In point of fact, I do have several. One is a suite that also uses an LDAP server and a Servlet container that I'd like to replace with OID/Oracle. And some others just need to be deployed to facilities that have no Postgres admin experience, but do support Oracle.
Then there are some customers who already run Oracle or DB2, so I need to migrate the Postgres app out of development. And in general, I'd rather deploy to a database with the level of commercial support available.
These are practical, not theoretical, issues regarding the role of open source and commercial products in a project. Each has its role. With the right tools to use them together, the productivity compartments feed each other, increasing productivity. The tools I mentioned would be gateways to the commercial databases for these products, and therefore license fees for their vendors. Hence their interest in producing them. Just as the others of their type have been through the years.
How much new Greenhouse will burning all the fuel to run that plan create?
Of course the operation could be fueled with nonemissions energy sources. But with a contingency plan like that, the petrofuel industry will have even less inhibition in pumping emissions into the Greenhouse.
Any Greenhouse plan has to start by changing the system to reduce its emissivity. The best way to reduce the Greenhouse, and its unpredictable chaotic feedbacks, is to stop building it.
Everything that's true about software is only true for programs that have already been written. What is your tautology supposed to mean?
I'm targeting my development specifically to leave Postgres for a commercial database. The tools I'm describing mitigate my risk of migration to one of several servers. An automated migration tool increases the chances I'll migrate to the target of the tool, rather than manually migrate. That's why Microsoft, not Oracle, makes the "Oracle to SQLServer" migration tool. Automating the migration reduces the barrier to entry to the new platform otherwise represented by the necessity of manual migration.
This value judgement is valid on principle, as well as supported by the existing software in the industry. And now that Sun bundles Postgres with Solaris 10, while Oracle specifies Solaris 10 as its preferred platform, Oracle has even more reason to help Postgres developers migrate to Oracle. And therefore IBM and other Oracle competitors have that much more reason to offer their competing tools, so they get their share of the migrators.
What's so obvious about that? That tool will help recruit Postgres developers to produce apps for Oracle.
Migration tools are almost always written by the group benefitting from the migration to their product, because migration sees people leaving the original platform.
Clinton's obstruction of justice was lying about a blowjob, which he was not guilty of. His denial he had sex met the legal definition he was asked against. And his prosecution was the product of a lengthy investigation of real estate crimes which produced nothing except a chance to attack a popular president.
Bush's crime was lying us into war (to pick just one).
Those are the facts. You are dressing up the massive Republican political hackjob on Clinton as "obstruction of justice", and equating that with lying us into war.
So of course you won't reply. All you want to do is post something that might possibly make Bush lying us into war look good, and make Clinton lying about a blowjob look bad. You have nothing to teach anyone about how to behave.
It actually sounds like an even better deal for Oracle or IBM. They should write a tool like that, and ask the Postgres maintainers to help market their products by including it with the Postgres distro.
Or maybe someone else could write it and sell it to Oracle or IBM, or give it to Postgres.
They're welcome to my idea, which is now in the public domain.
Charge isn't relative. Charge is either positive or negative, in some number of coulombs. Which reflects the balance of electrons per atom, a real physical quantity.
The Earth's charge is zero (at least at or near the surface, where we've measured it). The Earth's capacitance and conductivity (at least in the crust) is great enough that it remains effectively zero, even when charges are applied to it. That's why electrical devices are "grounded" by connection to "earth": the Earth's charge is net zero, even when negligible charges (up to lightning bolts) are transferred to/from it.
The Moon's surface is reportedly covered with "charged dust", as mentioned in the article we're discussing. I've heard that before, and assume it's true. But I don't know whether there are complimentarily charged piles of positive dust in some areas, and negative in others. I also don't know the conductivity of the Moon. It gets hit with particles, perhaps charged, all the time, some of which might carry off charge, others which might deposit them. But the evidence of charge is there in the dust. I wonder how that happens.
Oracle illustrates my point. It's way too complete for any single app. The problem is that efficiency is sacrificed for that extra, unnecessary completeness. Either performance efficiency, complexity (leading to failures, unpredictable behavior, unmanageability, etc), resource consumption, developer overhead, or other costs a more targeted app wouldn't bring. However, the bloated version that is the only one available might still be superior to even a pruned Postgres. And of course Oracle is just like any other database, like DB2, Sybase, SQLServer or otherwise.
My goal is to deploy the best app I can. The DB server is a means to that end. And, like any software, developing with it is more productive when I can use the source code for design and debugging.
But, though it's important, I didn't say that I wanted an open source DB server in my original post - any more than I asked for a free (beer) DB. In the followup, I mentioned that open source is important, in response to the totally irrelevant free (beer) DB. All I want for free is a migration tool - its source doesn't need to be open. I want it for free, because I might not benefit from the migration, if the result doesn't test well. And all I need to be open source is the test tool, to ensure it doesn't rig results to favor one target.
So thanks for the endless offers of free (beer) DBs. But what I asked for, what's important, is price and source just for the software I asked for - which didn't include the DB, just the tools to let me determine which DB to use.
I remember that Clinton signed the treaty for membership in the International Criminal Court, though he didn't submit it for ratification to the Republican Congress. And I remember that Bush nullified Clinton's signature when he took over a couple of years later.
I don't know what you remember, but the facts show there was a big difference.
Your insistence that the US did not defeat Hussein in 1991 really says it all for your argument. Where's bin Laden?
Of course you'll deny how the CIA and the Pentagon refused Clinton's orders to bomb bin Laden on his mobile phone coordinates, each trying to pass the buck to the other. Because Bush's CIA and Pentagon continue to fight each other, damaging our ability to fight terrorists. Where's bin Laden?
The FACT is that Bush has turned our country on its head after BIN LADEN attacked us, instead invading Iraq, and leaving bin Laden free to continue terrorizing us. Where's bin Laden?
While you insist on dragging this thread away from the topic that the top State Department aide admits that the case for the Iraq War was a hoax, I'll repeat the facts about Afghanistan that you insist on denying.
1> Iraq invaded Kuwait in 1990, and we defeated Hussein in a month in early 1991 - 15 years ago.
2> Bin Laden (remember him, Dexter?) had training camps in Afghanistan which Clinton bombed after bin Laden attacked US embassies in Africa. 3> At the same time, the Republican Congress impeached Clinton for lying about a blowjob.
Which one is the "distraction"? Interfering with counterattacking bin Laden, or interfering with a blowjob kangaroo court? Don't bother answering - I know you think the blowjob is more important. But your answer to whether hoaxing us into Iraq is impeachable will actually be a useful demonstration of just how well your denial machine is operating.
You mean when Clinton bombed bin Laden's training camps, while the Republican Congress tried to stop him by impeaching him for lying about a stained blue dress?
You mean the half that still demands the Iraq hoax creating the problems we now face in the Middle East?
Afghanistan's Taliban hosted bin Laden's Qaeda, which planebombed us. I understand that wingnuts always want to ignore bin Laden, and invade Iraq. But when one of the perpetrators straight up tells you that you've been hoaxed, it's time to admit you're a chump.
Except that the commercial target platforms have closed source. Open source's best advantage is for developers. Even if only the query client source is open, leaving the DB server source closed, that's a big advantage. Postgres source is open, so it's a big help for developers.
Open source also helps decide which platform to develop on. Practically all commercial databases trade efficiencies for completeness - bloatware. Open source allows developers to trim bloat while retaining required features.
So I can develop on generic Postgres, then decide whether to deploy to a stripped Postgres, Oracle, DB2, or other. In order to do so, I need to strip Postgres (or use others' stripped versions), migrate to the other candidates, and test the resulting platform. To do that, I need the Postgres source, which I've got, a migration tool, which I'd rather not pay for if its results don't bear fruit, and a testing tool, with open source I can inspect for rigged results.
Most people don't do anything like that. And most applications are low quality. My techniques produce high quality apps. I want the process to be easier, not only for me, but for others - so everyone can produce that quality.
The Moon has "electrically charged dust". Is the net charge of the lunar surface zero, like the ground of the Earth? Is the charge positive or negative, and where did the extra electrons come from (or where did they go)?
I'm not asking for a free (beer or speech) DB2, though that's got its own merits. I'm asking for a free (beer) migration tool, and an open source testing tool to reduce my risks when considering deploying to a commercial database.
You ARE reading my post, right? Oracle is not open source, which is more important when I'm developing an app than just no price. And the free (beer) migration tool needs no price more than open source, because using it might result in my not using Oracle, depending on the results. The testing tool needs open source more than no price, because I need to see whether the tests are rigged to favor Oracle.
If you really read the posts, and really develop apps, you should already know this. If you just want to flame on Slashdot, I guess you're free to do that regardless.
I'd love to develop my apps with Postgres, then deploy to Oracle or DB2 with an automated tool. If Oracle or IBM distributed a free (beer) one, I'd include it in my project plans. And if there were an open source tool for comparing performance of my app on each of those databases in real tests, I'd be more likely to make the switch - provided the tests showed an advantage.
You could guess about which science is getting censored by the government, solely from your ideological preconceptions, and then say its "more likely" that your preconceptions are being confirmed.
Or you could actually look at how the government is censoring science that conflicts with its policies, when those policies are based solely on politics and corporate bribes^Wcontributions, as dictated by their ideological preconceptions.
You clearly have chosen the politically correct path, not the scientifically correct path.
I don't blame the Corps exclusively for botching the job - I've already mentioned that their outsource suppliers. (BTW, I'm assuming your research exposing their shoddy deliveries is accurate, and would like to know more, from a reference you've got.)
I also note the Corps' budget was slashed, work even halted, in the years leading to Katrina's 2005 hurricane season. I don't blame just Bush, though he controls the budget both through proposing it and its reception in his Republican Congress. Senator Mary Landrieu (D-LA) has a lot of blood on her hands for allowing the budget to be slashed, for failing to ensure her home state got more than pork, but rather protection.
Katrina's devastation of a trusting New Orleans is not like the "want of a nail, a kingdom was lost" story. It wasn't a single fatal flaw in a system hanging by a thread. It's much more like the story in "Who Killed Davey Moore", where so many involved did their part, mostly by doing nothing when the victim's life depended to some extent on their action. Another way to look at the Katrina flood, and who's to blame, is to realize that New Orleans died for our sins. And since I was ringside in New Orleans during several hurricanes while I lived there, I feel obligated to tell the story, which of course implicates the legions who looked on in amusement rather than pitiful horror.
Slashdot Mirror
Will this engine run on any Linux phone, over EDGE or EVDO?
In point of fact, I do have several. One is a suite that also uses an LDAP server and a Servlet container that I'd like to replace with OID/Oracle. And some others just need to be deployed to facilities that have no Postgres admin experience, but do support Oracle.
Then there are some customers who already run Oracle or DB2, so I need to migrate the Postgres app out of development. And in general, I'd rather deploy to a database with the level of commercial support available.
These are practical, not theoretical, issues regarding the role of open source and commercial products in a project. Each has its role. With the right tools to use them together, the productivity compartments feed each other, increasing productivity. The tools I mentioned would be gateways to the commercial databases for these products, and therefore license fees for their vendors. Hence their interest in producing them. Just as the others of their type have been through the years.
How much new Greenhouse will burning all the fuel to run that plan create?
Of course the operation could be fueled with nonemissions energy sources. But with a contingency plan like that, the petrofuel industry will have even less inhibition in pumping emissions into the Greenhouse.
Any Greenhouse plan has to start by changing the system to reduce its emissivity. The best way to reduce the Greenhouse, and its unpredictable chaotic feedbacks, is to stop building it.
Everything that's true about software is only true for programs that have already been written. What is your tautology supposed to mean?
I'm targeting my development specifically to leave Postgres for a commercial database. The tools I'm describing mitigate my risk of migration to one of several servers. An automated migration tool increases the chances I'll migrate to the target of the tool, rather than manually migrate. That's why Microsoft, not Oracle, makes the "Oracle to SQLServer" migration tool. Automating the migration reduces the barrier to entry to the new platform otherwise represented by the necessity of manual migration.
This value judgement is valid on principle, as well as supported by the existing software in the industry. And now that Sun bundles Postgres with Solaris 10, while Oracle specifies Solaris 10 as its preferred platform, Oracle has even more reason to help Postgres developers migrate to Oracle. And therefore IBM and other Oracle competitors have that much more reason to offer their competing tools, so they get their share of the migrators.
What's so obvious about that? That tool will help recruit Postgres developers to produce apps for Oracle.
Migration tools are almost always written by the group benefitting from the migration to their product, because migration sees people leaving the original platform.
Clinton's obstruction of justice was lying about a blowjob, which he was not guilty of. His denial he had sex met the legal definition he was asked against. And his prosecution was the product of a lengthy investigation of real estate crimes which produced nothing except a chance to attack a popular president.
Bush's crime was lying us into war (to pick just one).
Those are the facts. You are dressing up the massive Republican political hackjob on Clinton as "obstruction of justice", and equating that with lying us into war.
So of course you won't reply. All you want to do is post something that might possibly make Bush lying us into war look good, and make Clinton lying about a blowjob look bad. You have nothing to teach anyone about how to behave.
Thanks :).
It actually sounds like an even better deal for Oracle or IBM. They should write a tool like that, and ask the Postgres maintainers to help market their products by including it with the Postgres distro.
Or maybe someone else could write it and sell it to Oracle or IBM, or give it to Postgres.
They're welcome to my idea, which is now in the public domain.
Moderation 0
50% Insightful
30% Troll
20% Flamebait
So in fact half the moderators have to suppress the facts rather than face them. The new info is that they're pretty sharply divided themselves.
Maybe you're thinking of voltage?
Charge isn't relative. Charge is either positive or negative, in some number of coulombs. Which reflects the balance of electrons per atom, a real physical quantity.
The Earth's charge is zero (at least at or near the surface, where we've measured it). The Earth's capacitance and conductivity (at least in the crust) is great enough that it remains effectively zero, even when charges are applied to it. That's why electrical devices are "grounded" by connection to "earth": the Earth's charge is net zero, even when negligible charges (up to lightning bolts) are transferred to/from it.
The Moon's surface is reportedly covered with "charged dust", as mentioned in the article we're discussing. I've heard that before, and assume it's true. But I don't know whether there are complimentarily charged piles of positive dust in some areas, and negative in others. I also don't know the conductivity of the Moon. It gets hit with particles, perhaps charged, all the time, some of which might carry off charge, others which might deposit them. But the evidence of charge is there in the dust. I wonder how that happens.
Oracle illustrates my point. It's way too complete for any single app. The problem is that efficiency is sacrificed for that extra, unnecessary completeness. Either performance efficiency, complexity (leading to failures, unpredictable behavior, unmanageability, etc), resource consumption, developer overhead, or other costs a more targeted app wouldn't bring. However, the bloated version that is the only one available might still be superior to even a pruned Postgres. And of course Oracle is just like any other database, like DB2, Sybase, SQLServer or otherwise.
Funny, that's not an open source testing tool or a free (beer) migration tool from Postgres.
Maybe you're posting in the wrong subthread.
My goal is to deploy the best app I can. The DB server is a means to that end. And, like any software, developing with it is more productive when I can use the source code for design and debugging.
But, though it's important, I didn't say that I wanted an open source DB server in my original post - any more than I asked for a free (beer) DB. In the followup, I mentioned that open source is important, in response to the totally irrelevant free (beer) DB. All I want for free is a migration tool - its source doesn't need to be open. I want it for free, because I might not benefit from the migration, if the result doesn't test well. And all I need to be open source is the test tool, to ensure it doesn't rig results to favor one target.
So thanks for the endless offers of free (beer) DBs. But what I asked for, what's important, is price and source just for the software I asked for - which didn't include the DB, just the tools to let me determine which DB to use.
Why are we still in Afghanistan? Why is bin Laden still terrorizing us? Wars are for winning, not just for winning elections. Bin Laden, is that you?
I remember that Clinton signed the treaty for membership in the International Criminal Court, though he didn't submit it for ratification to the Republican Congress. And I remember that Bush nullified Clinton's signature when he took over a couple of years later.
I don't know what you remember, but the facts show there was a big difference.
Your insistence that the US did not defeat Hussein in 1991 really says it all for your argument. Where's bin Laden?
Of course you'll deny how the CIA and the Pentagon refused Clinton's orders to bomb bin Laden on his mobile phone coordinates, each trying to pass the buck to the other. Because Bush's CIA and Pentagon continue to fight each other, damaging our ability to fight terrorists. Where's bin Laden?
And of course you'll throw a completely irrelevant old Clinton hatred into your smokescreen. Where's bin Laden?
The FACT is that Bush has turned our country on its head after BIN LADEN attacked us, instead invading Iraq, and leaving bin Laden free to continue terrorizing us. Where's bin Laden?
While you insist on dragging this thread away from the topic that the top State Department aide admits that the case for the Iraq War was a hoax, I'll repeat the facts about Afghanistan that you insist on denying.
1> Iraq invaded Kuwait in 1990, and we defeated Hussein in a month in early 1991 - 15 years ago.
2> Bin Laden (remember him, Dexter?) had training camps in Afghanistan which Clinton bombed after bin Laden attacked US embassies in Africa.
3> At the same time, the Republican Congress impeached Clinton for lying about a blowjob.
Which one is the "distraction"? Interfering with counterattacking bin Laden, or interfering with a blowjob kangaroo court? Don't bother answering - I know you think the blowjob is more important. But your answer to whether hoaxing us into Iraq is impeachable will actually be a useful demonstration of just how well your denial machine is operating.
You mean when Clinton bombed bin Laden's training camps, while the Republican Congress tried to stop him by impeaching him for lying about a stained blue dress?
You mean the half that still demands the Iraq hoax creating the problems we now face in the Middle East?
Afghanistan's Taliban hosted bin Laden's Qaeda, which planebombed us. I understand that wingnuts always want to ignore bin Laden, and invade Iraq. But when one of the perpetrators straight up tells you that you've been hoaxed, it's time to admit you're a chump.
Now, how about the free (beer) migration tool I asked for, and/or the open source testing tool that is all that I asked for?
I'll also gratefully accept sacks of $50 bills, but I didn't ask for that, either.
Except that the commercial target platforms have closed source. Open source's best advantage is for developers. Even if only the query client source is open, leaving the DB server source closed, that's a big advantage. Postgres source is open, so it's a big help for developers.
Open source also helps decide which platform to develop on. Practically all commercial databases trade efficiencies for completeness - bloatware. Open source allows developers to trim bloat while retaining required features.
So I can develop on generic Postgres, then decide whether to deploy to a stripped Postgres, Oracle, DB2, or other. In order to do so, I need to strip Postgres (or use others' stripped versions), migrate to the other candidates, and test the resulting platform. To do that, I need the Postgres source, which I've got, a migration tool, which I'd rather not pay for if its results don't bear fruit, and a testing tool, with open source I can inspect for rigged results.
Most people don't do anything like that. And most applications are low quality. My techniques produce high quality apps. I want the process to be easier, not only for me, but for others - so everyone can produce that quality.
The Moon has "electrically charged dust". Is the net charge of the lunar surface zero, like the ground of the Earth? Is the charge positive or negative, and where did the extra electrons come from (or where did they go)?
I'm not asking for a free (beer or speech) DB2, though that's got its own merits. I'm asking for a free (beer) migration tool, and an open source testing tool to reduce my risks when considering deploying to a commercial database.
You ARE reading my post, right? Oracle is not open source, which is more important when I'm developing an app than just no price. And the free (beer) migration tool needs no price more than open source, because using it might result in my not using Oracle, depending on the results. The testing tool needs open source more than no price, because I need to see whether the tests are rigged to favor Oracle.
If you really read the posts, and really develop apps, you should already know this. If you just want to flame on Slashdot, I guess you're free to do that regardless.
I'd love to develop my apps with Postgres, then deploy to Oracle or DB2 with an automated tool. If Oracle or IBM distributed a free (beer) one, I'd include it in my project plans. And if there were an open source tool for comparing performance of my app on each of those databases in real tests, I'd be more likely to make the switch - provided the tests showed an advantage.
You could guess about which science is getting censored by the government, solely from your ideological preconceptions, and then say its "more likely" that your preconceptions are being confirmed.
Or you could actually look at how the government is censoring science that conflicts with its policies, when those policies are based solely on politics and corporate bribes^Wcontributions, as dictated by their ideological preconceptions.
You clearly have chosen the politically correct path, not the scientifically correct path.
I don't blame the Corps exclusively for botching the job - I've already mentioned that their outsource suppliers. (BTW, I'm assuming your research exposing their shoddy deliveries is accurate, and would like to know more, from a reference you've got.)
I also note the Corps' budget was slashed, work even halted, in the years leading to Katrina's 2005 hurricane season. I don't blame just Bush, though he controls the budget both through proposing it and its reception in his Republican Congress. Senator Mary Landrieu (D-LA) has a lot of blood on her hands for allowing the budget to be slashed, for failing to ensure her home state got more than pork, but rather protection.
Katrina's devastation of a trusting New Orleans is not like the "want of a nail, a kingdom was lost" story. It wasn't a single fatal flaw in a system hanging by a thread. It's much more like the story in "Who Killed Davey Moore", where so many involved did their part, mostly by doing nothing when the victim's life depended to some extent on their action. Another way to look at the Katrina flood, and who's to blame, is to realize that New Orleans died for our sins. And since I was ringside in New Orleans during several hurricanes while I lived there, I feel obligated to tell the story, which of course implicates the legions who looked on in amusement rather than pitiful horror.