Germany does not subsidize any of the ISP's, but they do force competition. The US is slowly becoming a single provider country, at least for a given area. They can charge what they want.
That's not quite right. Everywhere in Germany where there's DSL service you can select from a number of vendors and they are running about 20 euros a month for up to 6MB- If you're paying $70 (about 50 euros) something isn't right.
They do this in Germany and it seems to work. IIRC the Deutsche Telekom is responsible for the line and they get fined if they refuse to repair the line. They can claim it's the ISP but it's pretty easy to tell and since they are responsible for the line right up the connector in your house, you can pretty easily tell if there is a DSL connection on the line or not. In any case it seems to work pretty well.
Why are we paying nearly double the cost as other countries?
Because people will pay for it.
In a lot of US markets there isn't much competition. Here in Germany, I can chose from about 10 DSL offerings that come to mind and there are probably more. There's only one cable offering in my area but I suspect the govt will force them to offer the last mile to competitors as they do with copper. My 32 MB connection with two phone lines and unlimited calls to most of Europe and the states costs 50 euros. You can get basic internet and telephone with 6MB for 20 euros a month. The DSL offerings are about the same, just without the 32 MB option.
According to the contract signed he would actually be correct in his demand. There is an actual contract and from my reading of it he would be correct. The problem is that the statute of limitations has expired. IANAL of course, so I may be completely off base on this but the article I read didn't question the claim.
I just refinished one of my bathrooms (I'm in Germany) and the new toilet uses much less water than the older "low-flush" toilet. But it is better at getting rid of any residues than the old one. This probably has to do with the shape and the coating.
A cut of the *gross* may not even work.... Thus, with a big enough initial "loan" and corresponding interest rate, it's possible to rig things so that no movie ever turns a profit
The profit doesn't matter, it's the gross revenues, which are not affected by interest, expenses and so on.
What sort of masochism had you use a C toolkit for C++?
You can still use C++ with GTK, in fact there is a C++ wrapper which I didn't use. I layered it in my own C++ objects, for the most part, which worked well.
Multiple updates per day sounds like a nightmare for customer relations if nothing else.
It's an internal mfg/sales/cust rel application which is constantly moving. The updates have to happen on the fly and not affect anyone other than the targeted group. In java you can use your own class loader to accomplish this. Under Windows, if someone has an application open on a shared drive, you have to wait for everyone using the application to close it before you can update it. The problem would be similar for java if you use jar files.
I tried to make something with Swing once. And SWK another time. I'm still traumatised by the (bad!) experience. Too hard to do even simple things.
IMO Swing is more difficult that GTK and also less amenable to abstraction. With GTK, it was alot easier to do even the basic things. Swing has the problem of not being thread-safe. Plus, the GTK apps loaded much more quickly. Java has improved alot since then, though.
since they have proper resource management (something Java only have for memory).
What resource mgmt are you referring to?
And frankly, I find the value of not having to recompile very small. I mean, it is a matter of a build environment, since you need the actual test environment anyway.
I have about 80 desktops. Installing a build environment on each would be a royal PIA, and, for each update, going to each machine and rebuilding?
C++, which is oh-so-much better suited to desktop applications than Java is.
Not sure you noticed, but C++ itself does not provide a desktop environment. You could use GTK but Windows compatibility is not always given. You could use Qt, but it's not a pervasive as GTk, though it would work. Still, for every update, I'd have to rebuild for each platform and each platform would have to have it's own update procedures.
Really, you need to read less marketing and more reality.
My application of 1.1 million lines of code runs on 80 boxes, currently mostly linux with some windows with updates happening multiple times a day. I also had tried Gtk with C++ and the main application used to be in Gtk/C++ so I know what's involved. Java is much much easier on multiplatform for those who have actually used both in real world environments. I guess this might be the "reality" you were referring to.
It's funny that the first argument I hear about the superiority of Proprietary software is usually Photoshop, a tool which very few people can afford. And it often has to do with people who've never used Gimp, or haven't used it enough to be proficient.
Could it be that if you spend that much money for something, you have to justify it to yourself? Or is it that Photoshop is now a verb ("that picture looks photoshopped to me"). What if Gimp were a verb ("that picture looks gimped to me"). The horror.
1. Windows vrs Linx: Our operation runs mostly under linux with a few Windows boxes. Our Linux boxes are much more reliable and easier to maintain than the Windows boxes. I maintain the ~70 linux boxes but my main job is writing the software. You set them up and they just work until you have a hardware issue. We have one guy who spends at least half his time fixing Windows issues for the roughly 10 Windows boxes we have in house. I can administer 70 Linux boxes with virtually no effort and write the software. I couldn't write the software if I had to administer that many windows boxes.
2. Open Office. We have a few MS Office experts who are constantly bragging about the superiority of MS Office. I use open office and when we've put our comparative office suites to efficiency tests (who can accomplish a specific task faster) Open Office usually wins. I know that MS Office offers alot and for real power users maybe they have to have it, but for everyday office tasks, OO is just as good and more efficient to use.
The fact is, you can create a Swing desktop program with extensive functionality which runs on Linux, Windows, Max OS X, Solaris and Windows as is without recompiling. Sure that are things you could do which are not platform independent but you usually don't have to.
You can also use java for everything from Cell Phones to Server Side applications.
I know of no other language with that flexibility.
Many Java apps made assumptions about file names and directory locations, and this prevented them from running on other OSes.
We've been using Java in a mixed environment for 10 years and haven't run into issues with file names. Most business applications don't do much with local files anyway, even if that were true, since most reference databases.
I had great hopes about Solaris as an optimized Java platform, but it didn't work out that way.
That only reason MacOS X has issues with Java is because Steve Jobs doesn't like java, probably because he doesn't own it and he was hurt that Sun didn't create a binary apple version, like it did for MS Windows and Linux. Once Apple decided to get on board, java worked fine.
Wasn't there a patent owned by xerox (I think) and maybe some others that Sun had to license for Java? My understanding was that there were are few patents that were licensed in the Sun version. The OpenJDK/JRE is free of those patents, AFAIK.
It seems, though, that if patents were violated, the mpeg-la (?) would have mentioned them by name already. They've done the usual M$ threat scene, but, AFAIK they haven't mentioned any specific patents, have they?
Our experience is that older workers want to work to get the job done but are slower to learn new tech but younger workers only want to learn the new tech but are less motivated when it comes to existing systems. Our conclusion is, if you are writing a business application, it's not sexy, so get someone older, he or she will be more reliable. If you are writing a game or something requiring a really cool interface then go with the younger applicant.
I would not be surprised if the percentage of non-thin-client Java development (including but not limited to Swing thick clients) is less than 0.01%
My app is written entirely in Java (MFG/Cust Service/Cash), 1.1 million lines of code. It is true that GUI bulders aren't very good compared to, let's say, Delphi, but Java lends itself well to code templates, which eases the burden, especially for an application where consistant look and feel is required.
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Germany does not subsidize any of the ISP's, but they do force competition. The US is slowly becoming a single provider country, at least for a given area. They can charge what they want.
That's not quite right. Everywhere in Germany where there's DSL service you can select from a number of vendors and they are running about 20 euros a month for up to 6MB- If you're paying $70 (about 50 euros) something isn't right.
HQ is located between Bremen and Hamburg. The best data service available economically is 4Mbit DSL
Do you have a cable option (Kabeldeutschland)? That would be significantly faster.
because we have to pay for the larger fiber footprint
Given what I've heard about the speeds in the US, most users aren't seeing much benefit from the fiber footprint.
They do this in Germany and it seems to work. IIRC the Deutsche Telekom is responsible for the line and they get fined if they refuse to repair the line. They can claim it's the ISP but it's pretty easy to tell and since they are responsible for the line right up the connector in your house, you can pretty easily tell if there is a DSL connection on the line or not. In any case it seems to work pretty well.
Why are we paying nearly double the cost as other countries?
Because people will pay for it.
In a lot of US markets there isn't much competition. Here in Germany, I can chose from about 10 DSL offerings that come to mind and there are probably more. There's only one cable offering in my area but I suspect the govt will force them to offer the last mile to competitors as they do with copper. My 32 MB connection with two phone lines and unlimited calls to most of Europe and the states costs 50 euros. You can get basic internet and telephone with 6MB for 20 euros a month. The DSL offerings are about the same, just without the 32 MB option.
I have family on different continents and never saw the need of using Facebook to connect with them or stay in touch. Email/phone/IM is way better.
If you know their email address, telephone number or IM id. If you don't, FB is a great way to find them (or be found).
According to the contract signed he would actually be correct in his demand. There is an actual contract and from my reading of it he would be correct. The problem is that the statute of limitations has expired. IANAL of course, so I may be completely off base on this but the article I read didn't question the claim.
I just refinished one of my bathrooms (I'm in Germany) and the new toilet uses much less water than the older "low-flush" toilet. But it is better at getting rid of any residues than the old one. This probably has to do with the shape and the coating.
Excellent points and very informative. Thanks.
A cut of the *gross* may not even work. ... Thus, with a big enough initial "loan" and corresponding interest rate, it's possible to rig things so that no movie ever turns a profit
The profit doesn't matter, it's the gross revenues, which are not affected by interest, expenses and so on.
What sort of masochism had you use a C toolkit for C++?
You can still use C++ with GTK, in fact there is a C++ wrapper which I didn't use. I layered it in my own C++ objects, for the most part, which worked well.
Multiple updates per day sounds like a nightmare for customer relations if nothing else.
It's an internal mfg/sales/cust rel application which is constantly moving. The updates have to happen on the fly and not affect anyone other than the targeted group. In java you can use your own class loader to accomplish this. Under Windows, if someone has an application open on a shared drive, you have to wait for everyone using the application to close it before you can update it. The problem would be similar for java if you use jar files.
I tried to make something with Swing once. And SWK another time. I'm still traumatised by the (bad!) experience. Too hard to do even simple things.
IMO Swing is more difficult that GTK and also less amenable to abstraction. With GTK, it was alot easier to do even the basic things. Swing has the problem of not being thread-safe. Plus, the GTK apps loaded much more quickly. Java has improved alot since then, though.
since they have proper resource management (something Java only have for memory).
What resource mgmt are you referring to?
And frankly, I find the value of not having to recompile very small. I mean, it is a matter of a build environment, since you need the actual test environment anyway.
I have about 80 desktops. Installing a build environment on each would be a royal PIA, and, for each update, going to each machine and rebuilding?
C++, which is oh-so-much better suited to desktop applications than Java is.
Not sure you noticed, but C++ itself does not provide a desktop environment. You could use GTK but Windows compatibility is not always given. You could use Qt, but it's not a pervasive as GTk, though it would work. Still, for every update, I'd have to rebuild for each platform and each platform would have to have it's own update procedures.
Really, you need to read less marketing and more reality.
My application of 1.1 million lines of code runs on 80 boxes, currently mostly linux with some windows with updates happening multiple times a day. I also had tried Gtk with C++ and the main application used to be in Gtk/C++ so I know what's involved. Java is much much easier on multiplatform for those who have actually used both in real world environments. I guess this might be the "reality" you were referring to.
It's funny that the first argument I hear about the superiority of Proprietary software is usually Photoshop, a tool which very few people can afford. And it often has to do with people who've never used Gimp, or haven't used it enough to be proficient.
Could it be that if you spend that much money for something, you have to justify it to yourself? Or is it that Photoshop is now a verb ("that picture looks photoshopped to me"). What if Gimp were a verb ("that picture looks gimped to me"). The horror.
I'll give you two examples of a F/OSS comparison:
1. Windows vrs Linx: Our operation runs mostly under linux with a few Windows boxes. Our Linux boxes are much more reliable and easier to maintain than the Windows boxes. I maintain the ~70 linux boxes but my main job is writing the software. You set them up and they just work until you have a hardware issue. We have one guy who spends at least half his time fixing Windows issues for the roughly 10 Windows boxes we have in house. I can administer 70 Linux boxes with virtually no effort and write the software. I couldn't write the software if I had to administer that many windows boxes.
2. Open Office. We have a few MS Office experts who are constantly bragging about the superiority of MS Office. I use open office and when we've put our comparative office suites to efficiency tests (who can accomplish a specific task faster) Open Office usually wins. I know that MS Office offers alot and for real power users maybe they have to have it, but for everyday office tasks, OO is just as good and more efficient to use.
Very well put. Thanks.
The fact is, you can create a Swing desktop program with extensive functionality which runs on Linux, Windows, Max OS X, Solaris and Windows as is without recompiling. Sure that are things you could do which are not platform independent but you usually don't have to.
You can also use java for everything from Cell Phones to Server Side applications.
I know of no other language with that flexibility.
Many Java apps made assumptions about file names and directory locations, and this prevented them from running on other OSes.
We've been using Java in a mixed environment for 10 years and haven't run into issues with file names. Most business applications don't do much with local files anyway, even if that were true, since most reference databases.
I had great hopes about Solaris as an optimized Java platform, but it didn't work out that way.
That only reason MacOS X has issues with Java is because Steve Jobs doesn't like java, probably because he doesn't own it and he was hurt that Sun didn't create a binary apple version, like it did for MS Windows and Linux. Once Apple decided to get on board, java worked fine.
Wasn't there a patent owned by xerox (I think) and maybe some others that Sun had to license for Java? My understanding was that there were are few patents that were licensed in the Sun version. The OpenJDK/JRE is free of those patents, AFAIK.
It seems, though, that if patents were violated, the mpeg-la (?) would have mentioned them by name already. They've done the usual M$ threat scene, but, AFAIK they haven't mentioned any specific patents, have they?
Our experience is that older workers want to work to get the job done but are slower to learn new tech but younger workers only want to learn the new tech but are less motivated when it comes to existing systems. Our conclusion is, if you are writing a business application, it's not sexy, so get someone older, he or she will be more reliable. If you are writing a game or something requiring a really cool interface then go with the younger applicant.
I'm no fan of the RIAA either, but can we keep this "it's a jihad!" bullshit out of this?
Actually, I think the poster is pretty reasonable in his use of that word. I couldn't think of a better application of the word.
t's slow, bloated ...
Gotta disagree with you there. It used to be but not any more. It's no slower than any other app with the same complexity.
If you had the right runtime
If I'm not mistaken, can't you tell JWS to download and install the correct runtime if it is not installed?
I would not be surprised if the percentage of non-thin-client Java development (including but not limited to Swing thick clients) is less than 0.01%
My app is written entirely in Java (MFG/Cust Service/Cash), 1.1 million lines of code. It is true that GUI bulders aren't very good compared to, let's say, Delphi, but Java lends itself well to code templates, which eases the burden, especially for an application where consistant look and feel is required.
Sheesh, this kind of attitude makes it pretty difficult for us Linux users. IE, Silverlight. C'mon guys, show some team spirit.