So your immune system is useless because it doesn't detect all diseases? And it causes all these problems from allergies to other autoimmune diseases right up to transplant rejections. Get rid of it and tell us how much better off you're now.
Let's be honest here, people: What is that story doing here? This isn't even a story. This is something you'd probably get asked by a buddy when you're sitting there on his porch, beer in the hand, it's too hot to think of a relevant subject and he's bothered by the awkward silence and the buzzing of flies around you that he tries to stir up some kind of conversation, hell, ANY topic will do, as long as you can at least talk about something.
This is usually when you'd grunt something agreeing, take another sip from your beer and say something non-committing like "Yeah. Kinda remember. Sucked." or something like this, before the two of you return to quietly sipping your beer and one of you saying "Hell, let's go inside where the AC is, the heat's killing me".
The problem here is the conflict of interest between you, the product's user, and its maker. Because the maker does have an interest for the product to open a port so he can communicate with it and violate your privacy, which you, very obviously, don't have.
Aside of that I'm fully with you. At the very least I would like to see makers of such devices being liable for gross negligence, most of these things don't suffer from obscure and unknown problems that require arcane knowledge of protocols unknown to mere mortals, we're talking about devices being delivered with ancient (read: multiple year old), insecure versions of standard software like SSL, announcing their insecure version to everyone who wants to know, IoT devices that have hardcoded and unchangeable passwords (or no passwords altogether), devices that connect with whatever access point they find first that isn't secured, and so on.
At the very least make the makers of such things liable for the damage caused by these mistakes that cannot even be classified as gross negligence. I think we need a new term for this level of ignorance.
You cannot sell a fridge that honors your customer's privacy at the same price as one that doesn't, because you being able to sell your customer's privacy is part of the revenue. If you can't sell that, someone else has to foot the bill, i.e. the customer.
And when you look at things like Facebook, tell me that there is ANY price you could sensibly demand that will be paid and that isn't to your disadvantage as a maker when you forgo the data revenue.
Erh... WW2 was started because the Allied noticed that giving Hitler a finger meant that he wanted the whole arm and they finally put the foot down when he came for Poland after taking Alsace, Austria, the Sudetenland, the rest of the Czech Republic, Slovakia... they finally caught on that he just wanted more and more and if he got what he demanded, he just turned around and demanded more.
If it sounds familiar... well, it seems history repeats itself.
Given Austria and its rather funny way to deal with unions (they have kinda-like a government run union that everyone who has a job has to be a member of... don't ask) that's probably what's really going on behind the scenes.
Knowing Austria and how they handle things like that, I bet they are now tourist guides showing Americans how lovely and picturesque steel cooking was back in the old days, or they're sitting in a bank somewhere and counting money.
Basically, tourism and banking is nearly all that's happening in that country...
Soon you cannot leave profit on the floor. Because your competitor will pretty much give his fridges away, he will sell them at half your price.
Why is he doing it? Because everyone is doing it. And why can they do it? Because the other half is being paid for by whoever buys the data the fridge will collect about its buyer. You think there's a market for fridges that cost more for fewer "features"?
What happens if next week an IOT device is at the heart of another terrorist attack?
It will be the news for a week then nobody gives a shit about it anymore. Why do you think this is different from the other attacks?
what if the ISP's get their way and are able to jack up the rates on bandwidth?
Why should the makers of IoT devices care? Yes, people will lament over them using their bandwidth. AFTER they bought them.
What if people start realizing that there is no incentive for manufacturers of IOT devices to give a shake about security and thus just stop buying them?
Is that a trick question? You're reading on/., so you know consumer habits when it comes to computers and internet. When, in the whole history of both of them, have security problems in any technology, in any place, in any way, EVER made people think "Hmm... maybe I shouldn't use that crap"?
And if the device does not work without wifi, I'll return it.
And then what? Your argument is much like "If the Bluray player doesn't let me record the signal, I return it". Yes. You can. But you can't get one that lets you.
It's by far not unlikely that you simply will not get any devices that give a shit what YOU want.
Then they will make it very, very, VERY inconvenient not to connect them to the internet, at the very least.
The market for such devices is rather small, so given the "danger" of people buying them who could else be forced into giving up their data buying them and thus not providing data that can be sold for lots of money, it's unlikely that any maker of appliances would endanger his data harvesting for such comparably insignificant gains.
Yes. The question is, though, whether the market is big enough and whether licensing will allow it to exist.
Imagine some company with an interest in heavy copyright enforcement establishes the next standard format. They could well demand that anyone who wants to use that format has to be connected with the internet so they can determine whether the content you try to view has been blessed by the DRM gods. No internet, no 16k smellovision for you. And no, making a TV that offers you to play it without the DRM connection is not allowed.
Not that complicated to accomplish, the problem is rather that it will not only invalidate the warranty but the device will very likely refuse to work if it notices that it can't inform the world about your toast eating habits.
I mean, what good is it to me if you can make toast and I don't hear about it? Just because you paid for it doesn't mean that it should do what you want!
So sorry, the boot sequence could not be completed as ordered, for some odd reason the WiFi module doesn't come online and without, I don't start. But since you didn't modify or tamper with the device, you can of course return it for a replacement!
Slashdot Mirror
Still, most reasons to travel (at least for business trips) are within 1000 miles.
What do you mean by "delete"? I've seen a lot of things happen during system upgrades, but deletion of select programs has never been one of them.
"only run whitelisted programs from whitelisted directories" (combined with "no office macros") solves nearly 100%.
So your immune system is useless because it doesn't detect all diseases? And it causes all these problems from allergies to other autoimmune diseases right up to transplant rejections. Get rid of it and tell us how much better off you're now.
Let's be honest here, people: What is that story doing here? This isn't even a story. This is something you'd probably get asked by a buddy when you're sitting there on his porch, beer in the hand, it's too hot to think of a relevant subject and he's bothered by the awkward silence and the buzzing of flies around you that he tries to stir up some kind of conversation, hell, ANY topic will do, as long as you can at least talk about something.
This is usually when you'd grunt something agreeing, take another sip from your beer and say something non-committing like "Yeah. Kinda remember. Sucked." or something like this, before the two of you return to quietly sipping your beer and one of you saying "Hell, let's go inside where the AC is, the heat's killing me".
Hey look, someone is trying to do a DDoS test on his website for cheap!
You have weird acquaintances.
Amateur. Pros move into retirement homes with built-in Haagen Dazs.
Wow. No wonder your air transportation system can get away with treating their customers like terrorists by default, you don't have alternatives.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...
("Gift" is the German word for "poison")
The problem here is the conflict of interest between you, the product's user, and its maker. Because the maker does have an interest for the product to open a port so he can communicate with it and violate your privacy, which you, very obviously, don't have.
Aside of that I'm fully with you. At the very least I would like to see makers of such devices being liable for gross negligence, most of these things don't suffer from obscure and unknown problems that require arcane knowledge of protocols unknown to mere mortals, we're talking about devices being delivered with ancient (read: multiple year old), insecure versions of standard software like SSL, announcing their insecure version to everyone who wants to know, IoT devices that have hardcoded and unchangeable passwords (or no passwords altogether), devices that connect with whatever access point they find first that isn't secured, and so on.
At the very least make the makers of such things liable for the damage caused by these mistakes that cannot even be classified as gross negligence. I think we need a new term for this level of ignorance.
You cannot sell a fridge that honors your customer's privacy at the same price as one that doesn't, because you being able to sell your customer's privacy is part of the revenue. If you can't sell that, someone else has to foot the bill, i.e. the customer.
And when you look at things like Facebook, tell me that there is ANY price you could sensibly demand that will be paid and that isn't to your disadvantage as a maker when you forgo the data revenue.
Erh... WW2 was started because the Allied noticed that giving Hitler a finger meant that he wanted the whole arm and they finally put the foot down when he came for Poland after taking Alsace, Austria, the Sudetenland, the rest of the Czech Republic, Slovakia... they finally caught on that he just wanted more and more and if he got what he demanded, he just turned around and demanded more.
If it sounds familiar... well, it seems history repeats itself.
Given Austria and its rather funny way to deal with unions (they have kinda-like a government run union that everyone who has a job has to be a member of... don't ask) that's probably what's really going on behind the scenes.
Knowing Austria and how they handle things like that, I bet they are now tourist guides showing Americans how lovely and picturesque steel cooking was back in the old days, or they're sitting in a bank somewhere and counting money.
Basically, tourism and banking is nearly all that's happening in that country...
Soon you cannot leave profit on the floor. Because your competitor will pretty much give his fridges away, he will sell them at half your price.
Why is he doing it? Because everyone is doing it. And why can they do it? Because the other half is being paid for by whoever buys the data the fridge will collect about its buyer. You think there's a market for fridges that cost more for fewer "features"?
What happens if next week an IOT device is at the heart of another terrorist attack?
It will be the news for a week then nobody gives a shit about it anymore. Why do you think this is different from the other attacks?
what if the ISP's get their way and are able to jack up the rates on bandwidth?
Why should the makers of IoT devices care? Yes, people will lament over them using their bandwidth. AFTER they bought them.
What if people start realizing that there is no incentive for manufacturers of IOT devices to give a shake about security and thus just stop buying them?
Is that a trick question? You're reading on /., so you know consumer habits when it comes to computers and internet. When, in the whole history of both of them, have security problems in any technology, in any place, in any way, EVER made people think "Hmm... maybe I shouldn't use that crap"?
But of course there is a reason for your air compressor to be on the internet. To tell its maker how and when you use it.
Huh? No, that has no use for you. Why should it? Who cares about you? It's beneficial to its maker, so it is done.
And if the device does not work without wifi, I'll return it.
And then what? Your argument is much like "If the Bluray player doesn't let me record the signal, I return it". Yes. You can. But you can't get one that lets you.
It's by far not unlikely that you simply will not get any devices that give a shit what YOU want.
They need internet connection because that way they can call the ambulance when you hurt yourself by noticing blood on the blade.
I dare you to ponder what it would take for a government to think "Good idea, let's make this mandatory!"
Then they will make it very, very, VERY inconvenient not to connect them to the internet, at the very least.
The market for such devices is rather small, so given the "danger" of people buying them who could else be forced into giving up their data buying them and thus not providing data that can be sold for lots of money, it's unlikely that any maker of appliances would endanger his data harvesting for such comparably insignificant gains.
Yes. The question is, though, whether the market is big enough and whether licensing will allow it to exist.
Imagine some company with an interest in heavy copyright enforcement establishes the next standard format. They could well demand that anyone who wants to use that format has to be connected with the internet so they can determine whether the content you try to view has been blessed by the DRM gods. No internet, no 16k smellovision for you. And no, making a TV that offers you to play it without the DRM connection is not allowed.
Not that complicated to accomplish, the problem is rather that it will not only invalidate the warranty but the device will very likely refuse to work if it notices that it can't inform the world about your toast eating habits.
I mean, what good is it to me if you can make toast and I don't hear about it? Just because you paid for it doesn't mean that it should do what you want!
So sorry, the boot sequence could not be completed as ordered, for some odd reason the WiFi module doesn't come online and without, I don't start. But since you didn't modify or tamper with the device, you can of course return it for a replacement!