NO THEY ARE NOT APPLE DIDNT FUCKING GO OUT AND GRAB THE GPL'D CODE, WRAP IT IN AN IPHONE SDK CREATED GOODNESS AND THEN RELEASE IT TO THE WORLD ON THE STORE
The idiot developer who submitted it, after reading not 1, not 2, not even 3, but 4 diffrerent licenses (gpl, itunes, sdk, and itunes connect (the apple store for developers license)) and then chose to try to do it anyhow is the only one at fault here
The chain goes like this.. you have to download the Iphone SDK (many strings attached) you have to signup to be an app store vendor (more strings attached) both of these agreements explicity state that you cannot release apps that conflict with the terms of these agreements.. which preclude use of GPL code since it is VERY incompatible with all of apple's licenses related to idevices
of course slashdot fanatical open source guys who have no clue what the hell they are talking about are par for the course on slashdot huh?
Your misssing the fact that "apple" is not the author of the code, and is in NO WAY responsible even if they where to allow GPL licensed apps in the store, the responsibility for source would rest entirely with the author/owner of the code (the app developers not apple.
Your deluded there buddy.. you should go read the gpl, you cannot "bundle" or "merge" gpl'd code into code that you do not own and taint that code.. the liability such as it is in this case, is entirely with the developer who tried to pull a fast one.
The distributor in this case is the developer, not the retailer.. Bestbuy and walmart are not responsible for Linksys, sony, and every other electronic gizmo vendor who ships infringing devices.. nor is apple
If anything Apple is the only party harmed by this developers actions (he attempted to taint the iphone libraries by bundling them with gpl'd code)
The "entity responsible for conveying the binary" in this case as in all cases is always the first party, not the site that hosts the code/binary, but then again, free beer brand open source zealots never seem to understand the licenses
Sounds like whoever decided to post this story was irritated with his cable company? The simple facts are that there are NOT customers leaving cable for the phone OR sattelite companies.. satellite has the most absurd "quality" levels and interference that makes good old over the air antenna viewing look great by comparison, the phone companies have nothing more than trial balloons of service up (fios and uverse get alot of press but the footprint they are available in is.. trivial)
people deal with phone companies because they have to for whatever reason not because they want to, and dish and directtv have absolutely horrible service, and even worse they treat their customers like criminals... the idea that anyone would switch to directtv willingly is comical.
Of course this is slashdot and i suppose it was a slow news day.. still why is this even being commented on? *sigh*
Re:What about for those who haven't seen it?
on
Lost Ends
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· Score: 1
If you are interested in being entertained in the moment, and following characters for a while, and are willing to accept that the end is requring some individual thought to put it all into place *for you* then by all means watch it from start to finish..
If you are more like the rest of the kids who want everything explained to you, think of the science as key and that there is nothing metaphysical about anything.. then dont bother watching as the end leaves just as much unsaid (if not more) as it resolved.
Re:So, my only question regarding Lost is
on
Lost Ends
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· Score: 1
Which was in fact the best line uttered by any character in the series over the last 6 years.. and was a PERFECT setup to what people would think after watching "The End"..
this is covered in the gpl as well as most of the other licenses
Lets describe a potential product that is most likely not real or exactly like a real product
This product is essentially an x86 PC with a custom case, some custom hardware, and output through a web interface
the product uses a variety of gpl'd projects within it.. and distributes all the code needed to build the code (which will pretty much run on any x86 pc)
the catch is that the product itself contains several embedded processors to make sure that what is running on this box is legit.. the first one is a code signing module that compares all incoming firmwares to a key that is burned into a rom when the product is shipped.. IE no proper key no install of rom, another customization is the bootloader itself which is entirely in house custom job and makes THIS PC not boot if the device is not booting off a special flash rom chip also hardware signed by a specific key. (IE even if you disable the security, remove the flash drive from the device and copy it over from your pc to the device it still will not "work"
all of this is pefectly legal under the GPL because the GPL is about sharing code, not about "hacking your device" while some people wish it was otherwise, it simply is not, there are times when the 2 cross paths and all is happy, but then again there are times when I agree with people who I would normally ignore as well.. that doesn't make us twins.
btw the bad publicity? comes when open source fanatics such as in this thread, give companies who are doing nothing illegal or wrong a hard time in the press and get a story posted on slashdot.. when in actual point of fact they are doing exactly what needs to be done based one the GPL.. which is probably why the OP doesn't want to "name names" until someone can convince him that they are actually breaking the rules of the GPL.
I think you need to look a bit deeper before relegating things like rpm vs deb, gnome vs kde to the wayside as "platform quirks"
The fact of the matter is this dispute is all about money and success..
Noone would be caring (as noone cared for years about any number of HUGELY successful mobile platforms not supporting flash in any way shape or form.. Then something wierd happened.. and the apps for a smaller platform started selling.. and suddenly everyone is up in arms that X platform with less than 20% marketshare.. is selling 96% of the addons for all smartphones newsflash: If you open source consumers of free software didn't think ahead to realize that the largest segment of the android market would be similarly minded individuals.. methinks you where deluding yourselves. This is not about Apple being evil, more about people choosing the wrong platform (flash in this case, java before that) and wanting everyone to make them feel better about that choice by forcing their poor planning on everyone.
Why is that notable? leaving out the first gen mini? Since the tools to actually create flash content require signficantly newer machines than a powermac from 2005.. that seems to me to be a silly ass comment.. just because there are alot of older macs still in service.. doesn't mean that "new stuff" will always run on it? I am sure that at some point in time every development enviroment will move on from "requires at least a 386 with floating point unit"
Also your pullout pretty much proves my point? 700$ is more expensive than 499+ 99..
The flex sdk is not capable of generating.ipa apps ready for submission to the app store.. its more on par with the xcode/iphone sdk package which like the flex sdk.. is also free to download.. but useless without the rest of the package (a recent vintage mac or repurposed pc running OSX)
I would also argue that http://www.adobe.com/products/flash/systemreqs/ pretty much is no different than requiring at least a 2006 or newer intel mac..
In short all of this is pointless to the discussion
Because the plugin is installed automatically by default on many platforms in the real world.. because many browsers will automagically try to install it if they see content flagged as flash.. etc.
ihackintosh.org + jailbreak means your out only the cost of the iDevice you want to run your apps on..of course we are talking about Flash CS5 content being converted to an iphone app.. which means you have to factor in the cost of CS5 http://phreakaholic.com/news/adobe-cs-5-prices/ which seem to trump what apple would require by a fairly wide margin (499$ refurb mac mini + 99$ for a year of app signing is way cheaper than any version of CS5 ?) Of course if you want to go ihackintosh + jailbreak you will prolly be downloading cs5 illegally as well? *shrug*
Also by sufficiently recent you mean "any intel mac since 2006"
But they are a monopoly in providing legit apps to their own platforms and therefore must be stopped!/rollseyes
BTW they are not a monopoly in music players either (merely the largest vendor there is a huge difference)
Dont try to cloud this with facts!.. we are having a holy war here!
Re:Apple changed the rules after the game started
on
Flash Is Not a Right
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· Score: 1
It was clear from the getgo that apple didn't want flash.. this is not new.. and if you think it is new.. if you are pissed at anyone.. you can take it out on adobe and the other "middleware" makers for selling you a line of shit about how they will fix it cause clearly apple would never go against adobe in their hackery right?
Do you also develop for linux? with your freedom stance.. I would think you do.. if so how do you explain the packaging requirements for the various distros? do you write only simple command line tools that say "I AM GREAT YOU ARE SUCK DONT BUY CLOSED PRODUCTS" and package them only as source?
Because if you do anything.. on any other platform.. like it or not you are buying in to the quirks and rules of a given system.. Clearly linux should support DirectX right? because its the most popular way to access 3d hardware and would single handedly fix the lack of linux games? Also shouldnt MS natively run Mac Apps in windows? since they are clearly being anticompetitive by not supporting and running mac apps? Why do you need to choose kde or gnome as a target.. what about RPM vs.deb vs source distribution once you have chosen..
Bah why am i bothering trying to explain that what happens in the real walled garden of college/highschool idealism ends the day you leave
Go tell Microsoft, sony and nintendo that you intend to put out a cross platform Flash game as an A title on their respective platforms.. and that its your RIGHT to do so , and as such they should implement flash immediately in the SDK..
I will sit and wait..
While you are at it.. you could also try telling every other embedded device maker that you will not use assembler, every "programmable" device (as in research/medical/etc type fields devices) that you will now require flash support or they are exerting monopoly power and restricting you from using hardware you own as you wish.
Get over it, Get over yourself.. you chose to learn flash and now are pissed that you cannot directly translate that to the only mobile app market that is actually making money.. and its pissing you off..
Experienced Power Users do not reinstall windows all the time because of unfixable errors, they do it because they are incompetent boobs who think all things require a reinstall to fix OR because they are tired of "fixing" an idiots computer for the 37th time due to "i turned off the antivirus because the thing i downloaded from limewire told me to"
The whole "the only way to fix it is to reinstall" is extremely rare since XP, and anyone saying otherwise clearly is not quite the experienced power user they think they are.. more likely they have just enough knowledge to do things they really don't understand, and hosed their computer with their stupidity. That behavior is not OS dependant and is just as likely to happen under any and all OS, even Linux.
The default? yes to overwrite the oldest with the most recent is the default.. this is not a problem it is by design.. and if users who where clueless would quit trying to make room for porn by underallocating for stuff like this (these are the same people who delete hibernation file, turn off virtual memory space, etc) rather than NOT having half their filesystems full of duplicate or triplicates of things (zip in temp folder, zip in downloads, zip moved to desktop, then the extracted zip in a subfolder, and then the actual "home" for that file.. and usually a few other stupid copies of the exact same file elsewhere..
As to the size.. restore points are a mirror of the changes made during whatever action happens to be going on. a restore made between large software installs can be enourmous (ditto service packs, etc)
its not affecting users who are not "too smart for their own good" and turned down the system restore size to the bare minimum that windows will require to do a windows update (without disabling it)
IE user error blamed on software that is performing the way it should be.. same old same old.
Nearly the same computing capacity yes.. but with terrifically small screen resolutions and battery life to deal with.
Even if i could get a quad core 3+ghz cpu, 16 gigs of RAM, 2 terryabtes of storage, and 50megabits per second of network speed, as well as whatever the best performing GPU on the planet is at the time of release..
We are still limited by the physical reality that you cannot jam any more juice into a battery that has to fit in a mobile device.. nor can you somehow "shrink" a UI from a 20-27" desktop screen, onto a mobile device.. they are just impossibilities
Since the mobile needs to have a very different UI, it makes sense that the "UI" layer of the APIs will vary..
And no amount of crying will change that fact, and no amount of worshipping to the Flash Gods at Adobe is gonna get you your wish either.. You want to do multiplatform correctly you have to embrace each platform with all its quirks and idiosyncrasy's intact,,
This kind of thinking is what leads to decisions like "no multitasking for third party apps"..
There is plenty of horsepower so i can be lazy and write crappy outdated code and then blame the platform for not being "backward compatible/cross platform compatible"
There is really nothing to see in this article/rant other than an angry person looking to find flaws in something because suddenly that is "the cool thing to do"
I would like to remind him however that Apple has gone out of its way to make crossPlatform be a "bad idea" on iphone, they make no apologies for it, and actually have a really good reason for doing so.. Big deal
As the orginal article stated, this was an ATLANTA federal appeals court that made the ruling.
Which was basically just setting up for the supreme court being forced to rule on this issue. Go Go Florida failing at comprehension, and wasting taxpayer dollars on idiotic prosecutions.. Some things will never change though
IMO the judge was looking to be overturned on appeal so he didnt have to create precedent with his decision. The screwy part is that there is no way this case should have ever made it into a florida courtroom to begin with *shrug*
The claim is not that Google's version of the JavaVM is 3x faster than any other.. But rather that this implmentation of the Google version of the JavaVM is 3x faster than default which is still not saying all that much given the performance issues across the board on androids VM.
Slashdot Mirror
NO THEY ARE NOT
APPLE DIDNT FUCKING GO OUT AND GRAB THE GPL'D CODE, WRAP IT IN AN IPHONE SDK CREATED GOODNESS AND THEN RELEASE IT TO THE WORLD ON THE STORE
The idiot developer who submitted it, after reading not 1, not 2, not even 3, but 4 diffrerent licenses (gpl, itunes, sdk, and itunes connect (the apple store for developers license)) and then chose to try to do it anyhow is the only one at fault here
The chain goes like this.. you have to download the Iphone SDK (many strings attached) you have to signup to be an app store vendor (more strings attached) both of these agreements explicity state that you cannot release apps that conflict with the terms of these agreements.. which preclude use of GPL code since it is VERY incompatible with all of apple's licenses related to idevices
of course slashdot fanatical open source guys who have no clue what the hell they are talking about are par for the course on slashdot huh?
Your misssing the fact that "apple" is not the author of the code, and is in NO WAY responsible even if they where to allow GPL licensed apps in the store, the responsibility for source would rest entirely with the author/owner of the code (the app developers not apple.
Your deluded there buddy.. you should go read the gpl, you cannot "bundle" or "merge" gpl'd code into code that you do not own and taint that code .. the liability such as it is in this case, is entirely with the developer who tried to pull a fast one.
The distributor in this case is the developer, not the retailer.. Bestbuy and walmart are not responsible for Linksys, sony, and every other electronic gizmo vendor who ships infringing devices.. nor is apple
If anything Apple is the only party harmed by this developers actions (he attempted to taint the iphone libraries by bundling them with gpl'd code)
The "entity responsible for conveying the binary" in this case as in all cases is always the first party, not the site that hosts the code/binary, but then again, free beer brand open source zealots never seem to understand the licenses
Sounds like whoever decided to post this story was irritated with his cable company? The simple facts are that there are NOT customers leaving cable for the phone OR sattelite companies.. satellite has the most absurd "quality" levels and interference that makes good old over the air antenna viewing look great by comparison, the phone companies have nothing more than trial balloons of service up (fios and uverse get alot of press but the footprint they are available in is .. trivial)
people deal with phone companies because they have to for whatever reason not because they want to, and dish and directtv have absolutely horrible service, and even worse they treat their customers like criminals... the idea that anyone would switch to directtv willingly is comical.
Of course this is slashdot and i suppose it was a slow news day.. still why is this even being commented on? *sigh*
If you are interested in being entertained in the moment, and following characters for a while, and are willing to accept that the end is requring some individual thought to put it all into place *for you* then by all means watch it from start to finish.. If you are more like the rest of the kids who want everything explained to you, think of the science as key and that there is nothing metaphysical about anything.. then dont bother watching as the end leaves just as much unsaid (if not more) as it resolved.
Which was in fact the best line uttered by any character in the series over the last 6 years.. and was a PERFECT setup to what people would think after watching "The End"..
Your still not getting the problem..
this is covered in the gpl as well as most of the other licenses
Lets describe a potential product that is most likely not real or exactly like a real product
This product is essentially an x86 PC with a custom case, some custom hardware, and output through a web interface
the product uses a variety of gpl'd projects within it.. and distributes all the code needed to build the code (which will pretty much run on any x86 pc)
the catch is that the product itself contains several embedded processors to make sure that what is running on this box is legit.. the first one is a code signing module that compares all incoming firmwares to a key that is burned into a rom when the product is shipped.. IE no proper key no install of rom, another customization is the bootloader itself which is entirely in house custom job and makes THIS PC not boot if the device is not booting off a special flash rom chip also hardware signed by a specific key. (IE even if you disable the security, remove the flash drive from the device and copy it over from your pc to the device it still will not "work"
all of this is pefectly legal under the GPL because the GPL is about sharing code, not about "hacking your device" while some people wish it was otherwise, it simply is not, there are times when the 2 cross paths and all is happy, but then again there are times when I agree with people who I would normally ignore as well.. that doesn't make us twins.
btw the bad publicity? comes when open source fanatics such as in this thread, give companies who are doing nothing illegal or wrong a hard time in the press and get a story posted on slashdot.. when in actual point of fact they are doing exactly what needs to be done based one the GPL.. which is probably why the OP doesn't want to "name names" until someone can convince him that they are actually breaking the rules of the GPL.
I think you need to look a bit deeper before relegating things like rpm vs deb, gnome vs kde to the wayside as "platform quirks"
The fact of the matter is this dispute is all about money and success..
Noone would be caring (as noone cared for years about any number of HUGELY successful mobile platforms not supporting flash in any way shape or form..
Then something wierd happened.. and the apps for a smaller platform started selling.. and suddenly everyone is up in arms that X platform with less than 20% marketshare.. is selling 96% of the addons for all smartphones
newsflash: If you open source consumers of free software didn't think ahead to realize that the largest segment of the android market would be similarly minded individuals.. methinks you where deluding yourselves.
This is not about Apple being evil, more about people choosing the wrong platform (flash in this case, java before that) and wanting everyone to make them feel better about that choice by forcing their poor planning on everyone.
Why is that notable? leaving out the first gen mini? Since the tools to actually create flash content require signficantly newer machines than a powermac from 2005.. that seems to me to be a silly ass comment.. just because there are alot of older macs still in service.. doesn't mean that "new stuff" will always run on it? I am sure that at some point in time every development enviroment will move on from "requires at least a 386 with floating point unit" Also your pullout pretty much proves my point? 700$ is more expensive than 499+ 99.. The flex sdk is not capable of generating .ipa apps ready for submission to the app store.. its more on par with the xcode/iphone sdk package which like the flex sdk.. is also free to download.. but useless without the rest of the package (a recent vintage mac or repurposed pc running OSX)
I would also argue that http://www.adobe.com/products/flash/systemreqs/ pretty much is no different than requiring at least a 2006 or newer intel mac..
In short all of this is pointless to the discussion
Because the plugin is installed automatically by default on many platforms in the real world.. because many browsers will automagically try to install it if they see content flagged as flash.. etc.
ihackintosh.org + jailbreak means your out only the cost of the iDevice you want to run your apps on..of course we are talking about Flash CS5 content being converted to an iphone app.. which means you have to factor in the cost of CS5 http://phreakaholic.com/news/adobe-cs-5-prices/ which seem to trump what apple would require by a fairly wide margin (499$ refurb mac mini + 99$ for a year of app signing is way cheaper than any version of CS5 ?) Of course if you want to go ihackintosh + jailbreak you will prolly be downloading cs5 illegally as well? *shrug* Also by sufficiently recent you mean "any intel mac since 2006"
or jailbreak it.. if all you want is to run your own apps jailbreaking is sufficient and free
But they are a monopoly in providing legit apps to their own platforms and therefore must be stopped! /rollseyes
BTW they are not a monopoly in music players either (merely the largest vendor there is a huge difference)
Dont try to cloud this with facts!.. we are having a holy war here!
It was clear from the getgo that apple didn't want flash.. this is not new.. and if you think it is new.. if you are pissed at anyone.. you can take it out on adobe and the other "middleware" makers for selling you a line of shit about how they will fix it cause clearly apple would never go against adobe in their hackery right?
Do you also develop for linux? with your freedom stance.. I would think you do.. if so how do you explain the packaging requirements for the various distros? do you write only simple command line tools that say "I AM GREAT YOU ARE SUCK DONT BUY CLOSED PRODUCTS" and package them only as source? Because if you do anything.. on any other platform.. like it or not you are buying in to the quirks and rules of a given system.. Clearly linux should support DirectX right? because its the most popular way to access 3d hardware and would single handedly fix the lack of linux games? Also shouldnt MS natively run Mac Apps in windows? since they are clearly being anticompetitive by not supporting and running mac apps? Why do you need to choose kde or gnome as a target .. what about RPM vs .deb vs source distribution once you have chosen..
Bah why am i bothering trying to explain that what happens in the real walled garden of college/highschool idealism ends the day you leave
Go tell Microsoft, sony and nintendo that you intend to put out a cross platform Flash game as an A title on their respective platforms.. and that its your RIGHT to do so , and as such they should implement flash immediately in the SDK.. I will sit and wait.. While you are at it.. you could also try telling every other embedded device maker that you will not use assembler, every "programmable" device (as in research/medical/etc type fields devices) that you will now require flash support or they are exerting monopoly power and restricting you from using hardware you own as you wish. Get over it, Get over yourself.. you chose to learn flash and now are pissed that you cannot directly translate that to the only mobile app market that is actually making money.. and its pissing you off..
Experienced Power Users do not reinstall windows all the time because of unfixable errors, they do it because they are incompetent boobs who think all things require a reinstall to fix OR because they are tired of "fixing" an idiots computer for the 37th time due to "i turned off the antivirus because the thing i downloaded from limewire told me to" The whole "the only way to fix it is to reinstall" is extremely rare since XP, and anyone saying otherwise clearly is not quite the experienced power user they think they are.. more likely they have just enough knowledge to do things they really don't understand, and hosed their computer with their stupidity. That behavior is not OS dependant and is just as likely to happen under any and all OS, even Linux.
The default? yes to overwrite the oldest with the most recent is the default.. this is not a problem it is by design.. and if users who where clueless would quit trying to make room for porn by underallocating for stuff like this (these are the same people who delete hibernation file, turn off virtual memory space, etc) rather than NOT having half their filesystems full of duplicate or triplicates of things (zip in temp folder, zip in downloads, zip moved to desktop, then the extracted zip in a subfolder, and then the actual "home" for that file.. and usually a few other stupid copies of the exact same file elsewhere.. As to the size.. restore points are a mirror of the changes made during whatever action happens to be going on. a restore made between large software installs can be enourmous (ditto service packs, etc)
its not affecting users who are not "too smart for their own good" and turned down the system restore size to the bare minimum that windows will require to do a windows update (without disabling it) IE user error blamed on software that is performing the way it should be.. same old same old.
Nearly the same computing capacity yes.. but with terrifically small screen resolutions and battery life to deal with. Even if i could get a quad core 3+ghz cpu, 16 gigs of RAM, 2 terryabtes of storage, and 50megabits per second of network speed, as well as whatever the best performing GPU on the planet is at the time of release.. We are still limited by the physical reality that you cannot jam any more juice into a battery that has to fit in a mobile device.. nor can you somehow "shrink" a UI from a 20-27" desktop screen, onto a mobile device.. they are just impossibilities Since the mobile needs to have a very different UI, it makes sense that the "UI" layer of the APIs will vary ..
And no amount of crying will change that fact, and no amount of worshipping to the Flash Gods at Adobe is gonna get you your wish either.. You want to do multiplatform correctly you have to embrace each platform with all its quirks and idiosyncrasy's intact,,
This kind of thinking is what leads to decisions like "no multitasking for third party apps" ..
There is plenty of horsepower so i can be lazy and write crappy outdated code and then blame the platform for not being "backward compatible/cross platform compatible"
There is really nothing to see in this article/rant other than an angry person looking to find flaws in something because suddenly that is "the cool thing to do"
I would like to remind him however that Apple has gone out of its way to make crossPlatform be a "bad idea" on iphone, they make no apologies for it, and actually have a really good reason for doing so .. Big deal
As the orginal article stated, this was an ATLANTA federal appeals court that made the ruling. Which was basically just setting up for the supreme court being forced to rule on this issue. Go Go Florida failing at comprehension, and wasting taxpayer dollars on idiotic prosecutions.. Some things will never change though
IMO the judge was looking to be overturned on appeal so he didnt have to create precedent with his decision. The screwy part is that there is no way this case should have ever made it into a florida courtroom to begin with *shrug*
The claim is not that Google's version of the JavaVM is 3x faster than any other.. But rather that this implmentation of the Google version of the JavaVM is 3x faster than default which is still not saying all that much given the performance issues across the board on androids VM.