3dfx never was able to crack in both the game and 3d (workstation (low-mid range) and buisness market.... nvidia simply did a great job, technology wise, performance-wise and quality-wise. They've won the fight against 3dfx with a FAIR war, beating them on every point they had to. They deserve a praise, as opposed to rambus. I never liked 3dfx after seeing tnt2, besides I Couldn't use a crappy voodoo2 with lightwave, so i've abandonned it there.
Another good thing is it leaves nvidia with another load of 3d engr. which is surely not bad do advance technology. either competing or joining force, they're will bring out new killer stuff, I'm sure... besides there's still ATI for competition...
and if they do like matrox and sit on their ass while having a great product (millenium anyone?) well, they'll still be in trouble... don't worry, ATI won't sit on their ass and do nothing, and as for matrox well.. dunno, since they've seem to have quitted the "performance" market to the visual.... will see with the newer chipsets.
anyhows, good move nvidia, congrads... you're the first company I see winning a fair war since a long time.
See, that's exactly what I meant by Clueless jerk.
Revive a dead platform, Okay, it's not even backward compatible, it's not even using 1% of the old Platform, so tell me, where's the REVIVAL part in this?? they are using a NAME, and a CONCEPT associated with the name.
What happened to you when you were a child dude? did you own a nice black and white mac II classic playing Dark Castle while someone was showing you Sword of Sodan or shadow of the beast? God, Now I know why you hate amiga so much now. Do you know how many people I pissed off (especially mac users) when I ran shapeshifter on my 040 A2000, trashing EVERY single Quadra benchmark there was, and this, my friend, on an EMULATOR. Hey I had a free mac for the price of my amiga, that was btw, cheaper than the mac.
That was destroying the mac users's claim "Amiga has less software than mac" well I was saying "Now amiga has all the MAC software, PLUS it's own software". Naturally, single tracked mind would see and still not beleive his investment was bad.... makes me think of teenagers battling over 3DFX vs Nvidia, Nintendo versus SEGA... Never show someone he made a bad investment decision, especially if he has an Ego the size of cartman's ass. Well that's what most mac user were back then. And some still are today.
I do not want this to be a troll, but it's seriously LAME to attack something you obviously don't know. Keyword such as:
"REVIVE DEAD PLATFORM"
"Oh I WANT MY COCO BACK"
"This reminds me of a 70 years old guy going on about his high-school lover without realizing that like 50 years have passed and everybody else has moved on. "
"Why do you keep bringing the amiga, it's dead"
I thought the slashdot readers were a bit more informed before stating such comments.
Kudos to Tacos, he actually read his stuff. You guys obviously don't.
I knew there was probably something like that around... but never seen it written anywhere yet.
Funny thing is, why when drive dies, (headcrash, not the PCB that burns out) it's such a pain in the ass to retreive data and we get "It's impossible to recover the data from it" but if you'd be a p0rn freak with disgusting tastes, and throw your drive against the wall and step over it just before the cops raid you, they could revive every single pixels of the shit you've leeched? Makes you wonder what purpose the technology serves, not that I am against taking these people down, but average joe that worked on a project without doing any backups (stupid I know, but the majority is "stupid" anyways:) ) cannot benefit from this.
Now you'll have to go from 1 wipe to 10.... thank you for
making people more paranoid:) heh.
Well if you want compatibility, go with Desjardins if you are located in Quebec:) these losers are still using the same web interface lacking 90% of the features of their competitors, and the same design that was there 3 years ago. It's buttugly and suckish, but hey! it works:)
Seriously, I think if people are pissed at TD you should to a petition thing, emailing one by one is dissolving and they won't take it into account, but if they receive a petition with 2000 names on it for example, that can be heard.
Others will say, "This a a platform for computer hobbyist, nothing more".
And some other clueless whiners that never even touched an amiga before nor have a clue about the people behind it will say "Bah it sucks for X (most of the time clueless), reasons".
The truth is, having choice for platforms is good. Else most of you people wouldn't be running linux and be stuck with MS. Now, how do you feel when windows people tell you "linux is not ready for primetime, it's not a desktop OS, it suck, it cannot play 90% of the games out there, it's too hard to configure, it's not user-friendly, bla bla bla"?
My point is: I do remember back in end-80's early 90's that the amiga was: "not a serious platform, only good for gaming (that was the argument that was pissing me off the most, look where gaming is today and the market behind it!) and there were no "tools" for it (yeah of course, wordperfect wasn't a tool I guess, Final writer didn't do it's job neither I guess? all this without mentionning all the AWESOME graphic apps/HW that were available (Art departement pro, lightwave, ImageFX, Deluxe Paint, the video toaster, to name a few). People were still bitching about it, bigmouths were bashing it against their 286 and after 386's... heck, an amiga could have a lifespan of over 5 years: just stick in an accelerator and you're back in buisness (exept when the AGA machines showed up). People were bitching at something they didn't even try out nor understood, *almost* everybody that learned how to use that platform fell in love with it, I'm not talking about the people who popped a disk and played speedball a few times, I'm talking about normal users, programmers, people that would rely on this platform for their daily work or dose of entertainment.
Well I've thought the linux community would be happy to see something this good to be kept alive. The amiga always did MORE with LESS hardware. The fact that today you find normal an OS like win2k pro needs 128+ megs of ram just to sit idle without burping on the harddrive is what makes you go "yuk... 64Megs". The Fact that you're driven with 100+fps (who needs that anyways? I'm still using a TNT2 and I'd like more 3d functions over raw speed, more realism, and that's what matrox said they would targer in their next generation products. Yes I know, NVIDIA are working on that too.) NVIDIA is the leader, that probably makes matrox sucks right? Well remember just 2 years ago, 3DFX were the leaders, and remember 2 years before that 3D franzy, Matrox were the 2D leaders. Things can change quickly. I'm not saying matrox will come out with a GTS killer, I'd doubt it, but they always find a good balancing to get into a part of the market. If amiga can exploit the new hardware from matrox correctly, it could e really get interresting.
Amiga was about hardware, today, you *CAN'T* compete against PC hardware, mainly because each parts of the PC motherboard gets a buttload of R&D from so many different companies, that if you are "smaller" you need to use off the shelves parts. Even apple understood that when they've chosen ATI for their graphics card just a few years ago.
Today, amiga is about software, OS, it's still "early" in developpement, it's *NOT* based on the 1985 model, so people saying "you're reviving a platform" are just CLUELESS about what's happening here and you only show sign of stupidity and ignorance publicly, the stuff being made today won't run on my Amiga 1200 for example (unless I add an accelerator or expansion module again:) ).
Bottom line is, bitch on something you've tested and played around with, and don't act like the windows users did with linux, and previous amiga models. If Amiga would have had good people at marketting and not an asshole for president, it would be far more advanced than apple is today, and if you think apple users are loyal, you haven't seen real amiga users in your life.
One funny thing is, I've never seen any java implementation on amiga, and now a java-tech company is Using amiga's name for the new OS, kind of ironic.
Anyways, competition is a good thing, What good is it to have a K12-40GHZ and NVIDIA DESTROYER XTREME XDS 2000 and 30TB of ram if you're running windows 3.1? I'm not saying others os won't cut it, but another good OS that could have a drastic approach and new concepts applied could be interresting to see. New stuff always gets criticized anyways, it's only history repeating itself. I wish for them to succeed this time.
All is missing now is someone with a tattoo of
the source code on his back, heh makes you wonder...
Disclaimer: I am not responsible if anyone does something that erm... weird;)
Probably the moderator has some shares of intel
or worse, rambus:) and he's pissed off:)
This post wasn't meant to be flamebait, but a
true statement. I didn't want to jump in the
4x bandwagon after seeing the poor integration
and most of the board had to be switched down
to 2x or to keep 4x you have to turn off some of the options that makes it worth the speed increase. Which is totally pathetic, it's like
buying a pentium III and having to shut down the cache because the supply current is too borderline, stupid? well it's about the same thing exept for a graphic card.
I hate it when they rush standards that aren't
"standard" or need a patch to work, and with the recent chipset fiasco from intel, I can't beleive the AGP8X will be any better than the current 4x incarnation.
On the bright side, there's always the fact that
they did it with NVIDIA and they are the #1 gfx card company for now. So probably the next chipset + nvidia boards will work properly:)
I don't know about you guys, but recently I feel that ANY "commercial" encryption solutions are nothing more than a big joke? if there's a backdoor, it beats the purpose of encryption itself. Worse, it even helps to filter the "garbage" from the useful stuff for anyone who has the power to defeat the encryption scheme with a backdoor (gov? yahoo staff? you name it), because the encrypted data is probably more important than the non-encripted data anyways.
Hell, might has well write all the message backwards, these people are so good for high-end crapping that they would probably miss the obvious:)
It keeps the same concept that the amiga name always brought after it's "death": Innovation... not "bull gates"'s innovation, as in stealing stuff and putting it mainstream, but true innovation.
For the people bitching that it's not fully backward compatible with the 1985 amiga models, just run UAE, with all the current high-speed CPU grade to chose from, processing power shouldn't be a problem.
I like the concept of VP, I like the fact that this company ACTUALLY shipped something, not only vaporware.
As for people biching about the Java engine's speed, you should have read the article entirely before jumping to the benchmarks and whinning about the results, this is a DEVELOPPERs version, and they've got some improved stuff already, not bad for a 1.0 version.
And finally, for those who claim that there's "no old people from commodore" in this project, well there's at least 2 good things: They won't fuckup (marketting-wise) and look at what Dave Haynie has to say about the VP (of course, you know who Dave Haynie is, right?)
http://amiga.org/editorials/2000/0808-haynie.sht ml
If you want more information I also suggest reading http://www-4.ibm.com/software/developer/library/am iga.html?dwzone=linux
I wish them luck, and success. For those who don't like it, just don't read about it or use it! put your negative energies on something more worthwhile like human causes or do something better, this one deserves more than a chance.
Slashdot Mirror
3dfx never was able to crack in both the game and 3d (workstation (low-mid range) and buisness market.... nvidia simply did a great job, technology wise, performance-wise and quality-wise. They've won the fight against 3dfx with a FAIR war, beating them on every point they had to. They deserve a praise, as opposed to rambus. I never liked 3dfx after seeing tnt2, besides I Couldn't use a crappy voodoo2 with lightwave, so i've abandonned it there. Another good thing is it leaves nvidia with another load of 3d engr. which is surely not bad do advance technology. either competing or joining force, they're will bring out new killer stuff, I'm sure... besides there's still ATI for competition... and if they do like matrox and sit on their ass while having a great product (millenium anyone?) well, they'll still be in trouble... don't worry, ATI won't sit on their ass and do nothing, and as for matrox well.. dunno, since they've seem to have quitted the "performance" market to the visual.... will see with the newer chipsets. anyhows, good move nvidia, congrads... you're the first company I see winning a fair war since a long time.
It's only cartman's ass.
See, that's exactly what I meant by Clueless jerk.
Revive a dead platform, Okay, it's not even backward compatible, it's not even using 1% of the old Platform, so tell me, where's the REVIVAL part in this?? they are using a NAME, and a CONCEPT associated with the name.
What happened to you when you were a child dude? did you own a nice black and white mac II classic playing Dark Castle while someone was showing you Sword of Sodan or shadow of the beast? God, Now I know why you hate amiga so much now. Do you know how many people I pissed off (especially mac users) when I ran shapeshifter on my 040 A2000, trashing EVERY single Quadra benchmark there was, and this, my friend, on an EMULATOR. Hey I had a free mac for the price of my amiga, that was btw, cheaper than the mac.
That was destroying the mac users's claim "Amiga has less software than mac" well I was saying "Now amiga has all the MAC software, PLUS it's own software". Naturally, single tracked mind would see and still not beleive his investment was bad.... makes me think of teenagers battling over 3DFX vs Nvidia, Nintendo versus SEGA... Never show someone he made a bad investment decision, especially if he has an Ego the size of cartman's ass. Well that's what most mac user were back then. And some still are today.
I do not want this to be a troll, but it's seriously LAME to attack something you obviously don't know. Keyword such as:
"REVIVE DEAD PLATFORM"
"Oh I WANT MY COCO BACK"
"This reminds me of a 70 years old guy going on about his high-school lover without realizing that like 50 years have passed and everybody else has moved on. "
"Why do you keep bringing the amiga, it's dead"
I thought the slashdot readers were a bit more informed before stating such comments.
Kudos to Tacos, he actually read his stuff. You guys obviously don't.
I knew there was probably something like that around... but never seen it written anywhere yet.
:) ) cannot benefit from this.
:) heh.
Funny thing is, why when drive dies, (headcrash, not the PCB that burns out) it's such a pain in the ass to retreive data and we get "It's impossible to recover the data from it" but if you'd be a p0rn freak with disgusting tastes, and throw your drive against the wall and step over it just before the cops raid you, they could revive every single pixels of the shit you've leeched? Makes you wonder what purpose the technology serves, not that I am against taking these people down, but average joe that worked on a project without doing any backups (stupid I know, but the majority is "stupid" anyways
Now you'll have to go from 1 wipe to 10.... thank you for
making people more paranoid
Well if you want compatibility, go with Desjardins if you are located in Quebec
Seriously, I think if people are pissed at TD you should to a petition thing, emailing one by one is dissolving and they won't take it into account, but if they receive a petition with 2000 names on it for example, that can be heard.
Most of the people will say, too little too late.
:) ).
Others will say, "This a a platform for computer hobbyist, nothing more".
And some other clueless whiners that never even touched an amiga before nor have a clue about the people behind it will say "Bah it sucks for X (most of the time clueless), reasons".
The truth is, having choice for platforms is good. Else most of you people wouldn't be running linux and be stuck with MS. Now, how do you feel when windows people tell you "linux is not ready for primetime, it's not a desktop OS, it suck, it cannot play 90% of the games out there, it's too hard to configure, it's not user-friendly, bla bla bla"?
My point is: I do remember back in end-80's early 90's that the amiga was: "not a serious platform, only good for gaming (that was the argument that was pissing me off the most, look where gaming is today and the market behind it!) and there were no "tools" for it (yeah of course, wordperfect wasn't a tool I guess, Final writer didn't do it's job neither I guess? all this without mentionning all the AWESOME graphic apps/HW that were available (Art departement pro, lightwave, ImageFX, Deluxe Paint, the video toaster, to name a few). People were still bitching about it, bigmouths were bashing it against their 286 and after 386's... heck, an amiga could have a lifespan of over 5 years: just stick in an accelerator and you're back in buisness (exept when the AGA machines showed up). People were bitching at something they didn't even try out nor understood, *almost* everybody that learned how to use that platform fell in love with it, I'm not talking about the people who popped a disk and played speedball a few times, I'm talking about normal users, programmers, people that would rely on this platform for their daily work or dose of entertainment.
Well I've thought the linux community would be happy to see something this good to be kept alive. The amiga always did MORE with LESS hardware. The fact that today you find normal an OS like win2k pro needs 128+ megs of ram just to sit idle without burping on the harddrive is what makes you go "yuk... 64Megs". The Fact that you're driven with 100+fps (who needs that anyways? I'm still using a TNT2 and I'd like more 3d functions over raw speed, more realism, and that's what matrox said they would targer in their next generation products. Yes I know, NVIDIA are working on that too.) NVIDIA is the leader, that probably makes matrox sucks right? Well remember just 2 years ago, 3DFX were the leaders, and remember 2 years before that 3D franzy, Matrox were the 2D leaders. Things can change quickly. I'm not saying matrox will come out with a GTS killer, I'd doubt it, but they always find a good balancing to get into a part of the market. If amiga can exploit the new hardware from matrox correctly, it could e really get interresting.
Amiga was about hardware, today, you *CAN'T* compete against PC hardware, mainly because each parts of the PC motherboard gets a buttload of R&D from so many different companies, that if you are "smaller" you need to use off the shelves parts. Even apple understood that when they've chosen ATI for their graphics card just a few years ago.
Today, amiga is about software, OS, it's still "early" in developpement, it's *NOT* based on the 1985 model, so people saying "you're reviving a platform" are just CLUELESS about what's happening here and you only show sign of stupidity and ignorance publicly, the stuff being made today won't run on my Amiga 1200 for example (unless I add an accelerator or expansion module again
Bottom line is, bitch on something you've tested and played around with, and don't act like the windows users did with linux, and previous amiga models. If Amiga would have had good people at marketting and not an asshole for president, it would be far more advanced than apple is today, and if you think apple users are loyal, you haven't seen real amiga users in your life.
One funny thing is, I've never seen any java implementation on amiga, and now a java-tech company is Using amiga's name for the new OS, kind of ironic.
Anyways, competition is a good thing, What good is it to have a K12-40GHZ and NVIDIA DESTROYER XTREME XDS 2000 and 30TB of ram if you're running windows 3.1? I'm not saying others os won't cut it, but another good OS that could have a drastic approach and new concepts applied could be interresting to see. New stuff always gets criticized anyways, it's only history repeating itself. I wish for them to succeed this time.
All is missing now is someone with a tattoo of the source code on his back, heh makes you wonder... Disclaimer: I am not responsible if anyone does something that erm... weird ;)
In Canada, we won't even bother calling you. :)
Probably the moderator has some shares of intel :) and he's pissed off :)
:)
or worse, rambus
This post wasn't meant to be flamebait, but a
true statement. I didn't want to jump in the
4x bandwagon after seeing the poor integration
and most of the board had to be switched down
to 2x or to keep 4x you have to turn off some of the options that makes it worth the speed increase. Which is totally pathetic, it's like
buying a pentium III and having to shut down the cache because the supply current is too borderline, stupid? well it's about the same thing exept for a graphic card.
I hate it when they rush standards that aren't
"standard" or need a patch to work, and with the recent chipset fiasco from intel, I can't beleive the AGP8X will be any better than the current 4x incarnation.
On the bright side, there's always the fact that
they did it with NVIDIA and they are the #1 gfx card company for now. So probably the next chipset + nvidia boards will work properly
.. Is asking for trouble...
:)
I don't know about you guys, but recently I feel that ANY "commercial" encryption solutions are nothing more than a big joke? if there's a backdoor, it beats the purpose of encryption itself. Worse, it even helps to filter the "garbage" from the useful stuff for anyone who has the power to defeat the encryption scheme with a backdoor (gov? yahoo staff? you name it), because the encrypted data is probably more important than the non-encripted data anyways.
Hell, might has well write all the message backwards, these people are so good for high-end crapping that they would probably miss the obvious
It keeps the same concept that the amiga name always brought after it's "death": Innovation... not "bull gates"'s innovation, as in stealing stuff and putting it mainstream, but true innovation.
t ml
m iga.html?dwzone=linux
For the people bitching that it's not fully backward compatible with the 1985 amiga models, just run UAE, with all the current high-speed CPU grade to chose from, processing power shouldn't be a problem.
I like the concept of VP, I like the fact that this company ACTUALLY shipped something, not only vaporware.
As for people biching about the Java engine's speed, you should have read the article entirely before jumping to the benchmarks and whinning about the results, this is a DEVELOPPERs version, and they've got some improved stuff already, not bad for a 1.0 version.
And finally, for those who claim that there's "no old people from commodore" in this project, well there's at least 2 good things: They won't fuckup (marketting-wise) and look at what Dave Haynie has to say about the VP (of course, you know who Dave Haynie is, right?)
http://amiga.org/editorials/2000/0808-haynie.sh
If you want more information I also suggest reading http://www-4.ibm.com/software/developer/library/a
I wish them luck, and success. For those who don't like it, just don't read about it or use it! put your negative energies on something more worthwhile like human causes or do something better, this one deserves more than a chance.