Integrating a second world country into a first world one is not an easy task. What is wrong with Americans? I used to want to scream when I heard on CNN that Germany's problems were due to their socialist government. East Germany is a mess because it is a recovering Soviet client state that doesn't have the Soviet Union propping up it's economy, and reversing 40 years of misrule doesn't happen overnight, or even in 11 years. Just imagine how well the US would do if it decided to integrate Mexico into the US. Economic stagnation would be the result, just as has happened in Germany. Blame Chancellor Kohl, it was his dumb idea, based on a Germany that never existed in the first place.
Trying to keep conflicts down? Ha! I think you should have a look at this and then judge how great a force for peace the US has been over the past 30 years. Not that the Europeans or Japanese have exactly covered themselves with glory either.
Because the NSA have it and the German government doesn't. If they used a truly open system then backdoors could be planted but a security audit would find them.
Moral reasons. As if US corporations don't use the same tactics and get as many government subsidies as European ones. Anyone who thinks otherwise should do a search on corporate welfare on Google and see that more of your taxes go to wealthy corporations than go on benefits to the poor, and yet those same corporations via the puppet media are the ones advocating cuts in poverty benefit.
I don't much like COBOL. It's way too wordy. It's my job though and it pays for me to play with better stuff (and the rest of my life too). I agree with you that a C/C++ programmer would have an easier job learning COBOL than I would (although they'd probably go insane first), but it doesn't make me any less of a programmer. The reason I haven't bothered to learn C yet is that it's a bit obscure and requires me to allocate my own memory and mess around with pointers which, although more efficient, is a pain in the backside. High level languages for me are supposed to allow the programmer to write code without having to worry about allocating and freeing space and cleaning up after myself. The system I'm working on at the moment is a shambles and would be a lot worse in C/C++ due to having to do more low-level stuff.
Finally I'd like to apologise if I was a bit ranty, but you seemed to be saying that only C/C++ programmers were the only ones who truly knew how to program. And salary is probably the worst indicator of someone's ability. I've worked with people on way more than me who should have been wearing bright orange wigs, baggy trousers and big floppy shoes:)
Of course I can debug a core dump. It'd be really tedious to have to go through the program putting displays everywhere. I don't need an understanding of assembler to do this, just knowledge of where my storage is.
So what you're saying is that only people who can code in C or C++ are programmers. Well I have the misfortune to be a COBOL contractor and, guess what? I get paid $100,000 a year. Not bad for someone who doesn't know the 2 true languages, C and C++. Of course I also know a few other languages, such as Java, Rexx and a bit of Python, but they're not 3l33t and therefore irrelevant. I've got a question for you Mister überprogrammer: what's the point of having high-level languages if you have to do the memory and pointer management yourself? Why not just use assembler? Granted it makes device driver writing easier, but that's a pretty specialised skill compared to the requirements of your average bank or supermarket.
So what you're saying is that coders should write everything from scratch. Have you written your own X server, or graphics toolkit. I doubt it. Java programming is a hell of a lot more than putting together a GUI. Or does the JDK contain classes for every business process for, say, every public utility on the planet, including future ones not yet thought of. OOP requires as much thought and knowledge as procedural unless you think you could learn Java and become productive in a few days.
By the way, Python is OO, so it's a crap example and it also has Jython **gasp** a Java-enabled version.
How long does an American who can't afford health insurance take to get a decent surgeon? This is the difference. It may take six months to get your knee op in Europe, but at least you can get it. As for America being the land of opportunity, the richest man in America was handed a very nice head start in life. Not to say that Gates hasn't worked for every penny, but if his parents had been rednecks from a trailer park, I doubt he would have amounted to much.
Which leads to a far lower crime rate everywhere in Europe except the UK (which is really just Eastern America anyway), decent public transport, cleaner streets, a truly free press (i.e all points of view not just the corporatist agenda), legal cannabis in Denmark and Holland, and a generally enlightened attitude towards the human body and human sexuality (also not found in the UK).There is a great deal more to the quality of life than money. What good is money if some crackhead can point a gun at you and take it (and possibly your life as well) from you?
Yes it has. That has nothing to do with my argument. Windows still has a long way to go before it's easy to use as well. When I go six months without anyone asking me for help on Windows then I will concede that it's easy to use.
And if your company will hire just anyone to admin their systems then they've got real problems in their IT department.
Ha! Like that would stop them. They're also forbidden to use a monopoly to restrict trade or to gain marketshare in another market, but look how many apologists came out saying that the anti-trust laws are stupid, Microsoft is a powerhouse yada yada.
I don't understand this because I was pretty useless at maths in school and because it was 16 years ago as well. Many braincells have been killed by beer since then.
What? Pay Microsoft yet again for something that doesn't work properly. I've got it on my desktop, a PIII-500 Compaq with stock parts. It took 3 hours to get it on there because it would fail silently after trying to load loads of unnecessary drivers. I started browsing the web, and after 5 minutes it rebooted automatically. Buggy drivers? Possibly, although I doubt I'll ever know. Linux has yet to do this to me, although I'll admit to a crash or 2 due to me not knowing what I was doing with X (and therefore could sort it out - unlike Windows)
I'm talking about corporate users. I, personally, would use the command line a lot, but there would be no requirement to do so. Set up the corporate desktop with the required start menus, host it remotely on an X server and have Win4Lin or VMWare for any apps that only run on Windows. Support nightmare is diminished due to Linux not blowing up incomprehensibly and the only difference the user might notice is that the fonts are uglier.
Susie the secretary will not understand *Nix vs. point and click.
Unless Susie the secretary installs a distro from '96 then she will probably never have to use the command line. Do you need to know how the Windows kernel works to use Word 2000. Also if Susie has problems with her machine she calls tech support who logon remotely and fix it for her.
As for 'which one is better', I suppose having several choices of server company is also a bad thing. How are you supposed to know who's the best.
How about anti-virus software, groupware, fault-logging software? Is the plethora of choices also a bad thing.
I'm so tired of bullshit arguments like this. Linux is no harder to use than Windows. I have to help my family out on a regular basis because Windows plays up on them, and unlike Linux there is no way for me to find out why.
If Windows is easy to use then obviously no tech support is required as well.
Linux nowadays needs as much command line intervention as Windows does, which is to say occasionally, usually when network information is required.
If you can name me a situation when command line is the only option I'll be impressed.
No their parents elected to send them there. The only choice (if any) was which one. What the parents think of the school policies may be completely different to the child's opinion, but it's the parents who have all the rights, not the child.
Creativity is not rewarded by the music industry - being the same as any 10 other artists is. And the 'reward' is 40 cents of a $15 CD.
I use Napster to hear songs from bands that I've heard of and am curious to hear more, or to work out a track on the guitar without having to go to the library and hire the CD. Being without the ability to do this wouldn't make me buy more CDs, it would make me buy less as I don't tend to buy albums when I've not heard at least one track from it. The RIAA is removing something I find useful that has cost them very little money and has given them a lot more targetted free advertising than MTV or the radio stations.
Had they taken the intelligent step as per Bertelsmann and instituted a subscription service I would have signed up in a second.
But no, the real scumbags in this have to stick to their olde-worlde business model for fear of losing even a single cent of the obscene profits they make on the back of those they're pretending to defend. Roll on MP3-only record labels.
But I'm running Mandrake 7.2 which is glibc-2.1. Sadly all the cooker RPMs are for glibc-2.2 and the upgrade comes out with about 50 dependencies. I'm a patient man, I can wait for 8.0.
Slashdot Mirror
Integrating a second world country into a first world one is not an easy task. What is wrong with Americans? I used to want to scream when I heard on CNN that Germany's problems were due to their socialist government. East Germany is a mess because it is a recovering Soviet client state that doesn't have the Soviet Union propping up it's economy, and reversing 40 years of misrule doesn't happen overnight, or even in 11 years. Just imagine how well the US would do if it decided to integrate Mexico into the US. Economic stagnation would be the result, just as has happened in Germany. Blame Chancellor Kohl, it was his dumb idea, based on a Germany that never existed in the first place.
How to look an idiot by forgetting to close quotes. Try looking here.
Trying to keep conflicts down? Ha! I think you should have a look at this and then judge how great a force for peace the US has been over the past 30 years. Not that the Europeans or Japanese have exactly covered themselves with glory either.
Because the NSA have it and the German government doesn't. If they used a truly open system then backdoors could be planted but a security audit would find them.
Moral reasons. As if US corporations don't use the same tactics and get as many government subsidies as European ones. Anyone who thinks otherwise should do a search on corporate welfare on Google and see that more of your taxes go to wealthy corporations than go on benefits to the poor, and yet those same corporations via the puppet media are the ones advocating cuts in poverty benefit.
US corporations of course receive no money from their government.
I don't much like COBOL. It's way too wordy. It's my job though and it pays for me to play with better stuff (and the rest of my life too). I agree with you that a C/C++ programmer would have an easier job learning COBOL than I would (although they'd probably go insane first), but it doesn't make me any less of a programmer. The reason I haven't bothered to learn C yet is that it's a bit obscure and requires me to allocate my own memory and mess around with pointers which, although more efficient, is a pain in the backside. High level languages for me are supposed to allow the programmer to write code without having to worry about allocating and freeing space and cleaning up after myself. The system I'm working on at the moment is a shambles and would be a lot worse in C/C++ due to having to do more low-level stuff. :)
Finally I'd like to apologise if I was a bit ranty, but you seemed to be saying that only C/C++ programmers were the only ones who truly knew how to program. And salary is probably the worst indicator of someone's ability. I've worked with people on way more than me who should have been wearing bright orange wigs, baggy trousers and big floppy shoes
Of course I can debug a core dump. It'd be really tedious to have to go through the program putting displays everywhere. I don't need an understanding of assembler to do this, just knowledge of where my storage is.
So what you're saying is that only people who can code in C or C++ are programmers. Well I have the misfortune to be a COBOL contractor and, guess what? I get paid $100,000 a year. Not bad for someone who doesn't know the 2 true languages, C and C++. Of course I also know a few other languages, such as Java, Rexx and a bit of Python, but they're not 3l33t and therefore irrelevant. I've got a question for you Mister überprogrammer: what's the point of having high-level languages if you have to do the memory and pointer management yourself? Why not just use assembler? Granted it makes device driver writing easier, but that's a pretty specialised skill compared to the requirements of your average bank or supermarket.
So what you're saying is that coders should write everything from scratch. Have you written your own X server, or graphics toolkit. I doubt it. Java programming is a hell of a lot more than putting together a GUI. Or does the JDK contain classes for every business process for, say, every public utility on the planet, including future ones not yet thought of. OOP requires as much thought and knowledge as procedural unless you think you could learn Java and become productive in a few days.
By the way, Python is OO, so it's a crap example and it also has Jython **gasp** a Java-enabled version.
Howabout 'Gin4Lin?
How long does an American who can't afford health insurance take to get a decent surgeon? This is the difference. It may take six months to get your knee op in Europe, but at least you can get it. As for America being the land of opportunity, the richest man in America was handed a very nice head start in life. Not to say that Gates hasn't worked for every penny, but if his parents had been rednecks from a trailer park, I doubt he would have amounted to much.
Surely it should be Progeny Debian GNU/Linux, or would that have made the box too big ;-) ?
Which leads to a far lower crime rate everywhere in Europe except the UK (which is really just Eastern America anyway), decent public transport, cleaner streets, a truly free press (i.e all points of view not just the corporatist agenda), legal cannabis in Denmark and Holland, and a generally enlightened attitude towards the human body and human sexuality (also not found in the UK).There is a great deal more to the quality of life than money. What good is money if some crackhead can point a gun at you and take it (and possibly your life as well) from you?
Yes it has. That has nothing to do with my argument. Windows still has a long way to go before it's easy to use as well. When I go six months without anyone asking me for help on Windows then I will concede that it's easy to use.
And if your company will hire just anyone to admin their systems then they've got real problems in their IT department.
Exactly. Hand most of the savings to the rich. That's really going to cut poverty.
Ha! Like that would stop them. They're also forbidden to use a monopoly to restrict trade or to gain marketshare in another market, but look how many apologists came out saying that the anti-trust laws are stupid, Microsoft is a powerhouse yada yada.
I don't understand this because I was pretty useless at maths in school and because it was 16 years ago as well. Many braincells have been killed by beer since then.
What? Pay Microsoft yet again for something that doesn't work properly. I've got it on my desktop, a PIII-500 Compaq with stock parts. It took 3 hours to get it on there because it would fail silently after trying to load loads of unnecessary drivers. I started browsing the web, and after 5 minutes it rebooted automatically. Buggy drivers? Possibly, although I doubt I'll ever know. Linux has yet to do this to me, although I'll admit to a crash or 2 due to me not knowing what I was doing with X (and therefore could sort it out - unlike Windows)
I'm talking about corporate users. I, personally, would use the command line a lot, but there would be no requirement to do so. Set up the corporate desktop with the required start menus, host it remotely on an X server and have Win4Lin or VMWare for any apps that only run on Windows. Support nightmare is diminished due to Linux not blowing up incomprehensibly and the only difference the user might notice is that the fonts are uglier.
Susie the secretary will not understand *Nix vs. point and click.
Unless Susie the secretary installs a distro from '96 then she will probably never have to use the command line. Do you need to know how the Windows kernel works to use Word 2000. Also if Susie has problems with her machine she calls tech support who logon remotely and fix it for her.
As for 'which one is better', I suppose having several choices of server company is also a bad thing. How are you supposed to know who's the best.
How about anti-virus software, groupware, fault-logging software? Is the plethora of choices also a bad thing.
I'm so tired of bullshit arguments like this. Linux is no harder to use than Windows. I have to help my family out on a regular basis because Windows plays up on them, and unlike Linux there is no way for me to find out why.
If Windows is easy to use then obviously no tech support is required as well.
Linux nowadays needs as much command line intervention as Windows does, which is to say occasionally, usually when network information is required.
If you can name me a situation when command line is the only option I'll be impressed.
No their parents elected to send them there. The only choice (if any) was which one. What the parents think of the school policies may be completely different to the child's opinion, but it's the parents who have all the rights, not the child.
Creativity is not rewarded by the music industry - being the same as any 10 other artists is. And the 'reward' is 40 cents of a $15 CD.
I use Napster to hear songs from bands that I've heard of and am curious to hear more, or to work out a track on the guitar without having to go to the library and hire the CD. Being without the ability to do this wouldn't make me buy more CDs, it would make me buy less as I don't tend to buy albums when I've not heard at least one track from it. The RIAA is removing something I find useful that has cost them very little money and has given them a lot more targetted free advertising than MTV or the radio stations.
Had they taken the intelligent step as per Bertelsmann and instituted a subscription service I would have signed up in a second.
But no, the real scumbags in this have to stick to their olde-worlde business model for fear of losing even a single cent of the obscene profits they make on the back of those they're pretending to defend. Roll on MP3-only record labels.
FreeDB is what you want.
But I'm running Mandrake 7.2 which is glibc-2.1. Sadly all the cooker RPMs are for glibc-2.2 and the upgrade comes out with about 50 dependencies. I'm a patient man, I can wait for 8.0.