What your refering to Xerox did first. DeskTop publishing.
But on the side.. accually "What You See Is What You Get" WYSIWYG is just what you see on the screen is what you'll get on the priniter. This didn't take a laser printer. Just a computer with a bit more than a text only display and a wordprocessor that takes advantage of that.
Desktop publishing being a great deal more than simply making "what you see" the same as "what you get".. It's also producing newsprint type results instead of just something that came off a typowriter.
None of this is really about transfering whats on the screen to paper but about making whats on the screen match what you'll eventually get on paper. (printing out test pages is a bastard... so it's great when it's not nessisary).
I have seen a "video printer" and that seems closer to what is being discribed in your quote...
But on reading the artical it seems more to the truth just a new lowcost flatscreen.
I think it's just an idea in education that they are trainning guys to get good jobs and girls to be good wifes. A tech guy can land a GREAT job in the tech world. A girl needs to be dumb so she dosn't outsmart (and fighten) potental husbands.
It's all outdated sexist notions that are probably allready dead. We are just living with the side effects. Few geek girls.
I say screw it... teach tech to as many nontech girls as posable.
[Ok so a certen lady friend of mine isn't to happy with it but I will have her writing code at some point]
Yes there are socal pressures pushing you to "the norm". You'r a guy you like football right? Play foot ball. But if you go against the main and go to computers if you are a guy you are encuraged. If you go to chess club you get a thumbs up. If you go to debate club you make friends. Girls going to computers get "ahh you don't REALLY want to do that". So even AFTER expressing an intrest they get pushed away. It is very unusuall for a kid to continue to presue intrests once an athoritry figure trys to discurage them.
Guys might get prodded into taking an intrest in sports but they don't interfear once a guy takes intrest in computers. Girls however.... The most intelectual thing they were allowed to be involved in was the debate club. Other intrests were heavly discuraged.
Nothing stopped me from preformming atheticly AND intelectually. Where I went to school it was expected. The jocks didn't have it any better than the geeks. I did catch it for never joinning the football team or the track team. But NEVER for my intrest in technology.
It's scarry enough that people think cop shows are an accurate study of law:)
IANAL but I real law books:) and I think that just makes me dangerous.. not informmed:)
On a side note.... I rember a Tv soap actor (he PLAYS a doctor) accually comment that people think he is qualifyed to give medical advice.
That probably lead to a TV doctor saying on TV ads "I am not a doctor but I play one on TV" becouse apparently playing a doctor on TV gives him medical credability. Just as watching cop shows seems to give people legal credability:)
I play a doctor on TV I watch cop shows and I have a high score on doom... I guess that makes me a psyco-path with medical skill and legal knowladge...:) Ok I lied... I don't watch TV or play anything on TV.... and I havn't played Doom in a long time...
> After all, they've doubtlessly over-extended themselves with mortgages and auto-loans for ferraris. Know what I mean?
Yeah I know what you mean... They have been living in the same place for a long time now. As far as I know none own fancy transportation (why bother.. Taco hates going places).... and they are making good money... (Saleryed employees... Andover dosn't need to turn a proffit for them to do well...)
The point (made as a Troll obveously) is a good one. (Oh my ghod a Troll accually had a good point... shoot me now).
If a website owned by a larger company (say Andover or Internet.com) shuts down. What happend to the userbase? All those e-mail addresses.
And if BigIPOWebSiteCompany.com is bought out by LargSpammer.com....
Or... what if one of the larg WebSite operating companys (not nessisarly Andover.. there are quite a few) folds and sells the user lists? Ohhhh spam Spam SPAM SpAm sPaM sSpPaAmM!!
It's a valid point.. Made by a troll... One of the signs of the end of time no doupt...
Let me check my Y2K bunker... see if it's still operational.
They don't have your identity to sell... What they have is records of your life. Footprints. They are selling your foot prints you left on them. Instead of sweeping them away they record them.
The evil part is.. those foot prints don't give a clear or accurate picture... CDs you got for your kid sister. DVDs for friends.
You know I get junkmail for videos all the time? I can only guess it's due to my old membership card thing to a video rental place. They rent Nintendo cartrages.. or they did when I had a Nintendo. The place is gone... and so is my Nintendo... My VCR is also dead and I never got a DVD player. But I still have all thies wonderful offers to buy DVDs.
Marketing statistics.. and most of it is all wacked...
Occasionally I get stuff for Unix and Linux.. but most of it is junk... "Computer.. he has Windows.. let's sell him Windows junk" "DotCom... he has a busness... let's sell him wealth building garbage"
MeowPawjects is a "hobby busness" not intended to make a proffit just a legalistic nesesity. I run Linux... and occasionally Dos.
But thats not what they learn from my footfalls.
So no... they don't own your identity... far from it... they own the trail you leave behind... That trail is not you...
>E-gads, never ever buy anything over the Internet! Told you so, didn't I? Would you trust your CC info to a plywood-and-tin booth selling CDs in the middle of nowhere? I knew you wouldn't. These dotcoms are no different.
Would you trust a random AC? Annon DotComs are no diffrent:) Sorry to compleatly sillify your comment:)
And yes... I would... and you know why? Becouse plywood burns.... and I have a lighter... Just kidding...
On a more sereous note... DotComs are not anologous to plywood huts... More to mailorder... I do busness with both plywood huts and mail order BTW.. But thats becouse I have a phisical location. With the plywood I have a face.
We do busness with throw up busnesses all the time. That guy selling stuff at a consert is in one of those plywood huts. Go to a renfair.. plywood huts.
Go to carnival... and usually the plywood huts ARE cons.
You pay for a domain for 2 to 4 years. The equipment isn't cheap. It may not take much to yank out a DotCom [Meow Pawjects costs me like $25 a month.. It was $40 but I dropped the SQL server] but it's not significantly diffrent from walking into a stripmall. It's all prefab...
The problem with DotComs is this world is totally diffrent and they keep doing things the same old way learning the hard way it don't work.
Selling costummer information is one of the few constents. So if a mail order busness folds your personal records get sold. If Jims Jumbo Pizza folds his records get sold. If MikoMiko.com folds his records get sold. It's wrong.. it's evil.. It should be stopped. But it's not DotCom it's REALITY.
On the other hand... if that plywood busness closes... No costummer records to sell... Becouse we know it's temporary... We know he'll be gone soon... We don't know that at the strip mall. We don't know that of a DotCom...
Is it really the same?
No... becouse we know better... we know what we are facing. We know he is temporary. We don't realise they may all be temporary...
For a silly (yet sereous) note... After all the weak DotComs sell off colected information....
COM collection copration... we sell databases full of all the information colected by the dot coms...
It is pritty scary....
So who's gona buy your Amazon records? Who will buy you CD Now data?
Hay... All you people who have my.mp3.com accounts... wouldn't you just LOVE to let some record company buy out a record of YOUR cd collection?
"hay he has lots of punk rock.. and dosn't have any 'Smelly Boot' CDs... let's go sell him some Smelly Boot..." "But I don't like Smelly Boot..."
or worse... people buying 1970s Disco [Ohh yuck.. ok bad tast to start with] get ads for 1960s Disco [It gose by a diffrent name I just don't know it becouse I was born in 1969].. I heard some of it... Trust me.. even if you LOVE 1970s Disco... you won't like the 1960s counterpart.. (Yes they call it Disco... they didn't back then but they do now.. I guess the lable was stapped by someone who hates both...)
I wonder if the FTC will care... This is an OLD busness practace... When my ex-employer was sold they did nothing more than sell the database, the name and the main office. Everything else got sold to other companys. Not a big issue as the information stayed with the name. But for any real sense of being the company no longer exists.
I'm sure you'll find when any given company folds the costumer records are right there for anyone who has the money.
You BIO should become public knowladge under certen situations. [Running for office.. etc]
Unatherised bios are pritty commen but pritty petty... and restricting your bio would effect your friends, famalys, assosiats and enemys more than it would effect companys as they know more about you or at least have more to say about you.
"Oh my dear Felinoid.. that wonderful kid.. allways buying techno mags" - Mom "Playboy, Sluts Inc, Chains and Whips" - Publishers Clearing house "Chains and Whips IS a tech mag.. I sware" - me...
Accually the above is for illistration.. I only buy busness mags vea publishers clearing house and my mother is totally aware of the kind of stuff I read.
I personally kinda signned off any rights to my bio when I ran for office. I lost I won't run again. But I'm public data now... So I'm kinda bies:)
> If onlyyou were listening me when I told you to never buy anything over the Internet... But now it's too late.
You think your buying habbits in the "real"* world are safe?
Thankfully I do most of my electronics shopping at a small electronics shop. They don't keep those sort of records.
On the other hand Radio Shack keeps asking for my name to see if I am on the database....
And those wonderful Luckys rewards cards. Some cashers asked for the card even when there were no "rewards" I would convenently lose the card in my wallet at those points.
* [real in quotes becouse it seems pritty sureal to me]
> I have never quite understood those opposing laws and regulations, claiming that "consumer power" and other public pressure will keep companies on the rug.
I do... politicians are far better at exactly the same tricks. Regulation isn't an evil thing in itself but I think the best regulations are in the "full disclosure" area where companys (and government agentcys) must be upfront.
Most consummers don't trust companys to collect data to start with. This is just one example of this. Companys change privacy policys or get bought out.
"We won't share with other companys" "Oh by the way we are now owned by Scam-U-Up" wops your screwed...
It is working... Note the Double Click warnning.. "We are Double Click we won't sell your information..." waiting for Scam-U-Up to do a corprate take-over of Double Click.
But.... that is becouse we KNEW about DC...
We take it on faith alone that CmdrTaco dosn't use his weblogs for anything more than security and admin information.
And then there is me. Where did all this junkmail come from? Not e-spam.. not UCE... postal spam.. Let's see.. I sent in my Commodore 64 and 128 warrenty cards... as well as warrenty cards for half a dosen other products to companys that went away in the early 1990s. My ex-employeer was sued. Oh wait... my employment records.. on cort documents? Ok thats government. Hmm most of this junk for dot coms... like... oh wait... MeowPawjects... oh yeah thats public record.. du...
My personal life is pritty well public knowladge and there isn't much I can say about it. You really think I'm trusting the agentcy that gave away my work records to protect my surfing habbits? I don't care if you know about my surfing habbits (I do mess with the systems used becouse it's just not right but thats about all I do).
I think self regulation dose work to a degree. Privacy is an area companys usually DO "go off the rug" so we distrust them in this area at every turn. But I'm not expecting any agentcy to prevent such records from becomming public when they'll publish it on cort documents.
The problem is that self regulation isn't ALLOWED to work. Picture kid trying to do stuff for himself and no one let's him. Then parents who won't let him do anything go around saying "He won't do anything for himself".
The corts not the busness itself are responsable for this.
Moderation is a good thing but don't go trusting "elected organisation"s in areas you can not trust corprate intrests. It's all the same.
With companys you vote with your paycheck with government you vote at the box. They screw you with exactly the same trick. Fool enough people and it dose not matter who you shafted.
It's knowladge not regulation that keeps them both in line.
In this case... regulation is called for... privacy policys should be a binding contract. They are not. As a contract the corts can't ask a company to violate it.
Oh yeah.. and get rid of corprate bankruptcy... Thats just plain silly.
Also cookies expire if you don't update them. So let's say your a normal user who NEVER flushes his cookies... But you opt out... and your not savy enough to realise... you opt out just expired....
Rember how they had that Opt out side bar? Once you opt out it vanishes... then after a while.. It's back...
The problem is they use a presistent cookie to opt out. That cookie expires over time so you don't opt out forever...
They should be required instead to opt in. So you opt to have a tracker cookie placed on your browser. No cookie no track. Then they will be encuraged to update and renew the cookie so it dosn't expire... As it is they just don't care
Just a quick note (I seem to be saying that a lot lately) The 1970s... 30 years ago... CmdrTaco is less than 35 years old "I have a few good years before I'm considered 'old'"(refering to an artical where "old" is 35).
A kid under 15 years old who can lay his hands on pounds and pounds of marijuana in the 1970s has got to rate in the brilent catagory.
This troll didn't do his math:)
A significant number of "geeks" like CmdrTaco are Xgen (The generation that said "Don't lable me".. what dose that say of the generaton who created the lable?) When home computers were a new toy for kids. Vic20s, Timex Sinclares, Cocos, Apples, Ataris..
FidoNet... Xmodem... 300 to 1200 baud... Anybody rember how in War Games the modem was an acustic cup that could dial, hang up and dial again?
Anyone noticed in the 1980s on the death of the acustic cup the final stake in the heart was those phones with the sqare ends instead of round so they wouldn't fit? They keepped making them mostly for laptops on the go when your at a hotel where the phones won't let you jack in to upload news storys... oh yeah square ends... ack...
That is something however. It's been known for a long time that the information age will be the death of IP laws. Or at least IP rights...
At one time it was a great thing. Book authors, musicians, and inventors would not be ripped off. But the issues get more complex over time....
Slashdot continually confuses TradeMarks, Patents and Copyrights. All IP rights but people confuse how they can be used.
They are simmiler but not identical and each have specal issues.
The music industry also seems to have similer problems understanding exactly what rights they accually have.
Even Microsoft seems to have problems understanding what IP laws apply and when.
(I read a lot of Nolo press books.. can you tell?.. IANAL so go read the books if you want to understand IP law)..
Even the USPO dosn't really understand Prior Art.
To get anything patented (the protection for the little guy) you need to be wealthy (not the little guy).
Copyrights are significantly better but let's face it. They are screwed.
Trade Marks being probably the only IP not totally messed up. But then it is becouse it's being abused by companys like Matel. On the other hand Matel has as much to worry about as parents who happen to name a kid Barbie.
Anyway... this all known... corprations want to protect IP rights rather than adapt. Thies rights may not exist for much longer. Eventually the laws will have to catch up to the fact that information.. reguardless of what it may or may not wish.. is free...
> Maybe if I get a kuro5hin tattoo on my ass, people will stop accusing Slashdot of bias. Maybe.
It'll never happen. Why? Becouse Slashdot will (unavoidably) fail to mention tiny tucked away websites. Why would Slashdot do that? Well a website on spore molds isn't in itself very intresting. A lot of web forums just arn't Slashdot matereal.
But Slashdot dose TRY to premote as many forums as posable. Check out the Slashboxes. Most of them are compeating web forums. All slapped on the main page of Slashdot for all to see.
Kuro5hin has been beating Slashdot to some stroys as of late so it's no supprise they get Slashdot mention. Slashdot isn't (in my opinion) going to back away from anything or anyone just becouse it's a compeating website. If Kuro5hin dreams up some amazing new technology then it will be Slashdotted. No doupt in my mind about that.
On the other hand Internet.com seems to be acting in bies against compeating websites.
Picture this announcment "Meow Pawjects will no longer announce anything connected with Slashdot, Andover, Internet.com, Microsoft or the New World Order as such premotion may confluct with personal busness intrests"... I'm thinking about posting this on MeowBBS under the "humor" section:)
A quick point.. copyright protection for software existed before the 1980s. It was challanged in the 1980s and found invalid and was then restored so really software copyrights were void for a very short span of time. Also... the "boom" started in the 1970s before this whole issue came into effect. It continued into the 1980s. With Commodore Vic20s, CoCos and Apple ][ computers. Basic as a commen programming language and no operating system to speak of.
Public domain played a larg part in the BBS world as well as the Internet. Out of the coutless commertal file transfer protocals the public domain Xmodem was the standard. Unlike others Xmodem was made by it's author only with his own needs in mind. He did not criple his code with features he believed other people needed. Instead he stayed with what he wanted and that was it. It is believed the fact that he didn't try to imagin what others needed that lead to Xmodems success.
It works this way.... With free software someone has a real need they create a real solution for that need and tag it on to existing software rather than reinvent the wheel. With commertal software marketting dreams up neat features they think people will like the software develupers write a brand new application from ground up so the whole pacage will be the property of the company (and not shared property as is usually the case with free software).
As a result commertal innovation is solving problems that may have never existed with solutions that may never work. Free software innovation is a person needs a tool that dose not exist they create that tool. The resulting tool fits the job perfictly.
>We're seeing a lot more students running multiuser systems; Linux, *BSD, whatever. These are quite often not the best maintained machines. They are relatively frequently subjected to root exploit, and are less likely to be quickly detected as such than well run systems.
I just wantted to attack this one point.... This is an issue of poor maintanence alone. Multiuser defects are not easyer to attack than single user defects. We are talking about defects BTW.. not normal functioning of a multiuser system... Personal systems shouldn't run logind and the like. Thies daemons don't do anything for personal workstations. But many systems include them by default. I allways disable anything I don't need but most people do not bother.
Same rules for Windows and other single user systems. No body bothers...
I hear about multiuser systems being banned for security reasons and it really bothers me. Getting root is not significantly diffrent from getting admin other than one is on Unix and one is on Windows.
Also Linux systems are being shipped with logind disabled by default. Not on all systems but on the more secure distros.
It'd be nice if everyone shipped secure but they don't.
If you do ban unsecure systems you have to start with Windows, then Linux. In the end you get Dos, Mac and Lunix.. and nothing else.
>How many times are we going to hear and listen to this "web logs are evil" crap before someone points out that it's all total BS?
Well I guess none more than has allready been heard becouse someone on Slashdot (you) just pointed it out:)
In the mean time while fearing logs don't leave messages on answering machines. Better yet don't make phone calls at all. The phone company keeps logs (just of who you called and for how long). Stay away from banks.. camras everywhere tracking your movments. And government buildings... ohhh scary.....
In fact stay away from people... that brain thing logs EVERYTHING...
> I can't see any reason anyone would believe this crap.
This is a profesional who has good reasoning capabilitys forgetting that many people out there are still functioning on the "computers = magic" mode and treat experts like wizards.
So while he may recomend replacing Telnet and FTP internally with secure protocals the "Folows of the all knowing and all powerful expert" will go ripping FTP and Telnet clients out of boxes screamming of "Security hazzards". Give it a week you'll hear about FTP and Telnet click viruses (Think 'I-Lov-U'.. or better yet think 'Good times') infecting everyone. (No accual virus just rummors).
Napster aside... we are talking about a group who think banning Unix as a security risk is a good idea and then install Windows in it's place. "We are protecting you from all those nasty Unix emplots... someone could hack into your box from remote and... oh dam.. anyone know what back oraface is?"
I say teach students security issues and let them fend for themselfs. I mean gezz. Trial by fire.... no better way to learn... Oh yeah and take your box off the network when you need to study.. just in case...
Allmost true. Much less the nature of humanity than the nature of things. Things don't change to acomindate the greater good. A tree remains a tree and it dose far more than is nessisary. It cares not if it cuts off the sunlight to other trees it comes first. Dirt is dirt it dose not yeald to more useful matereals. It may be made into other things by plants etc but in the end it all returns to dirt.
Human nature is not really to be lax or selfish but to be socal and coprative. We loath those who act out of pure selfiishness or put others in harms way for self. But as lacking in human nature as it is. As much as we aspire to be great things we do not overcome the simple fact that we operate as singler as self and must defend self and function as self. It is the nature of this singlaity that produces a lack of responsabilty. No matter how much we are a group we will never overcome our singularity and will allways function at what is best for self.
Anyone who thinks we can be otherwise with out being omnipotent is fooling themselfs. Anyone who thinks an omnipotent man kind could use nanites are being silly.
Slashdot Mirror
What your refering to Xerox did first. DeskTop publishing.
But on the side.. accually "What You See Is What You Get" WYSIWYG is just what you see on the screen is what you'll get on the priniter. This didn't take a laser printer. Just a computer with a bit more than a text only display and a wordprocessor that takes advantage of that.
Desktop publishing being a great deal more than simply making "what you see" the same as "what you get".. It's also producing newsprint type results instead of just something that came off a typowriter.
None of this is really about transfering whats on the screen to paper but about making whats on the screen match what you'll eventually get on paper.
(printing out test pages is a bastard... so it's great when it's not nessisary).
I have seen a "video printer" and that seems closer to what is being discribed in your quote...
But on reading the artical it seems more to the truth just a new lowcost flatscreen.
Not related to WYSIWYG at all...
I think it's just an idea in education that they are trainning guys to get good jobs and girls to be good wifes.
A tech guy can land a GREAT job in the tech world.
A girl needs to be dumb so she dosn't outsmart (and fighten) potental husbands.
It's all outdated sexist notions that are probably allready dead. We are just living with the side effects. Few geek girls.
I say screw it... teach tech to as many nontech girls as posable.
[Ok so a certen lady friend of mine isn't to happy with it but I will have her writing code at some point]
Yes there are socal pressures pushing you to "the norm". You'r a guy you like football right? Play foot ball.
But if you go against the main and go to computers if you are a guy you are encuraged. If you go to chess club you get a thumbs up. If you go to debate club you make friends.
Girls going to computers get "ahh you don't REALLY want to do that". So even AFTER expressing an intrest they get pushed away.
It is very unusuall for a kid to continue to presue intrests once an athoritry figure trys to discurage them.
Guys might get prodded into taking an intrest in sports but they don't interfear once a guy takes intrest in computers.
Girls however.... The most intelectual thing they were allowed to be involved in was the debate club. Other intrests were heavly discuraged.
Nothing stopped me from preformming atheticly AND intelectually. Where I went to school it was expected. The jocks didn't have it any better than the geeks.
I did catch it for never joinning the football team or the track team. But NEVER for my intrest in technology.
It's scarry enough that people think cop shows are an accurate study of law :)
:) :)
:)
:)
IANAL but I real law books
and I think that just makes me dangerous.. not informmed
On a side note.... I rember a Tv soap actor (he PLAYS a doctor) accually comment that people think he is qualifyed to give medical advice.
That probably lead to a TV doctor saying on TV ads "I am not a doctor but I play one on TV" becouse apparently playing a doctor on TV gives him medical credability.
Just as watching cop shows seems to give people legal credability
I play a doctor on TV I watch cop shows and I have a high score on doom...
I guess that makes me a psyco-path with medical skill and legal knowladge...
Ok I lied... I don't watch TV or play anything on TV....
and I havn't played Doom in a long time...
> After all, they've doubtlessly over-extended themselves with mortgages and auto-loans for ferraris. Know what I mean?
Yeah I know what you mean...
They have been living in the same place for a long time now. As far as I know none own fancy transportation (why bother.. Taco hates going places).... and they are making good money... (Saleryed employees... Andover dosn't need to turn a proffit for them to do well...)
The point (made as a Troll obveously) is a good one. (Oh my ghod a Troll accually had a good point... shoot me now).
If a website owned by a larger company (say Andover or Internet.com) shuts down. What happend to the userbase? All those e-mail addresses.
And if BigIPOWebSiteCompany.com is bought out by LargSpammer.com....
Or... what if one of the larg WebSite operating companys (not nessisarly Andover.. there are quite a few) folds and sells the user lists?
Ohhhh spam Spam SPAM SpAm sPaM sSpPaAmM!!
It's a valid point.. Made by a troll...
One of the signs of the end of time no doupt...
Let me check my Y2K bunker... see if it's still operational.
They don't have your identity to sell...
What they have is records of your life. Footprints. They are selling your foot prints you left on them.
Instead of sweeping them away they record them.
The evil part is.. those foot prints don't give a clear or accurate picture...
CDs you got for your kid sister. DVDs for friends.
You know I get junkmail for videos all the time? I can only guess it's due to my old membership card thing to a video rental place. They rent Nintendo cartrages.. or they did when I had a Nintendo.
The place is gone... and so is my Nintendo... My VCR is also dead and I never got a DVD player. But I still have all thies wonderful offers to buy DVDs.
Marketing statistics.. and most of it is all wacked...
Occasionally I get stuff for Unix and Linux.. but most of it is junk...
"Computer.. he has Windows.. let's sell him Windows junk"
"DotCom... he has a busness... let's sell him wealth building garbage"
MeowPawjects is a "hobby busness" not intended to make a proffit just a legalistic nesesity.
I run Linux... and occasionally Dos.
But thats not what they learn from my footfalls.
So no... they don't own your identity... far from it... they own the trail you leave behind...
That trail is not you...
>E-gads, never ever buy anything over the Internet! Told you so, didn't I? Would you trust your CC info to a plywood-and-tin booth selling CDs in the middle of nowhere? I knew you wouldn't. These dotcoms are no different.
:) :)
Would you trust a random AC? Annon DotComs are no diffrent
Sorry to compleatly sillify your comment
And yes... I would... and you know why?
Becouse plywood burns.... and I have a lighter...
Just kidding...
On a more sereous note...
DotComs are not anologous to plywood huts...
More to mailorder... I do busness with both plywood huts and mail order BTW..
But thats becouse I have a phisical location. With the plywood I have a face.
We do busness with throw up busnesses all the time. That guy selling stuff at a consert is in one of those plywood huts.
Go to a renfair.. plywood huts.
Go to carnival... and usually the plywood huts ARE cons.
You pay for a domain for 2 to 4 years. The equipment isn't cheap. It may not take much to yank out a DotCom [Meow Pawjects costs me like $25 a month.. It was $40 but I dropped the SQL server] but it's not significantly diffrent from walking into a stripmall. It's all prefab...
The problem with DotComs is this world is totally diffrent and they keep doing things the same old way learning the hard way it don't work.
Selling costummer information is one of the few constents.
So if a mail order busness folds your personal records get sold. If Jims Jumbo Pizza folds his records get sold. If MikoMiko.com folds his records get sold. It's wrong.. it's evil.. It should be stopped. But it's not DotCom it's REALITY.
On the other hand... if that plywood busness closes... No costummer records to sell...
Becouse we know it's temporary... We know he'll be gone soon... We don't know that at the strip mall. We don't know that of a DotCom...
Is it really the same?
No... becouse we know better... we know what we are facing. We know he is temporary. We don't realise they may all be temporary...
Yeah thats kinda scary...
For a silly (yet sereous) note...
After all the weak DotComs sell off colected information....
COM collection copration... we sell databases full of all the information colected by the dot coms...
It is pritty scary....
So who's gona buy your Amazon records?
Who will buy you CD Now data?
Hay... All you people who have my.mp3.com accounts... wouldn't you just LOVE to let some record company buy out a record of YOUR cd collection?
"hay he has lots of punk rock.. and dosn't have any 'Smelly Boot' CDs... let's go sell him some Smelly Boot..."
"But I don't like Smelly Boot..."
or worse... people buying 1970s Disco [Ohh yuck.. ok bad tast to start with] get ads for 1960s Disco [It gose by a diffrent name I just don't know it becouse I was born in 1969].. I heard some of it... Trust me.. even if you LOVE 1970s Disco... you won't like the 1960s counterpart..
(Yes they call it Disco... they didn't back then but they do now.. I guess the lable was stapped by someone who hates both...)
I wonder if the FTC will care...
This is an OLD busness practace...
When my ex-employer was sold they did nothing more than sell the database, the name and the main office. Everything else got sold to other companys. Not a big issue as the information stayed with the name. But for any real sense of being the company no longer exists.
I'm sure you'll find when any given company folds the costumer records are right there for anyone who has the money.
The KDE browser (and some other browsers) allow you to "reject forever" or "accept forever" cookies. So you can select on a case by case basis.
:)
So unless your logging into a website.. "reject forever" and you'll be happy
I agree with 1 but not 2.
:)
You BIO should become public knowladge under certen situations. [Running for office.. etc]
Unatherised bios are pritty commen but pritty petty...
and restricting your bio would effect your friends, famalys, assosiats and enemys more than it would effect companys as they know more about you or at least have more to say about you.
"Oh my dear Felinoid.. that wonderful kid.. allways buying techno mags" - Mom
"Playboy, Sluts Inc, Chains and Whips" - Publishers Clearing house
"Chains and Whips IS a tech mag.. I sware" - me...
Accually the above is for illistration.. I only buy busness mags vea publishers clearing house and my mother is totally aware of the kind of stuff I read.
I personally kinda signned off any rights to my bio when I ran for office. I lost I won't run again. But I'm public data now...
So I'm kinda bies
Sooo Yummy.. tasy and non-fat...
:)
And try our arsnic cola... It's populare with extreamist groups, Cults , Terrorists and Racists.
So get some for your nabors today
You are right however... there needs to be some binding of law to prevent this abuse...
Otherwise... it is both an asset AND a liability... asset to them.. liability to me
> If onlyyou were listening me when I told you to never buy anything over the Internet... But now it's too late.
You think your buying habbits in the "real"* world are safe?
Thankfully I do most of my electronics shopping at a small electronics shop. They don't keep those sort of records.
On the other hand Radio Shack keeps asking for my name to see if I am on the database....
And those wonderful Luckys rewards cards. Some cashers asked for the card even when there were no "rewards" I would convenently lose the card in my wallet at those points.
* [real in quotes becouse it seems pritty sureal to me]
> I have never quite understood those opposing laws and regulations, claiming that "consumer power" and other public pressure will keep companies on the rug.
I do... politicians are far better at exactly the same tricks. Regulation isn't an evil thing in itself but I think the best regulations are in the "full disclosure" area where companys (and government agentcys) must be upfront.
Most consummers don't trust companys to collect data to start with. This is just one example of this. Companys change privacy policys or get bought out.
"We won't share with other companys" "Oh by the way we are now owned by Scam-U-Up" wops your screwed...
It is working... Note the Double Click warnning.. "We are Double Click we won't sell your information..." waiting for Scam-U-Up to do a corprate take-over of Double Click.
But.... that is becouse we KNEW about DC...
We take it on faith alone that CmdrTaco dosn't use his weblogs for anything more than security and admin information.
And then there is me. Where did all this junkmail come from? Not e-spam.. not UCE... postal spam.. Let's see.. I sent in my Commodore 64 and 128 warrenty cards... as well as warrenty cards for half a dosen other products to companys that went away in the early 1990s. My ex-employeer was sued. Oh wait... my employment records.. on cort documents? Ok thats government. Hmm most of this junk for dot coms... like... oh wait... MeowPawjects... oh yeah thats public record.. du...
My personal life is pritty well public knowladge and there isn't much I can say about it.
You really think I'm trusting the agentcy that gave away my work records to protect my surfing habbits? I don't care if you know about my surfing habbits (I do mess with the systems used becouse it's just not right but thats about all I do).
I think self regulation dose work to a degree.
Privacy is an area companys usually DO "go off the rug" so we distrust them in this area at every turn.
But I'm not expecting any agentcy to prevent such records from becomming public when they'll publish it on cort documents.
The problem is that self regulation isn't ALLOWED to work.
Picture kid trying to do stuff for himself and no one let's him. Then parents who won't let him do anything go around saying "He won't do anything for himself".
The corts not the busness itself are responsable for this.
Moderation is a good thing but don't go trusting "elected organisation"s in areas you can not trust corprate intrests. It's all the same.
With companys you vote with your paycheck with government you vote at the box. They screw you with exactly the same trick. Fool enough people and it dose not matter who you shafted.
It's knowladge not regulation that keeps them both in line.
In this case... regulation is called for... privacy policys should be a binding contract. They are not. As a contract the corts can't ask a company to violate it.
Oh yeah.. and get rid of corprate bankruptcy... Thats just plain silly.
Also cookies expire if you don't update them.
So let's say your a normal user who NEVER flushes his cookies...
But you opt out...
and your not savy enough to realise... you opt out just expired....
Boy are you screwed...
Rember how they had that Opt out side bar?
Once you opt out it vanishes... then after a while.. It's back...
The problem is they use a presistent cookie to opt out. That cookie expires over time so you don't opt out forever...
They should be required instead to opt in. So you opt to have a tracker cookie placed on your browser. No cookie no track. Then they will be encuraged to update and renew the cookie so it dosn't expire...
As it is they just don't care
When informed that a servay is asking if the Internet "turns you on" someone on Geeks in Space says "TCP/IP has got to be the sexiest protocal".
Me personally time servers turn me on...
and hay lot's of people have binary fedishes...
Just a quick note (I seem to be saying that a lot lately)
:)
The 1970s... 30 years ago... CmdrTaco is less than 35 years old "I have a few good years before I'm considered 'old'"(refering to an artical where "old" is 35).
A kid under 15 years old who can lay his hands on pounds and pounds of marijuana in the 1970s has got to rate in the brilent catagory.
This troll didn't do his math
A significant number of "geeks" like CmdrTaco are Xgen (The generation that said "Don't lable me".. what dose that say of the generaton who created the lable?)
When home computers were a new toy for kids. Vic20s, Timex Sinclares, Cocos, Apples, Ataris..
FidoNet... Xmodem... 300 to 1200 baud...
Anybody rember how in War Games the modem was an acustic cup that could dial, hang up and dial again?
Anyone noticed in the 1980s on the death of the acustic cup the final stake in the heart was those phones with the sqare ends instead of round so they wouldn't fit?
They keepped making them mostly for laptops on the go when your at a hotel where the phones won't let you jack in to upload news storys... oh yeah square ends... ack...
That is something however. It's been known for a long time that the information age will be the death of IP laws. Or at least IP rights...
At one time it was a great thing. Book authors, musicians, and inventors would not be ripped off.
But the issues get more complex over time....
Slashdot continually confuses TradeMarks, Patents and Copyrights. All IP rights but people confuse how they can be used.
They are simmiler but not identical and each have specal issues.
The music industry also seems to have similer problems understanding exactly what rights they accually have.
Even Microsoft seems to have problems understanding what IP laws apply and when.
(I read a lot of Nolo press books.. can you tell?.. IANAL so go read the books if you want to understand IP law)..
Even the USPO dosn't really understand Prior Art.
To get anything patented (the protection for the little guy) you need to be wealthy (not the little guy).
Copyrights are significantly better but let's face it. They are screwed.
Trade Marks being probably the only IP not totally messed up. But then it is becouse it's being abused by companys like Matel. On the other hand Matel has as much to worry about as parents who happen to name a kid Barbie.
Anyway... this all known... corprations want to protect IP rights rather than adapt. Thies rights may not exist for much longer. Eventually the laws will have to catch up to the fact that information.. reguardless of what it may or may not wish.. is free...
> Maybe if I get a kuro5hin tattoo on my ass, people will stop accusing Slashdot of bias. Maybe.
:)
It'll never happen. Why?
Becouse Slashdot will (unavoidably) fail to mention tiny tucked away websites.
Why would Slashdot do that? Well a website on spore molds isn't in itself very intresting. A lot of web forums just arn't Slashdot matereal.
But Slashdot dose TRY to premote as many forums as posable. Check out the Slashboxes. Most of them are compeating web forums. All slapped on the main page of Slashdot for all to see.
Kuro5hin has been beating Slashdot to some stroys as of late so it's no supprise they get Slashdot mention.
Slashdot isn't (in my opinion) going to back away from anything or anyone just becouse it's a compeating website.
If Kuro5hin dreams up some amazing new technology then it will be Slashdotted. No doupt in my mind about that.
On the other hand Internet.com seems to be acting in bies against compeating websites.
Picture this announcment "Meow Pawjects will no longer announce anything connected with Slashdot, Andover, Internet.com, Microsoft or the New World Order as such premotion may confluct with personal busness intrests"... I'm thinking about posting this on MeowBBS under the "humor" section
A quick point.. copyright protection for software existed before the 1980s. It was challanged in the 1980s and found invalid and was then restored so really software copyrights were void for a very short span of time.
Also... the "boom" started in the 1970s before this whole issue came into effect. It continued into the 1980s.
With Commodore Vic20s, CoCos and Apple ][ computers. Basic as a commen programming language and no operating system to speak of.
Public domain played a larg part in the BBS world as well as the Internet. Out of the coutless commertal file transfer protocals the public domain Xmodem was the standard.
Unlike others Xmodem was made by it's author only with his own needs in mind. He did not criple his code with features he believed other people needed. Instead he stayed with what he wanted and that was it.
It is believed the fact that he didn't try to imagin what others needed that lead to Xmodems success.
It works this way....
With free software someone has a real need they create a real solution for that need and tag it on to existing software rather than reinvent the wheel.
With commertal software marketting dreams up neat features they think people will like the software develupers write a brand new application from ground up so the whole pacage will be the property of the company (and not shared property as is usually the case with free software).
As a result commertal innovation is solving problems that may have never existed with solutions that may never work.
Free software innovation is a person needs a tool that dose not exist they create that tool. The resulting tool fits the job perfictly.
>We're seeing a lot more students running multiuser systems; Linux, *BSD, whatever. These are quite often not the best maintained machines. They are relatively frequently subjected to root exploit, and are less likely to be quickly detected as such than well run systems.
I just wantted to attack this one point....
This is an issue of poor maintanence alone. Multiuser defects are not easyer to attack than single user defects.
We are talking about defects BTW.. not normal functioning of a multiuser system...
Personal systems shouldn't run logind and the like. Thies daemons don't do anything for personal workstations. But many systems include them by default. I allways disable anything I don't need but most people do not bother.
Same rules for Windows and other single user systems. No body bothers...
I hear about multiuser systems being banned for security reasons and it really bothers me.
Getting root is not significantly diffrent from getting admin other than one is on Unix and one is on Windows.
Also Linux systems are being shipped with logind disabled by default. Not on all systems but on the more secure distros.
It'd be nice if everyone shipped secure but they don't.
If you do ban unsecure systems you have to start with Windows, then Linux. In the end you get Dos, Mac and Lunix.. and nothing else.
>How many times are we going to hear and listen to this "web logs are evil" crap before someone points out that it's all total BS?
:)
Well I guess none more than has allready been heard becouse someone on Slashdot (you) just pointed it out
In the mean time while fearing logs don't leave messages on answering machines. Better yet don't make phone calls at all. The phone company keeps logs (just of who you called and for how long).
Stay away from banks.. camras everywhere tracking your movments. And government buildings... ohhh scary.....
In fact stay away from people... that brain thing logs EVERYTHING...
> I can't see any reason anyone would believe this crap.
You'd be amazed what people believe....
And HTTP band that too....
This is a profesional who has good reasoning capabilitys forgetting that many people out there are still functioning on the "computers = magic" mode and treat experts like wizards.
So while he may recomend replacing Telnet and FTP internally with secure protocals the "Folows of the all knowing and all powerful expert" will go ripping FTP and Telnet clients out of boxes screamming of "Security hazzards".
Give it a week you'll hear about FTP and Telnet click viruses (Think 'I-Lov-U'.. or better yet think 'Good times') infecting everyone. (No accual virus just rummors).
Napster aside... we are talking about a group who think banning Unix as a security risk is a good idea and then install Windows in it's place.
"We are protecting you from all those nasty Unix emplots... someone could hack into your box from remote and... oh dam.. anyone know what back oraface is?"
I say teach students security issues and let them fend for themselfs. I mean gezz. Trial by fire.... no better way to learn... Oh yeah and take your box off the network when you need to study.. just in case...
Allmost true. Much less the nature of humanity than the nature of things.
Things don't change to acomindate the greater good. A tree remains a tree and it dose far more than is nessisary. It cares not if it cuts off the sunlight to other trees it comes first.
Dirt is dirt it dose not yeald to more useful matereals. It may be made into other things by plants etc but in the end it all returns to dirt.
Human nature is not really to be lax or selfish but to be socal and coprative. We loath those who act out of pure selfiishness or put others in harms way for self.
But as lacking in human nature as it is. As much as we aspire to be great things we do not overcome the simple fact that we operate as singler as self and must defend self and function as self.
It is the nature of this singlaity that produces a lack of responsabilty. No matter how much we are a group we will never overcome our singularity and will allways function at what is best for self.
Anyone who thinks we can be otherwise with out being omnipotent is fooling themselfs. Anyone who thinks an omnipotent man kind could use nanites are being silly.