"Perhaps with MS Office they can draw upon the large talent pool of cheap, hack programmers and deliver certain solutions more cheaply."
I don't think relying on cheap hack programmers for your business is such a great idea.
"Perhaps this will give them a business advantage over their competitors who are using StarOffice as a 'dumb' suite or employing expensive Java programmers to build the solutions."
Open office can be scripted with python or C++ or it own version of basic. You don't need java programmers. I bet you can get python programmers cheaper then you can get VB programmers.
" If MS Office is essential to interacting with the people signing the checks, getting rid of it really isn't something one can consider. (and that applies to a lot of shops)"
Again openoffice can open up 99% of all office documents. No bid deal there.
OTOH if your customers are sending you documents with scripts in them and your employers are opening these documents and running those scripts then your business is in worse trouble then you think.
It's not so much the fault of the language. You can certainly write model view controllet apps with php. You can write well disgned OO code in php too. Nothing is preventing you from doing that.
It's just that php apps start small and it's easy to just slap them together. If the app is allowed to grow in a haphazard way without a serious and thoughful refactoring then you get huge ugly messes.
That being said PHP really should have a "strict" mode where it enforces type safety. They are going to make headway on that with php5. Also it would be nice to have some sort of a j2ee like environment.
"As my boss says, unfortunately, sometimes it just isn't worth the trouble."
No disagreement there. Your company is locked in and there is nothing you can do about it. That's the definition of locked in. MS has your company by the balls.
Your biggest problem now is what your competition will do. If they too are locked in then you are in luck. If they are not locked in though they can switch to some other product and save money. This means they can sell their products cheaper or spend more money on advertising or R&D.
Time will tell if your comapny will get beaten in the marketplace as a result of you being unable to change and unable to save money on software purchases. I'd say chances are not in your favor. Bad business decisions come back to haunt you sooner or later. Perhaps you'll get sold before somebody eats your lunch, that's probably the best outcome.
Re:which taxes? Income taxes? Social Security tax?
on
Tech Rich Get Richer
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· Score: 1
"but what about the middle class?"
Unforseen consequence? No not really. The middle class is the class I am talking about.
If you really need VBA then you are officially locked in. There is nothing you can at this late stage except bend over and take it whenever MS wants you to fork over more money.
Your post is a prime example of why it's bad to get locked into single vendor solutions.
It's too late for you. You better hope and pray that your competitor is not locked in like you are. I imagine they can use the few hundred thousand dollars they save to hire better programmers or spend it on more marketing and kick your ass to bankrupcy.
I use openoffice exclusively and have had 99.99% success rate at opening up office files sent by people. The only file I could not open up was an excel file with too many rows in it (don't ask).
Re:which taxes? Income taxes? Social Security tax?
on
Tech Rich Get Richer
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· Score: 1
"Yes, but not at gunpoint."
Historically the Rich don't help our the poor. The history of the world is one where gradually the wealth concentrates more and more until the entire wealth of a country is controlled by a handful of families. What follows is a bloody revalution where the rich are killed and the money is redistributed in one big shot and the cycle starts again.
Today we have learned from history. We have set up social structures whereby the natural tendency of money to concentrate is stemmed by redistribution schemes likes taxes. The trick of course is to trickle down just enough to keep the masses from revolting. Give them enough to eat, stay warm and placate them with TV. Keep them facinated with shiny toys and they won't think too much about a revolution.
" That wouldn't look too good for their antitrust case, would it? "
Do you honestly think MS cares? Do you honestly think that the DOJ will punish MS in any way for any infraction whatsoever? If so I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.
"You don't just "change your mind" about warrantless searches and secret trials!"
Oh come on now don't be ridiculus. A politian could change their mind for several reasons. For example they could disagree with how the law is being enforced or the law may have unforseen consequences.
It sounds to me like you just want to vote the guy out and this is as good an excuse and any. I guess there is nothing wrong with that. But if you think that the person who replaces your guy will read every bill before voting for it you are going to be in for a hell of a disapointment.
With both MS and SUN having vested interest in seeing SCO prevail I am sure SCO will not go out of business before the trial is over.
Worst comes to worst MS will buy them out and pursue the lawsuit themselves. They would love to invalidate the GPL and own the entire Unix codebase and all it's derivatives. Imagine what that would do the megolomaniacs who run MS.
"If it's a major bill, and you don't understand it, don't vote yes. Particularly when it looks like the executive branch is pulling a fast one. That's your obligation as a Senator or Representative."
Ok fine you don't have to keep repeating yourself. I understand that you want reality to mimic your version of what the world should be. I am merely pointing out that reality is not like that and will never be like that.
If you go around thinking that some guy you vote for will read every word of any bill you are simply setting yourself up for disappointment. Like I said it's humanly impossible to do that.
I don't know what world you live in because apparently it's not this one.
In this world not one congressman reads every word of every bill they sign. No matter who you vote for that person also will not read every word of every bill they vote for.
It may not be humanly possible to do such a thing.
"' No way. The time to vote against PATRIOT was when it mattered. I don't have time for a sitting member of Congress who can't be bothered to read before voting."
People can change their minds. It's permitted. I do it all the time.
I imagine that you'd be royally pissed off if you got fired every time you made a mistake or changed your mind about something important.
Forget the ugly site it's the non stop MS cheerleading that turned me off.
Re:We really need a different language
on
Secure Programming
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· Score: 1
"but I have confidence that at least one security hole will eventually be discovered in those programs."
qmail is very widely used and deployed (they claim it's the second most popular smtp program) and it has never been hacked. If it has held up so far I am pretty sure it's unbreakable.
"I wonder if we might borrow some of the practices from that ancient era, and use dynamic allocation as the exception, rather than rule. Programs should have fixed numbers of objects. Programs should have fixed input sizes and maximum capacities. String fields should always have a maximum, fixed, size."
You know what really bug me? Almost all languages have assertions and yet almost nobody uses them. If you are dealing with dynamic elements you should have pre and post conditions as assertions.
Re:the first rule of secure programming club is
on
Secure Programming
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· Score: 1
really why not?
Why is C or C++ some sort of a sacred cow. MS is throwing C away and going with C# why isn't the rest of the world throwing C away and going with Java or Python, or Eiffel or Lisp or whatever.
Write in python and then rewrite the critical sections in C if you must. You'll still be more productive in the long run.
"November of next year, do yourselves, your country, and your species a favor and don't vote for either major party. They've both shown themselves to be derelict in their duties as public servants."
Bad mistake. This will only insure that the current crop radical right wing zealots will continue in power.
Vote for Dean. He is a fiscal conservative, he is pro gun, he is pro gay marriage,he pro choice, he is anti patriot act. Go to his web site and read his positions on the issues you care about and I bet you agree with him on everything.
Slashdot Mirror
"Perhaps with MS Office they can draw upon the large talent pool of cheap, hack programmers and deliver certain solutions more cheaply."
I don't think relying on cheap hack programmers for your business is such a great idea.
"Perhaps this will give them a business advantage over their competitors who are using StarOffice as a 'dumb' suite or employing expensive Java programmers to build the solutions."
Open office can be scripted with python or C++ or it own version of basic. You don't need java programmers. I bet you can get python programmers cheaper then you can get VB programmers.
" If MS Office is essential to interacting with the people signing the checks, getting rid of it really isn't something one can consider. (and that applies to a lot of shops)"
Again openoffice can open up 99% of all office documents. No bid deal there.
OTOH if your customers are sending you documents with scripts in them and your employers are opening these documents and running those scripts then your business is in worse trouble then you think.
Php 5 addresses a lot of your concerns although not all of them.
"Also, if anyone knows of any projects (with source available) written in PHP that are designed well, I would be interested to hear of them."
ADODB.
It's not so much the fault of the language. You can certainly write model view controllet apps with php. You can write well disgned OO code in php too. Nothing is preventing you from doing that.
It's just that php apps start small and it's easy to just slap them together. If the app is allowed to grow in a haphazard way without a serious and thoughful refactoring then you get huge ugly messes.
That being said PHP really should have a "strict" mode where it enforces type safety. They are going to make headway on that with php5. Also it would be nice to have some sort of a j2ee like environment.
"As my boss says, unfortunately, sometimes it just isn't worth the trouble."
No disagreement there. Your company is locked in and there is nothing you can do about it. That's the definition of locked in. MS has your company by the balls.
Your biggest problem now is what your competition will do. If they too are locked in then you are in luck. If they are not locked in though they can switch to some other product and save money. This means they can sell their products cheaper or spend more money on advertising or R&D.
Time will tell if your comapny will get beaten in the marketplace as a result of you being unable to change and unable to save money on software purchases. I'd say chances are not in your favor. Bad business decisions come back to haunt you sooner or later. Perhaps you'll get sold before somebody eats your lunch, that's probably the best outcome.
"but what about the middle class?"
Unforseen consequence? No not really. The middle class is the class I am talking about.
If you really need VBA then you are officially locked in. There is nothing you can at this late stage except bend over and take it whenever MS wants you to fork over more money.
Your post is a prime example of why it's bad to get locked into single vendor solutions.
It's too late for you. You better hope and pray that your competitor is not locked in like you are. I imagine they can use the few hundred thousand dollars they save to hire better programmers or spend it on more marketing and kick your ass to bankrupcy.
I use openoffice exclusively and have had 99.99% success rate at opening up office files sent by people. The only file I could not open up was an excel file with too many rows in it (don't ask).
"Yes, but not at gunpoint."
Historically the Rich don't help our the poor. The history of the world is one where gradually the wealth concentrates more and more until the entire wealth of a country is controlled by a handful of families. What follows is a bloody revalution where the rich are killed and the money is redistributed in one big shot and the cycle starts again.
Today we have learned from history. We have set up social structures whereby the natural tendency of money to concentrate is stemmed by redistribution schemes likes taxes. The trick of course is to trickle down just enough to keep the masses from revolting. Give them enough to eat, stay warm and placate them with TV. Keep them facinated with shiny toys and they won't think too much about a revolution.
"though one of the great minor evils of the web"
A great minor evil. That's a new one on me.
" That wouldn't look too good for their antitrust case, would it? "
Do you honestly think MS cares? Do you honestly think that the DOJ will punish MS in any way for any infraction whatsoever? If so I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.
"You don't just "change your mind" about warrantless searches and secret trials!"
Oh come on now don't be ridiculus. A politian could change their mind for several reasons. For example they could disagree with how the law is being enforced or the law may have unforseen consequences.
It sounds to me like you just want to vote the guy out and this is as good an excuse and any. I guess there is nothing wrong with that. But if you think that the person who replaces your guy will read every bill before voting for it you are going to be in for a hell of a disapointment.
With both MS and SUN having vested interest in seeing SCO prevail I am sure SCO will not go out of business before the trial is over.
Worst comes to worst MS will buy them out and pursue the lawsuit themselves. They would love to invalidate the GPL and own the entire Unix codebase and all it's derivatives. Imagine what that would do the megolomaniacs who run MS.
"Any sitting member of Congress who voted for PATRIOT and now says it was a mistake is either lying or incompetent."
Nonsense. They could have simply changed their minds. Ever think of that?
"No matter what, MS is bad to a lot of people."
Ironic. You can parse this sentence two ways.
1) Many people dislike MS no matter what it does.
2) MS treats many people badly.
Maybe many people dislike MS because MS treats many people badly.
"If it's a major bill, and you don't understand it, don't vote yes. Particularly when it looks like the executive branch is pulling a fast one. That's your obligation as a Senator or Representative."
Ok fine you don't have to keep repeating yourself. I understand that you want reality to mimic your version of what the world should be. I am merely pointing out that reality is not like that and will never be like that.
If you go around thinking that some guy you vote for will read every word of any bill you are simply setting yourself up for disappointment. Like I said it's humanly impossible to do that.
I don't know what world you live in because apparently it's not this one.
In this world not one congressman reads every word of every bill they sign. No matter who you vote for that person also will not read every word of every bill they vote for.
It may not be humanly possible to do such a thing.
"Point being this: anyone can always restrict the criteria for the discussion to disallow any other points of view to be valid."
And you seem to be intent on doing that rather then discuss the issue at hand.
"' No way. The time to vote against PATRIOT was when it mattered. I don't have time for a sitting member of Congress who can't be bothered to read before voting."
People can change their minds. It's permitted. I do it all the time.
I imagine that you'd be royally pissed off if you got fired every time you made a mistake or changed your mind about something important.
Forget the ugly site it's the non stop MS cheerleading that turned me off.
"but I have confidence that at least one security hole will eventually be discovered in those programs."
qmail is very widely used and deployed (they claim it's the second most popular smtp program) and it has never been hacked. If it has held up so far I am pretty sure it's unbreakable.
"I wonder if we might borrow some of the practices from that ancient era, and use dynamic allocation as the exception, rather than rule. Programs should have fixed numbers of objects. Programs should have fixed input sizes and maximum capacities. String fields should always have a maximum, fixed, size."
You know what really bug me? Almost all languages have assertions and yet almost nobody uses them. If you are dealing with dynamic elements you should have pre and post conditions as assertions.
really why not?
Why is C or C++ some sort of a sacred cow. MS is throwing C away and going with C# why isn't the rest of the world throwing C away and going with Java or Python, or Eiffel or Lisp or whatever.
Write in python and then rewrite the critical sections in C if you must. You'll still be more productive in the long run.
"November of next year, do yourselves, your country, and your species a favor and don't vote for either major party. They've both shown themselves to be derelict in their duties as public servants."
Bad mistake. This will only insure that the current crop radical right wing zealots will continue in power.
Vote for Dean. He is a fiscal conservative, he is pro gun, he is pro gay marriage,he pro choice, he is anti patriot act. Go to his web site and read his positions on the issues you care about and I bet you agree with him on everything.
" I don't know about you, but I've found that greed is actually the best cure for laziness out there"
I though greed was one of the seven deadly sins. In fact I think there are lots of passages in the bible about how evil greed is.
Scalia will never vote against this administration and Thomas will never vote against scalia.