Isn't your mommy calling you? Don't you have better things to do than waste our times with your rants? Everyone has an ego, especially you it seems. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Debug doesn't make any difference. The debugging info is not loaded into memory if you aren't debugging.
Incorrect sir. Debug info is embedded into the program itself. The OS does not strip this info when you aren't debugging. If it did, it'd take forever to load the program.
Therefore, at the minimum, debugging stuff makes the program more bloated in memory. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Ever try a comparison? Note that the poster didn't say that GTK had more language bindings than Qt, he merely stated that C++ is harder to bind other languages to than C, which is absolutely, positively true. C++'s mangled names and virtual function lookups are not covered by standards, meaning that C++ libraries on the *same* platform, compiled with different compilers probably won't work. How can you write Perl bindings for a library when you can't predict the name-mangled symbol names?
This is all coming from a C++ programmer. I don't like using C, but I recognize C++'s deficiencies. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
If they decide to do somethingthe RedHat way (e.g. to follow some other RedHat 'standard'), it will be difficult to rewrite the whole stuff in another manner.
I'm not sure what you mean. You just said SuSE even had better GNOME integration than RedHat. Why is RedHat suddenly the target of everyone's disdain; that everyone assumes RedHat is out to control Linux. They have never made a proprietary change to Linux...they can't because it's all under GPL. Do you think Miguel (who, by the way, IS the head of GNOME) would allow GNOME to be un-workable in other distributions?
This is all just a backlash against commercial involvement into Linux (not necessarily on your part, but a general sentiment abounds). But interoperability between the commercial world and the Linux world is necessary if Linux is to grow anywhere beyond where it is now. That doesn't mean Linux becomes commercial, it means the business models of companies will change. RedHat and other companys, such as SuSE, are wonderful examples of this. They just don't package up and redistribute Linux, they make meaningful contributions to it, and they are open source nonetheless. RedHat felt that GNOME was important enough to the growth of Linux that they should take a direct role in supporting it. Does Caldera actually hire KDE developers? You know, us programmers have to eat too. I think getting paid for producing open source software is just about the best job one can get. Some people apparently want us to get paid by companies to produce proprietary programs, then expect us to come home at night and spend all *our* time making programs for *them*, so that they can feel happier using software that a company never was affiliated with. Those folks need to wake up. The rest of us need to ignore them in the meantime and stop believing *their* FUD. Open source will change the commercial world, as long as the clueless folks don't destroy open source first. Again, I'm not directing this to you, but to the many folks who took this article as an opurtunity to gather attention in their meaningless lives by flaming RedHat/GNOME/KDE/GTK+/Qt/LinuxWorld/whatever. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well put. It's a shame that the idiots who replied before me (and I say idiots not to flame, but because they don't seem to be able to read more than a paragraph before they jump to conclusions...shows a lack of intelligence to me) just didn't seem to get what you were saying.
Here's a message to them: IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT....DON'T USE IT!! -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Seems like you need a history lesson. GNOME was not started by RedHat, RedHat simply hire some GNOME developers to help support the project.
It seems to me if anyone is dividing the Linux community (btw I never knew it was united), it's the idiots who flame everything they don't like for Linux. I don't use KDE, I prefer GNOME, but I don't go around flaming KDE.
BTW, Debian have chosen GNOME too. Oh, they must be trying to dominate the standards. So clueless...no wonder you have to post anonymously. Doesn't Linus control Linux? Doesn't Bruce Perens and the LSB control Linux standards? Nope. As long as a project is *open source* no one can control it. Or were you too busy hopping on whatever the latest bandwagon happens to be.
Get a life. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
CDE is more popular than KDE. Yet you can't even *download* that, you have to spend $$ for it (and it sucks nonetheless).
If you don't like RedHat, vote with your dollars, not with your hot air. Go get SuSe or OpenLinux etc. etc. When you own RedHat, then you can make decisions for them. In the meantime, if you don't like what they provide or don't provide, don't use them and stop whining about it. This ain't windows, you have plenty of choices of distribution, you can even roll your own. Tell your friends not to use it. Who cares! -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
I've tried other wms like Enlightenment. E's not ready for my likes yet, perhaps when it reaches version 1. I haven't tried WM or icewm. I like fvwm2 for just about everything I need. If it were made GNOME-compliant (hell KDE-compliant too but I don't use that so I don't care about it) that would be great. I took a look at the fvwm2gnome site and it doesn't seem to me they're actually making the window manager GNOME-compliant, just providing configs that work well with GNOME.
If fvwm2 were GNOME-compliant (and if it could scale icons to become mini-icons;-), there would be no question for me. BTW, I agree, RedHat's fvwm95 config for fvwm2 bites. I change it right away to my tried and true config. RedHat needs to realize that you don't have to make the wm look (even vaguely) like winXX to make it easy for people to transition (note that the default E theme now looks kinda like winXX). They'd probably have more luck making it look like mwm (which I also don't like, but which many Unix users are at least familiar with). -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Right now there is no selection of window managers in Gnome. You are supposed to launch your window manager before the GNOME session manager. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Is Baboon OpenDoc compatible or interoperable? As I understand it, OpenDoc is the architecture OMG is developing for the CORBA 3.0 spec. There's probably gonna be alot more developers who become familiar with OpenDoc if only because it will be available for just about all the systems. It'd be nice if Linux was one of these, and if GNOME was the one to do it (maybe it could be implemented using the Baboon API underneath). -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Except that DVD is a more popular competitor to DIVX and has a higher name recognition. When folks walk into Blockbusters to rent their VHS tapes, what do they see against the entrance wall? Not DIVX (not in any of the Blockbusters I've been in), but DVD.
Even if CC could sell DivX to everyone going into their store looking for a DVD-like player, DVD would still be more popular because all the other stores are still selling DVD, and DVD can be used in computers.
I think DivX is being sold to two market segments: the uninformed (and that will change as DVD becomes the standard) and those who are hedging their bets by getting the dual-use players (I haven't compared quality, so I can't judge, but if quality is an issue, then the more informed will stop going this way). -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Except that SCSI is still faster (by far) than Firewire. If anything, it seems that Firewire will attack IDE, and Fibre Channel will attack SCSI. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Can't help you with the GNOME pager, but in fvwm2, I can swallow the FvwmPager into the panel. You won't get the window list but I use fvwm2's root menus for an alphabetically sorted window list anyways. The only other thing missing is that when you set your gtk theme, it won't affect the pager. Other than that, I find the FvwmPager more robust than the GNOME pager is right now anyways. Perhaps you can have similar luck with whatever WM has for a pager. Just make sure you have the pager running before the panel tries to swallow it.
One caveat: if the pager dies, so does the swallowed app; I wish the "swallower" could be configured to stay around and wait for another pager to swallow, because if I restart fvwm2, I have to re-add the swallowed pager to the panel. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Everything you mentioned except draging windows onto the virtual desktop is possible in fvwm2 (if I'm right in guessing you're talking about the pager). Fvwm2Pager can also show mini icons instead of the title names in the pager, which is nice because often the title is too long to read. You can use balloons (tooltips) which display the title when the mouse goes over the little windows. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
AFAIK, there are no alpha chips which will fit into the k7 slot, and none have been announced. PII will fit in the slot, they just won't work. Also, there is no indication that the k7 mobos will have alpha-compatible buses. I don't think AMD and Compaq/Digital have any strategic alliance (other than AMD licensing the ev6 bus) so I doubt we'll see swappable k7/alpha boards (unless a board manufacture provides both a k7 slot and an alpha socket, and a compatible BIOS;-) -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
My first warning sign was the URL:..../~fullermd/freebsd/.... ^^^^^^^
I think most of those "testimonials" were posted to a FreeBSD newsgroup. Now they may or may not be true (in whole or in part), but overall (I didn't read them all), you can't expect it to be unbiased.
BTW, where's your cookie damnit? -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Don't you use modules? or is that why you have to make bzImage? Nonetheless, most of us do use modules, and that automagically installs into the/lib/modules directory tree so there is some splaying. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Why I'd like to use RPM's for prereleases
on
Linux 2.2.0pre5
·
· Score: 1
Well you're right: I like SRPMs too, but you know what an SRPM is? It's a tar.gz file (maybe a few), together with patches and a spec file.
When you install an SRPM, all it does is copy the tar.gz file(s) and patches to/usr/src/redhat/SOURCES and the spec file to/usr/src/redhat/SPECS (talk about splaying all over your filesystem...and why are the RPMS binaries a part of the/usr/src tree?). You have to then use the spec file to build the RPM, then install the RPM.
The problem is that if you're looking for someone to provide an SRPM for a kernel, then simply build an RPM from their spec file, you *still* have no control over the kernel configuration, which is pretty important when testing the kernel (which is, after all, what the prereleases are for).
If you're building your own RPM/SRPM, you haven't saved any time (especially considering that you often have to build the stuff successfully more than once if you are making your own spec file; once by hand [using the tar.gz] and again from the spec-- for instance to find out what files it provides).
I don't think the original poster cared (or knew) about building his own RPM, he was more concerned with just getting a binary package and installing it, letting others compile for him.
If you want to build your own RPM/SRPM, then just grab a spec file from an earlier kernel SRPM and hack...er, edit it to work with the new kernel. The steps are the same, more or less, only the configuration file (which you would presumably include preconfigured) will be different. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
How he'd fit the droids in (supposed to be in all 9 movies) is beyond me. And it would kinda break the continuity of the episodes to have 6 which are more or less continuous and 3 which are not. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well there's a trilogy of books that take place immediately after Jedi; I haven't read them but I'll bet the good guys (no longer the rebels) win in the end of that too. -- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
I would think that under antitrust law (although I am no lawyer), the only relevant issues are: (1) is Microsoft a monopoly (not were they; not will they be) and (2) did Microsoft engage (and are they engaging) in acts deemed illegal under antitrust law? The fact that Linux is an alternative operating system does not weigh in on this at all, because Microsoft, to date, still has a monopoly on the personal computer operating system market, because they have (an estimated) 90+% market share in that area.
And besides, is Microsoft going to argue that the only means to undermine their monopoly is to produce a product pro bono? With lawyers like that, who needs the DOJ?
-- Aaron Gaudio "The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Slashdot Mirror
Isn't your mommy calling you? Don't you have better things to do than waste our times with your rants? Everyone has an ego, especially you it seems.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Incorrect sir. Debug info is embedded into the program itself. The OS does not strip this info when you aren't debugging. If it did, it'd take forever to load the program.
Therefore, at the minimum, debugging stuff makes the program more bloated in memory.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Ever try a comparison? Note that the poster didn't say that GTK had more language bindings than Qt, he merely stated that C++ is harder to bind other languages to than C, which is absolutely, positively true. C++'s mangled names and virtual function lookups are not covered by standards, meaning that C++ libraries on the *same* platform, compiled with different compilers probably won't work. How can you write Perl bindings for a library when you can't predict the name-mangled symbol names?
This is all coming from a C++ programmer. I don't like using C, but I recognize C++'s deficiencies.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
to do somethingthe RedHat way (e.g. to follow some other RedHat 'standard'), it will be difficult to rewrite the whole stuff in another manner.
I'm not sure what you mean. You just said SuSE even had better GNOME integration than RedHat. Why is RedHat suddenly the target of everyone's disdain; that everyone assumes RedHat is out to control Linux. They have never made a proprietary change to Linux...they can't because it's all under GPL. Do you think Miguel (who, by the way, IS the head of GNOME) would allow GNOME to be un-workable in other distributions?
This is all just a backlash against commercial involvement into Linux (not necessarily on your part, but a general sentiment abounds). But interoperability between the commercial world and the Linux world is necessary if Linux is to grow anywhere beyond where it is now. That doesn't mean Linux becomes commercial, it means the business models of companies will change. RedHat and other companys, such as SuSE, are wonderful examples of this. They just don't package up and redistribute Linux, they make meaningful contributions to it, and they are open source nonetheless. RedHat felt that GNOME was important enough to the growth of Linux that they should take a direct role in supporting it. Does Caldera actually hire KDE developers? You know, us programmers have to eat too. I think getting paid for producing open source software is just about the best job one can get. Some people apparently want us to get paid by companies to produce proprietary programs, then expect us to come home at night and spend all *our* time making programs for *them*, so that they can feel happier using software that a company never was affiliated with. Those folks need to wake up. The rest of us need to ignore them in the meantime and stop believing *their* FUD. Open source will change the commercial world, as long as the clueless folks don't destroy open source first. Again, I'm not directing this to you, but to the many folks who took this article as an opurtunity to gather attention in their meaningless lives by flaming RedHat/GNOME/KDE/GTK+/Qt/LinuxWorld/whatever.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well put. It's a shame that the idiots who replied before me (and I say idiots not to flame, but because they don't seem to be able to read more than a paragraph before they jump to conclusions...shows a lack of intelligence to me) just didn't seem to get what you were saying.
Here's a message to them: IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT....DON'T USE IT!!
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Seems like you need a history lesson. GNOME was not started by RedHat, RedHat simply hire some GNOME developers to help support the project.
It seems to me if anyone is dividing the Linux community (btw I never knew it was united), it's the idiots who flame everything they don't like for Linux. I don't use KDE, I prefer GNOME, but I don't go around flaming KDE.
BTW, Debian have chosen GNOME too. Oh, they must be trying to dominate the standards. So clueless...no wonder you have to post anonymously.
Doesn't Linus control Linux? Doesn't Bruce Perens and the LSB control Linux standards? Nope. As long as a project is *open source* no one can control it. Or were you too busy hopping on whatever the latest bandwagon happens to be.
Get a life.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
CDE is more popular than KDE. Yet you can't even *download* that, you have to spend $$ for it (and it sucks nonetheless).
If you don't like RedHat, vote with your dollars, not with your hot air. Go get SuSe or OpenLinux etc. etc. When you own RedHat, then you can make decisions for them. In the meantime, if you don't like what they provide or don't provide, don't use them and stop whining about it. This ain't windows, you have plenty of choices of distribution, you can even roll your own. Tell your friends not to use it. Who cares!
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
I had to download a workable version of GNOME. DAMN THOSE REDHAT ROGUES!
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
ftp://rawhide.redhat.com:
/i386/RedHat/RPMS:
kdeadmin-1.1-2pre.i386.rpm
kdebase-1.1-2pre.i386.rpm
kdegames-1.1-2pre.i386.rpm
kdegraphics-1.1-2pre.i386.rpm
kdelibs-1.1-2pre.i386.rpm
kdemultimedia-1.1-2pre.i386.rpm
kdenetwork-1.1-2pre.i386.rpm
kdenonbeta-1.1-1pre.i386.rpm
kdesupport-1.1-2pre.i386.rpm
kdeutils-1.1-2pre.i386.rpm
so there
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
I've tried other wms like Enlightenment. E's not ready for my likes yet, perhaps when it reaches version 1. I haven't tried WM or icewm. I like fvwm2 for just about everything I need. If it were made GNOME-compliant (hell KDE-compliant too but I don't use that so I don't care about it) that would be great. I took a look at the fvwm2gnome site and it doesn't seem to me they're actually making the window manager GNOME-compliant, just providing configs that work well with GNOME.
;-), there would be no question for me. BTW, I agree, RedHat's fvwm95 config for fvwm2 bites. I change it right away to my tried and true config. RedHat needs to realize that you don't have to make the wm look (even vaguely) like winXX to make it easy for people to transition (note that the default E theme now looks kinda like winXX). They'd probably have more luck making it look like mwm (which I also don't like, but which many Unix users are at least familiar with).
If fvwm2 were GNOME-compliant (and if it could scale icons to become mini-icons
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Right now there is no selection of window managers in Gnome. You are supposed to launch your window manager before the GNOME session manager.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Is Baboon OpenDoc compatible or interoperable? As I understand it, OpenDoc is the architecture OMG is developing for the CORBA 3.0 spec. There's probably gonna be alot more developers who become familiar with OpenDoc if only because it will be available for just about all the systems. It'd be nice if Linux was one of these, and if GNOME was the one to do it (maybe it could be implemented using the Baboon API underneath).
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Except that DVD is a more popular competitor to DIVX and has a higher name recognition. When folks walk into Blockbusters to rent their VHS tapes, what do they see against the entrance wall? Not DIVX (not in any of the Blockbusters I've been in), but DVD.
Even if CC could sell DivX to everyone going into their store looking for a DVD-like player, DVD would still be more popular because all the other stores are still selling DVD, and DVD can be used in computers.
I think DivX is being sold to two market segments: the uninformed (and that will change as DVD becomes the standard) and those who are hedging their bets by getting the dual-use players (I haven't compared quality, so I can't judge, but if quality is an issue, then the more informed will stop going this way).
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Except that SCSI is still faster (by far) than Firewire. If anything, it seems that Firewire will attack IDE, and Fibre Channel will attack SCSI.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Can't help you with the GNOME pager, but in fvwm2, I can swallow the FvwmPager into the panel. You won't get the window list but I use fvwm2's root menus for an alphabetically sorted window list anyways. The only other thing missing is that when you set your gtk theme, it won't affect the pager. Other than that, I find the FvwmPager more robust than the GNOME pager is right now anyways. Perhaps you can have similar luck with whatever WM has for a pager. Just make sure you have the pager running before the panel tries to swallow it.
One caveat: if the pager dies, so does the swallowed app; I wish the "swallower" could be configured to stay around and wait for another pager to swallow, because if I restart fvwm2, I have to re-add the swallowed pager to the panel.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Everything you mentioned except draging windows onto the virtual desktop is possible in fvwm2 (if I'm right in guessing you're talking about the pager). Fvwm2Pager can also show mini icons instead of the title names in the pager, which is nice because often the title is too long to read. You can use balloons (tooltips) which display the title when the mouse goes over the little windows.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
AFAIK, there are no alpha chips which will fit into the k7 slot, and none have been announced. PII will fit in the slot, they just won't work. Also, there is no indication that the k7 mobos will have alpha-compatible buses. I don't think AMD and Compaq/Digital have any strategic alliance (other than AMD licensing the ev6 bus) so I doubt we'll see swappable k7/alpha boards (unless a board manufacture provides both a k7 slot and an alpha socket, and a compatible BIOS ;-)
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Gullivers' Travels? You just described every human-inhabited place on earth.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
My first warning sign was the URL: ..../~fullermd/freebsd/....
^^^^^^^
I think most of those "testimonials" were posted to a FreeBSD newsgroup. Now they may or may not be true (in whole or in part), but overall (I didn't read them all), you can't expect it to be unbiased.
BTW, where's your cookie damnit?
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Don't you use modules? or is that why you have to make bzImage? Nonetheless, most of us do use modules, and that automagically installs into the /lib/modules directory tree so there is some splaying.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well you're right: I like SRPMs too, but you know what an SRPM is? It's a tar.gz file (maybe a few), together with patches and a spec file.
/usr/src/redhat/SOURCES and the spec file to /usr/src/redhat/SPECS (talk about splaying all over your filesystem...and why are the RPMS binaries a part of the /usr/src tree?). You have to then use the spec file to build the RPM, then install the RPM.
When you install an SRPM, all it does is copy the tar.gz file(s) and patches to
The problem is that if you're looking for someone to provide an SRPM for a kernel, then simply build an RPM from their spec file, you *still* have no control over the kernel configuration, which is pretty important when testing the kernel (which is, after all, what the prereleases are for).
If you're building your own RPM/SRPM, you haven't saved any time (especially considering that you often have to build the stuff successfully more than once if you are making your own spec file; once by hand [using the tar.gz] and again from the spec-- for instance to find out what files it provides).
I don't think the original poster cared (or knew) about building his own RPM, he was more concerned with just getting a binary package and installing it, letting others compile for him.
If you want to build your own RPM/SRPM, then just grab a spec file from an earlier kernel SRPM and hack...er, edit it to work with the new kernel. The steps are the same, more or less, only the configuration file (which you would presumably include preconfigured) will be different.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
How he'd fit the droids in (supposed to be in all 9 movies) is beyond me. And it would kinda break the continuity of the episodes to have 6 which are more or less continuous and 3 which are not.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Well there's a trilogy of books that take place immediately after Jedi; I haven't read them but I'll bet the good guys (no longer the rebels) win in the end of that too.
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
would this be inspiration or derailment for actual research?
Well we wouldn't know until it was proved successful or a failure would we?
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.
Heh heh heh thought that'd get your attention.
I would think that under antitrust law (although I am no lawyer), the only relevant issues are: (1) is Microsoft a monopoly (not were they; not will they be) and (2) did Microsoft engage (and are they engaging) in acts deemed illegal under antitrust law? The fact that Linux is an alternative operating system does not weigh in on this at all, because Microsoft, to date, still has a monopoly on the personal computer operating system market, because they have (an estimated) 90+% market share in that area.
And besides, is Microsoft going to argue that the only means to undermine their monopoly is to produce a product pro bono? With lawyers like that, who needs the DOJ?
--
Aaron Gaudio
"The fool finds ignorance all around him.