He hasn't been involved with the project in any way at all during the last four years.
Actually, he's submitted 82 bugs in the last year (although if you really want to confirm I'm telling the truth, you'll have to cut and paste the link.)
It doesn't matter how politely I submit my bug report, it still gets ignored with the classic phrase, "we are concentrating our resources in other directions"
I've never seen anyone use such a management-speak phrase in bugzilla.mozilla.org.:-) But it's still a fair response - "thanks for the bug report, but we aren't going to fix it. However, if it's important to you, you have the source."
What good timing; only last week, I bought my first game in ages, and it was programmed by just a couple of guys. Uplink, the "hacking simulator", while bearing only superficial resemblance to the real thing, is a lot of fun.
nor have I been able to get it to yield a list of all open bugs against a specific component.
Did you try selecting the name of the component, and pressing "Search"? Works for me...
If bugzilla is ever to become a realistic issue tracking system, it needs to have most of the features taken out and replaced with simple, generic systems.
Believe me, we'd take out features if we could be sure people wouldn't complain that they actually used them. Bugzilla has the number of features it has because people find them useful. It evolves under user pressure.
Bugzilla is not maintained by "Netscape guys". Well, they just hired the lead developer, but the rest of the developers work for mozilla.org or other companies.
Bugzilla's HTML validates to the maximum extent possible. There are several reasons why it can't validate completely:
Charsets. We can't specify one, because people enter data into Bugzilla in a variety of charsets, and rely on browser auto-detection to Do The Right Thing. The validator doesn't accept this.
Backwards compatibility. We have to work on version 4 browsers
Lack of support in standards. For example, we use <textarea wrap=hard> because there's no way to do that in CSS, and it's what is needed.
Given some of the above comments, this needs saying. This is a fun contest, and the prize is small. Anyone who tries to spam the database in any way will only mean that we can't have this fun any more. So please don't. And it won't work anyway, because we'll notice and stop you.
If you have an automatic bug creation script, please point it at Landfill, the Bugzilla test installation, which needs all the test bugs it can get:-)
Given that we get 300+ bug reports a day, you would have to file a _lot_ of fake bug reports to influence the result. And, after about 5 fake bug reports, I would find you and LART your ass.:-)
None of the bug entry forms rely on JavaScript; I do remember a problem with some of the JS assistance because of Opera's lack of support for JS regexps, but I think I fixed that quite a while back.
There are many distributions and channels for open source projects to reach the end user, so how do users, especially non-technical ones, effectively submit bug reports to the right database? How do open source projects make it easier for users to submit bug reports and consolidate the bugs in a single database?
They all standardise on Bugzilla, and use Bugzilla's import and export (or move) features to move bugs between instances:-)
Other bug trackers (e.g. Scarab) also support import of Bugzilla's XML format for bugs.
IMO, there's not much you can do with an offline bug system client. You can't query the database, update it, run reports, view bugs you haven't pre-cached (which would then be out of date) etc. We get a lot of enhancement requests for Bugzilla, including XML interfaces and command-line clients - but I've never heard a request for an offline client.
...and registration passport technology. It is inefficient to register an account for each single project.
...and people may not want any old random idiot who got an account on FooProject's Bugzilla filing bugs in theirs. And I may not want my Bugzilla password, which I use to administer Bugzilla, being made available to other sites in case I want to authenticate against them:-)
Registering in a Bugzilla takes half a minute. People can cope:-)
Bugzilla looks ugly and is no software for endusers.
The UI is fully customisable using templates. See KDE's Bugzilla for an example of an excellent customisation.
I thought I was the only person who hated Bugzilla's UI. I can use it, but I think it is incredibly messy and hard to use.
The query page was recently reordered to put the more commonly-used things at the top, and make it more understandable. Have you used the new version (it's been the default on bugzilla.mozilla.org for a few months.
When I want to do quick searches, I have to pretend to be entering a new bug, since the normal search form has way too many useless details on it.
QuickSearch is also available on the front page:-)
If you're the sort of person who reads Slashdot, then OEOne Homebase isn't for you anyway. This is your grandmother's Linux UI. And it's very good at removing complexity while retaining power.
Slashdot Mirror
Or, as I actually sum it up in the article itself, do to others what you would have them do to you [Matthew 7:12].
Gerv
He hasn't been involved with the project in any way at all during the last four years.
Actually, he's submitted 82 bugs in the last year (although if you really want to confirm I'm telling the truth, you'll have to cut and paste the link.)
Gerv
(document author)
Mozilla is trying to avoid the slashdot affect with some clever DNS switching. Here's a loophole, now slashdot that f*cker!
Actually, no. mozilla.org.uk is one of my personal websites (as you will see if you go to the front page) and is not a mirror of mozilla.org.
Gerv
(document author)
Funny - I sent someone a link to that just yesterday. The two documents serve different purposes, IMO.
Gerv
(document author)
Have you seen the Bug Writing Guidelines? They may be a more appropriate document to point your users to.
Gerv
(document author)
a) What is the same as "the developers must do my bidding"?
"Hi, I'm Greg, your new manager."
What is the phrase or action that will get the developers to actually do my bidding?
"Please", backed up by a good reason, often works wonders. Seriously.
Gerv
"Apple didnt pick us for their browser! waah"
Er... the only people I heard whining when Safari came out were the Opera team.
Gerv
(document author)
You don't like the tone of the bug notice so you're just going to ignore it.
That's not what it says. It says "If you submit an offensive bug report, or post an offensive comment, you risk being ignored." Which is fair enough.
Gerv
(document author)
It doesn't matter how politely I submit my bug report, it still gets ignored with the classic phrase, "we are concentrating our resources in other directions"
:-) But it's still a fair response - "thanks for the bug report, but we aren't going to fix it. However, if it's important to you, you have the source."
I've never seen anyone use such a management-speak phrase in bugzilla.mozilla.org.
Gerv
(document author)
What if some newbie found an integral bug, gets a "RTFM" and is too intimidated to report the bug?
:-)
Well, they wouldn't get pointed at this document until after they'd filed at least one bug
But anyway, this is part of the reason why the document requests that people politely point out transgressions by private email.
Gerv
(document author)
Uhhmmm.... yes it is.
He means the Mac OS X AOL Client, which definitely uses Gecko. You are talking about Safari, an Apple product which has nothing to do with AOL.
Gerv
What good timing; only last week, I bought my first game in ages, and it was programmed by just a couple of guys. Uplink, the "hacking simulator", while bearing only superficial resemblance to the real thing, is a lot of fun.
Gerv
OK then, and there's no way to do it in standard HTML either. :-)
Gerv
nor have I been able to get it to yield a list of all open bugs against a specific component.
Did you try selecting the name of the component, and pressing "Search"? Works for me...
If bugzilla is ever to become a realistic issue tracking system, it needs to have most of the features taken out and replaced with simple, generic systems.
Believe me, we'd take out features if we could be sure people wouldn't complain that they actually used them. Bugzilla has the number of features it has because people find them useful. It evolves under user pressure.
Gerv
Bugzilla is not maintained by "Netscape guys". Well, they just hired the lead developer, but the rest of the developers work for mozilla.org or other companies.
Gerv
- Charsets. We can't specify one, because people enter data into Bugzilla in a variety of charsets, and rely on browser auto-detection to Do The Right Thing. The validator doesn't accept this.
- Backwards compatibility. We have to work on version 4 browsers
- Lack of support in standards. For example, we use <textarea wrap=hard> because there's no way to do that in CSS, and it's what is needed.
GervGiven some of the above comments, this needs saying. This is a fun contest, and the prize is small. Anyone who tries to spam the database in any way will only mean that we can't have this fun any more. So please don't. And it won't work anyway, because we'll notice and stop you.
:-)
If you have an automatic bug creation script, please point it at Landfill, the Bugzilla test installation, which needs all the test bugs it can get
Gerv
Given that we get 300+ bug reports a day, you would have to file a _lot_ of fake bug reports to influence the result. And, after about 5 fake bug reports, I would find you and LART your ass. :-)
Gerv
...and at about 12.30pm GMT, my inbox was suddenly deluged with entries. Even without looking, I knew why that would be... :-)
Gerv
None of the bug entry forms rely on JavaScript; I do remember a problem with some of the JS assistance because of Opera's lack of support for JS regexps, but I think I fixed that quite a while back.
Gerv
There are many distributions and channels for open source projects to reach the end user, so how do users, especially non-technical ones, effectively submit bug reports to the right database? How do open source projects make it easier for users to submit bug reports and consolidate the bugs in a single database?
:-)
They all standardise on Bugzilla, and use Bugzilla's import and export (or move) features to move bugs between instances
Other bug trackers (e.g. Scarab) also support import of Bugzilla's XML format for bugs.
Gerv
IMO, there's not much you can do with an offline bug system client. You can't query the database, update it, run reports, view bugs you haven't pre-cached (which would then be out of date) etc. We get a lot of enhancement requests for Bugzilla, including XML interfaces and command-line clients - but I've never heard a request for an offline client.
Registering in a Bugzilla takes half a minute. People can cope
Bugzilla looks ugly and is no software for endusers.
The UI is fully customisable using templates. See KDE's Bugzilla for an example of an excellent customisation.
Gerv
I thought I was the only person who hated Bugzilla's UI. I can use it, but I think it is incredibly messy and hard to use.
:-)
The query page was recently reordered to put the more commonly-used things at the top, and make it more understandable. Have you used the new version (it's been the default on bugzilla.mozilla.org for a few months.
When I want to do quick searches, I have to pretend to be entering a new bug, since the normal search form has way too many useless details on it.
QuickSearch is also available on the front page
Gerv
If he was the first to receive a U.S. pilot license... who was his examiner?
Gerv
I think I'll stick with KDE for now.
If you're the sort of person who reads Slashdot, then OEOne Homebase isn't for you anyway. This is your grandmother's Linux UI. And it's very good at removing complexity while retaining power.
Gerv