You don't remember how Chile's economy was sabotaged before Allende was taken out? Venezuela's resources are just too valuable for the pirates to leave to the competition, been that way for what, about 500 years now? Your position here reflects a certain 'transparency' of where your loyalties lie.
I do not care what other people do. I will not vote for a republican or democrat. Godwin time: I wouldn't vote for Mussolini just to keep Hitler out of office just because he may have killed fewer people and offers a better dental plan.
As for third partiers taking bribes, so what? Vote them out when they do. Repeat until you get a good one. Whatever happens, good or bad, it is the voters who must be held responsible. In a way they kind of are, in that they also suffer the effects, but what they vote for is to pass the suffering to the 'other guy'. It's what can be called, "Fuck your neighbor".
NO! You throw away your vote when you vote for the bribed politician. And you bury it deep when you reelect him/her over and over. The chance of winning is strictly dependent on your vote, not the money, not anything else. When you vote for the bribed politician, it is YOU who is selling your vote to the highest bidder.
We tried that in Canada along with limits on campaign contributions and spending during elections. Worked OK until the Conservatives got in and they canceled the public campaign financing to save tax payers money...
Well if the Conservatives 'got in'(was there a miscount?), it can only mean the rules didn't work too well.
With the administrators of the fund. Appointees, or elected to the job? Distribution will be politically 'guided'. We don't need this shit. We have an internet now. A lot more people can be heard than before, and we can do a lot better background checks. The damn voters just have to listen and learn to filter out the spam. There is no rule that requires voting for the guy who spends the most. We do not need to censor anybody's speech in any fashion. That includes the money spent. If bullshit is such a hot commodity that gets results, who is anybody to say boo?
Pffft! DC is a giant Pavlov experiment. The behavior you see is highly rewarded. Just stop voting for the crooked politicians who bring back all that pork and the problem will clear up. 95% reelection rates really are an embarrassment, and with out any independents at all. Hardly a good reflection on the people who vote.
Strange, I always thought the people who won't look past the superficial bullshit were the short sighted ones. Or, maybe 'myopic' has a new meaning, who knows?
And please, don't play lawyer with the 'citation' crap. I showed you an example of their MO. It's the rat bastard's perfectly normal way of doing things. What, you want 10, 20? What's the point of that when you just dismiss it out of hand? That's what Smith and pudge do. So what if Greenwald is a dick and the magazine is a rag, sometimes they get it right. You just don't want to hear it. You write it off as meme. And I'm only saying they're a team, and the business is as fixed as professional wrestling only because of mass myopia of people who won't look past the "two" parties. That would be somebody like d_r, and apparently now you? You guys can identify individual zebras in the herd?
Inhuman? No, merely pathological. Inhuman is a Wallmart shopper the day after Thanksgiving. Actually the politician isn't at fault. The voters reward their bad behavior by constantly reelecting the worst of the worst to get their own little piece of the pie. Citation? Look at the tabulation. You won't find a better one than that. It's all republicans and democrats, playing the Bickersons for a tabloid lapdog press. And the voters are playing the fool who fall for the gag every single time..
What is there in this whole thing that makes you believe that the politician represents anything outside the party and the interests of the big donors and of course himself? The democrats gave us DOMA, NAFTA, damn near infinite copyright, civil forfeiture (the very thing that you're kissing Holder's butt for reducing, not eliminating. Fuck him! He should have done it six years ago), they started deregulating high finance before Reagan got into office, they went along and voted for war, the patriot act (even authored some of the worst parts), etc etc etc. How is playing follow the leader 'less evil'?? Just because they didn't think of it first? To hell with them. They got what they deserved in the midterms for damn good reason. Thems the breaks. The other half played a better game. What stands out through it all is that it is a single party, the party of power. Not a single independent with anything more that a big mouth, certainly not any clout.
You really could have saved yourself a lot of time by simply telling me that you get along by playing along, because it's easy. Being in the center usually is. And 98% of the voters are on your side. Who am I argue, right?
I kinda wonder, are you one of those people who blame the Nader voters for Bush's win? Do you think Obama 'caved' on the ACA's single payer issue?
About your bullshit that democrat politicians are 'better' than republican ones! They create a villain to destroy and you put them on a damn pedestal. It's ludicrous. It's a syndrome. Hell, it's just plain old tribalism. This 'lesser evil' shit is just as bad as the Reagan worship.
Well then I can clue you in on something. Whatever you're watching/reading spews the same crap about democrats and republicans as the TV. Sorry, sir, but your speculations are also nothing more than speculation inspired by a press release. The party created a monster, they chop one leg off, now they're a hero?
Sadly, real world events do not conform to that sentence.
No, the TV simply doesn't report motivation behind anything. You have to deduce them from observing the results. And the results, after you toss out the bullshit, say that the politicians reflect the voters wishes and corruption perfectly. The behavior they exhibit is consistently highly rewarded by their sponsors(if they play ball) and voters alike. How do you expect them to be? I mean, what is this? Am I supposed to believe that there is some kind of 'morality' here? Sorry, wouldn't be prudent. As obscure as it may seem, self interest is all there is, and when irrational self interest prevails, well, we're living it. You certainly can't single out 'republicans' for it. They simply express themselves a bit more directly and appeal more overtly to primal instinct and fears. The democrats are the same pig with more lipstick and KY. Maybe you've just fallen for the good cop, bad cop routine.
Prattle on together we will, you about republicans*, and me about nature..
*in which, if you are talking about the voters, then we are in agreement, but the politicians on both sides are only going over their spreadsheets and leave all the masturbatory philosophizing for you all to fight over.
Who's crying? And how can I argue a point that is based on faith? I'm not in the religious conversion business. You seem to be looking for something that isn't there.
Funny. I used to read Harpers a lot. And without remembering anybody by name, I frequently find out I'm just posting vague recollections. And after a quick glance at some of his stuff, you leave me wondering where I differ so much. Eh, whatever, I just picked what was closest. The idea is no less valid because you don't like the source. We all know the name for that now, don't we?
Obviously my linguistic skills are lacking, and nobody understands simple things anymore. Everybody does Java and Ruby without knowing assembly, binary, or even basic electricity.
But I must have done something right. Mr. Smith calls me 'hypermaterialist' and a 'lefty', which I find particularly humorous since I post almost word for word the same thing with him as I do here.
Politics, especially the kind with any real influence is one big gray mass of corruption. It takes a specific kind of person to make any headway in the business. The 'honest' ones sit on the bench or get the bums rush. Sorry, but your 'nuance' is bullshit, just another part of the charade to keep the game going. That is the objective, not to win, not to lose, just stay in the game. And I'm not 'bummed out' about anything. I just find it funny/sad when people standing on the beach tell me there's no water, and then give me shit every time I point out they're soaking in it.
Well hell, If you are going to insist that daytime soaps are for real and never back away to see that it's a studio set, there's nothing to be done. You know, all those people win votes, and have lots of real money backing them up. Maybe you should take a peek at the support structure you seem to deny that exists. You leave the impression that you're just another team player. Sorry if I expected better. This just isn't my game I guess, but unfortunately I'm stuck in it until the end.
Slashdot Mirror
Ouch! Can anybody spot me?
You don't remember how Chile's economy was sabotaged before Allende was taken out? Venezuela's resources are just too valuable for the pirates to leave to the competition, been that way for what, about 500 years now? Your position here reflects a certain 'transparency' of where your loyalties lie.
I am at war with nobody. I am just not interested in bullshit. If I stand alone, so be it. I won't be obligated to 'play along'.
My two semi solutions are to put a ceiling on campaign contributions
That is censorship. I'm against it too. You are free to tune out and make all that money worthless and put the people you want on the ballot.
One word: Ratings
Venezuela has always been at war, with its neighbors and itself. Plus you fail to acknowledge the outside provocateurs.
I'm put int he reasonable position of defending a president, an administration, a party and a country I don't even like all that much.
Not be me you're not! You are defending things you want to believe.
All those paragraphs when you didn't read a single word I said...
I'm sorry, what?
I do not care what other people do. I will not vote for a republican or democrat. Godwin time: I wouldn't vote for Mussolini just to keep Hitler out of office just because he may have killed fewer people and offers a better dental plan.
As for third partiers taking bribes, so what? Vote them out when they do. Repeat until you get a good one. Whatever happens, good or bad, it is the voters who must be held responsible. In a way they kind of are, in that they also suffer the effects, but what they vote for is to pass the suffering to the 'other guy'. It's what can be called, "Fuck your neighbor".
NO! You throw away your vote when you vote for the bribed politician. And you bury it deep when you reelect him/her over and over. The chance of winning is strictly dependent on your vote, not the money, not anything else. When you vote for the bribed politician, it is YOU who is selling your vote to the highest bidder.
We tried that in Canada along with limits on campaign contributions and spending during elections. Worked OK until the Conservatives got in and they canceled the public campaign financing to save tax payers money...
Well if the Conservatives 'got in'(was there a miscount?), it can only mean the rules didn't work too well.
...wheres the protection racket?
With the administrators of the fund. Appointees, or elected to the job? Distribution will be politically 'guided'. We don't need this shit. We have an internet now. A lot more people can be heard than before, and we can do a lot better background checks. The damn voters just have to listen and learn to filter out the spam. There is no rule that requires voting for the guy who spends the most. We do not need to censor anybody's speech in any fashion. That includes the money spent. If bullshit is such a hot commodity that gets results, who is anybody to say boo?
Then write in C: Mickey Mouse.
Precisely. But people would rather play helpless to absolve themselves of responsibility.
Pffft! DC is a giant Pavlov experiment. The behavior you see is highly rewarded. Just stop voting for the crooked politicians who bring back all that pork and the problem will clear up. 95% reelection rates really are an embarrassment, and with out any independents at all. Hardly a good reflection on the people who vote.
Strange, I always thought the people who won't look past the superficial bullshit were the short sighted ones. Or, maybe 'myopic' has a new meaning, who knows?
And please, don't play lawyer with the 'citation' crap. I showed you an example of their MO. It's the rat bastard's perfectly normal way of doing things. What, you want 10, 20? What's the point of that when you just dismiss it out of hand? That's what Smith and pudge do. So what if Greenwald is a dick and the magazine is a rag, sometimes they get it right. You just don't want to hear it. You write it off as meme. And I'm only saying they're a team, and the business is as fixed as professional wrestling only because of mass myopia of people who won't look past the "two" parties. That would be somebody like d_r, and apparently now you? You guys can identify individual zebras in the herd?
Inhuman? No, merely pathological. Inhuman is a Wallmart shopper the day after Thanksgiving. Actually the politician isn't at fault. The voters reward their bad behavior by constantly reelecting the worst of the worst to get their own little piece of the pie. Citation? Look at the tabulation. You won't find a better one than that. It's all republicans and democrats, playing the Bickersons for a tabloid lapdog press. And the voters are playing the fool who fall for the gag every single time..
What is there in this whole thing that makes you believe that the politician represents anything outside the party and the interests of the big donors and of course himself? The democrats gave us DOMA, NAFTA, damn near infinite copyright, civil forfeiture (the very thing that you're kissing Holder's butt for reducing, not eliminating. Fuck him! He should have done it six years ago), they started deregulating high finance before Reagan got into office, they went along and voted for war, the patriot act (even authored some of the worst parts), etc etc etc. How is playing follow the leader 'less evil'?? Just because they didn't think of it first? To hell with them. They got what they deserved in the midterms for damn good reason. Thems the breaks. The other half played a better game. What stands out through it all is that it is a single party, the party of power. Not a single independent with anything more that a big mouth, certainly not any clout.
You really could have saved yourself a lot of time by simply telling me that you get along by playing along, because it's easy. Being in the center usually is. And 98% of the voters are on your side. Who am I argue, right?
I kinda wonder, are you one of those people who blame the Nader voters for Bush's win? Do you think Obama 'caved' on the ACA's single payer issue?
He can be in two places at once?
When he's not anywhere at all?
Then we'll see how impressive that is.
Not nearly as much as his coming back...
What the fuck are you talking about?
About your bullshit that democrat politicians are 'better' than republican ones! They create a villain to destroy and you put them on a damn pedestal. It's ludicrous. It's a syndrome. Hell, it's just plain old tribalism. This 'lesser evil' shit is just as bad as the Reagan worship.
Well then I can clue you in on something. Whatever you're watching/reading spews the same crap about democrats and republicans as the TV. Sorry, sir, but your speculations are also nothing more than speculation inspired by a press release. The party created a monster, they chop one leg off, now they're a hero?
Sadly, real world events do not conform to that sentence.
No, the TV simply doesn't report motivation behind anything. You have to deduce them from observing the results. And the results, after you toss out the bullshit, say that the politicians reflect the voters wishes and corruption perfectly. The behavior they exhibit is consistently highly rewarded by their sponsors(if they play ball) and voters alike. How do you expect them to be? I mean, what is this? Am I supposed to believe that there is some kind of 'morality' here? Sorry, wouldn't be prudent. As obscure as it may seem, self interest is all there is, and when irrational self interest prevails, well, we're living it. You certainly can't single out 'republicans' for it. They simply express themselves a bit more directly and appeal more overtly to primal instinct and fears. The democrats are the same pig with more lipstick and KY. Maybe you've just fallen for the good cop, bad cop routine.
Prattle on together we will, you about republicans*, and me about nature..
*in which, if you are talking about the voters, then we are in agreement, but the politicians on both sides are only going over their spreadsheets and leave all the masturbatory philosophizing for you all to fight over.
Who's crying? And how can I argue a point that is based on faith? I'm not in the religious conversion business. You seem to be looking for something that isn't there.
Walter Karp
Funny. I used to read Harpers a lot. And without remembering anybody by name, I frequently find out I'm just posting vague recollections. And after a quick glance at some of his stuff, you leave me wondering where I differ so much. Eh, whatever, I just picked what was closest. The idea is no less valid because you don't like the source. We all know the name for that now, don't we?
Obviously my linguistic skills are lacking, and nobody understands simple things anymore. Everybody does Java and Ruby without knowing assembly, binary, or even basic electricity.
But I must have done something right. Mr. Smith calls me 'hypermaterialist' and a 'lefty', which I find particularly humorous since I post almost word for word the same thing with him as I do here.
You know what? Thanks!
Politics, especially the kind with any real influence is one big gray mass of corruption. It takes a specific kind of person to make any headway in the business. The 'honest' ones sit on the bench or get the bums rush. Sorry, but your 'nuance' is bullshit, just another part of the charade to keep the game going. That is the objective, not to win, not to lose, just stay in the game. And I'm not 'bummed out' about anything. I just find it funny/sad when people standing on the beach tell me there's no water, and then give me shit every time I point out they're soaking in it.
Well hell, If you are going to insist that daytime soaps are for real and never back away to see that it's a studio set, there's nothing to be done. You know, all those people win votes, and have lots of real money backing them up. Maybe you should take a peek at the support structure you seem to deny that exists. You leave the impression that you're just another team player. Sorry if I expected better. This just isn't my game I guess, but unfortunately I'm stuck in it until the end.
we'd have a clear record of who voted for it and who voted against it, which might have an effect on the next election cycle.
HA! Don't hold your breath. The only thing that has an effect on the elections is gas prices, and the reported unemployment rate.
Exactly what benefits do we get from the pipeline?
Whaddya mean 'we'? You think you're part of the deal? Pull the other one.