I agree, even for non-newbies who don't feel like compiling, it'd be nice if they included (or linked to an external site which did) some binary versions in the major distribution formats (deb, rpm, cpio...anything else?) when available. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
The original poster's point was that Linuxberg and the other sites like Freshmeat should share a single database of package information and meta-data and such. Just from looking at it, I like Linuxberg (I like Freshmeat too, but that's better for cutting-edge stuff, IMO), but I agree that if these sites shared data, everything would sync up easier, and it would be easier for package maintainers. For instance, I could submit a program to Freshmeat and TUCOWS could automatically receive the program too (in the form of a link and metadata, for example). -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Hey I think this new site and Freshmeat work great together. For instance, the next time some flames shut down Freshmeat you can always head over to Tucows;-) -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Uhm. Give me one major Linux vendor promoting and pre-announcing 2.2 as much as RH is promoting Gnome.
RedHat, for one. They have already announced that they will be using 2.2 for RedHat 6.0. That's all they announced for GNOME. They gave their rationale for not using KDE. Some of that was misquoted, some of it may just be wrong on RedHat's side, but they were giving their point of view. Debian has done the same thing WRT the licensing conflicts (which will still exist even when the QPL actually does apply to KDE).
Also, last time I looked RedHat was not lying about Linux competitors like it lies about Gnome competitors, although I may be wrong about that.
What lies do they say, keeping in mind that Infoworld misquoted them in the article. There is a license conflict between the old QT license (which, BTW, I believe still applies until KDE uses QT 2.0, but I certainly may be wrong about that), there will still be a conflict between the GPL license and the new QPL license.
Really I haven't seen alot of articles about RedHat and GNOME. I've seen articles about GNOME itself. Usually these are very vague, and don't even really talk about what it is. Often, uninformed journalists think it is a replacement for X or a window manager (just like what happened to E in the last article about Rasterman). Most often, it's just mentioned as an aside, as a project seeking to increase usability on Linux. If those journalists missed KDE in their research, then take it up with them. If you think that RedHat has control of the media then you are vastly overstating their position. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
No. The only person who's having their rights "infringed" upon is Intel, AMD, and Cyrix, and there obviously is no crime for making an x86 compatible CPU.
1. If their rights are infringed, why isn't it a crime? 2. Aren't AMD and Cyrix criminals for making Intel-compatible chips (apparently Intel, from time to time, thinks so). 3. Aren't every 80's non-IBM PC manufacturer criminals for using a bus that was reverse engineered from the IBM PC (and thus led to the "PC revolution")? -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well if Sony tried to claim that you are licensing the games on the CDs they'll lose right away. I've never seen a console game that has a license agreement on it. No license agreement = no license.
"I wasn't copying it, I was just examining the grooves on this cool new coaster I paid $40 for."
-- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well if you learned something by reading someone else's work (proprietary or not), then you really don't have basic concepts and ideas, you just have information. Just as I couldn't publish a work of Shakespeare and call it my own and try to make money off of it, I shouldn't be able to find out what some company is doing in their products and then use that information against their wills. To do otherwise would remove commercial incentive to do anything. You may like that, but as for me, I enjoy work; it tends to keep me fed.
-- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Damnit I could have sworn I responded to this...must have hit preview and forgot to hit submit.
Anyways, here's the short version:
I didn't mean to be aggressive towards you, I was merely pointing out that both GNOME and E are in development and it's not fair to complain about bugs/lack of functionality in development code. If you don't want to help the testing of these projects, then I hold nothing against you; but don't complain about how bad they are until they are released and can prove it for themselves;-)
As for "lurker", I don't remember calling you that (I wouldn't know anyways if you don't post alot). Hey I like to lurk around things too. Get comfortable here, and don't take anything seriously, we're all just a bunch of folks with nothing better to do on the weekend but flame each other. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
I actually like that better than "Gimp Toolkit". I mean Gimp Toolkit was nice when it was used just for Gimp, but now it's used for just more than the Gimp.
-- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Ha, grep the 'idiots' in your posts and then come back again.
Again, if you think "idiot" is a flame you need to stick around and read/. (or better yet, usenet) some more. If you think that's the best I could do at flaming, then you underestimate me;-P
Will you tell me that you do what *you* want, and not what XEROX wants, at work?
I work on a project started by Xerox, funded completely by Xerox, and designed to work only with a Xerox product, and it wasn't started and maintained by a group outside of Xerox. And AFAIK, Xerox doesn't distribute open source software, nor have they modelled their business around it in any way. I don't see the correlation...I guess that's just me.
Yeah, just as the DOJ fails to provide overwhelming evidence that MS has abused it's market power...
Actually they have alot of evidence. Whether you feel its overwhelming or not is your opinion. You're so nasty, how could you ever think I would use words like s*ck (terror!). This does sound soo much like one of these 4letter words, and I'd never use that in the american public.
Um....okay. I didn't say you said those things (except you did say the first..or did you...how would I know?) Thanks for taking my quote out of context. I doubt anybody but you and me are reading this thread so I'm not sure what you gained by it except maybe self delusion. I can only refer you to the post in question and hope you understand it without my further assistance.
But "Redhat... bad" is plain English, and it is backed with arguments.
Well that remains to be seen. I haven't heard any good ones from you yet.
Maybe it'll take some time, but RedHat definitely has monopolistic tendencies.
Every company has monopolistic tendencies.
They're playing rough against other Linux distributors and projects, which is something new in the community (where we kill each other without professional help).
If you could show me some proof of this. Some testamonials maybe. Maybe a little more than a misquote in an Infoworld. In the meantime, I think *I* reserve judgement. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
It's called a reference, you may check a dictionary for that one.
Then enlighten me, which article were you referring to that said that RedHat wasn't cool and they are just making good PR and that the Infoworld "FUD article" was part of RedHat's plans?
And I'm sorry but making a statement "it is good PR to be prasied by Infoworld" is a conclusion, it doesn't refer to anything directly, therefore it's not a reference. It may be true, but it is a conclusion nonetheless. Also, "...and drop a misleading note..." is a conclusion. You have concluded that RedHat dropped a misleading note about license problems (was it misleading? are you suggesting Qt hasn't had, and don't have now, issues with their license?) and i18n support.
Then you confuse your stance by admitting that it was Infoworld's fault, but you still think RedHat dropped the misleading note? Which is it? Was it RedHat's fault for the misinformation or Infoworld's? -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
No it's just that alot of people act like idiots alot, not excluding myself (or yourself), and I call them on it. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Maybe you oughta wait until they actually release them (E is not even version 0.15 yet) before you review them. Instead of giving Slashdot testomonials to your failures at using them, why don't you submit some bug reports and hope they fix the problem. After all, that's what developers releases are for you know.
BTW, I don't even use E because it's not up to snuff yet and I don't feel like testing it. I use fvwm2 with GNOME (which I do feel like testing).
-- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
tried to compile glibc under Slackware. even followed all the README and INSTALL notes. result? core dumps in ever glibc-linked program
installed RedHat, didn't have to try to install glibc (BTW, RedHat certainly isn't the only glibc distro). As for kernel compiling, I don't know what you were doing wrong, but I'm using RedHat 5.1 with kernel 2.2.0pre4-ac1 and it's just fine. Did it occur to you that the source of your problems was, in fact, not RedHat?
As for GNOME, I got news for you, even if you are using RedHat you're on your own. Any documentation you find there is either (a) out of date or (b) incomplete. It's because they are still in development.
Do you think the GNOME team would deliberately sabatoge their own project by making it depend on RedHat, no matter what RedHat pays (a relative few) of the developers?
As for rpm, do you know what RPM stands for? Let me tell you: "Red Hat Package Manager". Hmmmm. Nonetheless, when I was running Slackware I installed rpm and it worked fine, except that it didn't think I had any of the core packages that most rpms depend on (but there is an easy workaround for that by specifying which packages you do have in the config file).
And debian must want control because the deb packager is for Debian. And slackware must be the saints because they don't use any package manager and it's all guess-work (not to slam slackware because I liked it when I used it, only it's not glibc and that's a deficiency, IMO).
Did you ever think that these things say things like "its best to use X" because that's what they've been designed and tested for. RPM was not designed as a universal package manager (although in many regards it has become a de-facto one, due to other distros like SuSE using it), it was designed for RedHat systems (hence the name). That fact that it has grown out of its original intent is a testament to its benefits (although I won't start a flamewar by saying it's the best packager, because I don't know that it is).
-- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Huh? I'm paid by Xerox, so you try again. (Although I admit I wouldn't mind working for RedHat.) Anyways, if you think RedHat would waste their time and money responding to flamewars on Slashdot, then you got a lot of schooling ahead of you.
It doesn't matter who started the project, it's important who has the most influence. And that's probably RedHat. Whether they abuse their influence is a different question.
Have you any proof that RedHat itself, and not just people who work on GNOME and work at RedHat, have the most influence on GNOME?
OK, you're just flaming everyone who isn't flaming KDE:)
What are you talking about? I don't flame anybody. Sure I call people names sometimes, but that's because I geniunly feel that that is the way they are representing themselves (not that they are always like that, just that they came across that way). I always back my stances up with some explanation. If you thought my post was a flame, you better read Slashdot a little more often.
I don't think anyone should be flaming GNOME or KDE. If they have valid criticisms, I don't mind, but if I feel their allegations are wholly without merit (e.g. "RedHat has become bad for Linux" or "GNOME sucks" or "KDE sucks") and they cannot back them up with reasonable arguments, then I think I have the moral duty to point out their fallacies. I also don't attack them personally unless provoked.
OK, you're just flaming everyone who isn't flaming KDE:)
I didn't say you were flaming Gnome, only that others are. You were (kinda) flaming RedHat. Although you did cite your reasons for not liking them, you failed to cite any overwhelming evidence of your allegations.
BTW, Debian have chosen GNOME too.
And I believe they are planning on shipping GNOME. They may ship KDE too in the future, and that's fine, it doesn't affect me anyways because I don't use Debian. I was just pointing out that RedHat isn't the only folks using GNOME. From what I can tell, SuSE not only ships GNOME (and KDE), they actually integrate it better than RedHat.
Once KDE uses Qt 2.0 and/or the GPL issues are resolved, this isn't relevant any more.
Well that was one of the motivations for GNOME wasn't it? And it *still* hasn't been resolved. As you imply, until it is resolved, it is relevant (not to me, since I don't care about Qt's licensing [other than I can't develop a commercial app using Qt without paying Troll Tech money], but apparently to Debian). -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Exactly how are they? Are they members of some diabolical conspiracy to make Infoworld clueless? Your rant makes no sense. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well at this point I was more speaking to the community at large who wants to simply flame RedHat. If you took my arguments personally I apologize.
I have no problem with someone criticizing RedHat or any other company for things they include or don't include in their distribution, as long as those criticisms are valid. You said that RedHat was doing the Linux community a great disservice by not including KDE. These are strong words, and I made the point that if they are so far in the wrong, then don't use them and don't advocate their use. Posting your complaints to Slashdot isn't going to get you anywhere. If you honestly want to help RedHat, send them your suggestions and indicate why you don't use them and why your friends were dissapointed with their copies, etc.
The fact is that if RedHat makes a bad choice about something, they are doing a disservice to themselves. In Windowsland, people may get used to the Microsoft or nothing aproach, but if they want to succeed in Linuxland, they have to learn that there is no single entry point. As Perl programmers say, "there's more than one way to do it."
When I started with Linux, I installed Slackware (because RedHat 4.2 wouldn't read the CD right). I purchased a large (Que) book on using Linux because, although I had some experience with Solaris, I didn't know how to administrate a system or any of that. The book came with Slackware, RedHat and Caldera, and I liked that because it gave me somewhat of a choice of which one to install. For those people who ran to CompUSA to spend $40-$50 on RedHat without doing even a little investigation, well they get what they get. It's called buyer beware. If it turns them off of Linux altogether, then perhaps they are not ready for Linux yet.
I think RedHat is doing us all a great service by supporting GNOME. Whereever your allegience lies, in the end both KDE and GNOME move Linux forward. The people working on GNOME are doing so for their own reasons. Some of them used to work on KDE some didn't. If you prefer one over the other, use it. I prefer GNOME, so I'm happy that GNOME is an alternative to KDE. Others feel differently.
In the end, RedHat makes the final decision about what's in their distribution. If you're not happy with that, or don't feel like taking the time to give them some constructive criticism, then just don't worry about it and advocate a different distribution. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Don't forget about Visual Basic. Love it or hate it, lots of people use it (not on Linux, but nonetheless..) -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well if RedHat or SuSE or Caldera, et al. can make a business out of distributing and developing open source software, then *what's the problem*?
As to the Infoworld article, it was misquoted. Blame that on Infoworld instead of jumping to conclusions. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
That's funny, I didn't know RedHat owned Infoworld. Oh...wait you must be right because your reasoning is in bold. I am so sorry what was I thinking? -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Slashdot Mirror
I agree, even for non-newbies who don't feel like compiling, it'd be nice if they included (or linked to an external site which did) some binary versions in the major distribution formats (deb, rpm, cpio...anything else?) when available.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
The original poster's point was that Linuxberg and the other sites like Freshmeat should share a single database of package information and meta-data and such. Just from looking at it, I like Linuxberg (I like Freshmeat too, but that's better for cutting-edge stuff, IMO), but I agree that if these sites shared data, everything would sync up easier, and it would be easier for package maintainers. For instance, I could submit a program to Freshmeat and TUCOWS could automatically receive the program too (in the form of a link and metadata, for example).
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Hey I think this new site and Freshmeat work great together. For instance, the next time some flames shut down Freshmeat you can always head over to Tucows ;-)
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
RedHat, for one. They have already announced that they will be using 2.2 for RedHat 6.0. That's all they announced for GNOME. They gave their rationale for not using KDE. Some of that was misquoted, some of it may just be wrong on RedHat's side, but they were giving their point of view. Debian has done the same thing WRT the licensing conflicts (which will still exist even when the QPL actually does apply to KDE).
Also, last time I looked RedHat was not lying about Linux competitors like it lies about Gnome competitors, although I may be wrong about that.
What lies do they say, keeping in mind that Infoworld misquoted them in the article. There is a license conflict between the old QT license (which, BTW, I believe still applies until KDE uses QT 2.0, but I certainly may be wrong about that), there will still be a conflict between the GPL license and the new QPL license.
Really I haven't seen alot of articles about RedHat and GNOME. I've seen articles about GNOME itself. Usually these are very vague, and don't even really talk about what it is. Often, uninformed journalists think it is a replacement for X or a window manager (just like what happened to E in the last article about Rasterman). Most often, it's just mentioned as an aside, as a project seeking to increase usability on Linux. If those journalists missed KDE in their research, then take it up with them. If you think that RedHat has control of the media then you are vastly overstating their position.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
You are AC....the other poster was AC....
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
1. If their rights are infringed, why isn't it a crime?
2. Aren't AMD and Cyrix criminals for making Intel-compatible chips (apparently Intel, from time to time, thinks so).
3. Aren't every 80's non-IBM PC manufacturer criminals for using a bus that was reverse engineered from the IBM PC (and thus led to the "PC revolution")?
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well if Sony tried to claim that you are licensing the games on the CDs they'll lose right away. I've never seen a console game that has a license agreement on it. No license agreement = no license.
"I wasn't copying it, I was just examining the grooves on this cool new coaster I paid $40 for."
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well if you learned something by reading someone else's work (proprietary or not), then you really don't have basic concepts and ideas, you just have information. Just as I couldn't publish a work of Shakespeare and call it my own and try to make money off of it, I shouldn't be able to find out what some company is doing in their products and then use that information against their wills. To do otherwise would remove commercial incentive to do anything. You may like that, but as for me, I enjoy work; it tends to keep me fed.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Damnit I could have sworn I responded to this...must have hit preview and forgot to hit submit.
;-)
Anyways, here's the short version:
I didn't mean to be aggressive towards you, I was merely pointing out that both GNOME and E are in development and it's not fair to complain about bugs/lack of functionality in development code. If you don't want to help the testing of these projects, then I hold nothing against you; but don't complain about how bad they are until they are released and can prove it for themselves
As for "lurker", I don't remember calling you that (I wouldn't know anyways if you don't post alot). Hey I like to lurk around things too. Get comfortable here, and don't take anything seriously, we're all just a bunch of folks with nothing better to do on the weekend but flame each other.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
I thought that was the Illuminati?
if it made sense it wouldn't be a rant, now would it? sheesh.
No I think rants can make sense, just like a screaming toddler can make sense- not very much sense- but sense nonetheless.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
I actually like that better than "Gimp Toolkit". I mean Gimp Toolkit was nice when it was used just for Gimp, but now it's used for just more than the Gimp.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Again, if you think "idiot" is a flame you need to stick around and read
Will you tell me that you do what *you* want, and not what XEROX wants, at work?
I work on a project started by Xerox, funded completely by Xerox, and designed to work only with a Xerox product, and it wasn't started and maintained by a group outside of Xerox. And AFAIK, Xerox doesn't distribute open source software, nor have they modelled their business around it in any way. I don't see the correlation...I guess that's just me.
Yeah, just as the DOJ fails to provide overwhelming evidence that MS has abused it's market power...
Actually they have alot of evidence. Whether you feel its overwhelming or not is your opinion.
You're so nasty, how could you ever think I would use words like s*ck (terror!). This does sound soo much like one of these 4letter words, and I'd never use that in the american public.
Um....okay. I didn't say you said those things (except you did say the first..or did you...how would I know?) Thanks for taking my quote out of context. I doubt anybody but you and me are reading this thread so I'm not sure what you gained by it except maybe self delusion. I can only refer you to the post in question and hope you understand it without my further assistance.
But "Redhat
Well that remains to be seen. I haven't heard any good ones from you yet.
Maybe it'll take some time, but RedHat definitely has monopolistic tendencies.
Every company has monopolistic tendencies.
They're playing rough against other Linux distributors and projects, which is something new in the community (where we kill each other without
professional help).
If you could show me some proof of this. Some testamonials maybe. Maybe a little more than a misquote in an Infoworld. In the meantime, I think *I* reserve judgement.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Then enlighten me, which article were you referring to that said that RedHat wasn't cool and they are just making good PR and that the Infoworld "FUD article" was part of RedHat's plans?
And I'm sorry but making a statement "it is good PR to be prasied by Infoworld" is a conclusion, it doesn't refer to anything directly, therefore it's not a reference. It may be true, but it is a conclusion nonetheless. Also, "...and drop a misleading note..." is a conclusion. You have concluded that RedHat dropped a misleading note about license problems (was it misleading? are you suggesting Qt hasn't had, and don't have now, issues with their license?) and i18n support.
Then you confuse your stance by admitting that it was Infoworld's fault, but you still think RedHat dropped the misleading note? Which is it? Was it RedHat's fault for the misinformation or Infoworld's?
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
No it's just that alot of people act like idiots alot, not excluding myself (or yourself), and I call them on it.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Maybe you oughta wait until they actually release them (E is not even version 0.15 yet) before you review them. Instead of giving Slashdot testomonials to your failures at using them, why don't you submit some bug reports and hope they fix the problem. After all, that's what developers releases are for you know.
BTW, I don't even use E because it's not up to snuff yet and I don't feel like testing it. I use fvwm2 with GNOME (which I do feel like testing).
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Either that's a conclusion or you really are an idiot.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
another person's point of view....
tried to compile glibc under Slackware. even followed all the README and INSTALL notes. result? core dumps in ever glibc-linked program
installed RedHat, didn't have to try to install glibc (BTW, RedHat certainly isn't the only glibc distro). As for kernel compiling, I don't know what you were doing wrong, but I'm using RedHat 5.1 with kernel 2.2.0pre4-ac1 and it's just fine. Did it occur to you that the source of your problems was, in fact, not RedHat?
As for GNOME, I got news for you, even if you are using RedHat you're on your own. Any documentation you find there is either (a) out of date or (b) incomplete. It's because they are still in development.
Do you think the GNOME team would deliberately sabatoge their own project by making it depend on RedHat, no matter what RedHat pays (a relative few) of the developers?
As for rpm, do you know what RPM stands for? Let me tell you: "Red Hat Package Manager". Hmmmm. Nonetheless, when I was running Slackware I installed rpm and it worked fine, except that it didn't think I had any of the core packages that most rpms depend on (but there is an easy workaround for that by specifying which packages you do have in the config file).
And debian must want control because the deb packager is for Debian. And slackware must be the saints because they don't use any package manager and it's all guess-work (not to slam slackware because I liked it when I used it, only it's not glibc and that's a deficiency, IMO).
Did you ever think that these things say things like "its best to use X" because that's what they've been designed and tested for. RPM was not designed as a universal package manager (although in many regards it has become a de-facto one, due to other distros like SuSE using it), it was designed for RedHat systems (hence the name). That fact that it has grown out of its original intent is a testament to its benefits (although I won't start a flamewar by saying it's the best packager, because I don't know that it is).
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Huh? I'm paid by Xerox, so you try again. (Although I admit I wouldn't mind working for RedHat.) Anyways, if you think RedHat would waste their time and money responding to flamewars on Slashdot, then you got a lot of schooling ahead of you.
It doesn't matter who started the project, it's important who has the most influence. And that's probably RedHat. Whether they abuse their influence is a different question.Have you any proof that RedHat itself, and not just people who work on GNOME and work at RedHat, have the most influence on GNOME?
OK, you're just flaming everyone who isn't flaming KDEWhat are you talking about? I don't flame anybody. Sure I call people names sometimes, but that's because I geniunly feel that that is the way they are representing themselves (not that they are always like that, just that they came across that way). I always back my stances up with some explanation. If you thought my post was a flame, you better read Slashdot a little more often.
I don't think anyone should be flaming GNOME or KDE. If they have valid criticisms, I don't mind, but if I feel their allegations are wholly without merit (e.g. "RedHat has become bad for Linux" or "GNOME sucks" or "KDE sucks") and they cannot back them up with reasonable arguments, then I think I have the moral duty to point out their fallacies. I also don't attack them personally unless provoked.
OK, you're just flaming everyone who isn't flaming KDEI didn't say you were flaming Gnome, only that others are. You were (kinda) flaming RedHat. Although you did cite your reasons for not liking them, you failed to cite any overwhelming evidence of your allegations.
BTW, Debian have chosen GNOME too.And I believe they are planning on shipping GNOME. They may ship KDE too in the future, and that's fine, it doesn't affect me anyways because I don't use Debian. I was just pointing out that RedHat isn't the only folks using GNOME. From what I can tell, SuSE not only ships GNOME (and KDE), they actually integrate it better than RedHat.
Once KDE uses Qt 2.0 and/or the GPL issues are resolved, this isn't relevant any more.Well that was one of the motivations for GNOME wasn't it? And it *still* hasn't been resolved. As you imply, until it is resolved, it is relevant (not to me, since I don't care about Qt's licensing [other than I can't develop a commercial app using Qt without paying Troll Tech money], but apparently to Debian).
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Exactly how are they? Are they members of some diabolical conspiracy to make Infoworld clueless? Your rant makes no sense.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well at this point I was more speaking to the community at large who wants to simply flame RedHat. If you took my arguments personally I apologize.
I have no problem with someone criticizing RedHat or any other company for things they include or don't include in their distribution, as long as those criticisms are valid. You said that RedHat was doing the Linux community a great disservice by not including KDE. These are strong words, and I made the point that if they are so far in the wrong, then don't use them and don't advocate their use. Posting your complaints to Slashdot isn't going to get you anywhere. If you honestly want to help RedHat, send them your suggestions and indicate why you don't use them and why your friends were dissapointed with their copies, etc.
The fact is that if RedHat makes a bad choice about something, they are doing a disservice to themselves. In Windowsland, people may get used to the Microsoft or nothing aproach, but if they want to succeed in Linuxland, they have to learn that there is no single entry point. As Perl programmers say, "there's more than one way to do it."
When I started with Linux, I installed Slackware (because RedHat 4.2 wouldn't read the CD right). I purchased a large (Que) book on using Linux because, although I had some experience with Solaris, I didn't know how to administrate a system or any of that. The book came with Slackware, RedHat and Caldera, and I liked that because it gave me somewhat of a choice of which one to install. For those people who ran to CompUSA to spend $40-$50 on RedHat without doing even a little investigation, well they get what they get. It's called buyer beware. If it turns them off of Linux altogether, then perhaps they are not ready for Linux yet.
I think RedHat is doing us all a great service by supporting GNOME. Whereever your allegience lies, in the end both KDE and GNOME move Linux forward. The people working on GNOME are doing so for their own reasons. Some of them used to work on KDE some didn't. If you prefer one over the other, use it. I prefer GNOME, so I'm happy that GNOME is an alternative to KDE. Others feel differently.
In the end, RedHat makes the final decision about what's in their distribution. If you're not happy with that, or don't feel like taking the time to give them some constructive criticism, then just don't worry about it and advocate a different distribution.
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Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Don't forget about Visual Basic. Love it or hate it, lots of people use it (not on Linux, but nonetheless..)
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Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
You'd be a wise fool.
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Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
What does the Center for Disease Control have to do with this? ;-)
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Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well if RedHat or SuSE or Caldera, et al. can make a business out of distributing and developing open source software, then *what's the problem*?
As to the Infoworld article, it was misquoted. Blame that on Infoworld instead of jumping to conclusions.
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Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
That's funny, I didn't know RedHat owned Infoworld. Oh...wait you must be right because your reasoning is in bold. I am so sorry what was I thinking?
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Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.