record expires on 04-Jun-2002.
Record created on 04-Jun-2001.
Database last updated on 12-Jul-2001 04:15:00 EDT.
Domain servers in listed order:
NS.RACKSPACE.COM 207.235.16.2
NS2.RACKSPACE.COM 207.71.44.121
--
Delphis
SQL is not a word in the english language, I think that's the point that's trying to be made here.
--
Delphis
Did michael read the article?
/. editors read the shit they waffle about? Especially Michael it seems.
Of course he didn't.. do you think
--
Delphis
In summary, everybody learns things a little differently. If you don't already know any programming languages, it might be easier for you to learn something that doesn't use Object Oriented concepts -- such as BASIC or Pascal.
:D .. it's very C like in its syntax, plus you don't have to worry about compiling and things crashing on you, so you could pick up a few simplistic C functions (helloworld.php ?) without too much hassle. Then maybe try doing it in C. Start small and work up.
I heartily agree. It's much more important to first gain an understanding of 'how to program' rather than 'what language to learn'. Once you the general ideas behind programming (and hopefully learning good programming practices along the way), then you can program in anything - it tends to be just a case of picking up the language reference book and having a go.
I started on BASIC when I was about 10 on a Dragon32. Enjoyed that a lot and then in my first year of college I taught myself C with the aid of a reference book.
I've done a reasonable amount of VB, and it is easy to learn (IMHO), but I'm wondering if that was because I was already familiar with programming or not. I go back and forth on thinking whether to recommend it to beginners or not. I agree that clouding things with OO can frustrate matters whatever language you're in so it's important to get the 'basics' (no pun intended) down first before moving on to other concepts. I guess you could do that in VB, you can still write functions etc, just tuck them in a button.click procedure or whatever and go from there.
To me, procedural languages work better, but that might be just that they work better for my way of thinking. I tend to find I enjoy C more than VB.
Of course you could always try learning PHP
--
Delphis
Man, y'all are SO bored there aren't you?
.. wtf?
I mean, 'Kasstrator'??
--
Delphis
So yes, they can/do/will get your phone number if you call them. Want privacy somehow? Use a payphone.
..
..
I can see people hoofing their desktop computers with a UPS down to the nearest payphone to install WinXP
Sign on a payphone past the minicab and dubious 'massage' cards: 'WinXP Registration Party - This Payphone, 8:00pm'
--
Delphis
Hmm.. let me see, there's a slight problem with this logic...
.. eh?? .. how the hell are you doing that? (assuming ONE hard drive in the system, i.e. the one that has windows on it to start with).
From the article:
This means, for example, that in our above real-world example, we
could replace the harddrive and the CD-ROM drive and substantially
upgrade our RAM without having to re-activate our Windows XP
installation.
However, if we completely re-installed Windows XP, the information in
b) would be lost and we would have to re-activate our installation,
even if we had not changed our hardware.
Replace the hard drive but you DON'T reinstall the OS??
--
Delphis
The text of the finger (so people can stop /.'ing dnet :D) ->
/home/nugget
::
0 6 for details
nugget@distributed.net
[distributed.net]
Login: nugget
Name: David McNett
Directory:
:: 09-Jul-2001 00:15 (Monday)
Well, since it's hit slashdot and I'm getting lots of mails asking if
we're aware of the situation, I thought I'd post a plan explaining
distributed.net's perspective on David McOwen and the State of Georgia.
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/07/08/21532
distributed.net can confirm that at least some part of what's being reported
is accurate. We were subpoenaed for information relating to Mr. McOwen's
participation in the RC5-64 project and supplied that information as
requested. We also spoke at length with representatives of the prosecution
to make sure they understood the actual impact of the dnetc software on
the machines and networks in question.
However, part of the subpoena restricts us from commenting on the details
of pending litigation. Especially since we do not know the details or
circumstances of the alleged activity, we do not want to do anything which
would endanger either party's position in this case. We trust that the
community understands our position in this matter.
In the more general sense, not commenting at all on the specifics of this
case, it is never a good idea to run the distributed.net client software
on computers you don't own or administrate. In the four years or so that
we've been in operation we've been dragged in to a handful of situations
where people have lost their jobs, positions, and scholarships by thinking
that forgiveness would be easier to obtain than permission. Nobody,
especially distributed.net, wants to see this happen.
It's important to keep in mind that the literal resource consumption of
the client (which is as close to "zero" as can be) is often not the only
factor important to a business. The existence of prize money with the
RC5-64 project is discomforting to many organizations. One tactic which
has proven to be very effective is to provide an affidavit that you will
donate any winnings to a charity if a client you installed on a company
or university machine finds the winning key. In many cases, this has been
key to a participant receiving permission to run the client on non-owned
resources.
Another frequent stumbling block is with service and support contracts
which prohibit non-certified software running on workstations or servers.
Your university or employer may risk losing support on their equipment if
software is installed that hasn't been explicitly mentioned in the support
agreements.
The bottom line is, always get permission first. It might not be as
difficult to get permission as you think. And if you can't get permission,
don't install the client.
We hope for a speedy and just resolution to this case, whatever that
outcome should be, and that we never have to be involved in another one.
--
Delphis
Man, you're just begging to be told 'GO USE LINUX' aren't you? :)
If you're serving files, using a windows PC is ludicrous.
--
Delphis
$400 at the start, no, not 'expensive'. I guess I was thinking more in the long term after the planned obsolesence and proprietary add-on devices that BECOME NECESSARY. Suddenly it's all getting more expensive and those that are locked into it get to pay through the nose for it. Good luck :>
--
Delphis
Of course the people that bang-on about using consoles on a TV then come out and complain about comparing the outfit cost INCLUDING 'a nice monitor'.
.. very good graphics card.. costs about 1/3rd of a GeForce3. Nothing really NEEDS the power right now, so it's a waste of money.
You don't always have to go to the latest and 'greatest' to get kick-ass performance. The cost savings can be huge, and why by the latest stuff when it's going to be obsoleted in roughly the same period of time anyway.
GeForce2 GTS is my example
--
Delphis
With the advances in graphics cards, PCs look better for gaming to me. Consoles make (made?) a big point about being simple and portable. Once you started adding more and more shit to them they just become very expensive proprietary PCs. Seems a bit strange somehow..
--
Delphis
George Bush IS Barney
/. 'enhancement' of making you wait 20 seconds before posting anything?.. seems quick quips aren't 'allowed' any more... jeez..
PS: Anyone else notice the
--
Delphis
Yea, but you still see them driving around TOO FAST in their tank-sized SUV
--
Delphis
Are you going to mirror the anti-Barney sites then? ;)
--
Delphis
They are!
o n.obit/index.html
d ley.ap/index.html
That and the actor Jack Lemmon died yesterday, and of course Walter Mattau died about a year ago. A year ago next Monday actually.
http://www.cnn.com/2001/SHOWBIZ/Movies/06/28/lemm
And John Yardley who helped design the first spacecraft that put an American in space, died yesterday too:
http://www.cnn.com/2001/TECH/space/06/27/obit.yar
2001 seems to be a bad year for the deaths of well known people.
--
Delphis
Exactly. Latency is the real trick. Sure bandwidth is important but it's not much point if it takes ages to get it going. For example you can have a lot of bandwidth to your house this way: I fill up a 40GB disk and travel to your house with it, but the latency sucks .. it takes me a long time to travel there and hook up the drive compared to you actually starting to download the data with a modem.
When at the chip level and serveral requests are made constantly, the latency problem really kicks in.
--
Delphis
All this means is that there is a subtle bug in his logic.
.. Well, that's just DOS and Windows all through isn't it?
A subtle bug in Bill Gates' logic?
--
Delphis
We'll just lots of lurching drivers with worn out brake pads who speed, get a 'warning' from the GPS thingy that's about to rag on them, then slow down.
.. there time is money and they want to make sure you're not off lazing around in the truck stops, plus they have an image to protect hence the speeding tracking. But for personal motoring it's going too far imho.
Lather. Rinse. Repeat.
I still don't like the idea of being spied upon. If you're an employee for a trucking company, I can see it
--
Delphis
Anyway, I ended up waiting through 3 cycles of the light before finally running right on the red
.. How strange.
And the cycle of the light did not have a green for the road you were on?
--
Delphis
Have you ever driven in a 30 mph zone in England? ;> .. come to that, ever driven in england? :)
:) - I'm thinking of Leicester here...
You're lucky to have a two-lane road (i.e. one lane one way, one the other), after all the parked cars... normally it's down to 1 in side streets (yea, you have to take turns)
And with all the traffic I doubt you'd be able to accelerate anywhere.. let alone maneuver out of the way of anything.
--
Delphis
Yea.. it's strange. Here's an email I got back from Freedom Support (names and email addresses removed):
Subject: Ref: HD0000000034496 Support Linux!
Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 09:29:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: FreedomSupport@freedom.net
To: xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Hello,
Thank you for your interest in Freedom.
While we have every intention to continue our efforts with Linux in the future, at this time, this is not possible. We have not had as much interest as expected, so we are following the market tendencies until these prove otherwise.
We are compiling this feedback, and will make it available to our Product Managers, which are responsible for these decisions.
Regards,
xxxxxxxxx
Freedom Support Team
I don't know whether that's marketting snow or if they really do want to support Linux, maybe we'll see in the future..
--
Delphis
Thank god with Linux you can actually DO something about bloat. Linux user skill (on average) has gone from mainly very compentent to mainly 'whiney-ass Windows lusers' in a suprisingly short time. Right now you can configure your particular setup as you see fit, removing programs and areas of the filesystem you don't use. WTF is wrong with that?
--
Delphis