I never said it was complaint, nor that it wasn't. I said it went out of its way to support non-compliant code created by other persons/software agents, and due to it's massive end-user use thus gave rise to sites that are nowhere near compliant yet at the same time render fine for most people. You're free to start defending it when I start attacking it. Deal?
And for the sake of world peace I'll drop the Mozilla might as well be Navigator issue.
My apologies, I was not aware that I was wielding large caliber weapons with the intent to rearrange my jawline.
As for IE6, I just left Windows XP land completely several days ago because of massive incompatibilities. (lets not get into XP bashing/defending please) Objectively though, what little surfing I did within it was alright, save the fact that IE6 does break the search abilities of www.pricewatch.com. (at least it appears to- happens on multiple XP systems but only in IE)
To clarify, I was infact referring to varying versions of Internet Explorer. In an attempt to give Microsoft some credit (this goes against my nature) I imagine IE's ability to render horrid code accurately stems from their wish to have IE render FrontPage pages without hitch.
Just for the record, two questions for ya. How am I shooting my mouth off? This I am truly curious to know. Also, how did you manage to fill in the blank I left with Navigator? I referred to Mozilla distinctly outside the "certain other browser" motif.
There's another face to this argument, although it has conspiracy theory written all over it. A good deal of sites are created with software, not hand coded- mostly because the people creating the site do not understand HTML any more than I understand the minute details of quantum physics. Too bad HTML editors rarely output W3C certifiable code. Anyone that has seen the code some of those pieces of software put out understands the horrors within. Certainly not compliant by any definition of the word- and hence browsers striving for that compliance end up not rendering them right. Opera and Mozilla are both doing everything in their power to try to adhere to the standards set down by the W3C, and bully for them. I can name one other browser, however, that could really care less about the standards, and doesn't hesitate to render bad code as if nothing is whack. (hint:... do you even need a hint?)
I'm beyond assessing blame- that is a buck that can be tossed indefinitely and incur a lot of energy expenditure doing so. I'm just observing that browsers that render bad code as if it was good code allow designers to continue writing bad code.
This idea may sound very American of me, but I can see it happening. Could there be a future potential for an ISP that deliberately refused to filter anything?
I mean, should ISP filters become the norm I would not hesitate to pay extra for a service provider that let me, the customer, be the judge of right and wrong. I must admit however, I surf with a filtering proxy- guess I am a hypocrite now. It doesn't filter porn, doesn't filter polticially incorrect sites (why is it that porn blockers always have a political agenda to their filtering?), doesn't filter the naughty bits. It filters out ads. I am quite thankful for it.
If you create an environment where certain things are harder to get, people will go through the extra effort to get it, and the action has failed. Two examples of this: the war on drugs and prohibition. Both involved the forced separation of things that are questionably bad (I'm gonna get flamed for that one) and both not only failed, but caused as many problems as they were supposed to solve.
Just to throw my 2 cents in on this, as in the tradition of all/. types- the first thing that popped in my head was using it to determine the window focus in X. I have a nasty habit of turning to my Linux PC, typing, and thinking whatever window I was looking at was the active one.
This may be out of order, but is there merit in exposing him to a variety of languages and letting him select which ones are worth following? I felt the need to respond based on earlier comments- for me, it was much easier to learn x86 assembly than it was C, or Perl, or Python.
Then again, maybe my education in electronics engineering might have influenced my experiences.
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I never said it was complaint, nor that it wasn't. I said it went out of its way to support non-compliant code created by other persons/software agents, and due to it's massive end-user use thus gave rise to sites that are nowhere near compliant yet at the same time render fine for most people. You're free to start defending it when I start attacking it. Deal?
And for the sake of world peace I'll drop the Mozilla might as well be Navigator issue.
-irk
My apologies, I was not aware that I was wielding large caliber weapons with the intent to rearrange my jawline.
As for IE6, I just left Windows XP land completely several days ago because of massive incompatibilities. (lets not get into XP bashing/defending please) Objectively though, what little surfing I did within it was alright, save the fact that IE6 does break the search abilities of www.pricewatch.com. (at least it appears to- happens on multiple XP systems but only in IE)
To clarify, I was infact referring to varying versions of Internet Explorer. In an attempt to give Microsoft some credit (this goes against my nature) I imagine IE's ability to render horrid code accurately stems from their wish to have IE render FrontPage pages without hitch.
Just for the record, two questions for ya. How am I shooting my mouth off? This I am truly curious to know. Also, how did you manage to fill in the blank I left with Navigator? I referred to Mozilla distinctly outside the "certain other browser" motif.
-irk
There's another face to this argument, although it has conspiracy theory written all over it. A good deal of sites are created with software, not hand coded- mostly because the people creating the site do not understand HTML any more than I understand the minute details of quantum physics. Too bad HTML editors rarely output W3C certifiable code. Anyone that has seen the code some of those pieces of software put out understands the horrors within. Certainly not compliant by any definition of the word- and hence browsers striving for that compliance end up not rendering them right. Opera and Mozilla are both doing everything in their power to try to adhere to the standards set down by the W3C, and bully for them. I can name one other browser, however, that could really care less about the standards, and doesn't hesitate to render bad code as if nothing is whack. (hint: ... do you even need a hint?)
I'm beyond assessing blame- that is a buck that can be tossed indefinitely and incur a lot of energy expenditure doing so. I'm just observing that browsers that render bad code as if it was good code allow designers to continue writing bad code.
-irk
This idea may sound very American of me, but I can see it happening. Could there be a future potential for an ISP that deliberately refused to filter anything?
I mean, should ISP filters become the norm I would not hesitate to pay extra for a service provider that let me, the customer, be the judge of right and wrong. I must admit however, I surf with a filtering proxy- guess I am a hypocrite now. It doesn't filter porn, doesn't filter polticially incorrect sites (why is it that porn blockers always have a political agenda to their filtering?), doesn't filter the naughty bits. It filters out ads. I am quite thankful for it.
If you create an environment where certain things are harder to get, people will go through the extra effort to get it, and the action has failed. Two examples of this: the war on drugs and prohibition. Both involved the forced separation of things that are questionably bad (I'm gonna get flamed for that one) and both not only failed, but caused as many problems as they were supposed to solve.
-r0bb
Just to throw my 2 cents in on this, as in the tradition of all /. types- the first thing that popped in my head was using it to determine the window focus in X. I have a nasty habit of turning to my Linux PC, typing, and thinking whatever window I was looking at was the active one.
Then again, maybe I'm lazy beyond belief.
-r0bb
This may be out of order, but is there merit in exposing him to a variety of languages and letting him select which ones are worth following? I felt the need to respond based on earlier comments- for me, it was much easier to learn x86 assembly than it was C, or Perl, or Python.
Then again, maybe my education in electronics engineering might have influenced my experiences.
-r0bb