i agree with you, but since minorities don't exist, nothing like affirmative action would ever exist there (ignoring the controversy over it now, it was once very useful)
my favorite line from that article (written well before the riots BTW) "The European Union finances programs for minorities but not in France, because of its refusal to recognize minorities."
Yes. France does not recognize minorities at all and there is nothing that prevents racial discrimination there because racial minorities do not officially exist in France. Have you been watching the coverage of the riots? non-whites are treated like shit over there and officially they do not exist. In Iraq, at least the non-arab kurds are recognized now.
even better, I've posted it here. I want to show eveyone how you claim between 300,000 and 1,000,000 is more than 20,000 and 30,000. Man i've seen dumb stuff on slashdot, but this one takes the cake. heck in 1991 60,000 kurds were killed. In one single year, it is double almost 3 years of this war. you level of ignorance is simply amazing. BTW these are not pro war sources, human rights watch as it at over 250,000.
Iraq, Saddam Hussein (1979-2003): 300 000 Human Rights Watch: "twenty-five years of Ba`th Party rule... murdered or 'disappeared' some quarter of a million Iraqis" [http://www.hrw.org/wr2k4/3.htm%5D 8/9 Dec. 2003 AP: Total murders New survey estimates 61,000 residents of Baghdad executed by Saddam. US Government estimates a total of 300,000 murders 180,000 Kurds k. in Anfal 60,000 Shiites in 1991 50,000 misc. others executed "Human rights officials" est.: 500,000 Iraqi politicians: over a million
"This war has killed more Iraqi civilians than have ever been in mass graves."
are you joking!!!?? last i checked the iraq body count (which is hardly a pro war site) had a max of 30,318 the mass graves have had over 300 000 and those are are only those discovered so far. We are talking about an order of magnitude more. I know it is cool to bash the war, but making up numbers does not help your case.
"from what I understand the new iraqi government is basically being set up to be like many other middle eastern countries, with the government existing to back up the laws of islam with political power."
out of curiosity, have you read their new constitution or just glanced at it. Sure, there are elements of islam but thats what you get when you let people decide for themselves what type of country they want. However, the other provisions on the protection of rights is hardly like anything else in the middle east except for israel.
you do know that iraq is the most secular of all the arab countries and they have had all of that for a very long time right? you can already go get shitfaced in a bar there.
you raise an interesting point. alan dershowitz has talked about a torture warrant. Basically in a high stakes situation you go before a judge and get a warrant to beat the crap out of a guy. Why? well, normally torture sucks and is totally useless because a person will say anything to stop the torture so the info you get is crap. This is the real reason why the military doesnt allow it, its pointless. However, if it is something like a password, it can be instantly verified. Assume a HD has the location of bombs and you need to password. There isn't enough time to crack the encryption, so you use whatever is left at your disposal.
actually they do. One of the things they talk about is the decadence of the west and non muslims in general. That would include bars, clubs, tank-tops, bikinis, beer, wine etc etc. all thing we are free to enjoy.
"GET OUT THE MIDDLE EAST, WEST!" sounds _very_ political to me! "STOP MESSING IN OUR AFFAIRS", sounds political to me!"
Ah, now it all makes sense. So this is why Hindus in Bali are repeatedly bombed? I'm not sure how Hindu ndoneseans are messing with anyone's affairs aside from being a non muslim in the world's biggest muslim nation. I also don't know how Bali is related or anywhere near the Mid east or any way associated with the west.
What? you mean the same unilateral american imerialist hegemony that the EU and UN want to replace with a multilateral international cosensus organization based on sensitivity to the needs of China?
"You mean the FAILED coup of 1992 and his election, SIX YEARS LATER? In what bizarro world does a failed coup give one the power to rig elections over half a decade later?"
maybe in the same world where you spend a few years in jail are pardoned, released from jail and then go on to openly re-form your old millitary coup group and then a couple of years later "win" an election. Look at when he reformed his military clique and when he won, there isn't much of a time difference don't count the time he spent in jail.
"As for the Carter Center's endorsement of the election, you cite that as if it is somehow a bad thing."
Yes, Carter is a leftwing leader and he obviously has his biases. I said that his verification of an election hardly carries any weight. Would you agree that if george bush verified a hosni mubarak landslide in Egypt that it would not be credible? same logic.
"As for your citations of n/s korea and taiwan/china - you REALLY need to learn some history. Freedom and democracy in both of those countries is only a recent phenomenon. Both of them suffered military dictatorships up until the mid-80s at least. Dictatorships that the US actively supported."
Did you even read what i wrote? they both became full democracies after the cold war ended. It was much easier to remove the military dictator in s. korea that it is to remove the communist in N. Korea. While i don't endorse military dictators, i can see where they may be "useful idiots".
Secondly, ad-hominem attacks are the mark of a person who has lost a debate. I marked you as a foe not because i dont like what you said ( could care less), but because of the way you said it. The fact that you can't argue a point without peppering your post with insults shows that you are immature and don't really have a point. Therefore, I don't need to see what you say. Don't bother replying to this. I'm not going to waste my time. Come back when you pass puberty.
"Dude, focus here - democractically elected - not sham election"
Right, and you verified the elections of these people how? let me give you an example, Hugo chavez led a military coup to take over his country and then later was "democratically eleced" according to Jimmy carter. I am going to assume you consider his government legitimate.
I can tell you one thing, if the US hadn't intervened in many of those countries, the wouldn't have free democratic govenments today. It is far easier to remove a dictator who is just a man than it is to eliminate an entrenched political party/idea like communism. Compare N. korea to S. korea or taiwan to china... etc etc.
"How many legitimate governments did the US overthrow because they didn't like them?"
care to name a few of those "legitimate" govenments and how they were liegitimate. Thats right you cant. How many were elected? oh wait, elected govenment is something the americans pushed.
I'm sure Saddam's was also a legitimate govenment to you.
another dhimmi moonbat flaps his wings. What tranlation of the koran did you read? the ones i have read tend to vary widely depending on the person translating it. And yes, some versions do call for the ritual killing of non believers which is extended to other people of the book (ie jews and christians).
depends on who you ask. keep in mind that the story of abraham is very different in islam. In fact muslims believe Ismael and not Issac was to be sacrificed which is a major difference. ( you might not have known that. )
Slashdot Mirror
'Microsoft : who do you want to execute today"
i agree with you, but since minorities don't exist, nothing like affirmative action would ever exist there (ignoring the controversy over it now, it was once very useful)
my favorite line from that article (written well before the riots BTW) "The European Union finances programs for minorities but not in France, because of its refusal to recognize minorities."
damn, i wish slashdot had an edit ability.
Yes. France does not recognize minorities at all and there is nothing that prevents racial discrimination there because racial minorities do not officially exist in France. Have you been watching the coverage of the riots? non-whites are treated like shit over there and officially they do not exist. In Iraq, at least the non-arab kurds are recognized now.
that should be "you claim between 300,000 and 1,000,000 is less than 20,000 and 30,000" basic math got in the way of writing that sentence.
even better, I've posted it here. I want to show eveyone how you claim between 300,000 and 1,000,000 is more than 20,000 and 30,000. Man i've seen dumb stuff on slashdot, but this one takes the cake. heck in 1991 60,000 kurds were killed. In one single year, it is double almost 3 years of this war. you level of ignorance is simply amazing. BTW these are not pro war sources, human rights watch as it at over 250,000.
... murdered or 'disappeared' some quarter of a million Iraqis" [http://www.hrw.org/wr2k4/3.htm%5D
Iraq, Saddam Hussein (1979-2003): 300 000
Human Rights Watch: "twenty-five years of Ba`th Party rule
8/9 Dec. 2003 AP: Total murders
New survey estimates 61,000 residents of Baghdad executed by Saddam.
US Government estimates a total of 300,000 murders
180,000 Kurds k. in Anfal
60,000 Shiites in 1991
50,000 misc. others executed
"Human rights officials" est.: 500,000
Iraqi politicians: over a million
"This war has killed more Iraqi civilians than have ever been in mass graves."
are you joking!!!?? last i checked the iraq body count (which is hardly a pro war site) had a max of 30,318 the mass graves have had over 300 000 and those are are only those discovered so far. We are talking about an order of magnitude more. I know it is cool to bash the war, but making up numbers does not help your case.
"We must "liberate" these represive heathens immediately!"
Is that support for Saddam i hear there? i am assuming you havent seen all the mass graves.
sure but secular hardly means protection of rights. Take a look at France.
i remember some movies having something called infinity film on them. Obnoxious stuff that tried to autorun in windows
I personally prefer the perfect 10 attack ;) but thats something else altogether.
"from what I understand the new iraqi government is basically being set up to be like many other middle eastern countries, with the government existing to back up the laws of islam with political power."
out of curiosity, have you read their new constitution or just glanced at it. Sure, there are elements of islam but thats what you get when you let people decide for themselves what type of country they want. However, the other provisions on the protection of rights is hardly like anything else in the middle east except for israel.
the summary fails to mention that OSX has no autorun. There is no way it can install something behind your back like windows does.
you do know that iraq is the most secular of all the arab countries and they have had all of that for a very long time right? you can already go get shitfaced in a bar there.
you raise an interesting point. alan dershowitz has talked about a torture warrant. Basically in a high stakes situation you go before a judge and get a warrant to beat the crap out of a guy. Why? well, normally torture sucks and is totally useless because a person will say anything to stop the torture so the info you get is crap. This is the real reason why the military doesnt allow it, its pointless.
However, if it is something like a password, it can be instantly verified. Assume a HD has the location of bombs and you need to password. There isn't enough time to crack the encryption, so you use whatever is left at your disposal.
actually they do. One of the things they talk about is the decadence of the west and non muslims in general. That would include bars, clubs, tank-tops, bikinis, beer, wine etc etc. all thing we are free to enjoy.
"GET OUT THE MIDDLE EAST, WEST!" sounds _very_ political to me! "STOP MESSING IN OUR AFFAIRS", sounds political to me!"
Ah, now it all makes sense. So this is why Hindus in Bali are repeatedly bombed? I'm not sure how Hindu ndoneseans are messing with anyone's affairs aside from being a non muslim in the world's biggest muslim nation. I also don't know how Bali is related or anywhere near the Mid east or any way associated with the west.
"current chairman of ICANN."
What? you mean the same unilateral american imerialist hegemony that the EU and UN want to replace with a multilateral international cosensus organization based on sensitivity to the needs of China?
sir, you've been trolled. I doubt this guy knows what he is talking about.
"You mean the FAILED coup of 1992 and his election, SIX YEARS LATER? In what bizarro world does a failed coup give one the power to rig elections over half a decade later?"
maybe in the same world where you spend a few years in jail are pardoned, released from jail and then go on to openly re-form your old millitary coup group and then a couple of years later "win" an election. Look at when he reformed his military clique and when he won, there isn't much of a time difference don't count the time he spent in jail.
"As for the Carter Center's endorsement of the election, you cite that as if it is somehow a bad thing."
Yes, Carter is a leftwing leader and he obviously has his biases. I said that his verification of an election hardly carries any weight. Would you agree that if george bush verified a hosni mubarak landslide in Egypt that it would not be credible? same logic.
"As for your citations of n/s korea and taiwan/china - you REALLY need to learn some history. Freedom and democracy in both of those countries is only a recent phenomenon. Both of them suffered military dictatorships up until the mid-80s at least. Dictatorships that the US actively supported."
Did you even read what i wrote? they both became full democracies after the cold war ended. It was much easier to remove the military dictator in s. korea that it is to remove the communist in N. Korea. While i don't endorse military dictators, i can see where they may be "useful idiots".
Secondly, ad-hominem attacks are the mark of a person who has lost a debate. I marked you as a foe not because i dont like what you said ( could care less), but because of the way you said it. The fact that you can't argue a point without peppering your post with insults shows that you are immature and don't really have a point. Therefore, I don't need to see what you say. Don't bother replying to this. I'm not going to waste my time. Come back when you pass puberty.
"Dude, focus here - democractically elected - not sham election"
Right, and you verified the elections of these people how? let me give you an example, Hugo chavez led a military coup to take over his country and then later was "democratically eleced" according to Jimmy carter. I am going to assume you consider his government legitimate.
I can tell you one thing, if the US hadn't intervened in many of those countries, the wouldn't have free democratic govenments today. It is far easier to remove a dictator who is just a man than it is to eliminate an entrenched political party/idea like communism. Compare N. korea to S. korea or taiwan to china... etc etc.
well saddam got 99% of the vote as do many dictators. My point is who are you to say a government is legitimate.
"How many legitimate governments did the US overthrow because they didn't like them?"
care to name a few of those "legitimate" govenments and how they were liegitimate. Thats right you cant. How many were elected? oh wait, elected govenment is something the americans pushed.
I'm sure Saddam's was also a legitimate govenment to you.
another dhimmi moonbat flaps his wings. What tranlation of the koran did you read? the ones i have read tend to vary widely depending on the person translating it. And yes, some versions do call for the ritual killing of non believers which is extended to other people of the book (ie jews and christians).
feel free to be a dhimmi, its not my problem.
depends on who you ask. keep in mind that the story of abraham is very different in islam. In fact muslims believe Ismael and not Issac was to be sacrificed which is a major difference. ( you might not have known that. )