i was reading an old Racer magazine this morning (Jan 2002); the head of the BMW/Williams team (i think) was quoted as saying "There's not enough surface area on the car to fully fund the team anymore." I got a good chuckle out of that one, sums up modern motorsports rather nicely.
heh, beat you to the punch, i have matched JWT cams and an ECU, with Apex'i N1 headers and exhaust (SO SWEET), ripped the restrictors off the airbox and put in a Filtercharger. i'd say it's ~190 by the seat of my pants, which is enough for the time being, until i get the N1 2000-spec coilovers, the Cusco replacement suspension links and bushings, and the lower tie rods and make the thing into a true handling beast. Then i'mm looking at a T06/07...mmmm....efficient horsepower...with a MoTec M4 of course:D
thanks for assuming i'm a ricerboy with a honda, asshole. (yes, i know i said 'ricer', but come on - if i call it a ricer, it bloodly likely isn't) fact is, i drive a 240SX, which is REAR-DRIVE (in fact that's why i bought it); there's several examples of the 2.4L KA24DE fitted with blowers and good intercoolers pushing 450-500hp; add a small NOS squirt (or a suicially high boost) and you're at 550 easily. Or just go for the VG30DETT swap; the 300ZX TT engines can be bumped to 700+bhp with good Garretts. Makes the car awfully nose-heavy though, unless you shoehorn it in 6 inches to the rear...
the handling of the 240 chassis is legendary; the multilink IRS keeps the rear tires flat and glued to the pavement through all sorts of bumpies, and the front, while it is MacPhersons, is rather heavily overbuilt, and stiffens up like John Holmes if you throw on a strut-tower brace, lower tie bar, and swaybars. Drop the car 2" with Eibachs and add some KYB AGX adjustable struts, spoon on some good 225/45ZR17s, and yes, the car will drive in circles around a Shelby. like i said in another post, japanese car != ricer; mine is a beautiful understated maroon, with not a single sticker in sight, and it's going to stay that way until somebody pays me with money or free product to put stickers on it.
oh, and the carbon brakes, i really really want a set of those. quite seriously, does any company make full carbon-carbon discs and pads for street use? i realize they're like $5000 a disc, but man that would be l33t...and very very good at stopping, although i don't know if i'd want to brake enough to keep them hot...
yeah, mayne R&D stuff for small-time race teams, but there's really almost nothing that is applicable for street use - i don't wanna deal with an engine with a 3:1 bore:stroke ration, pneumatic valves, and piston speeds approaching Mach 1. although the aeros would be nice; anybody know where i can pick up an F1 front wing?
i'm really interested in the ignition timing; they have to be firing at some insane number like 80 DBTDC, nitro burns so freakin slow (that's why they spew fire, unburnt fuel coming out the exhaust). oh, and the injection maps. i wanna figure out how to ram that much gas through my car (90gallons a minue!)
depends. that immense boat you've wrapped yout 883hp in probably weighs around 4000 lbs, while my little ricer is more like 2500lbs. Means i only need 550hp to have the same power-to-weight ratio, and therefore the same acceleration, and i still probably handle better. If i start ripping out unneccessaries, i can probably get down to 2300lb, and go even faster. Case in point - a 140-bhp GSX1000R will utterly annihilate your 427 from the line.
yeah, 850hp in qualifying, where they only need to last ~5 laps before putting a piston through the cylinder head. [in the turbo years, the BMW 1500cc engine ran in a qualifier at 68+ pounds of boost, turning out 1300hp - useless trivia, and a demo of what F1 will do with no limits] in race tune, i'd wager most of the engines are probbly between 650-750hp. probably less with next season, as teams will only be allowed one engine per weekend (no destroying one $1mil mill in qualifying and then slapping another in for the race).
before you rank on all cars from the land of the rising sun, keep in mind that not all of us who drive them want to put stickers all over them. I have a Nissan 240SX that i'm in the process of building up, and it hasn't got a single sticker on it. Not gonna, either, unless i can get sponsored. Bottom line is, i bought the car because it was cheap, efficient, very reliable, looks mighty nice, and handles like a dream (they hit it really well with that chassis; it's a lot more compact and nimble than the 300ZX while feeling a lot less claustrophobic inside). i want to make it into a ripping fast sports car, although on the track instead of the strip, and since i lack the money for an M5 (damn straight - if i buy a BMW it will seat 5 comfortably), i settled for the best available solution.
ps - imprezas aren't slow, i thought they sold the WRX STi Type R 2-door over there for awhile?
Just get a K&N filter (or a shiny CAI if you wanna show youir enjun to the chickies), a good set of headers and an exhause (Apexi makes really nice ones, specially if you can kluge an N1 Dual to fit) and throw in a chip - you'll be around 280-300, with very close to stock reliability; a kid i know did this to a very early US WRX, one of the first 500 in i think, and it's still running smooth as silk 70,000 miles later. Embarasses Z06s and Vipers, all for about $3000. then you have that much more to dump into the suspension; a well-done WRX with good coilovers, full tie/strut bars, and really hard bushings handles soooo well...
Nah, Kenny's still racing, I think he still has the fastest Top Fuel run (330.88, 4.477 sec) - that's just mindbendind, makes the 10.28/120 Civic look downright ricey.
that might be true, but if he is a robot he's got some pretty damn impressive AI - for all his flaws, and egomania, and general despisability, you have to admit the man is one hell of a driver. and don't say that it's politics that keeps him up front - i'm sure it plays a part, but nobody is that utterly dominant soley on command.
anyway, Montoya's a hell of a lot cooler than Villeneuve:P
While 330.88 MPH, 4.477sec, 8,000+hp fire-breathing nitromethane-burning supercharged fire-breathing Top Fuel dragsters are indeed performance art, and I'd love to see how they manage the engines on those beasts...this article was about a bunch of Civic prettyboys and their 220-300hp engines...sort of like talking about ASCI White, and then pulling out an Ars Tech God Box - nice piece of machinery, but nothing at all like what was mentioned. It doesn't even really talk about the engine management packages or technology that much (the shining example is a fscking Palm program that adjusts your nitro boost on the fly); mostly just about how these kids are making their cars run in the mid-10s, at a piddling 120mph, with the likes of Real sports cars - the closing line is "This is about getting into something I built and whipping a 350Z. That's the best feeling in the world." Admirable perhaps, but not really a hugely tech-involved story. I've been looking at MoTec ECUs for my 240SX, now there's some high-tech car stuff - the features and what it can do would make a car-savvy geek twitch and drool..basically full control over every electronic feature in the engine, with optional realtime telemetry. Notice the record-setting Civic uses MoTec, but they don't even mention it in the article; I guess Viper's ultra-l33t nitro Palm app ("Instead of using your PC, now you can sit in your car and change your whole system. The Palm Pilot has all your engine configurations. You can set it to full race mode in seconds.") is more technologically interesting than Ferrari's F1 engine management systems (and the ECU for virtually every other racewinning car out there).
yah, and while Schumacher may make ninety-two MILLION dollars (or was it $89M?) a year for driving around in a Ferarri, he still wouldn't know a good time if it danced naked for a dollar.
anyway, the 7-posters are marvels of engineering technology, and a stunning example of what neccessity can create (they didn't come into widespread use until the FIA banned unlimited track time during R&D) - it's a shame most of the tech in F1 nowadays is of so little use to roadgoing cars (i want my 3.0L, 700hp 18,500rpm NA V10 dammit!!!) that we'll never see any practical use for these sorts of things. My question is, when marlboro eventually goes broke (don't tell me you don't see it coming), who's going to fill out Ferrari's $400mil budget?
And before you comment on other film sizes, realize also that many of the largest advertising companies shooting commercial spreads abandoned film long ago and are shooting with digital medium format or large format backs. Yes, many of the fashion or product spreads you see in your favorite checkout stand magazine are in fact digital these days.
you're absolutely right, and that's all very fine and good for ad and fashion companies, who need to get their images processed and laid-out as quickly as possible; but there's still absolutely no comparsion between film and digital for large-format artistic work, where the quality of the image is key. before somebody me an example of an arthouse that's gone all-digital, i've looked at 8x10s from a Phase One H20 next to contact-print 8x10s from Fuji and Kodak film, and while it's reasonably close, the film prints still blow the digital print away. it's really visble in the tonal changes and ultrafine detail - the H20 is 4080x4080, but good fine-grained film is ~3000dpi (percieved even finer in color film, since the three stacked layers of emulsion tend to fuzz out the detail of the grain in any one of them). makes an 8x10 24,000x30,000...that's a lot of grains/pixels; call me back whn there's a digital back that large. so while digital is making huge inroads in a lot of areas of photography, i think it's safe to say that for situations where image quality is the main concern, large-format film has nothing to worry about for awhile.
why on earth would i want to kludge linux on a Mac to run OSX apps when I can just run OS X? you'll notice that the project is still only for ppc machines, and while LinuxPPC/YDL is nice, i really prefer X...it's just so much better a *nix on the Mac...
I don't know about you, but when I was a kid I got in to the most trouble when my and friends and I were bored.
amen...8 counts of criminal mischief's worth of trouble. and then the DA had the balls to say "i grew up in West Virginia and i NEVER heard of 'mailbox baseball' until i moved up here"...scumsucker.
...the first thing Hitler did was prohibit private firearms ownership in the name of 'public safety'. i'm not terribly fond of the direction the political leadership of this country is heading, but at least this particular face of the coin (the Repubs) are rabidly protective of my Right To Keep And Bear Arms - so if there actually are 'HS' soliders around, and they start to get offensively Nazi-istic, we can always start plinking at them...my.270's zeroed at 100m, it was a good whitetail season...
yeah, i know, that's what everybody says whn i suggest that. that's why i said 50-100K people. 100 people storming washington is a blurb on the evening news. 100,000 armed people storming washington is a rebellion, and the media machine can't whitewash it. still label you "terrorists", but i think it would go something like "100,000 unpatriotic terrorist americans are fighting with our great noble army in washington at this hour, blah blah blah"; hopefully something that large would be a critical mass.
incidentally, in the early 90s Marines in florida were given a series of tests, and one of the questions was "would you fire on American citizens if ordered to?" it pertained to confiscation of guns, and citizens who hypothetically refused to hand them in the event of a national ban, but at any rate, the huge majority of soldiers replied "No" - i'd be willing to bet they's stand by their morals in this case. or at least some of them would, and that would send the military into internal chaos, and then the White House is a short stroll across the Mall...
(yes, this is just a rant...i'm not thinking much today, thousand pardons)
god, every time somebody posts an article about homeland security/the war on terror/the bush administration/any topic even remotely related, everybody and their brother goes off on how evil bush is and how horrible republicans are and how the 2000 election was stolen and how we're all going to hell in a handbasket, and then bitches that they're going to leave for canada or something. Guess what:
Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.
that's from the declaration of independence. now, if nothing else, the evil power-hungry money-grubbing world-domination-seeking republicans (and if you honestly believe the democrats are a better alternative..well...heh) have at least upheld the indivdual right to keep and bear arms...which was originally put into the constitution not for something as silly as the defense of the country, but to insure that the above quote was eternally valid - very much the "a man with a gun is a citizen, a man without a gun is a subject" mentality. so instead of bitching or trying to do some sort of fuzzy warm feel-ggod sit-in protest that isn't going to do jack squat, why not just pick up your guns and march on Washington? if everybody on slashdot who calims to be fed up with the US gov't actually had the cojones to do something about it, you could probably drum up 50-100,000 supporters and make an armed march on washington. the military probably wouldn't shoot back at you; if they did it would just whip up more support for your cause [the american public may be dumb cattle, but they'll notice if we start shooting our own citizens] - and then you can put in whatever form of government you want. yes, i honestly do believe it would work, and i also believe that in order for you to get the government to behave as you want them to, you need to have a rebellion. personally, i don't see a difference between republicans and democrats; at least the republicans are pragmatic and open with their plans for world domination...i plan to just see where things go over the next few years and then decide on my course of action...no matter what freedoms they take away, ashcroft is rabid about letting me keep my guns, so i always have that option to fall back on.
it's possible to make sure somebody's breathing properly without removing their helmet - then take it off if needed. a lot of newer halmets have a flip-up facebar, that might be an option for CPR as well.
oh, you mean a hellbound heathen idolater? i'm sorry, but i've had it explained by priests and theologians, but i just don't see how PRAYING to the saints and to Mary isn't idolatry. maybe giving them props in a prayer...but asking mary to ask god for remdemption..jeez. yes, i know that was mean, i'm not trying to flame or bait, but i'm really curious to know how you get around "Thou shalt have no gods before God" with "hail mary mother full of grace"...
Slashdot Mirror
i was reading an old Racer magazine this morning (Jan 2002); the head of the BMW/Williams team (i think) was quoted as saying "There's not enough surface area on the car to fully fund the team anymore." I got a good chuckle out of that one, sums up modern motorsports rather nicely.
Damn, which ones? I'm pretty handy with the F094/H (Damon Hill's 1994 car) in GT3...
that was a typo, morning coffee hadn't kicked it...should have been $1000, maybe $1200 (600 for exhaust, 300 for headers, 300 for ECU)
heh, beat you to the punch, i have matched JWT cams and an ECU, with Apex'i N1 headers and exhaust (SO SWEET), ripped the restrictors off the airbox and put in a Filtercharger. i'd say it's ~190 by the seat of my pants, which is enough for the time being, until i get the N1 2000-spec coilovers, the Cusco replacement suspension links and bushings, and the lower tie rods and make the thing into a true handling beast. Then i'mm looking at a T06/07...mmmm....efficient horsepower...with a MoTec M4 of course :D
thanks for assuming i'm a ricerboy with a honda, asshole. (yes, i know i said 'ricer', but come on - if i call it a ricer, it bloodly likely isn't) fact is, i drive a 240SX, which is REAR-DRIVE (in fact that's why i bought it); there's several examples of the 2.4L KA24DE fitted with blowers and good intercoolers pushing 450-500hp; add a small NOS squirt (or a suicially high boost) and you're at 550 easily. Or just go for the VG30DETT swap; the 300ZX TT engines can be bumped to 700+bhp with good Garretts. Makes the car awfully nose-heavy though, unless you shoehorn it in 6 inches to the rear...
the handling of the 240 chassis is legendary; the multilink IRS keeps the rear tires flat and glued to the pavement through all sorts of bumpies, and the front, while it is MacPhersons, is rather heavily overbuilt, and stiffens up like John Holmes if you throw on a strut-tower brace, lower tie bar, and swaybars. Drop the car 2" with Eibachs and add some KYB AGX adjustable struts, spoon on some good 225/45ZR17s, and yes, the car will drive in circles around a Shelby. like i said in another post, japanese car != ricer; mine is a beautiful understated maroon, with not a single sticker in sight, and it's going to stay that way until somebody pays me with money or free product to put stickers on it.
oh, and the carbon brakes, i really really want a set of those. quite seriously, does any company make full carbon-carbon discs and pads for street use? i realize they're like $5000 a disc, but man that would be l33t...and very very good at stopping, although i don't know if i'd want to brake enough to keep them hot...
yeah, mayne R&D stuff for small-time race teams, but there's really almost nothing that is applicable for street use - i don't wanna deal with an engine with a 3:1 bore:stroke ration, pneumatic valves, and piston speeds approaching Mach 1. although the aeros would be nice; anybody know where i can pick up an F1 front wing?
i'm really interested in the ignition timing; they have to be firing at some insane number like 80 DBTDC, nitro burns so freakin slow (that's why they spew fire, unburnt fuel coming out the exhaust). oh, and the injection maps. i wanna figure out how to ram that much gas through my car (90gallons a minue!)
he's the man indeed...he was the first TF race i ever saw, i blinked and damn near missed it...
depends. that immense boat you've wrapped yout 883hp in probably weighs around 4000 lbs, while my little ricer is more like 2500lbs. Means i only need 550hp to have the same power-to-weight ratio, and therefore the same acceleration, and i still probably handle better. If i start ripping out unneccessaries, i can probably get down to 2300lb, and go even faster. Case in point - a 140-bhp GSX1000R will utterly annihilate your 427 from the line.
yeah, 850hp in qualifying, where they only need to last ~5 laps before putting a piston through the cylinder head. [in the turbo years, the BMW 1500cc engine ran in a qualifier at 68+ pounds of boost, turning out 1300hp - useless trivia, and a demo of what F1 will do with no limits] in race tune, i'd wager most of the engines are probbly between 650-750hp. probably less with next season, as teams will only be allowed one engine per weekend (no destroying one $1mil mill in qualifying and then slapping another in for the race).
before you rank on all cars from the land of the rising sun, keep in mind that not all of us who drive them want to put stickers all over them. I have a Nissan 240SX that i'm in the process of building up, and it hasn't got a single sticker on it. Not gonna, either, unless i can get sponsored.
Bottom line is, i bought the car because it was cheap, efficient, very reliable, looks mighty nice, and handles like a dream (they hit it really well with that chassis; it's a lot more compact and nimble than the 300ZX while feeling a lot less claustrophobic inside). i want to make it into a ripping fast sports car, although on the track instead of the strip, and since i lack the money for an M5 (damn straight - if i buy a BMW it will seat 5 comfortably), i settled for the best available solution.
ps - imprezas aren't slow, i thought they sold the WRX STi Type R 2-door over there for awhile?
Just get a K&N filter (or a shiny CAI if you wanna show youir enjun to the chickies), a good set of headers and an exhause (Apexi makes really nice ones, specially if you can kluge an N1 Dual to fit) and throw in a chip - you'll be around 280-300, with very close to stock reliability; a kid i know did this to a very early US WRX, one of the first 500 in i think, and it's still running smooth as silk 70,000 miles later. Embarasses Z06s and Vipers, all for about $3000. then you have that much more to dump into the suspension; a well-done WRX with good coilovers, full tie/strut bars, and really hard bushings handles soooo well...
Nah, Kenny's still racing, I think he still has the fastest Top Fuel run (330.88, 4.477 sec) - that's just mindbendind, makes the 10.28/120 Civic look downright ricey.
that might be true, but if he is a robot he's got some pretty damn impressive AI - for all his flaws, and egomania, and general despisability, you have to admit the man is one hell of a driver. and don't say that it's politics that keeps him up front - i'm sure it plays a part, but nobody is that utterly dominant soley on command.
:P
anyway, Montoya's a hell of a lot cooler than Villeneuve
While 330.88 MPH, 4.477sec, 8,000+hp fire-breathing nitromethane-burning supercharged fire-breathing Top Fuel dragsters are indeed performance art, and I'd love to see how they manage the engines on those beasts...this article was about a bunch of Civic prettyboys and their 220-300hp engines...sort of like talking about ASCI White, and then pulling out an Ars Tech God Box - nice piece of machinery, but nothing at all like what was mentioned.
It doesn't even really talk about the engine management packages or technology that much (the shining example is a fscking Palm program that adjusts your nitro boost on the fly); mostly just about how these kids are making their cars run in the mid-10s, at a piddling 120mph, with the likes of Real sports cars - the closing line is "This is about getting into something I built and whipping a 350Z. That's the best feeling in the world." Admirable perhaps, but not really a hugely tech-involved story.
I've been looking at MoTec ECUs for my 240SX, now there's some high-tech car stuff - the features and what it can do would make a car-savvy geek twitch and drool..basically full control over every electronic feature in the engine, with optional realtime telemetry. Notice the record-setting Civic uses MoTec, but they don't even mention it in the article; I guess Viper's ultra-l33t nitro Palm app ("Instead of using your PC, now you can sit in your car and change your whole system. The Palm Pilot has all your engine configurations. You can set it to full race mode in seconds.") is more technologically interesting than Ferrari's F1 engine management systems (and the ECU for virtually every other racewinning car out there).
yah, and while Schumacher may make ninety-two MILLION dollars (or was it $89M?) a year for driving around in a Ferarri, he still wouldn't know a good time if it danced naked for a dollar.
anyway, the 7-posters are marvels of engineering technology, and a stunning example of what neccessity can create (they didn't come into widespread use until the FIA banned unlimited track time during R&D) - it's a shame most of the tech in F1 nowadays is of so little use to roadgoing cars (i want my 3.0L, 700hp 18,500rpm NA V10 dammit!!!) that we'll never see any practical use for these sorts of things. My question is, when marlboro eventually goes broke (don't tell me you don't see it coming), who's going to fill out Ferrari's $400mil budget?
And before you comment on other film sizes, realize also that many of the largest advertising companies shooting commercial spreads abandoned film long ago and are shooting with digital medium format or large format backs. Yes, many of the fashion or product spreads you see in your favorite checkout stand magazine are in fact digital these days.
you're absolutely right, and that's all very fine and good for ad and fashion companies, who need to get their images processed and laid-out as quickly as possible; but there's still absolutely no comparsion between film and digital for large-format artistic work, where the quality of the image is key.
before somebody me an example of an arthouse that's gone all-digital, i've looked at 8x10s from a Phase One H20 next to contact-print 8x10s from Fuji and Kodak film, and while it's reasonably close, the film prints still blow the digital print away. it's really visble in the tonal changes and ultrafine detail - the H20 is 4080x4080, but good fine-grained film is ~3000dpi (percieved even finer in color film, since the three stacked layers of emulsion tend to fuzz out the detail of the grain in any one of them). makes an 8x10 24,000x30,000...that's a lot of grains/pixels; call me back whn there's a digital back that large. so while digital is making huge inroads in a lot of areas of photography, i think it's safe to say that for situations where image quality is the main concern, large-format film has nothing to worry about for awhile.
why on earth would i want to kludge linux on a Mac to run OSX apps when I can just run OS X? you'll notice that the project is still only for ppc machines, and while LinuxPPC/YDL is nice, i really prefer X...it's just so much better a *nix on the Mac...
I don't know about you, but when I was a kid I got in to the most trouble when my and friends and I were bored.
amen...8 counts of criminal mischief's worth of trouble. and then the DA had the balls to say "i grew up in West Virginia and i NEVER heard of 'mailbox baseball' until i moved up here"...scumsucker.
...the first thing Hitler did was prohibit private firearms ownership in the name of 'public safety'. i'm not terribly fond of the direction the political leadership of this country is heading, but at least this particular face of the coin (the Repubs) are rabidly protective of my Right To Keep And Bear Arms - so if there actually are 'HS' soliders around, and they start to get offensively Nazi-istic, we can always start plinking at them...my .270's zeroed at 100m, it was a good whitetail season...
yeah, i know, that's what everybody says whn i suggest that. that's why i said 50-100K people. 100 people storming washington is a blurb on the evening news. 100,000 armed people storming washington is a rebellion, and the media machine can't whitewash it. still label you "terrorists", but i think it would go something like "100,000 unpatriotic terrorist americans are fighting with our great noble army in washington at this hour, blah blah blah"; hopefully something that large would be a critical mass.
incidentally, in the early 90s Marines in florida were given a series of tests, and one of the questions was "would you fire on American citizens if ordered to?" it pertained to confiscation of guns, and citizens who hypothetically refused to hand them in the event of a national ban, but at any rate, the huge majority of soldiers replied "No" - i'd be willing to bet they's stand by their morals in this case. or at least some of them would, and that would send the military into internal chaos, and then the White House is a short stroll across the Mall...
(yes, this is just a rant...i'm not thinking much today, thousand pardons)
that's from the declaration of independence. now, if nothing else, the evil power-hungry money-grubbing world-domination-seeking republicans (and if you honestly believe the democrats are a better alternative..well...heh) have at least upheld the indivdual right to keep and bear arms...which was originally put into the constitution not for something as silly as the defense of the country, but to insure that the above quote was eternally valid - very much the "a man with a gun is a citizen, a man without a gun is a subject" mentality. so instead of bitching or trying to do some sort of fuzzy warm feel-ggod sit-in protest that isn't going to do jack squat, why not just pick up your guns and march on Washington? if everybody on slashdot who calims to be fed up with the US gov't actually had the cojones to do something about it, you could probably drum up 50-100,000 supporters and make an armed march on washington. the military probably wouldn't shoot back at you; if they did it would just whip up more support for your cause [the american public may be dumb cattle, but they'll notice if we start shooting our own citizens] - and then you can put in whatever form of government you want. yes, i honestly do believe it would work, and i also believe that in order for you to get the government to behave as you want them to, you need to have a rebellion. personally, i don't see a difference between republicans and democrats; at least the republicans are pragmatic and open with their plans for world domination...i plan to just see where things go over the next few years and then decide on my course of action...no matter what freedoms they take away, ashcroft is rabid about letting me keep my guns, so i always have that option to fall back on.
it's possible to make sure somebody's breathing properly without removing their helmet - then take it off if needed. a lot of newer halmets have a flip-up facebar, that might be an option for CPR as well.
born Catholic
oh, you mean a hellbound heathen idolater? i'm sorry, but i've had it explained by priests and theologians, but i just don't see how PRAYING to the saints and to Mary isn't idolatry. maybe giving them props in a prayer...but asking mary to ask god for remdemption..jeez. yes, i know that was mean, i'm not trying to flame or bait, but i'm really curious to know how you get around "Thou shalt have no gods before God" with "hail mary mother full of grace"...