Also note there is no "left" in the American government. There is only power and authority and various methods of acquiring it.
And how did you come to this conclusion, exactly? Keep your cynical platitudes to yourself. Unless you've convinced yourself that there's only the hard-right and the right, which indicates you might be having trouble coming to terms with sanity...
But until dubya decided to get his jollies by launching himself a couple o' wars
Bush invaded Iraq on the information he had at the time. That information turned out to be false (my money says someone grabbed the warheads and bolted before/during the initial invasion given the ridiculous amount of warnings they were given, but the fact is I don't know). 9/11 was a rude awakening for him and made him take a good look at the world's preeminent threats.
Let's hope those will convince you what an evil scumbag he was and how the world is better off without them. And if you're still wondering about the al-Qaeda connection, they had a base in Anbar province.
If I were him, I'd have invaded sooner, with or without WMDs. Nevertheless, I believe that Bush is a good and honorable man and I will defend him until I'm dead.
The fact is there aren't that many terrorists. If there were, there would be trains and malls and e.g. tourist hotspots exploding every other month in the US.
I'm going to call you on that one. Please tell me how you've come to this conclusion...or are you just telling yourself what you want to hear? My money says you don't really know.
And you are the best person to decide what qualifies as "security theater" versus true security? As for me, I'm glad they decided to do something. If you're so sure that you have the answers they need, I'd get on the phone with your congressman and tell him what policies they need to put in place. I believe they're doing the best they can; nobody's out to humiliate anyone.
The best way to honor their memory is to accept small inconveniences in the name of collective safety. Keeping people safe on planes does not equal civil liberties violations if all people are treated equally upon boarding. And it was nine "freaking" years ago, though I'm sure it doesn't seem that long for the families you claim to sympathize with.
I'm sorry, I missed a solution in there somewhere. All I hear is rambling negativity about how no system works. I'm glad in the knowledge that our government at least does the best it can to protect us. Not to say it couldn't be improved, but considering its track record over the last nine years, I'd say it's doing a pretty good job.
Closed-minded from your perspective maybe; in your world 'inconvenience' is the same as 'thuggery' (and probably 'racism' too, though I won't just out-and-out assume that). You're the one yelling with the mob here, not me. It takes a truly open-minded person to revisit things that he's told by conventional wisdom are closed-minded.
supposedly the US is this horrible imperialistic country which thinks nothing of killing poor innocent foreign civilians...
I'm wondering who you're getting your information from. In any case, your ideas would probably lead to our expulsion from NATO and the UN, and would effectively cause the rest of the world to treat us like North Korea.
Someone (whose identity has never been determined) smuggled the boxcutters onto the planes for them.
And presumably they had to go through airport security as well? Security measures are designed to be comprehensive; they're not to specifically counteract the exact procedures that made the attack possible. If everyone gets scanned, including your non-determined friend, then presumably we'd find something like that.
How about a former liberal who used to watch Michael Moore movies and talk at coffee shops who accepted everything he was told because it was an expedient way to vent his frustrations at the time. I grew up, I started reading and I started being more positive and appreciative of the luxuries my country affords me...and started seeing the holes in the arguments of the left. I believe it's better to act the best and most responsible way we can, rather than to do nothing in fear of upsetting people. I'm all for improvement...but I'm against abandonment. Same holds true of my feelings about Iraq and Afghanistan.
I got rid of my Facebook and GMail accounts because I disagreed with their policies and their business practices. I had over 300 Facebook friends and my world hasn't come crashing down around me. People sometimes confuse what they need with what they want.
Apology accepted. I have no desire to provoke people, except in the case it causes them to challenge their previously-accepted notions. If I can do that, I'm happy.
So they take their hats off and shave off their beards. In fact, I clearly remember hearing that the September 11 hijackers shaved before they boarded the planes...
I believe in it when life and limb are at risk, yes. And please stop with your name calling; the fact that your posts don't get marked as "flamebait" only further proves my point.
It's only 'propaganda' if you don't agree with it; otherwise it's just telling it like it is, right? Somebody has to stand up for the actions of people who had our best interests at heart when they created these laws.
I don't have time to research your assertions, but the fact is we more or less ignored Afghanistan until September 11th happened. I call bullshit on you.
See, THIS is the kind of thing I like to see...rational solutions. I have no desire to see anyone groped, but unless viable alternatives are in place it's the best we have.
An 'adult' would recognize the value of safety policies when it cost almost 3000 Americans their lives. And don't kid yourself; this IS a left-right issue, if only for question of timing. Bush put in place these policies and the left has been using them to their political advantage ever since. If Obama or Clinton were in office in 2001 they would have done the same thing and the right would have had a field day with it too. We can call each other names all day long but when it comes down to the hard reality of saving lives we rely on policymakers to make the best decisions. And they have performed admirably.
Most of my comments that are absent of political bent do get moderated fairly. And my comment about "liberal cynicism" deserved it; it was a gut reaction to someone's blatant provocation. But simply arguing that Bush-era policies truly have kept us safe should not be a criterion for flamebait or trolling. And I am opposed to the nanny state except in extreme cases where negligence lost us the lives of 2973 Americans.
I believe what truly created the environment of American resentment in Iraq and Afghanistan was our abandonment of both countries after the Iran/Iraq wars and the Afghanistan/Russia sovereignty conflict in the 80s. This created poverty and despair, which in turn lead to extremism.
Slashdot Mirror
There are fundamental differences between the left and the right in this country. Whether you chose to acknowledge it is your own business.
Also note there is no "left" in the American government. There is only power and authority and various methods of acquiring it.
And how did you come to this conclusion, exactly? Keep your cynical platitudes to yourself. Unless you've convinced yourself that there's only the hard-right and the right, which indicates you might be having trouble coming to terms with sanity...
But until dubya decided to get his jollies by launching himself a couple o' wars
Bush invaded Iraq on the information he had at the time. That information turned out to be false (my money says someone grabbed the warheads and bolted before/during the initial invasion given the ridiculous amount of warnings they were given, but the fact is I don't know). 9/11 was a rude awakening for him and made him take a good look at the world's preeminent threats.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dujail_Massacre
http://www.usembassy.it/pdf/other/iraqfocus1.pdf
http://www.c-span.org/Content/PDF/hrdossier.pdf
Let's hope those will convince you what an evil scumbag he was and how the world is better off without them. And if you're still wondering about the al-Qaeda connection, they had a base in Anbar province.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Anbar_Governorate
If I were him, I'd have invaded sooner, with or without WMDs. Nevertheless, I believe that Bush is a good and honorable man and I will defend him until I'm dead.
The fact is there aren't that many terrorists. If there were, there would be trains and malls and e.g. tourist hotspots exploding every other month in the US.
I'm going to call you on that one. Please tell me how you've come to this conclusion...or are you just telling yourself what you want to hear? My money says you don't really know.
And you are the best person to decide what qualifies as "security theater" versus true security? As for me, I'm glad they decided to do something. If you're so sure that you have the answers they need, I'd get on the phone with your congressman and tell him what policies they need to put in place. I believe they're doing the best they can; nobody's out to humiliate anyone.
The best way to honor their memory is to accept small inconveniences in the name of collective safety. Keeping people safe on planes does not equal civil liberties violations if all people are treated equally upon boarding. And it was nine "freaking" years ago, though I'm sure it doesn't seem that long for the families you claim to sympathize with.
I'm sorry, I missed a solution in there somewhere. All I hear is rambling negativity about how no system works. I'm glad in the knowledge that our government at least does the best it can to protect us. Not to say it couldn't be improved, but considering its track record over the last nine years, I'd say it's doing a pretty good job.
The true definition of "Anonymous Coward..."
Closed-minded from your perspective maybe; in your world 'inconvenience' is the same as 'thuggery' (and probably 'racism' too, though I won't just out-and-out assume that). You're the one yelling with the mob here, not me. It takes a truly open-minded person to revisit things that he's told by conventional wisdom are closed-minded.
supposedly the US is this horrible imperialistic country which thinks nothing of killing poor innocent foreign civilians...
I'm wondering who you're getting your information from. In any case, your ideas would probably lead to our expulsion from NATO and the UN, and would effectively cause the rest of the world to treat us like North Korea.
Someone (whose identity has never been determined) smuggled the boxcutters onto the planes for them.
And presumably they had to go through airport security as well? Security measures are designed to be comprehensive; they're not to specifically counteract the exact procedures that made the attack possible. If everyone gets scanned, including your non-determined friend, then presumably we'd find something like that.
I've said it before and I'll say it again...please stop with the name-calling. For someone called "countertrolling," you sure do a lot of it yourself.
How about a former liberal who used to watch Michael Moore movies and talk at coffee shops who accepted everything he was told because it was an expedient way to vent his frustrations at the time. I grew up, I started reading and I started being more positive and appreciative of the luxuries my country affords me...and started seeing the holes in the arguments of the left. I believe it's better to act the best and most responsible way we can, rather than to do nothing in fear of upsetting people. I'm all for improvement...but I'm against abandonment. Same holds true of my feelings about Iraq and Afghanistan.
I got rid of my Facebook and GMail accounts because I disagreed with their policies and their business practices. I had over 300 Facebook friends and my world hasn't come crashing down around me. People sometimes confuse what they need with what they want.
Apology accepted. I have no desire to provoke people, except in the case it causes them to challenge their previously-accepted notions. If I can do that, I'm happy.
Ha. We can't call this one "trolling" or "flamebait," so we'll call it "offtopic." There are loopholes in everything...
So they take their hats off and shave off their beards. In fact, I clearly remember hearing that the September 11 hijackers shaved before they boarded the planes...
I believe in it when life and limb are at risk, yes. And please stop with your name calling; the fact that your posts don't get marked as "flamebait" only further proves my point.
It's only 'propaganda' if you don't agree with it; otherwise it's just telling it like it is, right? Somebody has to stand up for the actions of people who had our best interests at heart when they created these laws. I don't have time to research your assertions, but the fact is we more or less ignored Afghanistan until September 11th happened. I call bullshit on you.
Yes. They have another word for that; it's also known as "racial profiling."
See, THIS is the kind of thing I like to see...rational solutions. I have no desire to see anyone groped, but unless viable alternatives are in place it's the best we have.
Then we should work on protecting subways too, though I admit this will be an uphill battle.
An 'adult' would recognize the value of safety policies when it cost almost 3000 Americans their lives. And don't kid yourself; this IS a left-right issue, if only for question of timing. Bush put in place these policies and the left has been using them to their political advantage ever since. If Obama or Clinton were in office in 2001 they would have done the same thing and the right would have had a field day with it too. We can call each other names all day long but when it comes down to the hard reality of saving lives we rely on policymakers to make the best decisions. And they have performed admirably.
Most of my comments that are absent of political bent do get moderated fairly. And my comment about "liberal cynicism" deserved it; it was a gut reaction to someone's blatant provocation. But simply arguing that Bush-era policies truly have kept us safe should not be a criterion for flamebait or trolling. And I am opposed to the nanny state except in extreme cases where negligence lost us the lives of 2973 Americans.
Vitriol isn't going to keep our country safe from attack. the only things that can are sound policy decisions free from the debasement of emotion...
I believe what truly created the environment of American resentment in Iraq and Afghanistan was our abandonment of both countries after the Iran/Iraq wars and the Afghanistan/Russia sovereignty conflict in the 80s. This created poverty and despair, which in turn lead to extremism.