You are both very right.
Enforcing a way of life upon someone is wrong. It is a violation of the integrity of the other person. It is denying everything that the other person is. There is a delicate balance there somewhere, and I am not Solomon.
Nah, the Chem prof's right.
Learn Pascal. write FORTRAN. That works.
Learn FORTRAN. Write Pascal. Doesn't really work.
The Chem prof's probably seen the results many a time.
It will be interesting to see wether fancy tools (Microsoft VisualStudio) or good software engineering practices are the better strategy. If you want cross-platform viruses then Microsoft is definitely the way to go.
This notion that it requires Windows Messenger and.Net passport is absolutely false. No such requirement exists, and none shall ever exist. Wow. We have an Anonymous Coward's assurance. Incredible.
Both C# and.NET with be at Microsoft's whim.
Java is Sun's baby, but IBM is enough involved that I do not have to trust either Sun or IBM to have reasonable assurance that Java will continue to be usable. Both IBM and Sun have too much to lose to allow silly fun&games to be played.
... then post lists of registrations that show vivendi-universal's opinion of itself.
My own opinion is that the name hit too close to home and that vivendi and vivendisucks are the same thing.
Isn't that the point of firewalls... you trust everything inside and distrust everything outside. Psst. Wanna buy a bridge?
If anyone inside has ever gotten an email or visited a web page, there is no way a firewall can make you safe. The main thing a firewall can do is prevent the crossing of insiders posing as outsiders and vice-versa.
You're being too kind.... create my own proprietary movie file format... is too much like inventing a square wheel in a world of oval wheels, and then wondering why it doesn't roll.
Bridge building is fairly mature, at least compared to the ancient Romans, but would you trust a bridge built with a 1.001 safety factor?
It is possible to design a program without actually coding it. Probably much better to design it before coding it.
I think you are an optimist. Me, I'm a cynic. I think the state-of-the-art is abysmal and will not soon improve much.
Muttering something about people who refuse to learn from history...
Yeah, we've heard of it. Have we learned everything we need to know from it? Not likely. Ignoring problems does not make them go away.
I cannot imagine any large-scale app being released by a group of "programmers" who designed as they implemented. RedHat Linux 7.2 with current patches.
getting the exact requirements for a bridge would involve actually building the bridge. Actually, getting the aproximate requirements for a bridge involves building a lot of bridges. Getting the exact requirements, including all of the minimum required safety margins, is a lot more difficult. The main difference between bridges and programs is that when bridges fall down, people actually try to find out why so that the next bridge will not be as likely to fall down. Another difference is that with bridges you don't get something like "Maybe it would look better if it crossed the river over there".
You are very right is that the earlier you find out what doesn't work the better. If the design is flawed the resulting code is flawed. It doesn't take much wrong with existing code to make it a liability instead of an asset.
My problem with the law is, that it only works against voicing the thoughts in public, whereas the hatred remains. Preaching to the choir Ok, the hatred remains. But is expressing that hatred considered "socially acceptable"? How do you stop the mob? You don't make sparks in an explosive environment.
calling for murder when you sure as hell know someone might listenand act Methinks you understand the line that should not be crossed. Something like yelling "fire" in a crowded theatre. Prejudice dies hard. Anything that condones/furthers/perpetuates it should be stomped on. Hard.
it's the law-abiding citizens who are being effectively punished. Look at who's affected:
Alan. Not much. He'll miss a bit of informed opinion from the US.
International Linux. No effect. The info is freely available.
"Foreign Hackers". No effect. The info is freely available.
"Domestic Hackers". Minimal effect. They've got to use a foreign source of info.
"Law-abiding" US sysadmins. Upgrade without knowing why or risk the unknown. These are the ones being punished.
Can't really blame Alan. It's not his responsibility to risk jail to protect Americans from their own stupid laws.
...don't think the DMCA really has anything to do with this. Shouldn't, maybe doesn't, but are you sure?
Apparently it has enough chilling effect that Alan thought that discretion was the better part of valor. The information is freely available, just not in the USA. You're right to be concerned. Our security is now at the mercy of "foreigners".
It is being disclosed, just not in the good ole USA.
This means that "foreign hackers" have free access to the information and that US sysadmins do not have access to the information.
It's a stupid law that in this case puts American security at risk. Since we did it to ourselves, there is no reason to expect a brit to emperil himself to attempt to rescue us from our own stupidity.
The constitution is not worth a damn if our freedom and liberty is taken away by external enemies. Is the constitution worth any more if our freedom and liberty is taken away by internal enemies?
Slashdot Mirror
just copy a file to install, and delete it to uninstall. ;-)
Ah, memories of DOS 2. Microsoft has sure come a long way
You are both very right.
Enforcing a way of life upon someone is wrong. It is a violation of the integrity of the other person. It is denying everything that the other person is.
There is a delicate balance there somewhere, and I am not Solomon.
Oh, I get it. C# doesn't run, with or without a "PERIOD".
Nah, the Chem prof's right.
Learn Pascal. write FORTRAN. That works.
Learn FORTRAN. Write Pascal. Doesn't really work.
The Chem prof's probably seen the results many a time.
It will be interesting to see wether fancy tools (Microsoft VisualStudio) or good software engineering practices are the better strategy.
If you want cross-platform viruses then Microsoft is definitely the way to go.
This notion that it requires Windows Messenger and .Net passport is absolutely false. No such requirement exists, and none shall ever exist.
.NET with be at Microsoft's whim.
Wow. We have an Anonymous Coward's assurance. Incredible.
Both C# and
Java is Sun's baby, but IBM is enough involved that I do not have to trust either Sun or IBM to have reasonable assurance that Java will continue to be usable. Both IBM and Sun have too much to lose to allow silly fun&games to be played.
... then post lists of registrations that show vivendi-universal's opinion of itself.
My own opinion is that the name hit too close to home and that vivendi and vivendisucks are the same thing.
Sounds like a good idea. Glad you suggested it.
Isn't that the point of firewalls ... you trust everything inside and distrust everything outside.
Psst. Wanna buy a bridge?
If anyone inside has ever gotten an email or visited a web page, there is no way a firewall can make you safe. The main thing a firewall can do is prevent the crossing of insiders posing as outsiders and vice-versa.
You either made my day or ruined it.
I'm not sure which.
You're being too kind. ... create my own proprietary movie file format ... is too much like inventing a square wheel in a world of oval wheels, and then wondering why it doesn't roll.
Bridge building is fairly mature, at least compared to the ancient Romans, but would you trust a bridge built with a 1.001 safety factor?
It is possible to design a program without actually coding it. Probably much better to design it before coding it.
I think you are an optimist. Me, I'm a cynic. I think the state-of-the-art is abysmal and will not soon improve much.
HeHe.
What's a traffic jam?
What's gridlock?
How do you avoid them before you've seen them?
Muttering something about people who refuse to learn from history ...
Yeah, we've heard of it. Have we learned everything we need to know from it? Not likely. Ignoring problems does not make them go away.
I cannot imagine any large-scale app being released by a group of "programmers" who designed as they implemented.
RedHat Linux 7.2 with current patches.
getting the exact requirements for a bridge would involve actually building the bridge.
Actually, getting the aproximate requirements for a bridge involves building a lot of bridges. Getting the exact requirements, including all of the minimum required safety margins, is a lot more difficult. The main difference between bridges and programs is that when bridges fall down, people actually try to find out why so that the next bridge will not be as likely to fall down. Another difference is that with bridges you don't get something like "Maybe it would look better if it crossed the river over there".
You are very right is that the earlier you find out what doesn't work the better. If the design is flawed the resulting code is flawed. It doesn't take much wrong with existing code to make it a liability instead of an asset.
Microsoft Windows XPeeYew.
Windows XP
The WINDOW of EXPOSURE
Where do you want to be eXPosed today?
I wish it was just a joke.
XP?
Nah, too many worms.
My problem with the law is, that it only works against voicing the thoughts in public, whereas the hatred remains.
Preaching to the choir
Ok, the hatred remains. But is expressing that hatred considered "socially acceptable"? How do you stop the mob? You don't make sparks in an explosive environment.
He wrote an abridged but accurate tabloid version, interspersed with anti-Nazi explanatory notes. ;-)
No wonder he was sued
calling for murder when you sure as hell know someone might listen and act
Methinks you understand the line that should not be crossed. Something like yelling "fire" in a crowded theatre. Prejudice dies hard. Anything that condones/furthers/perpetuates it should be stomped on. Hard.
it's the law-abiding citizens who are being effectively punished.
Look at who's affected:
Alan. Not much. He'll miss a bit of informed opinion from the US.
International Linux. No effect. The info is freely available.
"Foreign Hackers". No effect. The info is freely available.
"Domestic Hackers". Minimal effect. They've got to use a foreign source of info.
"Law-abiding" US sysadmins. Upgrade without knowing why or risk the unknown. These are the ones being punished.
Can't really blame Alan. It's not his responsibility to risk jail to protect Americans from their own stupid laws.
...don't think the DMCA really has anything to do with this.
Shouldn't, maybe doesn't, but are you sure?
Apparently it has enough chilling effect that Alan thought that discretion was the better part of valor. The information is freely available, just not in the USA. You're right to be concerned. Our security is now at the mercy of "foreigners".
It is being disclosed, just not in the good ole USA.
This means that "foreign hackers" have free access to the information and that US sysadmins do not have access to the information.
It's a stupid law that in this case puts American security at risk. Since we did it to ourselves, there is no reason to expect a brit to emperil himself to attempt to rescue us from our own stupidity.
The constitution is not worth a damn if our freedom and liberty is taken away by external enemies.
Is the constitution worth any more if our freedom and liberty is taken away by internal enemies?
It's irresponsible to expect Microsoft to get a secure product out in any number of days.