Yes, but the people saying "it's not theft!" are not saying that because they say it's unauthorized duplication.
They're saying "IT'S NOT THEFT!!!" because they believe they have some sort of moraly, holy right to enjoy the work of other people without paying those other people.
If you can't tell the difference, then you shouldn't be part of the debate, either.
> Thats the problem with the RIAA, they market
> shit which is the reason I cant find anything
> good on the Radio's or MTV.
Last time I checked, the "officially" available music on Napster, from this century anyway, was utter unlistenable crap that wouldn't know a catchy tune if it got bit on the butt by it.
Also, last time I checked, the music (and sophomoric poetry and essays) on NPR wasn't exactly something to rush down to the store over, either.
>> This "service" [by corporations] exists only to
>> the point that it facilitates the acquisition
>> of profit.
>
> It exists just as equally as it serves the
> interests of customers and workers. If it did
> not serve them, they would refuse to participate
> in the corporation
Which is to say, the profit of the workers (paychecks) and the profits of customers (goods for cash.) Which is to say, free-market capitalism, where no one can force you to buy a product or work for a particular wage at the point of a gun.
> Think about the shortage of fast food resturant
> workers...who spend time
> downloading songs instead of working at buger
> king to pay for that CD they just downloaded.
> Lets see a CD is 15$ and w/minimum wage thats
> three hours of work.
The common buffoon who can do little other than menial tasks assigned to him by others owes much more to the productive thinkers and creators than any wage could ever cover, no matter how high.
Without them, he would be nothing more than an animalistic oaf hoping the berry bush nearby didn't run out of berries.
How dare you decry the poorest of the poor having to work three whole goddamned hours to earn enough to buy music created by an artist who worked hundreds of hours, and played on devices that cost billions of dollars to make with various parts fine-tuned over the course of decades to hundreds of years by brilliant engineers, scientists, and other experts?
Oh my god! A poor man has to work three whole F****** hours to buy a CD. OH MY GOD, the injustice of it all. Oh my god!
> What I wonder is who is doing the community more
> good, Napster (who have encouraged communication
> and sharing) or the RIAA (who encourage
> closemindness and destroy that feeling of
> community.
I don't see how allowing tens of millions of people to thieve music without paying the creators and publishers of it as "benefitting the community," which is, of course, 99.99% (probably an UNDERSTATEMENT by several decimals) of what Napster was used for.
If anyone out there is really worried about the religious morality of killing yourself after having lived a few thousand years and gotten bored (which won't happen because by then there will no doubt be chemicals to remove the "bored" emotion) then all you have to do is deactivate the anti-aging miracle machinery and chemicals and return to a good old-fashioned body and let GOD KILL YOU THE NATURAL WAY after a paltry 50 or so more years.
Yes, if it's a problem, all you have to do is just let God do the murdering dirty work (the hideous thug Yaweh.)
> Assuming I were to live forever, why should I want to?
Well, I do know one thing for sure, 70 years or so (if you are lucky) is WAY to damned short.
Besides, after a few more hundred years, you'll be able to brain-wipe parts of your mind, one of which will allow you to make "every time seem like the first time."
That's the answer to boredom and a lack of things to do.
Notice from the article this piece of meaningless marketting poop way near the top in only the 3rd paragraph:
For consumers, increased data density will hasten
the transition in home entertainment from passive
analog technologies to interactive digital formats.
I wanna invest if it is needed for the Internet! Now I can store 4x the already massive numbers of DVD's I can copy to my hard drive!
Lotta good feminium does if they don't have enough to make magic bracelets for all to keep the Nazi's from shooting the residents. The driving force behind technological advancement is materials science, after all...
> You kids and your 150 MB hard drives. I remember
> having to uninstall Windows 3.1 so I would have
> space to put King's Quest 5 (which took up ~18 MB)
Bah! What's a hard drive? I remember laughing at DOS guys because my Mac had 2 floppies (and 1 MB of RAM! Hehe, 640k losers!)
See, before that, we had TRS-80's (no model number) and we typed in long games from magazine printouts, and even if we didn't make a typo, the games didn't work anyway, and we saved it on tape because that's what you did, and we liked it!
And before that, we had an Atari game (no model numbers) and we programmed the Atari Basic cartridge, which had room for 11 lines of code in its RAM. And we programmed it in our minds because we couldn't actually afford such a thing, and we liked it! You imagined yourself using the optional numeric keypad to clumsily edit lines, then you imagined yourself executing the code.
And before that, my buddy had a Bally's Whateverthehellitwas, and it had a drawing cartridge where you could tell the cartridge to repeat a drawing sequence in pixels larger than Julia Roberts' lip fat injections. One day I "programmed" it with a sequence that, when repeated, drew a guy walking up a stairs, complete with stairs. We couldn't even save it, because that's the way it was, and you liked it!
I don't want that Noisy Cricket(TM) Pixie Dust(TM) hard drive from IBM(TM). I want a hard drive using that big honkin' platter hanging on the wall behind the receptionist in the main lobby. That's gotta store WAY more info, right?
Would be good for compiles, but if you have cash to burn, you might as well get 2gig of ram and just use giant ram disks. For that matter, I know there is hardware out there that plugs in as if it were a HD but is actually a huge box or RAM.
IANAL but I recall a TV show about juries some years ago that suggested perhaps they should be allowed to do one of their functions -- their own investigations. I gathered that juries actually had this power historically (it IS called a Grand Jury Investigation, after all) but that judges just prevented it. I didn't know if they actually had the power to prevent that, or if they could just de facto prevent it they way they prevent jury nullification -- by taking advantage of ignorance of the jury and not allowing lawyers to bring it up.
> I still dont get how the jugde could deny the
> defendant to present the context of his messages.
I agree -- it's like arresting someone who said "I'm gonna kill you!" and denying them the context that they were acting in the play "Twelve Angry Men."
It sure as hell does guarantee this. You are perfectly free to hate any race or religion you care to, and to blather your asinine mouth off about it.
The only problem is when it becomes "fightin' words". But at that point it is still protected, it's just that the person punching you out has an excuse.
> It's probably better to take [the 50 cents on
> the dollar] that's being offered and go
> elsewhere, as if they lose all their clients
> then all the future money is gone.
MRS. THOMPSON: Are you going to go to Potter's?
TOM: Better to get half than nothing.
A few other people start for the door. CAMERA PANS WITH George as he vaults over the counter quickly, speaking to the people.
GEORGE: Tom! Tom! Randall! Now wait . . . now listen . . . now listen to me. I beg of you not to do this thing. If Potter gets hold of this Web Site there'll never be another decent BBS built in this town. He's already got charge of the bank. He's got the bus line. He's got the department stores. And now he's after us. Why? Well, it's very simple. Because we're cutting in on his business, that's why. And because he wants to keep you living in his slums and paying the kind of rent he decides.
The people are still trying to get out, but some of them have stood still, listening to him. George has begun to make an impression on them.
GEORGE (cont'd): Joe, you worked on one of his web sites, didn't you? Well, have you forgotten? Have you forgotten what he charged you for that broken-down URL? Here, Ed. You know, you remember last year when things weren't going so well, and you couldn't make your payments. You didn't lose your web site, did you? Do you think Potter would have let you keep it? Can't you understand what's happening here? Don't you see what's happening? Potter isn't selling. Potter's buying! And why? Because we're panicky and he's not. That's why. He's picking up some bargains. Now, we can get through this thing all right. We've got to stick together, though. We've got to have faith in each other.
MRS. THOMPSON: But my husband hasn't worked in over a day, and I need money.
IANAL but it seems like as soon as it starts getting debated in committee or on the floor, or stuffed into a proposed bill (or regulation) it should immediately become public domain.
> You Americans - a 13 year old kid who hacks into
> a school PC should never have been even given
> the *glimmer* that jail was an option in this
> situation!!
You forget that we demonize anything deemed wrong. There is no gray here, no middle of the road. You're either on my side or against me, and I should consider you morally and ethically identical to a mass murderer, sorry, a mass murderer who mass murderers because of hate.
So, hacking, murder, taking an unapproved recreational drug, and torturing children to death while you sodomize them are all equivalent in the eyes of the outraged politicians.
> Hatch could care less about Napster, or any of
> the ideals or philosophy of copyright.
>
> He is only concerned with hurting funding
> sources for his competition.
It's called Playing The Game for $$$. You don't think Clinton had Barbara Streisand over to the White House because he valued her razor mind and keen political analyses, do you?
Official sites aren't like giant news sites or giant message board sites -- they don't update every single day with several programmers sitting around waiting to jump on the latest news.
Slashdot Mirror
> It's not theft. It's unauthorized duplication.
Yes, but the people saying "it's not theft!" are not saying that because they say it's unauthorized duplication.
They're saying "IT'S NOT THEFT!!!" because they believe they have some sort of moraly, holy right to enjoy the work of other people without paying those other people.
If you can't tell the difference, then you shouldn't be part of the debate, either.
> Thats the problem with the RIAA, they market
> shit which is the reason I cant find anything
> good on the Radio's or MTV.
Last time I checked, the "officially" available music on Napster, from this century anyway, was utter unlistenable crap that wouldn't know a catchy tune if it got bit on the butt by it.
Also, last time I checked, the music (and sophomoric poetry and essays) on NPR wasn't exactly something to rush down to the store over, either.
>> This "service" [by corporations] exists only to
>> the point that it facilitates the acquisition
>> of profit.
>
> It exists just as equally as it serves the
> interests of customers and workers. If it did
> not serve them, they would refuse to participate
> in the corporation
Which is to say, the profit of the workers (paychecks) and the profits of customers (goods for cash.) Which is to say, free-market capitalism, where no one can force you to buy a product or work for a particular wage at the point of a gun.
> actually its copyright infringement. not theft.
So you don't go to jail or have to pay for what you infringed?
> Think about the shortage of fast food resturant
> workers...who spend time
> downloading songs instead of working at buger
> king to pay for that CD they just downloaded.
> Lets see a CD is 15$ and w/minimum wage thats
> three hours of work.
The common buffoon who can do little other than menial tasks assigned to him by others owes much more to the productive thinkers and creators than any wage could ever cover, no matter how high.
Without them, he would be nothing more than an animalistic oaf hoping the berry bush nearby didn't run out of berries.
How dare you decry the poorest of the poor having to work three whole goddamned hours to earn enough to buy music created by an artist who worked hundreds of hours, and played on devices that cost billions of dollars to make with various parts fine-tuned over the course of decades to hundreds of years by brilliant engineers, scientists, and other experts?
Oh my god! A poor man has to work three whole F****** hours to buy a CD. OH MY GOD, the injustice of it all. Oh my god!
> What I wonder is who is doing the community more
> good, Napster (who have encouraged communication
> and sharing) or the RIAA (who encourage
> closemindness and destroy that feeling of
> community.
I don't see how allowing tens of millions of people to thieve music without paying the creators and publishers of it as "benefitting the community," which is, of course, 99.99% (probably an UNDERSTATEMENT by several decimals) of what Napster was used for.
If anyone out there is really worried about the religious morality of killing yourself after having lived a few thousand years and gotten bored (which won't happen because by then there will no doubt be chemicals to remove the "bored" emotion) then all you have to do is deactivate the anti-aging miracle machinery and chemicals and return to a good old-fashioned body and let GOD KILL YOU THE NATURAL WAY after a paltry 50 or so more years.
Yes, if it's a problem, all you have to do is just let God do the murdering dirty work (the hideous thug Yaweh.)
> Assuming I were to live forever, why should I want to?
Well, I do know one thing for sure, 70 years or so (if you are lucky) is WAY to damned short.
Besides, after a few more hundred years, you'll be able to brain-wipe parts of your mind, one of which will allow you to make "every time seem like the first time."
That's the answer to boredom and a lack of things to do.
Notice from the article this piece of meaningless marketting poop way near the top in only the 3rd paragraph:
For consumers, increased data density will hasten
the transition in home entertainment from passive
analog technologies to interactive digital formats.
I wanna invest if it is needed for the Internet! Now I can store 4x the already massive numbers of DVD's I can copy to my hard drive!
Lotta good feminium does if they don't have enough to make magic bracelets for all to keep the Nazi's from shooting the residents. The driving force behind technological advancement is materials science, after all...
> You kids and your 150 MB hard drives. I remember
> having to uninstall Windows 3.1 so I would have
> space to put King's Quest 5 (which took up ~18 MB)
Bah! What's a hard drive? I remember laughing at DOS guys because my Mac had 2 floppies (and 1 MB of RAM! Hehe, 640k losers!)
See, before that, we had TRS-80's (no model number) and we typed in long games from magazine printouts, and even if we didn't make a typo, the games didn't work anyway, and we saved it on tape because that's what you did, and we liked it!
And before that, we had an Atari game (no model numbers) and we programmed the Atari Basic cartridge, which had room for 11 lines of code in its RAM. And we programmed it in our minds because we couldn't actually afford such a thing, and we liked it! You imagined yourself using the optional numeric keypad to clumsily edit lines, then you imagined yourself executing the code.
And before that, my buddy had a Bally's Whateverthehellitwas, and it had a drawing cartridge where you could tell the cartridge to repeat a drawing sequence in pixels larger than Julia Roberts' lip fat injections. One day I "programmed" it with a sequence that, when repeated, drew a guy walking up a stairs, complete with stairs. We couldn't even save it, because that's the way it was, and you liked it!
> You have misspelled MIB
I don't want that Noisy Cricket(TM) Pixie Dust(TM) hard drive from IBM(TM). I want a hard drive using that big honkin' platter hanging on the wall behind the receptionist in the main lobby. That's gotta store WAY more info, right?
Would be good for compiles, but if you have cash to burn, you might as well get 2gig of ram and just use giant ram disks. For that matter, I know there is hardware out there that plugs in as if it were a HD but is actually a huge box or RAM.
...unless it has a nuclear warhead on it.
There are only 3 non-scifi weapons of mass destruction:
1. Nuclear
2. Biological
3. Chemical
The famed "NBC" style of warfare.
How could he be prosecuted for that?
IANAL but I recall a TV show about juries some years ago that suggested perhaps they should be allowed to do one of their functions -- their own investigations. I gathered that juries actually had this power historically (it IS called a Grand Jury Investigation, after all) but that judges just prevented it. I didn't know if they actually had the power to prevent that, or if they could just de facto prevent it they way they prevent jury nullification -- by taking advantage of ignorance of the jury and not allowing lawyers to bring it up.
> I still dont get how the jugde could deny the
> defendant to present the context of his messages.
I agree -- it's like arresting someone who said "I'm gonna kill you!" and denying them the context that they were acting in the play "Twelve Angry Men."
It sure as hell does guarantee this. You are perfectly free to hate any race or religion you care to, and to blather your asinine mouth off about it.
The only problem is when it becomes "fightin' words". But at that point it is still protected, it's just that the person punching you out has an excuse.
What's a budgie? That's the second time I've heard this new word in as many days. "A beef budgie?" It sounds like a sandwich.
> It's probably better to take [the 50 cents on
> the dollar] that's being offered and go
> elsewhere, as if they lose all their clients
> then all the future money is gone.
MRS. THOMPSON: Are you going to go to Potter's?
TOM: Better to get half than nothing.
A few other people start for the door. CAMERA PANS WITH George as he vaults over the counter quickly, speaking to the people.
GEORGE: Tom! Tom! Randall! Now wait . . . now listen . . . now listen to me. I beg of you not to do this thing. If Potter gets hold of this Web Site there'll never be another decent BBS built in this town. He's already got charge of the bank. He's got the bus line. He's got the department stores. And now he's after us. Why? Well, it's very simple. Because we're cutting in on his business, that's why. And because he wants to keep you living in his slums and paying the kind of rent he decides.
The people are still trying to get out, but some of them have stood still, listening to him. George has begun to make an impression on them.
GEORGE (cont'd): Joe, you worked on one of his web sites, didn't you? Well, have you forgotten? Have you forgotten what he charged you for that broken-down URL? Here, Ed. You know, you remember last year when things weren't going so well, and you couldn't make your payments. You didn't lose your web site, did you? Do you think Potter would have let you keep it? Can't you understand what's happening here? Don't you see what's happening? Potter isn't selling. Potter's buying! And why? Because we're panicky and he's not. That's why. He's picking up some bargains. Now, we can get through this thing all right. We've got to stick together, though. We've got to have faith in each other.
MRS. THOMPSON: But my husband hasn't worked in over a day, and I need money.
IANAL but it seems like as soon as it starts getting debated in committee or on the floor, or stuffed into a proposed bill (or regulation) it should immediately become public domain.
> You Americans - a 13 year old kid who hacks into
> a school PC should never have been even given
> the *glimmer* that jail was an option in this
> situation!!
You forget that we demonize anything deemed wrong. There is no gray here, no middle of the road. You're either on my side or against me, and I should consider you morally and ethically identical to a mass murderer, sorry, a mass murderer who mass murderers because of hate.
So, hacking, murder, taking an unapproved recreational drug, and torturing children to death while you sodomize them are all equivalent in the eyes of the outraged politicians.
The other factor was being born.
> Hatch could care less about Napster, or any of
> the ideals or philosophy of copyright.
>
> He is only concerned with hurting funding
> sources for his competition.
It's called Playing The Game for $$$. You don't think Clinton had Barbara Streisand over to the White House because he valued her razor mind and keen political analyses, do you?
And like any good politician, he immediately began decrying a "widening gap" between "haves and have-nots", with, wait for it...
...wait...
TA DA! Government to the rescue with free computers for the poor.
Like all politicians, he buys votes with other peoples' money on conjured "emergencies." The Health Care "emergency" was already taken, see?
And why is it "Health Care"? I guess politicians decrying a "Medical Emergency" sounded too idiotic, so conjur up a new name...
Official sites aren't like giant news sites or giant message board sites -- they don't update every single day with several programmers sitting around waiting to jump on the latest news.